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Rust
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Post Number: 64
Registered: 08-2004
Posted From: 68.43.180.171
Posted on Monday, December 26, 2005 - 10:33 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I have seen numerous shots of the exterior of the "Old City". Does anybody have any shots of the Interior?

It is too late now with One Kennedy going up, but would the footprint of the "Old City Hall" have fit on what was left of Kennedy Square after Campus Martius was created?
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Hornwrecker
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Post Number: 605
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Posted From: 216.203.223.102
Posted on Monday, December 26, 2005 - 2:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Here's a couple of photos found in WSU/VMC; first City Coucil Chambers:

Old City Hall Council Chambers

... and the Mayor's Office.

Old City Hall Mayor's Office
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Hornwrecker
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Posted on Monday, December 26, 2005 - 2:25 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

A quick map I did of the footprint of Old City Hall.

Old City Hall footprint
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Gistok
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Posted on Monday, December 26, 2005 - 2:43 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It appears that the 1872 old City Hall was no where near as opulent as the 1900 old County Building. I also noticed that the footprint of old City Hall was much smaller than the County Building (from another map).
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Hornwrecker
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Username: Hornwrecker

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Posted on Monday, December 26, 2005 - 2:59 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Interesting point, here's both from the same map, so I assume it's the same scale.

City/County Bldgs map
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Alexei289
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Posted From: 68.61.183.223
Posted on Monday, December 26, 2005 - 3:30 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

smaller is better ;)... It makes a large beaurocracy less feasable...
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Hornwrecker
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Posted From: 66.2.148.197
Posted on Monday, December 26, 2005 - 11:28 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

A couple of other interior views, some kind of conference room, probably in the mayor's office...

Old City Hall Conference Room

... and the Press Room with a mural on the wall.

Old City Hall Press  Room
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Bagman
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Post Number: 34
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Posted From: 68.73.57.80
Posted on Tuesday, December 27, 2005 - 2:07 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I have some photos hanging in my shop of this old building. I have one photo showing the building all decked it what appears to be red white and blue bunting. If my memory is correct when we were given the photos the guy said it was all decked out for FDR. I will try to take a photo and post them as they are to large for my scanner.
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Karl
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Username: Karl

Post Number: 721
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Posted From: 68.230.22.99
Posted on Tuesday, December 27, 2005 - 4:09 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Interesting shot of the conference room - ashtrays all around but not a water bottle in sight. How times have changed. The year each photo was taken would be interesting if they're ever available.

Thanks for these.
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Lmichigan
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Username: Lmichigan

Post Number: 2863
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Posted From: 67.172.95.197
Posted on Tuesday, December 27, 2005 - 6:05 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Compared to other historic halls of large cities, this is much smaller than I imagined. I can definitely see how the city outgrew the structure. It's a shame that it was taken down, though, especially considering how the County Building just down the street was saved.
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Carptrash
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Username: Carptrash

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Posted on Tuesday, December 27, 2005 - 6:38 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Love that mural, but . . . . ............. there sure are a lot of White Guys in the pictures. eeeeeeeeeek
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Rust
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Post Number: 65
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Posted on Tuesday, December 27, 2005 - 8:42 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hornwrecker, Thanks!

From your map it looks like it would have been a very tight fit on the southeast corner of the Old City Hall with the new Campus Martius park. It doesn't look like they would have worked together. So on the bright side of losing the Old City Hall we gained a great civic park.

Your photos are excellent. Was there any Grand Staircase? or Lobby? That is usually where they put most the effort in civic building of this era.
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Hornwrecker
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Username: Hornwrecker

Post Number: 613
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Posted From: 66.2.148.30
Posted on Tuesday, December 27, 2005 - 12:21 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

No idea on the years of the photos, someone with some fashion sense should be able to date the photos; alas I have none. I haven't found any other interior photos yet, but am still searching.

Here's an aerial photo from 1949, labeled due to heavy shadows.

City Hall aerial 1949

Anybody know anything of the Old, Old City Hall. Torn down in around 1872 to build the Old City Hall. I found a couple of photos, but still needs some retouching.

(Message edited by Hornwrecker on December 27, 2005)
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Gistok
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Username: Gistok

Post Number: 1681
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Posted From: 207.69.137.13
Posted on Tuesday, December 27, 2005 - 2:00 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Rust, I don't think there is ANY bright side to losing old City Hall.

Campus Martius Park would have fit in, even if old City Hall was still standing. If Campus Martius Park could fit in with the BancOne block as a square block just south of old City Hall (it didn't become a square block until that building was built), then it could have accommodated old City Hall as well.

I don't think old City Hall took up more of a footprint than the Redico Building does today.
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Rust
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Post Number: 66
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Posted on Tuesday, December 27, 2005 - 6:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I am not trying to make a case that the Campus Martius is better than the having the Old City Hall and if it could have fit on the block that One Kennedy Square is on that you are right there is no bright side to its loss.

In fact I wonder sometimes if the type of reconstructions done in Europe where grand civic buildings which were totaly destroyed during WWII only to be completely and accurately reconstructed would have been a better choice for One Kennedy Square. It would certainly have been a landmark and point of pride today.

(Message edited by rust on December 28, 2005)
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Hornwrecker
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Posted From: 66.2.149.81
Posted on Tuesday, December 27, 2005 - 6:43 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

A closeup of the tower, and interior showing clockwork. Any horologists out there know anything about the movement, and if the clock survived the demolition and its whereabouts?

Old City Hall clock tower

Old City Hall clock movement
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Gistok
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Post Number: 1682
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Posted From: 207.69.139.139
Posted on Tuesday, December 27, 2005 - 9:33 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hey Rust, on what you just mentioned.... the Berlin city government is contemplating destroying the (former East Berlin central plaza) Alexander Platz, in order to rebuild the Baroque "Town Palace" of the former (King's of Prussia/Kaiser's of Germany) rulers.

At the end of WWII the palace was still standing, but badly damaged. The Russians had it bulldozed for the cental plaza of the new communist government.

There is a 40 story office building that would have to come down. The city government and federal Bundestag (Parliament) want the palace rebuilt, but former East Berliners want to keep their Alexander Platz. The battle is still going on....

Of course German's could teach American's a thing or two about historic preservation.... the world famous Dresden Semper Opera House (Semper was the 19th century German architect) was built back in the early 1800's, burned to the ground in the late 1800's, was rebuilt exactly, and burned down again on Feb. 13, 1945 when the allies firebombed Dresden. They spent 10 years painstakingly rebuilding it for the 2nd time.
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Barnesfoto
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Posted From: 66.2.148.102
Posted on Wednesday, December 28, 2005 - 2:34 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Alexanderplatz is almost as ugly as Kenedy Square was...
If anyone responsible for the demolition of the old City Hall is still alive, I'd love to be part of a class action lawsuit against them for depriving us of the pleasure of seeing this building.
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Fury13
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Posted From: 69.14.122.204
Posted on Wednesday, December 28, 2005 - 9:35 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I like the old City Hall as well as anyone, but put the demolition in historical context. In the '50s, modern was always considered better, and Victorian-era structures were deemed gaudy and tasteless. There wasn't as much of a sense of history with most people then... it was the space age. And remember, old City Hall was only just shy of 90 years old at that point (think of all the 1915-era buildings still being torn down today.... they're considered more expendable than a 150-year-old building). The city fathers didn't want a vacant, derelict, decaying building in the middle of downtown (that's right, such things were frowned upon in the '50s), since the City-County Building was already up and running. Rather than see it sit vacant, the decision was made to demo it.
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Psip
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Username: Psip

Post Number: 761
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Posted From: 69.246.13.131
Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 4:02 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

WSU
Just prior to demolition it briefly was an art museum.
Art

Caution:
the following pictures are disturbing and may cause nausea and other unpleasant side effects.
demo1

Demo 2

Demo3

Demo 4

Demo 5

demo 6

Demo 7

THE END
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Rust
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Username: Rust

Post Number: 67
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Posted From: 64.118.136.130
Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 6:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

How nauseating!!!
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Psip
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Posted From: 69.246.13.131
Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 10:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Where are the statues now?
http://www.metrotimes.com/editorial/story.asp?id=6495

Head
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Hornwrecker
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Username: Hornwrecker

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Posted From: 66.2.149.84
Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 10:45 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I saw those photos when looking for the interior shots, but I didn't want to be the one to post them.

Well, for that city hall to be built, another one was torn down. Here's a couple of pictures of Really Old City Hall built in 1835:

Really Old Detroit City Hall

Really Old Detroit City Hall
wsu
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Mikem
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Username: Mikem

Post Number: 2248
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Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 11:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The second shot above is a picture of the precession transferring the seat of power to the new city hall in 1872.






And they didn't necessarily tear down one for the other:

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Hornwrecker
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Username: Hornwrecker

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Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 11:54 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks again for the history lesson Mikem. I looked at the 1860 map, which should show at least one City Hall, but has neither, at least that I could find on it.

I think I need a break, so I'll go post some nonsense on Fark.
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Mikem
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Posted on Friday, January 06, 2006 - 12:21 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The 1835 City Hall looks like a toy in that last photo.

From Burton's "The City of Detroit" (1922):


quote:

The Old City Hall

The first city hall...stood where the westerly end of what was then Michigan Grand Avenue, now Cadillac Square, now meets Woodward; was 50 by 100 feet in size and cost approximately $15,000. John Scott was the name of the contractor. This building was first occupied November 18, 1835. Payment was made by the proceeds of lots sold by the city on the military reserve. The lower story of this building, which was half basement, was cut up into stalls and rented as a meat market. Incidentally, it became a center of political wiles and guile, for the butchers were active in politics in those days. Silas Farmer, in his "History of Detroit," states that the second story was occupied only by the city clerk and collector, while the mayor, sewer commissioners, surveyor, and assessor, in 1857, were in the old female seminary building on the site of the present city hall, and that from 1866 until 1871 some of the city offices such as surveyor and sewer commissioners were located in the Williams Block on Monroe Avenue. The upper floor of the old city hall was mainly taken up with the council chamber, which was also used for citizens' meetings, as a theatre, as a church and for other miscellaneous gatherings. The building was vacated by the city in July, 1872, and in the following November was torn down. A three-story structure for a public hall and markets, called the Central Market Building, was erected on the same site and opened in August, 1880. The second story of this building was occupied by the board of health, also the poor and park commission, in 1881, and the third story was used by the Superior Court in 1883 and for a few years thereafter.


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Mikem
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Posted on Friday, January 06, 2006 - 3:25 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Burton delves into details that seem to take you way off track, but here is his history of the "present" city hall, i.e. the old city hall, including the history of the land it sits on and Campus Martius. It starts off slow but gets better toward the end. For the history of the building itself, skip to the paragraph in the middle with the first sentence in bold type.


Continuing..


quote:

The Present City Hall

The site upon which the present city hall stands has had a checkered history. When the military reservation was platted in 1830, there was a large lot left between Griswold and Fort Streets, Michigan Avenue and the Campus Martius. It was the only part of the military reservation which was east of Griswold Street. This lot was 238 feet long on the Griswold Street side, twenty feet front on Lafayette Avenue and twelve feet on Fort Street; the easterly side was the Campus Martius of 245 feet, and the lot had a Michigan Avenue frontage of 144 feet.

The Association for the Promotion of Female Education requested the city authorities to give them this lot and they erected on it a large three-story brick building fronting on Griswold Street, and in it they maintained a school or seminary for young ladies for some years. The deed to the association is dated March 29, 1830. the school was not a success and the association leased the building and lot to the University of Michigan for 999 years. The formal lease was executed March 30, 1843. At this time there was an engine house, No. 2, erected in 1836, belonging to the fire department, on the south end of the lot on the Fort Street corner. In the lease to the university, it was provided that the city could retain the engine house site as long as it desired.

There was a time in the history of the city when the people and the newspapers encouraged the introduction and extension of railroads as a benefit to the town. The Detroit & St Joseph Railroad, now called the Michigan Central, wanted a central location for depot grounds, and the western portion of the Campus Martius was selected as the proper place to locate the buildings.

On August 4, 1836, Edmund A. Brush, in behalf of the railroad, wanted to lay the track down Michigan Avenue and also asked permission "to occupy so much of the public ground adjacent to the female seminary as might be necessary for a terminating depot." Permission was granted to lay the track on the south side of Michigan Avenue. The road was also allowed to use all that it needed of that part of the Campus lying west of Woodward Avenue. At this time the railroad was owned by a private company, but in the early part of 1837 the legislature provided for the organization of a state commission of internal improvements and in May of that year the commission acquired the railroad, and thenceforth it was known as the Central Railroad. Justus Burdick was the first president of the commission and David C. McKinstry was the acting commissioner.

The first track was laid down Michigan Avenue and around the west side of Woodward Avenue to Fort Street. A petition of the citizens was presented to the common council in January, 1838, asking that the track be continued down Woodward Avenue to the public wharf at the foot of the street. The petition was referred to a committee consisting of the mayor, Henry Howard; recorder, Ross Wilkins, and aldermen John McDonnell and Thomas Chase. A plan was prepared which was submitted to the council with the report of the committee favorable to the project. The resolution, which was adopted February 5, 1838, outlined the plan for this work as follows:

"Resolved, That permission be, and it is hereby given to the state or others to make, in accordance with the plan on record, a cut in the center of Woodward Avenue, fourteen feet wide and as deep as may be found necessary, commencing as near the crossing of Congress Street and terminating at or below the crossing of Atwater Street, as shall be found practicable, but so as in no wise to interfere with or injure the grand sewer, for the purpose of laying down a railway track from the depot at the Campus Martius to the water at the foot of Woodward Avenue. Provided, however, that the state or parties constructing the same shall secure the sides of said cut with a stone wall or with timber, and shall cover over in the same way all of said cut that can be so covered without obstructing the passage of the cars which may be employed in transporting goods on said track, preserving through the whole line the grades of the several streets and so constructing the crossings as not to present any obstructions or impediment to the free passage of said streets, or of the water course thereof. And to construct a good and sufficient rail on both sides of said cut as shall not be covered, and at the crossings of the same, except at the commencement and termination of said cut, and to put lamps at convenient distances and to keep them lit during the night, and to make the whole of said work safe and secure and also to keep the same always in repair.

"Provided, also, That none of the expense of constructing said work, nor for keeping the same in repair shall be paid by said corporation (the city).

"Resolved, That the use of steam engines or locomotives is expressly forbidden on the track, the construction of which is authorized by these resolutions." (whew!)


The plan was accepted by the state with the provision that the lighting of the subway would not be insisted upon. A profile of the grade was submitted and accepted in June following. this did not include much of a cut, for the grade was made to correspond with Bates Street. The track was laid to Atwater Street and consent was given to extend it on either side to the city limits, but as the state did not want to bear this expense, private land owners were permitted to lay tracks along Atwater Street to connect with the road. Advantage was not taken of this permission and the road was but little used. The commissioner of internal improvements in 1840 reported that the work had been completed, “but no use had been made of it, and the apathy manifested by those for whose convenience it had been constructed, seems strongly to indicate the fact that as a public thoroughfare, it is perfectly useless.” The track was then taken up and that part of the route abandoned March 26, 1844.

The city leased to the state for 999 years, from August 19, 1837, all of the Campus lying west of Woodward Avenue, and east of the lot occupied by the seminary. The provision in the lease was that the land should be “used for a depot and the general stopping place for cars carrying passengers on the Detroit & St Joseph Railroad and for no other purpose.” The lease was to cease when the premises were abandoned as depot grounds. At the same time the city gave to the railroad a lease of the central portion of Cadillac Square, extending westwardly from Bates Street to the old city hall and market, which was in the center of the street fronting on the Campus. The lease permitted the railroad to run a track across Woodward Avenue to connect with the tracks at Bates Street. The Cadillac Avenue grounds were intended for freight yards. Two of the residents on Cadillac Square (then Michigan Grand Avenue) were David Cooper and Charles Jackson. Upon their petition, the court enjoined the railroad from proceeding with their work, and the supreme court decided that the city should not lease or dispose of a street in the manner attempted. The result was that the railroad established its freight yard and buildings on the south side of Michigan Avenue, a short distance west of Griswold Street.

After the railroad passed into the hands of the Michigan Central Railroad Company in 1847, the depot was established at the foot of Third Street. The Campus depot ceased to be used for that purpose in 1848, but the state continued in the ownership of a portion of the buildings for some years. The university conveyed the seminary building to the state in 1854 and some of the state offices were maintained in the building. In 1853 a portion of the old depot building on Griswold Street was leased to Andrew Ladue and Francis E. Eldred. This building is referred to in the deed from the university to the state as “the main structure of the large wooden building originally erected for a warehouse of the Central Railroad.” The seminary building is here referred to as “The Yellow State Building.” The state sold everything – lease, lot, and buildings, to the city January 23, 1856, for $18,816.66.

Agitation for a new city hall had begun before this time, but now, as the city was sole owner of the property, it was proposed to proceed with the new building.

Proceedings were begun in 1859 to vacate so much of the Campus as lies west of Woodward Avenue in order that the land might become the city hall site. Guy F. Hinchman and Sarah Abbott, executors of the will of James Abbott, whose home was on the site of the present Hammond Building, attempted to restrain the city from excavating the Campus and from erecting the city hall at that place. It was stated that those connected with this movement wanted the city hall built on the Grand Circus. Mr. Hinchman’s suit was begun May 31, 1860. Although he failed in the suit, the institution of it delayed the work of building for that year, and in the succeeding year, 1861, the War of the Rebellion coming on, prevented further work for some years.

In 1850, John Palmer and others residing near the square petitioned the council to have the Campus graded, fenced , and ornamented with shade trees. The committee of the council made a report July 9, 1850, recommending that the prayer be granted. The city had leased this corner to a circus company for one day in 1849 and had received $100 for the use of the ground and the license. The money was now authorized to be expended in leveling the ground and there was added to it a like sum subscribed by John Palmer and other neighbors and another hundred dollars taken from the road fund. The transformation must have been startling, for the “Free Press” of August 2, 1851, said regarding it: “The Campus Martius makes quite an appearance with its young trees and its oat crop springing up fresh and green among the bricks and mortar surroundings. A similar disposition of the area on the opposite side of the street towards the city hall would be a good idea. It would make Woodward Avenue one of the pleasantest, as it is now one of the busiest and most important thoroughfares of the city.”

The property was not cared for and the council, in 1851, found that “but one chain had been placed through the posts around the Campus Martius, and the same is now left exposed, so that the cattle and other animals are destroying the improvements made by the city appropriation.”

The trees and grass were short-lived among the bricks and mortar and in 1853 the “Advertiser” said: “The Campus Martius looks very forlorn. The supposed shade trees are only poles, and the only green thing on the square is a big dock weed,” so the city leased the corner to the railroad circus for an exhibition in September of that year. In June, 1854, the same circus company paid the city $250 for a three days’ lease of the lot.

The present city hall itself was a long time in contemplation. As early as 1857, committees on almshouse and public buildings jointly reported in favor of so amending the charter “that the bonds of the city may be issued for such a sum of money as must be required to build such public buildings for said purpose, as this council shall deem expedient, for the purpose of constituting a fund, to be used for the purpose of erecting public buildings in the city; namely, an almshouse, a city jail, a city hall and such other public buildings as may be deemed necessary.” The recommendation was adopted and the amendment to the charter was made by the legislature. Two years later the subject of a city hall was taken up by a separate proposition and at the last of a series of meetings the controller, James M. Edmunds, submitted a definite plan for a building upon the following basis: “The basement will contain heating apparatus, coal rooms, store rooms, water closets, etc. the first floor will contain eight offices, two rooms and a vault, each office containing 448 square feet of floor surface; one office with a floor surface of 525 square feet, two halls each twenty feet wide, crossing at right angles in the center, making a public entrance on each of the four fronts.

“The second floor will contain four offices, two rooms and vault, each office having a floor space of 821 or more feet; three offices, two rooms and a vault, one committee room, one council chamber 60 x 90 feet, the halls of the same width as on the first floor.

“The third floor will contain one circuit court room, with 5,400 square feet of surface; one supreme court room, with 2,400 square feet of surface, two judges’ consultation rooms, two attorneys’ consultation rooms, one library, two jury rooms, one sheriff’s room.

“The building to be constructed of hewn stone and fire proof. The elevation to be massive and attractive, and on whatever location it may be placed, the building and entire grounds to occupy one entire block, that it may present four fronts, and a public entrance on each front.”

This plan was strikingly similar to the one that was actually adopted a dozen years later. The estimated cost of the building was $250,000, and the common council authorized the issue of bonds for that amount. The proposed site was then a part of the Campus Martius. The steps necessary to vacate it for the purpose of the building, the competitive submission and examination of plans and other preliminaries filled up the time until the spring of 1861, when the Civil war commenced and building operations of this kind were suspended. The subject was taken up again in the summer of 1865, but it was not until the fall of 1866 that a contract for the excavation was let. The final plans for the structure were drawn by the architect, James Anderson, and in 1867 the contract for the building was let to N. Osborn & Company of Rochester, New York, for #379,578. Their contract called for the completion of the building July 1, 1871, and they fulfilled it and had two months to spare. The city gave them a bonus of $3,000 for the privilege of occupying the building earlier than the time called for. This was done as a measure of economy and for the convenience of the county, which was required to vacate other quarters. Of the result one of the local papers said at the time: “The contractors, Messrs. Osborn & Company, are entitled to great praise, not only for their promptness with which they have done their work, but for the manner in which they have done it. It is conceded on all hands, that every stone and brick has been laid in a conscientious and faithful manner. Those who have watched the building closely pronounce it a first class piece of work, and really the structure speaks for itself, both to the credit of the taste of the designer and the skill and honesty of the builder.” The building is 204 feet long and 90 feet wide. The height of the building to the cornice is 66 feet and to the top of the flagstaff 200 feet. The walks are constructed of Amherst sandstone, quarried near Cleveland, Ohio. Some remodeling was done upon the city hall in 1906.

It was also matter of comment that not only was the building completed within the specified time, but within the stipulated cost, and without a suspicion of fraud or graft. This constructive work was going on at the same time as that on the New York City courthouse, made infamous by the frauds of Tweed, Sweeney & Ingersoll, and the contrast between the two records was matter of bitter comment in the New York press. The estimated value of the land upon which the building stood was $195,000. The total cost of the building, including the plans, excavation, structure, heating apparatus, clock and bell was $519,949. Furniture, ornamenting the grounds, interest on bonds, printing and other incidentals added $82,181 to this, making a total cost, exclusive of grounds, of $602,130. The corner stone was laid August 6, 1868, with an address by Charles I. Walker. The building was dedicated July 4, 1871, the council held their first meeting therein on the 18th, and for the half century since then it has been one of the busiest and most useful structures in the city.

Other items of interest concerning the city hall follow. The four stone figures on the first section of the tower are each 14 feet in height and represent Justice, Industry, Art, and Commerce. In 1884, Bela Hubbard commissioned the sculptor, Julius Melchers, to make four statues, of Cadillac, La Salle, Father Marquette and Rev. Fr. Gabriel Richard, which he presented to the city and they were placed in niches on the east and west fronts of the city hall. The bell tower, weighing 7,670 pounds, cost $2,782. The clock cost $2,850, has four dials each 8 feet 3 inches in diameter, and the mechanism was first started July 4, 1871. the two cannon on each side of the front steps on the east were captured from the British at the battle of Lake Erie, when Perry routed the English fleet under Barclay. These pieces were brought here from Erie, Pennsylvania, placed on the old government wharf between Wayne and Cass, then served as posts to which to tie vessels, but were later secured for the city by private subscription and gift in April, 1872, the larger by the citizens, on the 12th, and the other by Moore, Foote & Company, on the 17th, and on July 4, 1874, they were placed in their present position.

Built originally to accommodate both city and county, the building has now become inadequate to the needs of the city alone. The city courts and many of the county offices are accommodated in the five-story Municipal Courts building, corner of St. Antoine and Macomb, which was completed and occupied in 1917 and which cost $845,000. The board of health and public welfare commission occupy a separate building at St. Antoine and Clinton Street. The department of buildings and safety engineering has the larger part of a remodeled old court building erected in 1889 at Clinton and Raynor Streets, and there are several other officials and commissions scattered throughout the city.


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Psip
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Posted From: 69.246.13.131
Posted on Friday, January 06, 2006 - 3:46 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thank you MikeM, that is very interesting.
As Lowell Thomas might have said, "the story behind the pictures"
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Psip
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Posted From: 69.246.13.131
Posted on Friday, January 06, 2006 - 4:40 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

This is starting to make some sense, and takes the thread into another direction.
Julius Melchers was the sculpture of the statues on old city hall. He is more importantly known for his work as a carver of cigar store Indians. (Remember Detroit was the cigar capital of the world at one time). His son, Geri Melchers went on to become a famous artist in his own right.

Some other tidbits:
Albert Kahn (1869-1942) was an internationally famed industrial architect who for many years was the leading designer of automobile plants in the United States. Born in Rhauen, Westphalia, Germany, he immigrated to the U.S. while still a youth and received drawing lessons from the sculptor Julius Melchers and practical experience in architecture from the Detroit firm of George Mason.

Julius Melchers (1829-1909), a German sculptor and woodcarver who settled in Detroit in 1855, worked in several different mediums, including wood, plaster, and stone. He had apprenticed with a sculptor in his native Prussia and studied with two leading academic sculptors at the Ecole des Beaux Arts in Paris.
For more than 40 years, his Detroit workshop produced architectural sculpture, church carvings, patterns for decorative castings, and shop figures. Melchers also conducted classes in drawing and modeling, and so made a major contribution to Detroit's fledgling artistic community.

One of the better-known artists of that day was Julius Theodore Melchers. In a July 23, 1899 interview in the Detroit News Tribune, he detailed how he approached his statue-crafting assignments: "When I came to Detroit in 1852, a few rudely carved and badly painted signs were found at the stores. The first work I did in Detroit was to carve a little chief, about five feet high," he said. Reflecting the attitudes of the day, he explained, "I hired an Indian to put on a lot of savage finery and pose as a model. It was no trouble getting an Indian model in those days," he elaborated. "He would pose all day, if I wanted him to. When I got the image done, I received $55 for it."

caution PDF file http://www.evanschuman.com/clips/Americana.pdf


Cigar 4
A FINE CARVED AND PAINTED PINE CIGAR STORE INDIAN, ATTRIBUTED TO JULIUS THEODORE MELCHERS, DETROIT, MICHIGAN LATE 19TH CENTURY height 66in., base 14.75in.


Cigar 1
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Lmichigan
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Username: Lmichigan

Post Number: 2960
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Posted From: 67.172.95.197
Posted on Friday, January 06, 2006 - 6:03 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mikem, is that except of Burton's City of Detroit available anywhere on the web, just wondering?
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Goat
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Username: Goat

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Posted on Saturday, January 07, 2006 - 3:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

From the article listed by Psip.

"Slomzenski says the local statues represent the four “civic virtues” — art, justice, commerce and industry."

Could this be the albatross hanging around Detroit's neck? Considering the decline of Detroit started when the idea of demolition of the bulding and the demise of these "civic virtues" was left by the wayside.
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Mikem
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Username: Mikem

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Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Saturday, January 07, 2006 - 3:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Sorry Lmich, I don't believe it's on the web. I took this from my own copy of his history, located in Chapter XIV "Public Buildings" in Volume I.

(Message edited by MikeM on January 07, 2006)

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