Discuss Detroit » Hall of Fame Threads » Old Car Factories » Old Car Factories - 10
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Kathleen
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Username: Kathleen

Post Number: 531
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 69.14.122.57
Posted on Monday, May 23, 2005 - 9:20 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The German Protestant Home for Orphans and Old People was located at 1852 W. Grand Boulevard. I think it was somewhere over near where Henry Ford Hospital is located. It was opened in 1894. I have a 30th Anniversary booklet for the Home, probably because my mother's maternal grandparents were German immigrants.

The Palace Gardens amusement park was just one of many amusement parks that were at the foot of the Belle Isle Bridge on Jefferson throughout the years.

The Kling Brewery was founded by Philip Kling whose daugher Emilie married Louis Kamper, the architect, who for a while worked for the Kling Brewery. It is not known whether Kamper was hired by Kling and then married his daughter, or if he married the daughter and then worked for Kling.
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Aiw
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Username: Aiw

Post Number: 3894
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Posted From: 65.92.103.100
Posted on Monday, May 23, 2005 - 10:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Humm... Sorry to go off...

Electric Park 1907

ep07

Another Photo Late 20's, note the "new" Belle Isle Bridge in existance, as well as the crazy interchange.

bib

Anyone with access to an old City Directory or Sandborn Map, this on is postmarked 1910 and is called Wolff's Park. There is an ad for Boats rides on the right of the card, so I am assuming that this is along the waterfront... This has been a mystery to me for a long time....

wolff's
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Kathleen
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Username: Kathleen

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Posted on Monday, May 23, 2005 - 11:45 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yup, Wolff's Park was right there at Jefferson and the Belle Isle Bridge. Somewhere I've got more details about it and the other numerous parks that were located on either side of the bridge over the years.
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Psip
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Username: Psip

Post Number: 54
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Posted From: 69.246.13.131
Posted on Monday, May 30, 2005 - 12:25 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I have just found some video of the old Uniroyal plant. I will post some captures of it soon.
Also, I don't want this thread to fall off the page.
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Sven1977
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Username: Sven1977

Post Number: 87
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Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Thursday, June 02, 2005 - 10:57 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Kathleen, why don't you remind people of the tours your group puts on. You mentioned them a few months ago when the cold winds were blowing off the Detroit River but now it's warm and we all want to be out walking.
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Wkl
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Username: Wkl

Post Number: 43
Registered: 11-2003
Posted From: 204.212.159.1
Posted on Thursday, June 02, 2005 - 11:26 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Always wanted my dad to honk the car horn when we went through the "tunnel" going to Belle Isle. Greate echo. He always did, even though the was a sign telling people not to do so.
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Kathleen
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Username: Kathleen

Post Number: 593
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Posted From: 140.244.107.151
Posted on Sunday, June 05, 2005 - 1:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks, Sven, for the reminder.

The Preservation Wayne Walking Tour 2005 Season is well underway...

SATURDAY MORNING TOURS. May 3, 2005 through September 27, 2005. Tours start at 10:00 am (arrive by 9:45 am)

Meeting Locations
Auto Heritage: Corner of Piquette and Beaubien
Cultural Center: Cass entrance of Detroit Public Library
Downtown Detroit: Lobby of the Ponchartrain Hotel (Jefferson and Washington)
Eastern Market: Eastern Market Welcome Center (Adelaide and Market Streets)
Midtown: Avalon International Bakery (Willis, just west of Cass)

By reservation only (for Saturday mornings or weekday evenings):
New Center: Atrium of New Center Place Building

TUESDAY EVENING TOURS. Meet at the Pontchartrain Hotel lobby and begin at 5:30 pm:

Downtown Restaurants and Bars: May 3, June 7, July 12, August 16, September 20.

Skyscraper Tour: May 10, June 14, July 19, August 23, September 27.

Albert Kahn Buildings: May 17, June 21, July 26, August 30.

Louis Kamper Buildings: May 24, June 28, August 2, September 6.

Downtown Sculptures & Fountains: May 31, July 5, August 9, September 13.

Check out this Preservation Wayne webpage for more details: http://www.preservationwayne.o rg/tours.htm
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Kathleen
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Username: Kathleen

Post Number: 596
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Posted From: 140.244.107.151
Posted on Sunday, June 05, 2005 - 1:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Wkl,

I too have fond memories of our visits to Belle Isle that began with the ride through the tunnel, imploring Dad to ignore the "Do Not Honk Horn" signs. And later as we drove around the island, we would beg him to "go faster" as we went over the little bridges on the east end of the island. Our stomachs would always drop as we hit the apex and went down the other side!!!
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Tåla
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Username: Tåla

Post Number: 4
Registered: 05-2005
Posted From: 68.41.164.3
Posted on Sunday, June 05, 2005 - 2:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I found this page last year. http://www.windsorpubliclibrar y.com/digi/sar/exhibit.htm
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Sven1977
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Username: Sven1977

Post Number: 88
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Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Monday, June 06, 2005 - 11:45 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Tåla, thanks for the Windsor info. Windsor looked like a mirror of Detroit but on a smaller scale. Where did your screen name Tåla come from?
I know they use the å in Sweden but I'm not sure about other countries.
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Tåla
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Username: Tåla

Post Number: 6
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Posted From: 68.41.164.3
Posted on Monday, June 06, 2005 - 12:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yes my Father came from a swede town in the U.P.
He came to Detroit to do war work (to stay out of
draft). Tåla is my dogs name it means to bear with.I have an ö in my last name.
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Sven1977
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Username: Sven1977

Post Number: 89
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Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Monday, June 06, 2005 - 2:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

You're welcome to join the Swedish Club in Farmington Hills. But, you have to like meatballs and herring.
Dan or "Sven1977".
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Tåla
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Username: Tåla

Post Number: 10
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Posted From: 68.41.164.3
Posted on Monday, June 06, 2005 - 3:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The old man did.He was a Fin-Swede.
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Tåla
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Username: Tåla

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Posted From: 68.41.164.3
Posted on Thursday, June 09, 2005 - 12:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I just found this page on the Windsor Public Library site. It has a map old Winsors auto plants.I don't Know if it was posted before,but here it is. http://www.windsorpubliclibrar y.com/digi/wow/
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Sven1977
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Username: Sven1977

Post Number: 90
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Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Thursday, June 09, 2005 - 4:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

AIW, how many of the buildings mentioned above are still around?
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Aiw
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Username: Aiw

Post Number: 4019
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 65.92.100.231
Posted on Thursday, June 09, 2005 - 5:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

That map is all over the place, putting factories miles away from where the Sandborn Maps put them. I came acorss the site years ago, and quickly found it to be light in "location accuracy".
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Aiw
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Username: Aiw

Post Number: 4107
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Posted From: 209.216.150.127
Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 8:38 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Here's an interesting article from the News...

http://info.detnews.com/joyrid es/story/index.cfm?id=549
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Kathleen
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Username: Kathleen

Post Number: 678
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Posted From: 140.244.107.151
Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 11:10 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks, Andrew. A visit to the musem in Kingsville sounds like a nice day trip that could be combined with Jack Miner's and Point Pelee!! I'll keep this one in mind.
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Aiw
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Username: Aiw

Post Number: 4111
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Posted From: 209.216.150.127
Posted on Monday, June 20, 2005 - 12:23 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Kathleen,

I've been, and while any museum is worth a visit, it doesn't take that long to go through... There is also a little area that has some historic buildings on the grounds, saved from demolition from all over the county. It's just around the corner from Miner's.
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Kathleen
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Username: Kathleen

Post Number: 695
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Posted From: 69.14.122.57
Posted on Thursday, June 23, 2005 - 7:52 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Desiree Cooper from the Free Press following the devastating fire at the Piquette Market/EMF-Studebaker Plant:

June 23, 2005

History doesn't preserve itself: Pieces of Detroit's past deserve more

BY DESIREE COOPER
FREE PRESS COLUMNIST

"They say you don't know what you've got until it's gone. After Monday night's five-alarm fire that incinerated a 99-year-old former Studebaker plant in Detroit, that saying is ringing true. Eulogies for the mammoth building that stretched an entire city block lament the role the plant played in launching one of the most important inventions of our age: the automobile.

The plant on Piquette at John R once housed one of the largest automakers in the world, second only to the Ford Motor Co. Next door, Henry Ford built his first 12,000 Model T's between 1908 and 1910. In fact, the entire area, known as Milwaukee Junction, is home to 35 historic buildings relating to the emerging auto industry.

Why can't we seem to relish our history before it all goes up in smoke?...."

For the complete article: http://www.freep.com/news/metr o/cooper23e_20050623.htm
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Aiw
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Username: Aiw

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Posted From: 209.216.150.127
Posted on Thursday, June 23, 2005 - 8:21 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks K.

This seems like a good time to revive this thread, after the loss of such a giant building.
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Sven1977
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Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Thursday, June 23, 2005 - 5:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hopefully this thread raised people's interest to head downtown to Piquette to see the Studebaker plant while it was still around. It is strange to see the sections of the building that are still standing. Stairways perhaps? One picture still shows "Studebaker" on the wall. Mike M., are you a commercial pilot or a weekend flyer in a triplane?
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Bob_cosgrove
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Username: Bob_cosgrove

Post Number: 108
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Posted From: 67.38.11.192
Posted on Thursday, June 23, 2005 - 11:54 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The Detroit Historical Museum gave Desiree Cooper a copy of our "Milwaukee Junction" brochure for help with her Detroit Free Press article. We mentioned the brochure previously on detroityes.com. The color illustration on the brochure's cover cover is the 1906 Wayne/Northern/EMF/Studebaker plant destroyed in Monday night's fire.

The brochure is subtitled "Cradle of the Automobile Industry" covers the many auto and parts plants between Woodward and St. Aubin (site of the GM Hamtramck Assembly Plant - Pole Town) and from Harper north to Clay.

The brochures are available in the Detroit Historical Museum gift shop for $2. Or, send a self-addressed envelope and check for $3 payable to the Detroit Historical Society Guild to Bob Cosgrove, Curator, Detroit Historical Museum, 5401 Woodward Avenue, Detroit, MI 48202 and we'll mail one to you.

Bob Cosgrove
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Jjaba
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Username: Jjaba

Post Number: 1982
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Posted From: 24.22.7.93
Posted on Saturday, June 25, 2005 - 1:30 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

jjaba ordered the brochure and received it quickly. He endorses it. It is a nice booklet.
jjaba
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Kathleen
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Username: Kathleen

Post Number: 699
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Posted From: 69.14.122.57
Posted on Saturday, June 25, 2005 - 8:21 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Definitely worth more than the cost, too!!!

Here's a short article about the Ford Piquette Plant that appeared in yesterday's Free Press:

Detroit Free Press, June 24, 2005

MODEL T SITE RESCUED FROM RUIN

by BILL McGRAW

"Most Detroit stories about preserving the past sound familiar: Buildings age ungracefully, acquire graffiti, start falling apart and get demolished.

Or they burn.

That's why the story of the Model T birthplace is so unusual. It has turned into a real, live, historically preserved landmark. And, for the first time, the public can get in twice a month to check it out.

...

The Model T plant was on its way to ruin, too, when it was preserved by a band of auto history buffs....."

http://www.freep.com/news/locw ay/journal24e_20050624.htm
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Kathleen
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Username: Kathleen

Post Number: 720
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Posted on Monday, June 27, 2005 - 11:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

AIW,

Dave and I are planning a visit to Kingsville and will take in the auto museum sometime in the next two weeks. So, librarian that I am, I went online to the museum's website and was perusing their list of automobile companies that were based on southwestern Ontario. One name caught by eye: Menard Auto Buggy; Menard Motor Truck. My great-great-grandmother Rose Menard was born in Belle River.

I then Google'd these two company names and came up with the Windsor PL's webpages on the company, discussing Moise Menard and his buggy company and interest in automobiles. I'll have to do a bit more research to see where Moise fits into the family history. I'm not sure if he was Rose's brother or her cousin. I'll have to see if the Windsor PL has any info on his family background.

Have you run across any Menard automobile sites in Essex County? or any info at all on these companies?

This could be interesting!!!
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Aiw
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Username: Aiw

Post Number: 4180
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Posted From: 67.71.65.157
Posted on Monday, June 27, 2005 - 11:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Kathleen, I'll have a look and get back to you... If you're out that way swing through Leamington. The Heinz Factory (while not cars) is a Kahn. It's your normal run of the mill 1930 industrial factory, but worth a visit to shoot.... Add it to the Kahn photo album.
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Kathleen
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Username: Kathleen

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Posted on Monday, June 27, 2005 - 11:52 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks, Andrew. I totally forgot about The Heinz Factory by Kahn. Thanks for the reminder!
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Jjaba
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Username: Jjaba

Post Number: 2008
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Posted From: 24.22.7.93
Posted on Tuesday, June 28, 2005 - 12:25 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Andrew, what was the product produced in that Kahn Heinz plant; gerkins, pickles, ketchup, what?
What's the use of it today?
jjaba, good natured thread jacking.
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Aiw
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Username: Aiw

Post Number: 4182
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Posted From: 67.71.65.157
Posted on Tuesday, June 28, 2005 - 7:05 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Heinz Ketchup for the Canadian market. There are actually two formula's one for Canada and one for America.
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Aiw
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Post Number: 4185
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Posted From: 209.216.150.127
Posted on Tuesday, June 28, 2005 - 8:54 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Kathleen, For the museum head south on Highway 3, there is a sign where to turn, that will be the Arner Townline. It's a good 5 or 6 miles after you turn to the Museum.
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Jjaba
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Posted From: 24.22.7.93
Posted on Tuesday, June 28, 2005 - 2:20 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Now AIW has messed with jjaba. There's two Heinz ketchups?
Is the Kahn factory still in use today as Heinz Ketchup?
What about a picture now that you've got us interested in another wonderful Kahn site.
jjaba, man about Kahn.
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Aiw
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Username: Aiw

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Posted From: 64.228.203.111
Posted on Friday, July 01, 2005 - 3:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

JJaba, the factory today still pumps out Ketchup. Sadly that one's still not in my xyz picture files.
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Aiw
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Posted on Friday, July 01, 2005 - 3:22 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I took a ride this morning, based on a tip from a friend. I drove out to Tilbury, Ontario, about 30 miles east of Windsor where I was told the old Hudson Factory still was standing. The Factory produced the Hudson Essex.

Here it is:



A mural downtown tells about the factory:





A pano of the factory:

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Sven1977
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Username: Sven1977

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Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Friday, July 01, 2005 - 4:21 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Good work Andrew. Was it really a final assembly plant? It hardly looks big enough.
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Aiw
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Posted From: 64.228.195.114
Posted on Friday, July 01, 2005 - 4:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It really was. The plant goes deeper than the view here. Although I wasn't sure how to get back there...

Here's a link to the Canadian built Hudson's... The webmaster is looking for info about the Tilbury Assmebly Plant.
http://www.hudsonmotorcar.org/

It seems the plant ran from the 30's until the Nash/Hudson merger to form AMC.

http://www.windsorpubliclibrar y.com/digi/wow/plants/hudson.h tm
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Sven1977
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Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Tuesday, July 05, 2005 - 11:44 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Does anyone have any information on the Ford tractor plant that used to be in Birmingham on Maple Road?
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Kathleen
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Username: Kathleen

Post Number: 745
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Posted From: 69.14.122.57
Posted on Wednesday, July 13, 2005 - 11:40 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Keeping this thread alive.....

Dave and I visited the Southwestern Ontario Heritage Village and Transportation Museum in Kingsville Monday afternoon. I enjoyed all the cars, running from the 1893 Shamrock up to the 1956 Lincoln...that's about as new as I enjoy photographing!! There were actually a number of cars in their collection that I photographed to fill in gaps in my Detroit automobile photohistory, so it was well worth the visit. Of particular note was a 1920 Dodge with a sign that said "Barn Fresh"....still dusty from its home of many years!!

A few posts above, I asked AIW if he knew anything about an Essex County automobile manufacture named Moise L. Menard, said to be the founder/owner of the Menard Auto Buggy Works, the Menard Commercial Car Company, and the Menard Motor Truck Company Limited. I have Menards in my father's lineage through his mother and there are a couple named Moise in the family tree. So, before we headed home, we stopped at the Windsor Public Library where I was able to locate Mr. Menard's 1946 obituary from the Windsor Star. The librarian, though, struck gold for me with an undated (1950s?) article that was in somebody's scrapbook. The headline reads "Consider Menard As Father of Auto" and the article goes on to say that "Many historians consider Moise L. (Mose) Menard, blacksmith, wagon maker, car manufacturer and public servant, the father of the automobile in Windsor." It further states that he made a decision to move to the production of trucks, which likely cost him the fame and success he would have received if he stayed with the automobile. He was in the vehicle manufacturing business starting with wagons in 1875 through 1920 when he sold his company. He had operations in Belle River, Stoney Pointe, and Windsor (at the intersection of London and Caron--does that still exist?). In addition, the article provided his birth date which was enough to determine that he was the older brother of my great-great-grandmother!! So I have some automobile industry blood in me, even if it is just a few drops from 4 generations back!!! AIW: Let me know if you want a copy of the article and the obituary.

Also, in Kingsville, we checked out the old train station. According to the published history of Kingsville, Hiram Walker was instrumental in bringing people and business to Kingville. He had a summer home there, and hired Mason and Rice to design and build the train station and the Mattawas Hotel (demolished in the 1980s, I think). Albert Kahn is given credit for designing the train station.

kingsvilletrainstation

Lastly, check out the "For Jjaba" thread in Detroit Connections for some Leamington/Heinz photos and a question for AIW!
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Aiw
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Post Number: 4318
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Posted From: 209.216.150.127
Posted on Thursday, July 14, 2005 - 12:02 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Kathleen, The Mettawas was gone long before the 80's... It was demoed in 1902...

Here's an interesting link: http://www.walkervilletimes.co m/26/to-the-mettawas.html

Walker built his own railway line, this I believe is the only remaining Station. M&R also did the Windsor station leveled in the 1950's for a "modern" station.

I would love a copy of that article, feel free to scan it and e-mail my way :-)

As for London & Caron, it still exists... London became University back a long time ago....

I can't place anything at that intersection that would be factory like... I'd have to see an old Sandborn map to say one way or the other. I'll try and get out and shoot all four corner for you.

If you and Dave were at the Library, you were only about 5 blocks west from my place... You should have let me know you were coming over...
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Bob_cosgrove
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Post Number: 130
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Posted From: 207.74.110.238
Posted on Thursday, July 14, 2005 - 12:24 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The Walker railway's office building which was across the tracks and further west from the present Windsor Station has been removed in the last 10 years or so, but was in use until then.

Bob Cosgrove
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Sven1977
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Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Tuesday, July 19, 2005 - 11:28 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

My mom grew up in Kingsville and spent many hours dancing to big bands like Glenn Miller at the band shell.
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Bate
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Username: Bate

Post Number: 39
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Posted From: 4.247.230.138
Posted on Monday, July 25, 2005 - 6:00 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hi all. Nice to see the auto plant thread is still alive. I recently picked up a couple of book titles that should be interesting to anyone following along here. "Rivethead" ISBN: 0446394009 and "Autopsy of an Engine: and Other Stories from the Cadillac Plant" ISBN: 1566891612. Both are from the auto workers perspective and available from "the jungle" (amazon) and other fine book sellers. Figure 11-12.00 new, 1.50 and up used.

Enjoy
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Sven1977
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Username: Sven1977

Post Number: 97
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Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Tuesday, July 26, 2005 - 2:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Here's a car built in Detroit by Stout Engineering. Wonder where their plant was? Only a few were ever built.



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Kathleen
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Username: Kathleen

Post Number: 772
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Posted From: 140.244.107.151
Posted on Tuesday, July 26, 2005 - 3:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The car pictured above is the Stout Scarab.

Here's an address in a webpage I found:

Stout Motor Car Corp & Engineering Lab - 2124 S. Telegraph St. Dearborn, MI

And some additional info:

"William B. Stout, inventor of tri-motor airplane, also designed and built Scarab Automobile in Dearborn. The Scarab was aerodynamic vehicle with a rear engine mount. In 1945, Owen Corning, working with William Stout, developed the Stout-Scarab auto. This prototype, which never made it into production, was the first car with a FRP (Fiberglass-Reinforced Plastic) body."

For more information: http://www.coachbuilt.com/des/ s/stout_william/stout_william. htm
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Mikem
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Username: Mikem

Post Number: 1780
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Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Tuesday, July 26, 2005 - 3:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

looks like they wanted to make a hearse out of a Beetle, but I love it!

FYI, today I received in the mail "Recasting the Machine Age: Henry Ford's Village Industries" by Howard Segal.

http://www.umass.edu/umpress/f all_04/segal.html

I'll give a book review when I'm done with it. Although it is from an academic press, it has pictures too, if your reading level hasn't advanced beyond the magazine. :-)
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Bob_cosgrove
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Username: Bob_cosgrove

Post Number: 142
Registered: 03-2005
Posted From: 207.74.110.132
Posted on Tuesday, July 26, 2005 - 9:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Contrary to popular myth, the designers of the Ford Tri-Motor were Henry Ford's engineers under the direction of Ford's chief engineer, William B. Mayo, not William Stout. Although Stout certainly deserves credit for the basic concept of the thick wing and the corrugated fuselage, three-engined aircraft based on his earlier designs.

Stout's studio in the 1920's was where the vacant lot is across from the Ford Motor 1904 Piquette Avenue Plant.

Bob Cosgrove
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Jjaba
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Post Number: 2084
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Posted From: 24.22.7.93
Posted on Tuesday, July 26, 2005 - 11:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks Bob. jjaba used your Milwaukee Junction book with great success on an adventure with Lowell a few weeks back. jjaba took the risk of going deep into the Eastside once he had the security of your dandy booklet. Now you tell us of William Stout's Studios there too. Amazing district.

jjaba collected some bricks from the Studebaker bldg. fire and used them as trivia contest winners at the Detroit Beer Company just after the tour. Forummers were delighted.
Thanks alot.

Sven, your photo is wonderful. What a unique car, eh.

jjaba, a Westsider who survived a day on the Eastside with The Rock and Lowell.
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Sven1977
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Post Number: 98
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Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Friday, July 29, 2005 - 11:07 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Kathleen, I think you mentioned many months ago about a book sale going on this weekend. What are the details again?
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Kathleen
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Post Number: 781
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Posted From: 140.244.107.151
Posted on Friday, July 29, 2005 - 11:42 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Here you go:

The Friends of the National Automotive History Collection Duplicates Sale, Saturday - Sunday, July 30 - 31, 10 am - 4 pm, DPL Extension Building, 801 W. Baltimore Avenue (at Third St., in the New Center area).

For more info: http://www.detroit.lib.mi.us/f riends/index.htm#NAHC
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Kathleen
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Post Number: 787
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Posted From: 69.14.122.57
Posted on Sunday, July 31, 2005 - 12:07 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Did anyone go? How was it?
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Sven1977
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Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Monday, August 01, 2005 - 11:28 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I went down to the book sale. Lots of stuff. Nothing was very cheap but people were buying. I went the the Studebaker pile of bricks afterwards and saw a number of people drive buy to take pictures. Shovels were cleaning up the area where the meat market used to be. It still has a powerfull stink. Whew! I ran into a guy who was taking pictures. He said that he had a hobby of collecting pictures of old car factories. "Boy do I have a website for you!" I told him. I helped eliminate the mess by removing two bricks. Most all of the "good" brick are gone. Then a man stopped his van in the middle of the road, got out and started asking questions about if it was okay to take bricks. He "knew the owner" and it was his way of balling us out for helping to clean the sidewalk. Whatever...
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Kathleen
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Posted From: 69.14.122.57
Posted on Monday, August 01, 2005 - 11:39 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks for the report, Sven. I suspected that the prices would be for the super serious collectors only.

Dave and I stopped by the Studebaker plant site on Saturday morning as well to see how the clean up is going and take a few photos of the progress. Yes, it still stinks pretty bad, but it certainly has improved a lot. I wouldn't worry one iota about taking the bricks. Since Day 1, people have been taking bricks and other souvenirs. (I got mine, for sure!!) I even saw people loading pickup trucks with the heavy metal items which I assumed they were taking to the recycling place to turn in for $$$.
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Kathleen
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Post Number: 801
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Posted From: 140.244.107.151
Posted on Thursday, August 04, 2005 - 9:43 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Talked with Boston-Edison historian Jerald Mitchell the other day at the Boston-Edison Centennial Celebration. Of course, the Studebaker plant fire and T-Plex came up in the course of conversation as Jerry is the T-Plex CEO.

Just a reminder that T-Plex (Ford Piquette Plant) is open for tours on the first and third Saturdays of the month, 10-4. And the Preservation Wayne Auto Heritage Tour of the surrounding area follows the same 1st and 3rd Saturday schedule with a 10am walking tour that starts at T-Plex.
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Kathleen
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Posted on Thursday, August 04, 2005 - 9:51 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Anyone catch the Nash article in this week's issue of Detroit Auto Scene? Unfortunately the article is not posted online.

Last month, as part of Flint's Sesquicentennial Celebration, the Erie Shores Nash Car Club sponsored a "Ramble" of vintage Nash automobiles called "Charles Nash Returns to Flint" and included stops at the Sloan Museum, Nash House and Durant-Dort Office Bldg. in Flint as well the rejuvenated Nash-Kelvinator plant building on Plymouth Rd. Interesting article with a lot of Nash facts.
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Aiw
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Post Number: 4521
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Posted From: 65.92.102.253
Posted on Monday, August 15, 2005 - 6:36 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Bump
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Mikem
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Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Monday, August 15, 2005 - 11:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

From Jenay's link to the Detroit Publishing Co.'s archives:

Detroit Copper & Brass:

DCB

DCB2

So we can eliminate this as possibly being part of the Paige factory.
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Aiw
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Post Number: 4523
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Posted From: 65.92.102.253
Posted on Monday, August 15, 2005 - 11:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Is that on the west side Mike near the river?
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Mikem
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Post Number: 1815
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Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Monday, August 15, 2005 - 11:45 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

USRubber

Detroit Rubber Works 1908

a/k/a Murray & Wright - U.S. Rubber & Tire - Uniroyal
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Hornwrecker
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Posted From: 63.41.24.129
Posted on Monday, August 15, 2005 - 11:56 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Chalmers Motor Co, from the same link

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Hornwrecker
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Post Number: 54
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Posted From: 63.41.24.129
Posted on Monday, August 15, 2005 - 11:59 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Cadillac Motor Car Co
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Hornwrecker
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Post Number: 55
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Posted From: 63.41.24.129
Posted on Tuesday, August 16, 2005 - 12:04 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Packard
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Mikem
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Post Number: 1817
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Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Tuesday, August 16, 2005 - 12:13 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

AIW, yes.

Ford
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Mikem
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Post Number: 1818
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Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Tuesday, August 16, 2005 - 12:15 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"Riemer's Loco winning five-miles event in 10:51 4-5, Grosse Pointe track, Detroit." 1902

race
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Mikem
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Post Number: 1819
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Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Tuesday, August 16, 2005 - 12:25 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Packard: E Grand Blvd at Canton

Packard
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Rustic
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Username: Rustic

Post Number: 1683
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Posted From: 128.253.198.203
Posted on Tuesday, August 16, 2005 - 12:28 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hornwreckers last photo appears to show the packard factory under construction ... heady days those, eh?
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Mikem
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Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Tuesday, August 16, 2005 - 12:32 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It was either Packard or Hudson (or both) that operated for a few years with a two-story building before expanding upward. Now that I think of it, Chalmers had floors added as did Ford's Highland Park factory.
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Mikem
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Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Tuesday, August 16, 2005 - 12:36 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

More Packard:

http://rs6.loc.gov/cgi-bin/que ry/D?detr:1269:./temp/~ammem_B 21m:

Add that colon on the end.

I think the water tank is still there.
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Aiw
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Username: Aiw

Post Number: 4524
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Posted From: 209.216.150.127
Posted on Tuesday, August 16, 2005 - 9:24 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thought it looked familliar.
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Bob_cosgrove
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Username: Bob_cosgrove

Post Number: 163
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Posted From: 207.74.111.29
Posted on Tuesday, August 16, 2005 - 11:06 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The caption on the photo Mikem posted on 8-15-05 of the former UniRoyal plant on East Jefferson just west of the East Grand Boulevard (Belle Isel Bridge) identifies its previous name as "Murray & Wright." Not unlike some Library of Congress Detroit Publishing Company photo captions, that is incorrect. The correct name of the predecessor to U.S. Rubber and UniRoyal is Morgan & Wright.
Bob Cosgrove
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Hornwrecker
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Username: Hornwrecker

Post Number: 56
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Posted From: 63.41.8.147
Posted on Tuesday, August 16, 2005 - 12:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The Timken-Detroit Axle Co., Detroit, Mich.

timken

Hudson Motor Car Co., Detroit, Mich..

hudson
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Hornwrecker
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Post Number: 57
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Posted From: 63.41.8.147
Posted on Tuesday, August 16, 2005 - 1:02 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Buhl Stamping in Detroit

buhl

I'm not sure exactly what they made, but this photo shows signs for lanterns, so I guess that they probably made headlights, as well as other stamped metal parts for cars.
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Jjaba
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Post Number: 2112
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Posted From: 67.189.31.36
Posted on Wednesday, August 17, 2005 - 1:53 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Bob Cosgrove is all over it. Murray Wright is auto bodies. Good work, Bob.
jjaba
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Jjaba
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Post Number: 2115
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Posted From: 67.189.31.36
Posted on Wednesday, August 17, 2005 - 2:53 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Moise L. Menard, Blacksmith.

Menard Auto Buggy Company, 1908-09
Menard Commerical Car Company, 1910-16
Menard Motor Truck Company, 1917-20

Sold out to Maple Leaf Munufacturing Company, Montreal, 1920.

Blacksmith Moise L. Menard built a car designed by Detroiter M.B. Covert. He made a "highwheeler" with oversized tires, a fashion for a time then.
It was completely manufactured in Windsor, Ontario with no imported parts. Good sales were recorded in Quebec and in the Prairie Provinces of Canada.

As mentioned by Kathleen, he switched to trucks, making one ton to 3 1/2 ton trucks. In 1916, he delivered to the City of Windsor, a Menard aerial ladder fire truck.

After selling his business in 1920, Moise L. Menard was elected Mayor of Riverside, Ont. in 1923. He died in 1946.

jjaba, some research.
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Hornwrecker
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Posted From: 66.2.148.75
Posted on Wednesday, August 24, 2005 - 12:50 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ford's first factory on Mack, from the above site. {I had to resize it slightly for posting.}

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Sven1977
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Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Thursday, August 25, 2005 - 11:03 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Does anyone know if the Checker building near Tiger stadium was always the cab company garage? At least it looks like a garage.
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Psip
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Username: Psip

Post Number: 239
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Posted From: 69.246.13.131
Posted on Saturday, September 03, 2005 - 8:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

bump
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Jjaba
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Post Number: 2217
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Posted From: 67.189.31.36
Posted on Saturday, September 03, 2005 - 10:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Sven, the Checker Garage on Trumbull has been there as long as jjaba can remember. jjaba remembers it from many yrs. of going to ballgames.
jjaba,Westsider.
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Bob_cosgrove
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Posted From: 207.74.111.49
Posted on Sunday, September 04, 2005 - 8:35 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Volume II of the 1929 Baist's Real Estate Atlas lists the Checker Garage on Trumbull across from the ball park as the Detroit Cab Company. Given the chance, I'll research it further in Polk's City of Detroit Directories.

Bob Cosgrove
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Jjaba
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Username: Jjaba

Post Number: 2219
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Posted From: 67.189.31.36
Posted on Sunday, September 04, 2005 - 4:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It is very possible that Detroit Cab Company was there. The facility had been a taxi garage forever it seems.
jjaba
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Hornwrecker
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Posted From: 63.41.8.250
Posted on Friday, September 16, 2005 - 12:59 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

[Assembling room, Leland & Faulconer Manufacturing Co., Detroit, Mich.

Leland

Photo shows men working at foundry and machine shop that produced automobile engines and merged with Cadillac Motor Co. in 1905.
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Jjaba
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Posted From: 24.22.82.162
Posted on Friday, September 16, 2005 - 2:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Compare this scene to later auto manufacturing in those bright light Albert Kahn buildings. Amazing.

Thanks Hornwrecker. Wonderful photo. Do you have an address?
jjaba
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Hornwrecker
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Post Number: 89
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Posted From: 63.41.40.149
Posted on Friday, September 16, 2005 - 4:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

jjaba, I think that might be their orginal machine shop at Trombley and Dequindre, so it was of the Eastside.

Here's a group photo of the boys at L & F posing in their everyday duds.



(Message edited by Hornwrecker on September 16, 2005)
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Hornwrecker
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Post Number: 92
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Posted From: 63.41.40.79
Posted on Friday, September 16, 2005 - 10:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

F & L Office

Mr Faulconer {left} and Mr Leland in their office.

From what I gather, they made engines for Olds at this time. This company was later merged into the Detroit Automobile Co, when Leland took it over after Henry Ford pulled out. I think that this company turned into Cadillac.

This thread is getting so long, I can't remember if this was mentioned earlier.
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Bob_cosgrove
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Post Number: 221
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Posted From: 207.74.110.64
Posted on Saturday, September 17, 2005 - 5:34 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Kathleen began this thread on May 23 mentioning the Old German Protestant Home for Orphas and Old People and then switched to the Kling's Palace Gardens Amusement Park.

She raised a question when she said, "The Kling Brewery was founded by Philip Kling whose daugher Emilie married Louis Kamper, the architect, who for a while worked for the Kling Brewery. It is not known whether Kamper was hired by Kling and then married his daughter, or if he married the daughter and then worked for Kling."

Louis Kamper (1861-1953) married Emelie Kling (1871-1846)on July 20, 1890. He was then practicing as an architect having trained with the famed architectural partnership of McKim, Mead and White in New York City.

German born Kamper had come to the United States in 1880. His first major commission in Detroit was the 1888 Exposition Pavilion, which was located where the large truck terminal stands to the west of Historic Fort Wayne.

In 1890 he designed the Colonel Frank J. Hecker mansion on the northeast corner of Woodward and Ferry pictued here. Col. Hecker and his parnter Charles Lang Freer, whose mansion is behind Hecker's on Ferry, were the principals in the Peninsular Car Company.

Kamper left architecture for a few years in the mid-1890's after he had married Emelie.

Bob Cosgrove Colonel Fank J. Hecker mansion
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Bob_cosgrove
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Post Number: 222
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Posted on Saturday, September 17, 2005 - 5:41 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I should have mentioned Kamper left architecture to manage the Kline Brewery for a few years before returning to that field.

Bob Cosgrov
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Jjaba
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Posted From: 24.22.82.162
Posted on Saturday, September 17, 2005 - 2:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks Bob. Great story and photo.

Hornwrecker, that puts the plant in the Milwaukee Junction Industrial District.
jjaba
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Bob_cosgrove
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Posted From: 207.74.111.64
Posted on Saturday, September 17, 2005 - 9:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The Leland & Falconer Machine Shop was on Trombly on with buildings on both sides of the Grand Trunk tracks east of Russell and west of St. Aubin.
Bob Cosgrove
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Psip
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Post Number: 297
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Posted From: 69.246.13.131
Posted on Sunday, September 25, 2005 - 1:57 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The Allied Chemical Semet Solvay Division
Coke

Massey Ferguson Tractor Plant
MF tractor
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Jjaba
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Posted From: 24.22.82.162
Posted on Sunday, September 25, 2005 - 2:40 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Love those M-F Tractors. Is this the plant on Southfield Road?
jjaba.
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Hornwrecker
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Post Number: 140
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Posted From: 63.41.8.9
Posted on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 - 12:17 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I found a bunch of photos of some fallen marks' factories. Companies like Kessler-Detroit, Krit, Kessline, Abbott, Carter Car, Brush Runabout, E-M-F, and Regal. Does anyone remember if period photos of these have been posted yet? I'm on dial-up, and I don't want to re-size all of them if they've been already done. I also found a bunch of photos from Liberty; interior and exterior shots.

Just to add something constructive, here is the Oakand Car Co in Pontiac MI, which was later Pontiac.

Oakland Motors

Lowell, can we have another page? Please.
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Mikem
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Post Number: 1914
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Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 - 12:41 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I think the only one from the list that has been posted here is Regal; I posted a scan of a colorized post card of their factory on Piquette:

http://atdetroit.net/forum/mes sages/5/40963.html#POST339928

How does it compare with your Regal photo?
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Hornwrecker
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Posted From: 63.41.8.9
Posted on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 - 12:53 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The photo is of the same building, only bleaker with no landscaping, but it shows the front of the building too.

I also found a cool one of the Dodge Bros test track behind the factory. Kind of a board oval, with these big cars racing around. Another is of the Flint Wagon Works which became the first Chevrolet factory.

I guess I'll get busy on cropping and resizing.
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Sven1977
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Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 - 12:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Post'em! Summer is over and it's time to start researching again.
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Hornwrecker
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Post Number: 144
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Posted From: 63.41.40.215
Posted on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 - 4:23 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Abbott Motor Company factory



Abbott Motor Company

According to Jjaba's definitive list of addresses:

Abbott- used Northern plant (1910) then built at Beaufait & Waterloo (to 1915). Changed name to Consolidated Car Company in 1916. They then moved to a larger plant in Cleveland and went bankrupt in 1918. The cars use the 4 and 6 cylinder Continental engines, and the 8 cyl Herschell-Spillman engine.

Enlargement of photo showing details of vehicles in front,

Abbott 2

Any other info on Abbott?
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Bob_cosgrove
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Post Number: 238
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Posted From: 207.74.111.55
Posted on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 - 9:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Getting back to the Detroit Taxicab and Transfer Company on Trumbull across from the Tiger Stadium, it first appears in the 1918 Polks City of Detroit Directory, which dates the building 1917 or 1918. The company's president was Angus Smith, one of the sons of Samuel Latta Smith, the financial backer of Ransom E. Olds in Oldsmobile.
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Jjaba
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Posted From: 24.22.82.162
Posted on Tuesday, September 27, 2005 - 11:28 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Great info. Bob. jjaba has two Oldsmobiles in his stable. That garage has been full of cabs for as long as jjaba can remember. Been going to Tigers games since the 1940s. Always cabs at the ready, even in the days of the street cars on Trumbull and Michigan Avenue. Gotta picture for the people?
jjaba, Westsider.
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Bob_cosgrove
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Posted From: 207.74.111.29
Posted on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 - 3:36 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Sorry no photograph. But, I also noted that Brooks Lumber, which is next door to Trumbull cab garage, was listed in the 1918 Polks Directory and probably goes back further than that.

Bob Cosgrove
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Jjaba
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Posted From: 24.22.82.162
Posted on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 - 4:48 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Before enclosure of Briggs Stadium, balls were often hit out into the lumber yard. It is recorded in many books. Bob Cosgrove tells it like it tis.
jjaba, in the bleachers.
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Hornwrecker
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Post Number: 148
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Posted From: 63.41.8.141
Posted on Wednesday, September 28, 2005 - 5:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Photo of Abbott Motor Co badge.

Abbott badge
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Hornwrecker
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Post Number: 151
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Posted From: 63.41.40.248
Posted on Thursday, September 29, 2005 - 12:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Here are a couple of ads from Abbott-Detroit. They show two addresses both on Waterloo, 108 and later 615.

.Abbott-Detroit ad

A closeup of the bottom of the ad.

 Abbott-Detroit ad c/u

A later ad, showing prices starting at $1700 up to over $3000, also featured an electric starter.

Abbott-Detroit ad 2

A photo of a 1912 Abbott-Detroit.

1912 Abbott-Detroit

This is about all I can find on the net about Abbott, and I don't feel like leaving the basement.

I"m currently working on Brush Runabout, and Cartercar, which will be posted soon, I hope, and have Kessler, Krit, and Liberty started
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Jjaba
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Post Number: 2423
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Posted From: 24.22.82.162
Posted on Thursday, September 29, 2005 - 1:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Excellent work Hornwrecker. Thanks for your research and fantastic photos.
jjaba
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Sven1977
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Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Thursday, September 29, 2005 - 1:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I looked for the old Abbot building on Waterloo but there are old houses where I think it should be. It's right near the cemetery and Vernor.
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Jjaba
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Posted From: 24.22.82.162
Posted on Thursday, September 29, 2005 - 6:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The Abbott Detroit car was built, 1909-19.
A luxury car, the basic ones went for $1,700 and the Foredor sold for $3,050.
The car was guaranteed for life.

The company went kaput in 1919. Hornwrecker's photos show us the craftsmanship involved. Pure Detroit. Pure joy. Pure driving pleasure.

But compared to jjaba's 1941 fourdoor Chevy, new for $600, you can imagine how dear that really was in the early 1900s.

jjaba on the Westside.
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Jjaba
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Posted on Thursday, September 29, 2005 - 6:50 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

James W. Abbott started in Detroit with Abbott-Detroit but then expanded to build cars in Cleveland. These Abbott cars dropped the "Detroit" from the name and rightfully so. They were not made here. It turned out to be his swansong.

In Detroit, the 1912 Abbott Detroit "30" roadster was all the rage.

The Cleveland factory ran 1916-18. The sixes ran a Continental engine. The eights, a Hershell-Spillman engine.

In 1919, the company went kaput. Bankrupt. Curtains, the last guy out, turn off the lights.

jjaba, FOB Detroit.
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Hornwrecker
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Posted From: 63.41.40.55
Posted on Friday, September 30, 2005 - 10:40 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks for the info Jjaba, it sure was a top of the line marque.

I lied about the next maker as I've accidentally found enough info on Krit first, or as it seems to be spelled: K-R-I-T. The story has ties to Briggs-Detroiter, Brush, Ford, Owen, Regal, and Russel.

From the list of makers and locations:

K-R-I-T (1909-10) 2600-2795 Wight St & Lieb (former C.H. Bloomstrom)

K-R-I-T (1911-15) 1608 E. Grand Blvd. {former Owen factory}

This photo must be of their plant on East Grand Blvd, heavily airbrushed.

K-R-I-T factory
DPL collection on all photos

The Krit Motor Car Company was founded in Detroit in mid-1909 and set up by a group of people including W.S. Piggins and Claude S. Briggs to build cars designed by Kenneth Crittenden, whose background had included spells at Ford and Regal prior to this. Crittenden's new car, which began to roll off the production line in the autumn of 1909, was much in the mould of both other companies, being a four cylinder model with a purposeful 25hp fitted in a car of modest proportions. This combination allowed it to achieve fair competitive success in a number of hillclimb events, and to begin to establish a reputation.

Krit c/u

Despite this promising start and their choice of a swastika as a motif for the company - a 19th century good luck symbol - it consistently suffered from financial troubles, and early on lost one of the principal team, Briggs, who left to work at Brush and later on the Detroiter cars. By 1911 Krit was sold to Walter S. Russel of the Russel Wheel and Foundry company. Russel increased capital, and took over the former Owen plant for manufacturing the Krit, with Crittenden now installed as head of engineering and Vice President. This development was also not met with the fortune that it perhaps deserved, as even with the manufacturing streamlined the cars' sales became affected. Firstly local demand suffered from a poor crop harvest in 1913, and then the export market which had proven successful was limited by the onset of war in Europe. {I found this under spelling Krittenden with a "C".}

Taken from an auction listing at, with no source given
http://www.practicalclassics.co.uk/auctionlot/by-id/1478316112/

An interior shot of the factory showing the chassis room.

Krit interior

More photos of ad, cars, and some details to come...\

{edited to correct street names and spelling}

(Message edited by Hornwrecker on September 30, 2005)

(Message edited by Hornwrecker on October 01, 2005)

(Message edited by Hornwrecker on October 01, 2005)
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Bob_cosgrove
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Posted From: 207.74.110.34
Posted on Saturday, October 01, 2005 - 12:41 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Do you mean Wight Street rather than Wright?

Bob Cosgrove
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Hornwrecker
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Post Number: 155
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Posted From: 63.41.40.55
Posted on Saturday, October 01, 2005 - 1:08 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'm going by a list that Jjaba posted earlier on this thread, and making corrections, and adding info as I find it.

This thing is getting too unwieldly for me to remember which page the list was on., so I keep it handy on one of my numerous text files. Checking an old street map, by George, you are correct sir. Will edit post.

Thanks
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Jjaba
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Posted on Saturday, October 01, 2005 - 2:11 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

1608 E. Grand is East Grand Blvd.
There is a Grand Avenue north of Davison so we must make the distinction.

Excellent pictures and discussion from Hornwrecker. Thanks.
jjaba
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Jjaba
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Posted on Saturday, October 01, 2005 - 2:59 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The KRIT Factory, 1608 E. Grand Blvd. is on the Michigan Central RR tracks, one blk. East of Mt. Elliott St., Detroit. They made cars 1909-15.

The company is named for Kenneth Krittenden. The car bodies were made by Fisher Bros. Body Company.
Right hand models were made for export, mostly to England.

Popular models were 1914 Krit Model L Torpedo, 1913 Krit 25 HP Tourer, and roadsters.

There's a SWASTIKA, Ontario, Canada. They have a Swastika Grade School, Grades 1-6. It is in Northern Ontario, in a mining region. The town is now part of Kirkland Lake, Ontario. During WWII, the Canadian govt. suggested renaming it Winston in honour of Winston Churchill. The citizens in the town told the Govt. that their Swastika was much older than Nazis and to leave them be.

jjaba.
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Hornwrecker
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Posted on Saturday, October 01, 2005 - 12:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks Jjaba, I'll correct your list to add a Blvd, this is the good thing about a forum, instant proofreading. :-)

I'll post the rest of the KRIT stuff soon, but found some interesting, but meager evidence about Kessler. All searches for a car or ad have failed so far, but one brute force search turned up some info about them making aircraft engines. This lead to a list I edited down to pre-WWII Detroit aircraft enging makers, which is leading to a list of all Detroit area aircraft makers. I see a future Old Aero Factories thread in the distant future. Work, work, work...

I have some photos of the swastika on a KRIT radiator. Just dug out a copy of "Made in Detroit", by Beasley {1957} from the local library. I hope it's a decent read.
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Jjaba
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Posted on Saturday, October 01, 2005 - 2:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hornwrecker shows heart and good scholarship.
He's taken up the mantle on this thread.

An aero legacy thread would be incredible, given the resources we bring to this effort. It would be very illuminating to everybody.
jjaba
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Mikem
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Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Sunday, October 02, 2005 - 12:44 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

From what I can tell, the Abbott factory on Beaufait at Waterloo (E Vernor Highway) burned down during World War I while it was being leased to the Saxon Motor Co.

I posted a map clipping on the previous page showing the location of the Saxon (Abbott) plant. The Page-Litho printing company occupies part of the lot now.
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Hornwrecker
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Posted From: 63.41.40.185
Posted on Sunday, October 02, 2005 - 4:40 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Some more K-R-I-T photos.

An ad for the 1910 model

1910 Krit Ad

Here is a photo of a 1910 that is all over the web, so I don't know the original source.

1910 Krit

A close-up of the radiator swastika

1910 Krit c/u

An newer version of the swastika.

Kirt swastika

Finally, a photo of a 1914 Krit, showing the boys on a outing.

1914 Krit
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Hornwrecker
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Posted From: 63.41.8.4
Posted on Sunday, October 02, 2005 - 11:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I found a few omissions from the Detroit car makers list. One was Aerocar, the info was in the Continental thread that started this juggernaut.

Aerocar-(1905-08) Mack & Beaufait, later 1st Hudson plant

Another maker that hasn't come up yet in this thread, is Gray Motor Co., primarily known as a maker of stationary and marine engines, but they ventured into car production from 1922-26. They had a few factories around Detroit, so it might take some sleuthing to figure out where cars were produced. i think that it was later bought by Chrysler to become Chrysler-Marine. This site has a lot of info on Gray, but isn't to well organized.

http://www.geocities.com/baja/canyon/4192/Gray/graymotorcompany.html

The last maker that I found is:

Doble Detroit

In 1914 Mr. Doble drove one of his cars to Detroit where he found financial backing and produced the Doble Detroit car. The Doble Detroit was the first Doble to use a forced draft burner. It also used two-cylinder double acting uniflow engine of Doble's design. Doble had obtained capital to get a company going making steam cars but World War I was on and the government refused to give the Doble company an allotment of steel. The project thus failed and Doble returned to California, later in 1920 establishing with his brothers the Doble Steam Motor factory in Emeryville.

http://ghlin2.greenhills.net/~apatter/doble.html

I've heard ot the Doble 4 cylinder steam cars before, but never knew that they briefly were made in Detroit.

Mikem, thaks for the info on the Abbott-Saxon factory, and will ammend the list again. Will post as soon as we get a new page.
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Psip
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Posted From: 69.246.13.131
Posted on Sunday, October 02, 2005 - 11:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I think Doble was the same guy that made the steam powered air plane. Hornwrecker, you should have a video of that.
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Sven1977
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Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Monday, October 03, 2005 - 12:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Jjaba,
The K-R-I-T building on EGB isn't still there is it?
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Hornwrecker
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Posted From: 63.41.40.102
Posted on Monday, October 03, 2005 - 2:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

While googling today I found a link to UofM's Digital Sanborn Maps 1867-1970. The question is: How do you get access to it, as it is password protected?

http://sanborn.umi.com/

I'm rereading and saving all of the pages for this behemoth, to reftesh my memory and avoid duplication of efforts. I've found somethings that might prove interesting.
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Jjaba
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Posted From: 24.22.82.162
Posted on Monday, October 03, 2005 - 2:27 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Sven, you the man.
Dunno, jjaba doesn't go on the Eastside. You know the drill. Give us a full report.

jjaba, Proudly Westsider.
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Jams
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Post Number: 2165
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Posted From: 69.212.126.166
Posted on Monday, October 03, 2005 - 5:02 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hornwrecker
If you find a way to access the registration, would you post it please.

There is a particular map of The Greektown-Bricktown area from the late 1880-90s I'm looking for. I came across it years ago, and now I can't remember where I saw it.

I've been looking for that sucker for several years now. That site may be a good resource.
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Jjaba
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Posted on Monday, October 03, 2005 - 5:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

ABNER DOBLE (1891-1961)
Member, Automotive Hall of Fame.

The Doble Steam Automobile was a state of the art engineering masterpeice. 1915-25, 125 cars were produced. Factories were in Waltham, Mass., Detroit, and Emeryville, Calif.

It was a race to see which power was to be used on the roads of the World. Gas? Steam, Oil? Electric?
Doble chose steam from an oil fuel. He chose wrong. Doble is from a family of MIT engineers. His brothers John and Warren are in the business.
Abner made his first steam car in Waltham, Mass. at age 16, in 1907.

The Doble Steam Car was a luxury vehicle driven by movie stars and royalty. 42 of them were built in Emeryville, Calif. hard by the eastside of San Francisco Bay. Cars came with 100,000 mile warrantees.

When the brothers were still in Waltham, they drove their cars past the Newton, Mass. Stanley Steamer works and showed them a thing or two. Stanley's laughed as Doble perfected systems much advanced to Stanley. Factory was at 157 High St., Waltham, Mass., demolished. The Doble cars had no exhaust pipes, no exhaust at all.

Because they had financial backing in Detroit, they moved to Detroit for awhile from 1914. From 1920-32, they made 42 steamers in California.

A 1923 Doble Model E14 steam car burning fuel oil clocked 600,000 miles. It had a high pressure 4 cylinder steam engine, double acting. New price, $9,750 and the sales dept. threw in free floor mats.

A Doble Steam Car, Model E-19 clocked 186,000 miles in 20 yrs. It used 3 sets of tires and 2 batteries. Ave. mileage was 10-14 MPG Fuel Oil.
The steam cars were not good at climbing hills and had terrible vibrations at high speeds. In Calif. that meant trips to the mtns. could result in stall-outs, and loose teeth.

The Doble Bros. Steam Motors Company went kaput.
Then, they were hired as consultants all over the world.
They built steam buses in New Zealand, 1930-31. They designed and built English steam lorries and locomotives, 1931-35. In Germany, they built steam trucks, boats, and railcars.

In 1950, Abner Doble was hired by Mc Colloch Corp. to build a steam sports car.

Later, he was hired by Ford Motors and in Los Angeles, they drove his steam sports car for a few hundred miles.

The Doble Brothers are inducees of the Waltham Museum Hall of Fame. Abner Doble died in 1961, at age 70 yrs.

jjaba
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Hornwrecker
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Posted on Monday, October 03, 2005 - 6:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks Jjaba, Jay Leno had a Doble that he's restored. There was a show on Speed Channel that had it.

Found this little gem in the book I'm currently reading:

1907- "... a financial storm har blown up out of Wall Street and before the summer was over five Detroit automobile companies were in bankruptcy. They were the Aerocar, Marvel, Huber, St. Clair, and Detroit Auto Vehicle companties." Beasley, Made in Detroit, 1957

St. Clair?

The whole Ford-Malcomson thing, about him pulling out of Ford because Henry won't make an expensive car, Old Malc. cashes in and starts Aerocar which promptly folds, losing most of his Ford investment.

Also first Dodge Bros. machine shop was at 240 Monroe, then moved to Beaubien.
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Sven1977
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Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Monday, October 03, 2005 - 6:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I checked out the on-line Sanborn Maps. The main company said I could reasearch one map for somewhere around $120. They then told me that I should check out another company (ProQuest) that has access to the maps that might be cheaper but ProQuest said that they only sell to institutions like libraries and colleges. I even used Jjaba's name in the conversation but no luck.
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Jjaba
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Posted on Monday, October 03, 2005 - 8:19 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Sven, how can jjaba be the man when you the man?
jjaba has said "Sven 1977" sent me and has gotten free tire rotations, $5 off on oil changes, and free rotary lawn mower sharpening. Why, 'cause you the man.

For Sanborn maps, tell them Mr. Chase sent you.
They're partners, and have a small coffee operation in the back. jjaba can't help you here.

Hornwrekcer, thanks for the comments about Jay Leno and Malcomson. Leno's pretty much current TV royality our there, eh.
jjaba
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Psip
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Posted on Monday, October 03, 2005 - 8:53 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

for jjaba
/sorry
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Hornwrecker
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Posted From: 63.41.8.72
Posted on Monday, October 03, 2005 - 10:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

<b>THE LIST</b>

<b>Inactive Auto Plants & Related</b>

(s) standing (d) demolished # new name

<b>Abbott{-Detroit}</b> (1909-18) Northern plant (1910) then Beaufait & Waterloo(d), to OH, (then Saxon}
<b>American Electromobile</b>(1906) 1571 River St.
<b>Anderson</b> (1907-19) factory- Riopelle & 416 Clay St. / warehouse- 81-83 Jefferson
#<b>Aerocar</b>-(1905-08) Mack & Beaufait later1st Hudson plant
<b>Anhut </b>> Barnes (1909-10) 510 Howard St.

<b>Beyster Detroit </b>(1910-11) 1329 Woodward Ave.
<b>Bour-Davis</b>- (1915-??)W. Ford & 23rd St. (d)
<b>Briggs-Detroiter</b> (1911-15) 461 Holbrook Ave & Grand Trunk RR
<b>Brush</b>- (1911- ) Oakland & Rhode Island Ave, Highland Park
<b>Brush Runabout</b> (1906-7) used Briscoe Factory
<b>Buick Mfg. Co.</b>(1902)- 416-418 Howard St.
<b>Buick Auto-Vim & Power</b> (1900)- 39 Beaubien St.

<b>Cadillac Amsterdam Plant</b>- 450 Amsterdam & 1363 Cass (d) fire 1904, rebuilt (1905-21) (s) > Wescott Bldg.
<b>Cadillac</b> Clark St Plant (1921-87)- 2680 Clark St (d) except for engineering bldg > Ameritech.
<b>Cadillac</b> Fleetwood Plant aka Fisher #18 (1917-80's)- 261 West End Ave & Fort St. (d) potrions in 1993
<b>Cadillac</b> Plant #2 -1899 Trombley & Dequindre
<b>Cadillac</b> ???- Riopelle & E. Warren (s)
<b>Callie Motor Co</b>- 6210 2nd Ave.
<b>Carhartt</b> (1902-12) S.W. corner Michigan & 10th Ave
<b>Carter Color</b>- 6051 Hastings (d)
<b>Cartercar</b> (1905) 230 21st & Baker
<b>Cartercar</b>- (1907-09) 220-230 1st St., moved to Pontiac
<b>C.H. Blomstrom</b> (1904-08) 75 Clark & River Rd (100-401 Clark St)
<b>C.H. Blomstrom</b> (1906-09)- Leib & Wright St.
<b>Chalmers</b>-(1911-?) Oakland Ave
<b>Chalmers</b>- Jefferson Ave
<b>Chevrolet </b>(1911-13) converted Corcoran Lamp Factory 1145 West Grand Blvd
<b>Chevrolet</b>- 1145 W. Grand Blvd
<b>Chrysler</b>- 6501 Harper
<b>Chrysler Motors</b> (1924-)- 841 Massachusetts, Highland Park
<b>Chrysler</b>, Mack Ave Stamping- 11631 Mack Ave (d)
#<b>Columbia</b>-(1923- ) bought Liberty, Charlevoix & Conner
<b>Commercial</b> (1903-05)- 259-267 Franklin st
<b>Continental Motors</b>- 12801 E. Jefferson

<b>Day Auto Car</b> (1911-13) Trumbull (moved to) 25 E. Milwaukee
<b>Deluxe</b> (1906-09) 75 Clark & River Rd. (100-401 Clark St)
<b>Deluxe</b>- 1000 Woodward
<b>Demotcar Co</b>- (1910-?) 21st St > 1305 Bellevue
<b>DeSoto</b>-(1928-) McGraw Glass- LaSalle, Liberty engs, ex-Saxon
<b>Detroit Auto Co</b> (1901-02) 1363 Cass Ave.
<b>Detroit Auto Mfg. Co.</b> (1905-07) 177-179 Larned St.
<b>Detroit Auto Vehicle Co.</b> (1904-07) 65-71 Cathrine St.
<b>Detroit Excelsior Works</b>- S.W. Custer & Richmond
<b>Detroit Electric Car</b> (1919) was Anderson -731 10th St.
<b>Detroit Forge</b> - 9611 Winfield
<b>Detroit Ind.Veh. Co.</b>,(1926-67) DIVCO, 2435 Merrick Ave at 16th Street:
<b>Detroit Motor Casting</b>- 1067 Beaufait (s)
#<b>Detroiter{Det. Mot. Car}</b>(1912-??)-1915-17 Holbrook & Greeley.
<b>Dingfelder</b> (1903-04)- 958 Jefferson
#<b>Doble-Detroit</b>(1914-17) steam, moved to CA 1918
#<b>Dodge Brothers</b>- (1903- ) 240 Monroe> Boydell Bldg, Beaubien
<b>Dodge</b> Main- 7900 Joseph Campau Ave (d)

<b>Eclipse MFG</b> (engines) Euclid Ave
<b>EMF</b> - (1907-09) Piquette (d) fire 2005
<b>EMF</b> - Clay & Dequindre
<b>EMF</b>- also used Wayne & Northern factories
<b>EMF</b> - 75 Clark & River Rd
<b>Eureka Mfg.</b> (1905)- 169-171 Sylvester
<b>Everitt, B.F.</b>- (1909 or 11) 63-65 Fort St.

<b>Fee & Block</b>-(1908-?) 254 Jefferson
<b>Federal Motor Truck</b>-(1910-?) 5780 Federal
<b>Fisher Body</b>- W. Fort & Livernois
<b>Fisher Body</b> Plant #2 (wood kiln)- St. Antoine (d) 1925
<b>Fisher Body</b> Plant #4- Oakland Ave.
<b>Fisher Body</b> Plant #12 -1961 E. Milwaukee (d)
<b>Fisher Body</b> Plant #18 (aka Cadillac Fleetwood Plant)- West End Ave
<b>Fisher Body</b> #19 - Piquette and Hastings.
<b>Fisher Plant</b> #21>GMC NATP (1919-1990?) - 601 Piquette (s)
<b>Ford</b> (1903) -Mack Ave
<b>Ford</b> - Piquette & Beaubien (s)
<b>Ford</b> Highland Park - Manchester -plant (s) powerhouse (d)
<b>Ford Service</b>- 7310 Woodward
<b>Ford</b> > Hudson - Mack & Beaufait

<b>Gemmer</b>- 6400 Mt. Elliott
<b>Gilmore Motor Works</b> (1904)- 1174 Fort St W.
<b>GMC Saginaw/Detroit</b> -1840 Holbrook
#<b>Grabowsky Mot. Veh. Co</b>- (1902-04) became Rapid {trucks}
<b>Graham Paige</b>- 6250 Woodward
<b>Graham Paige</b>- 8505 W. Warren
<b>Graham Paige</b>- Mckinstry (?)
<b>Graham Paige</b> (Jewett factory) Warren Ave
<b>Graham Paige</b> (trucks)- (1922- ) Meldrum Ave
<b>Graham Paige</b> (trucks) Conant Ave
<b>Graham Paige</b> (trucks) Lynch Rd
<b>Griswold Motor Car</b> (1907) headquarters @ 521 Lincoln, plant shared <b>w/ C.H. Blomstrom- Leib & Wright St.
#<b>Gray Motor Corp.</b>-(1922-26) 124 Lieb St. Stationary, and marine engines c.1900-

<b>Hammer-Sommer</b> (1903-04) 573 Gratiot
<b>Hammer-Sommer</b>- 298-300 W. Columbia
<b>Hammer Motor Car</b> (1904) 313-315 Riopelle
<b>Henry Ford Co.</b> > Detroit Auto Co (1901-02) 1363 Cass Ave.
<b>Herreshoff</b> (1908-14) used E.R. Thomas factory- Woodward
<b>Huber Auto Car</b> (1903-07) -248 Jefferson
<b>Hudson</b>- (1909- ) Mack & Beaufait former Aerocar bldg
<b>Hudson</b>- 12601 E. Jefferson & Conner (d)
<b>Hupp</b> (1915-41) Milwaukee & Mt. Elliott
<b>Hupp</b> (1908-15) Bellvue St.
<b>Hupp</b> (1911-12) became RCH- 115-185 Lycaste & Jefferson Ave
<b>Hupp</b>- 1300-1324 Jefferson & Concord (?)
<b>Hupp Yeats Electric</b> (1911-12) 285 Monroe St. (115-185 Lycaste St)
<b>Hussley Auto & Supply</b> (1902-03)- Beaubien & Trombley

<b>Keeton</b>- (1908-?) 11600-11649 Lawton
<b>Kelsey Hayes Wheel Corp</b>- 3600 Military
<b>Kelvinato</b>r- 14250 Plymouth Rd.
<b>King Motor Car Co</b> (1911-23) 1559 West Jefferson (5700-5799 Concord)
<b>Kess Line</b>-(19??-1915) 657 Lycaste {later 1st Liberty factory}
<b>Kessler-Detroit</b>-(1921-??) motors, aero engines ???
<b>K-R-I-T</b> (1909-10) 2600-2795 Wight St & Lieb (former C.H. Bloomstrom)
<b>K-R-I-T</b> (1911-15) 1608 E. Grand Blvd {former Owen factory}

<b>Leland & Faulkner</b> (1893) > Cadillac Plant #2 -1899 Trombley & Dequindre
<b>Liberty</b>- (1916-23) 657 Lycaste, Charleviox & Conner, acquired by Columbia
<b>Lincoln</b>-(1921-) W. Warren & Livernois
<b>Lozier</b> (1910) - 3703 Mack Ave & St Jean

<b>Mack Ave Stamping</b>- 11631 Mack Ave (d)
<b>Marvel</b> (1906-08) 284-290 Rivard & Mullet
<b>Massnick Mfg. Co.</b> (1904-08) Lafayette & Meldrum
<b>Massnick Mfg. Co.</b>-8400-8499 River Ct.
<b>Maxwell-Briscoe</b> (1906)-sales office 243-246 Jefferson
<b>Mercury </b>(1938-)
<b>Metzger</b> (1910-12) used Jacob Meire Truck plant- Dequindre & Milwaukee
<b>Metzger</b> (1912- ?) > Maxwell (1910- ) > Fisher - 1961 E. Milwaukee (d)
<b>Miller Car Co</b> (1911-14) 1638 Russell St, used Detroit Excelsior Works- S.W. Custer & Richmond
<b>Motor Products</b>- 11801 Mack Ave
<b>Murray Body</b>- 7590 Russell

<b>Northern</b>- (1905-?)
#<b>Oakland</b>- (1907-32) Oakland & Grove, Pontiac
<b>Olds Motor Works</b> (1900-01)- 1308-1318 Jefferson & Concord (d) fire 1901
<b>Owen</b> (1910-11) 1608 East Grand Blvd {later K-R-I-T factory}

<b>Packard</b> (1904-58)- E.Grand Blvd (s) some buildings demolished 2000
<b>Page-Detroit</b> - (1922- )West Warren
<b>Page- McKinstry </b>???
<b>Paragon Motor Ca</b>r- (1906-?) Rivard & Mullet (sold to Marvel)
<b>Plymouth</b>- (1928-) Lynch Road Assembly
<b>Puritan Machine</b> > Deluxe Auto Parts (1911-24) 51-57 10th St & factory 413-415 Layafette Bl.
#<b>Princess Motor Car</b>-(1905-??) 1201-1215 Frederick & Bellevue

<b>RCH</b>- (1911-?) 115-185 Lycaste & Jefferson Ave
<b>Regal</b> (1907-18) 201 Piquette & Woodward
<b>Regal</b>- Harper & Hastings
<b>Reliance</b> (1903-07) 87-89 Fort St E.
<b>Rickenbacker</b>- (1922- ) 4815 Cabot (s)
<b>Ritter</b>- 1305 Bellevue

#<b>St. Clair</b>- (190?-07) ? a Ste Claire (1919-28) in Marysville
<b>Saxon Motor Co</b>-(1914-22) former Abbott factory Beaufait & Waterloo
<b>Scripps Motor Car</b>- 5817 Lincoln
<b>Sibley</b> (1910-11) used Detroit Valve Co plant- Solvay & Mackie
<b>Sommers Motor Car </b>(1904-05) 298-300 Columbia St E.
<b>Standard Motor Truck</b>- 1111 Bellevue (s)
<b>Studebaker</b>- Piquette (d) ex-E M F plant, fire 2005
<b>Studebaker</b>- Fort & Clark

<b>Templeton-Dubrie</b> (1910) 687 Mack Ave.
<b>Thomas, E.R.</b>- (1902-?) Woodward Ave
<b>Timken Detroit Axle</b>- Fort & Clark
<b>Traveler</b>- 5786-5845 Commonwealth

<b>U.S. Rubber</b> (Uniroyal) 6600 E. Jefferson
<b>Vandyke</b> (1910-12) West Fort & 36th St
<b>Wahl</b>- (1913-?) 3089 E. Grand Blvd
<b>Walker Motor Car</b> (1905-06) 107 East Fort St.
<b>Warren Motor Car</b> (1910-13) 1331 Holden (s)
<b>Wayne Auto Car</b> (1904-08) Piquette & Brush
#<b>Welch-Detroit</b> (1911-?) Jefferson & Brush, 1st made above Metzger showroom
<b>Wheeler Mfg Co.</b> (1903-04) 10-16 Baltimore Ave.



(Message edited by Hornwrecker on October 04, 2005)
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Hornwrecker
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Username: Hornwrecker

Post Number: 171
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 63.41.8.72
Posted on Monday, October 03, 2005 - 10:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The "Detroit" car name mess: date of incorporation shown, most are on the list, but a few are missing. Some may have never produced a car. Who the hell knows.

Which is which? One of the Detroit names on the list, is one of the steam car makers.

x= on list

xDetroit—1900
xDetroit—1905
Detroit-Dearborn—1909
Detroit Air Cooled—1923
Detroit-Chatham—1912 {Canada???}
xDetroit (Electric) —1907
Detroit Speedster—1914
xDetroiter—1912
Detroit (Steam) —1901
Detroit (Steam) —1923

From THE LIST:

xDetroit Auto Co (1901-02) 1363 Cass Ave.
xDetroit Auto Mfg. Co. (1905-07) 177-179 Larned St.
Detroit Auto Vehicle Co. (1904-07) 65-71 Cathrine St.
Detroit Excelsior Works- S.W. Custer & Richmond
xDetroit Electric Car (1919) was Anderson -731 10th St.
Detroit Forge - 9611 Winfield
Detroit Industrial Vehicle Co.,(1926-1967) started in Detroit, later DIVCO
Detroit Motor Casting- 1067 Beaufait (s)
xDetroiter{Detroit Motor Car Co.} (1912-??)- 1915-1917 Holb

(Message edited by Hornwrecker on October 03, 2005)
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Jjaba
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Username: Jjaba

Post Number: 2465
Registered: 11-2003
Posted From: 24.22.82.162
Posted on Monday, October 03, 2005 - 11:37 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hornwrecker gives us quite a list. It would take a long time to see each site.

jjaba makes some corrections:

E-M-F, Studebaker, Piquette Ave., burned, 2005.
Packard, East Grand BLVD.
Lincoln and Mercury, missing.
Plymouth missing.
DeSoto, missing.
Chevrolet, 1911, East Grand BLVD.
Chrysler, Highland Park, Massachusetts Ave.

Excellent scholarship Hornwrecker.

jjaba
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Hornwrecker
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Username: Hornwrecker

Post Number: 174
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 63.41.8.72
Posted on Tuesday, October 04, 2005 - 12:01 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

How could I forget the Piquette fire, I stayed up most of the night watching it on TV,

I'll make the BLVD corrections, but will let someone else sort out the Chrysler, GM and Ford families of marques. Right now I'm sticking to the early, defunct makers, lest I become more confused.

Thanks, but I'm only maintaining the standard set from the start of this leviathan.
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Bob_cosgrove
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Username: Bob_cosgrove

Post Number: 257
Registered: 03-2005
Posted From: 207.74.110.236
Posted on Tuesday, October 04, 2005 - 5:02 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Fisher Body #19 Piquette and Hastings.

Bob Cosgrove
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Kathleen
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Username: Kathleen

Post Number: 924
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 69.14.122.57
Posted on Tuesday, October 04, 2005 - 8:34 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hornwrecker: The "St. Clair" that you noted is likely the Wills Ste. Clair automobile company that was started in 1919 by C. Harold Wills who worked with Henry Ford for many years.

Historic marker: http://www.michmarkers.com/Pag es/L1100.htm

"In 1921, C.H. Wills Co. introduced its first overhead-cam V-8 Wills Sainte Claire that was built in Marysville on the banks of the St. Clair River. Wills added an "e" to Saint and Clair, because he thought it was "classier."

And the Wills Sainte Claire was classy. It cost about $3,500 at a time when the Ford Model T sold for about $450. ... Wills Sainte Claire built about 12,000 automobiles from 1921 through 1926 and about 80 still exist,..."

There is a small, but very nice, musuem in St. Clair dedicated to this car company:
http://info.detnews.com/joyrid es/story/index.cfm?id=453

Another interesting aspect of C. Harold Wills' company was his vision for building a town or city around the automobile company...not unlike Hiram Walker and his Walkerville, but definitely more grandiose.
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Bob_cosgrove
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Username: Bob_cosgrove

Post Number: 259
Registered: 03-2005
Posted From: 207.74.111.16
Posted on Tuesday, October 04, 2005 - 10:10 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

While Marysville reflects Wills wife's name, he did not found Marysville.

Ste. Claire with and "e" on the end is the original French spelling. The 1908 Island of Bob-Lo steamer is the Ste. Claire.

At the time he was building his automotile, Wills lived in Indian Village on riverside of East Jefferson next to John Owen Park at the foot of Iroquois.

This home was built by Carl G.Fisher of Indianapolis (no relation to the Fisher Brothers), who founded the Autolite Company, the Indianapolis Speedway and was one of the founders of the Lincoln Highway Association. Fisher lived there only two years before returning to Indianapolis.

Bob Cosgrove
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Jjaba
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Username: Jjaba

Post Number: 2467
Registered: 11-2003
Posted From: 24.22.82.162
Posted on Tuesday, October 04, 2005 - 4:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Bob and Kathleen, merci.
jjaba
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Sven1977
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Username: Sven1977

Post Number: 113
Registered: 04-2004
Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Tuesday, October 04, 2005 - 6:27 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Here are a couple of ads from the book: "The Wonderful World of Automobiles."\


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Hornwrecker
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Username: Hornwrecker

Post Number: 176
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 63.41.40.242
Posted on Tuesday, October 04, 2005 - 10:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Well, I fixed the list that I posted yesterday, but I did the names in html, and it's screwing up. Added Jjaba's and Bob's corrections and added Welch-Detroit. From what little I've learned so far is that the first one was made above Metzger's showroom at Jefferson and Brush. It was too large to fit into the elevator, so it had to be disassembled and reassembled in the street. Will re-edit list so it is decent. I know bold tags worked in other posts of mine {?},

Here's the Kess-Line plant on Lycaste. If you'll look at the list for K-L and Liberty, please note the same address. I found photos of the new Liberty factory when it was purchased, and it is the same building. I have found nothing more on Kess-Line, or if they even produced a car, yet...

Kess-Line factory

I think Sven and Mikem were wondering about that Liberty plant.

Thanks Kathleen, interesting about the Ste. Claire. The one I saw mentioned folded around 1908, it might have been a car maker on paper only. {BGHS '76}

/wondering why that tag worked
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Kathleen
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Username: Kathleen

Post Number: 925
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 69.14.122.57
Posted on Wednesday, October 05, 2005 - 8:27 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

A couple summers ago, on display at the main Detroit Public Library was a Detroit automobile company family history. It was hand lettered by a gentlement and was quite detailed. Not sure if it was a Burton Historical Collection item or National Automotive History Collection (the latter now being housed at the Skillman Branch downtown). It might be worth checking into!

Hornwrecker: BGHS '76!! I'm pretty good with names and faces, so I probably would recognize your name. My sister was in Class of '76. Any clues?
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Kathleen
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Username: Kathleen

Post Number: 926
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 69.14.122.57
Posted on Wednesday, October 05, 2005 - 8:35 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hornwrecker: Following up the St. Clair name from an earlier time, I came across the Old Marine Engine forum whose members were discussing the St. Clair Motor Co. Maybe somehow this is related. Check it out at: http://www.oldmarineengine.com /cgi-bin/discus/discus.cgi?pg= next&topic=3454&page=5542
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Toolbox
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Username: Toolbox

Post Number: 685
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 65.196.220.198
Posted on Wednesday, October 05, 2005 - 11:58 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

\ b{ bold } is the code for BOLD, remove the space between the slash and b. Not HTML tagging.

Click here for Formatting tips.
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Hornwrecker
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Username: Hornwrecker

Post Number: 177
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 63.41.40.54
Posted on Wednesday, October 05, 2005 - 12:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks Toolbox will learn the forum code, but if I bold this in html, it works.

Kathleen I was in the band, ran track, played a horn solo in a concert my senior year.

Now back to business. To correct a bit on Kess-Line, they moved into the old Liberty factory in 1922, when Liberty moved to larger quarters. Liberty took possession in 1916. The proof from DPL/NAHC:

Liberty on Lycaste

Hornwecker got them mixed up on the list, he's making up shit again, so he will fix it when he fixes the coding. There are a few shots of the Lycaste plant from an old scrapbook, but need a bit of PSing to make postable.
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Sven1977
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Username: Sven1977

Post Number: 114
Registered: 04-2004
Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Wednesday, October 05, 2005 - 12:28 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

All right you guys, what's BGHS stand for?
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Mikem
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Username: Mikem

Post Number: 1935
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Wednesday, October 05, 2005 - 12:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I need to drive through that area again. There isn't much left on Lycaste. I only have pictures of these two buildings, part of a cluster on Lycaste north of Freud, all painted a blue-gray color which I initially thought was because they were part of the old Chrysler Jefferson factory complex, but maybe not.

Lycaste1

Lycaste2
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Kathleen
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Username: Kathleen

Post Number: 927
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 140.244.107.151
Posted on Wednesday, October 05, 2005 - 12:51 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Sorry for the diversion...but it is a small world!!!

Sven: BGHS = Bishop Gallagher High School

Hornwrecker: I must know you since I was in the band for 4 years (actually 5 1/2 if you count that I played during 8th grade and again for a semester my first year of college; I actually played for your graduation at Ford Auditorium...my last public performance!!).

More clues? I'll give you one....I played clarinet and my sister played flute. Also we attended St. Clare for grade school; Mr. Rostek was our band instructor there.
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Hornwrecker
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Username: Hornwrecker

Post Number: 178
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 63.41.8.174
Posted on Wednesday, October 05, 2005 - 4:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I found another photo of a old factory in Detroit, Norhway, started around 1922. Anybody?

Mikem Here's two c/u's from the K=L pic. The building on the left background looks like it might be your top photo.

K-L c/u

...and a shot from the right to some other buildings.

K-L c/u 2

If someone wanted to get the GPS, plug them into LandSat/ERSAT photos, there might be a hint of foundations. Some of the other Liberty shots show corrugated metal bldgs, so they wouldn't leave much of a footprint.

Kathleen I have to dig out my old yearbooks. Now where did I put them? I might even have some old concert programs around.

(Message edited by Hornwrecker on October 05, 2005)
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Kathleen
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Username: Kathleen

Post Number: 929
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 69.14.122.57
Posted on Wednesday, October 05, 2005 - 6:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hornwrecker: To keep this Old Car Factories thread on track, I've posted a continuation of our off-topic over in Detroit Connections. Look for "The BGHS Connection" thread.

(Message edited by Kathleen on October 05, 2005)
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Mikem
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Username: Mikem

Post Number: 1943
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Wednesday, October 05, 2005 - 6:21 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Norhway? You mean Northway? If so, I know there's some info about Northway buried in this thread. I think I even posted a map showing the Northway factory on the westside. Chevrolet took over the factory but i can't remeber what they did with it. I'll look later tonight to see what I can find.

Horn, the two buildings in the pictures I posted are across the street from each other. Perhaps the building in the old picture you posted is the backside of the Kennelly & Sisman building? Didn't Sven post some Sanborns of this area?
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Sven1977
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Username: Sven1977

Post Number: 115
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Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Wednesday, October 05, 2005 - 7:03 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I looked through my maps but couldn't find one that matched. I may have photo copied it so I'll look at home. I remember the train spur being there but the 657 address places the building away from the existing spur that can be seen from aerial maps. For those of you with newer computers and a quick line into the house, download "google earth" for some really cool spy mapping.
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Hornwrecker
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Username: Hornwrecker

Post Number: 180
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 63.41.24.178
Posted on Wednesday, October 05, 2005 - 10:22 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Since it's too late to edit the last list, I'll post the new, and improved list, now with forum code goodness.

THE LIST


Inactive Auto Plants & Related
(s) standing (d) demolished

Abbott(-Detroit) (1909-18) Northern plant (1910) then Beaufait & Waterloo(d) to OH (then Saxon)
American Electromobile(1906) 1571 River St.
Anderson (1907-19) factory- Riopelle & 416 Clay St. / warehouse 81-83 Jefferson
Aerocar-(1905-08) Mack & Beaufait later 1st Hudson plant
Anhut> Barnes (1909-10) 510 Howard St.

Beyster Detroit (1910-11) 1329 Woodward Ave.
Bour-Davis- (1915-??)W. Ford & 23rd St. (d)
Briggs-Detroiter (1911-15) 461 Holbrook Ave & Grand Trunk RR
Brush- (1911- ) 468 Rhode Island Ave, Highland Park
Brush Runabout (1906-7) used Briscoe Factory
Buick Mfg. Co.(1902)- 416-418 Howard St.
Buick Auto-Vim & Power(1900)- 39 Beaubien St.

Cadillac Amsterdam Plant- 450 Amsterdam & 1363 Cass (d) fire1904, rebuilt (05-21) (s) > Wescott Bldg.
Cadillac Clark St Plant (1921-87)- 2680 Clark St (d) except for engineering bldg > Ameritech.
Cadillac Fleetwood Plant aka Fisher #18 (1917-80's)- 261 West End Ave & Fort St. (d) potrions in 1993
Cadillac Plant #2 -1899 Trombley & Dequindre
Cadillac ???- Riopelle & E. Warren (s)
Callie Motor Co- 6210 2nd Ave.
Carhartt (1902-12) S.W. corner Michigan & 10th Ave
Carter Color- 6051 Hastings (d)
Cartercar (1905) 230 21st & Baker
Cartercar- (1907-09) 220-230 1st St., moved to Pontiac
C.H. Blomstrom (1904-08) 75 Clark & River Rd (100-401 Clark St)
C.H. Blomstrom (1906-09)- Leib & Wright St.
Chalmers-(1910-23) Oakland Ave, bought Thomas-Detroit (08) >Chalmers-Detroit
Chalmers- Jefferson Ave
Chevrolet (1911-13) converted Corcoran Lamp Factory 1145 West Grand Blvd
Chevrolet- 1145 W. Grand Blvd
Chrysler- 6501 Harper
Chrysler Motors (1924-)- 841 Massachusetts, Highland Park
Chrysler, Mack Ave Stamping- 11631 Mack Ave (d)
Columbia-(1923- ) bought Liberty, Charlevoix & Conner
Commercial (1903-05)- 259-267 Franklin st
Continental Motors- 12801 E. Jefferson

Day Auto Car (1911-13) Trumbull (moved to) 25 E. Milwaukee
Deluxe (1906-09) 75 Clark & River Rd. (100-401 Clark St)
Deluxe- 1000 Woodward
Demotcar Co- (1910-?) 21st St > 1305 Bellevue
DeSoto-(1928-) McGraw Glass- LaSalle, (Buick?), Liberty engs, ex-Saxon
Detroit Auto Co (1901-02) 1363 Cass Ave.
Detroit Auto Mfg. Co. (1905-07) 177-179 Larned St.
Detroit Auto Vehicle Co. (1904-07) 65-71 Cathrine St.
Detroit Excelsior Works- S.W. Custer & Richmond
Detroit Electric Car (1919) was Anderson -731 10th St.
Detroit Forge - 9611 Winfield
Detroit Ind.Veh. Co.,(1926-67) DIVCO, 2435 Merrick Ave at 16th Street
Detroit Motor Casting- 1067 Beaufait (s)
Detroiter(Det. Mot. Car)(1912-??)-1915-17 Holbrook & Greeley.
Dingfelder(1903-04)- 958 Jefferson
Doble-Detroit(1914-17) steam, moved to CA 1918
Dodge Brothers- (1903- ) Boydell Bldg, Beaubien
Dodge Main (1910- )- 7900 Joseph Campau Ave (d)

Eclipse MFG (engines) Euclid Ave
EMF - (1907-09) Piquette (d) fire 2005
EMF - Clay & Dequindre
EMF- also used Wayne & Northern factories
EMF - 75 Clark & River Rd
Eureka Mfg. (1905)- 169-171 Sylvester
Everitt, B.F.- (1909 or 11) 63-65 Fort St.

Fee & Block-(1908-?) 254 Jefferson
Federal Motor Truck-(1910-?) 5780 Federal
Fisher Body- W. Fort & Livernois
Fisher Body Plant #2 (wood kiln)- St. Antoine (d) 1925
Fisher Body Plant #4- Oakland Ave.
Fisher Body Plant #7- Harper Ave / see parking lot behind F21 (d)
Fisher Body Plant #10- 5140 Riopelle (Cadillac)
Fisher Body Plant #12 -1961 E. Milwaukee (d)
Fisher Body Plant #18 (aka Cadillac Fleetwood Plant)- West End Ave
Fisher Body #19 - Piquette and Hastings.
Fisher Plant #21>GMC NATP (1919-1990?) - 601 Piquette (s)
Fisher Body #23- used as GMC NAPT assembly 1990-94 (s)
Fisher Body #27- (1925>)-E. Milwaukee & Hastings now NewCenter (8 mile movie site) (s)
Ford (1903) -Mack Ave
Ford - Piquette & Beaubien (s)
Ford Highland Park - Manchester -plant (s) powerhouse (d)
Ford Service- 7310 Woodward
Ford > Hudson - Mack & Beaufait

Gemmer- 6400 Mt. Elliott
Gilmore Motor Works (1904)- 1174 Fort St W.
GMC Saginaw/Detroit -1840 Holbrook
Grabowsky Mot. Veh. Co- (1902-04) became Rapid {trucks}
Graham Paige- 6250 Woodward
Graham Paige- 8505 W. Warren
Graham Paige- Mckinstry (?)
Graham Paige (Jewett factory) Warren Ave
Graham Paige (trucks)- (1922- ) Meldrum Ave
Graham Paige (trucks) Conant Ave
Graham Paige (trucks) Lynch Rd
Griswold Motor Car (1907) headquarters @ 521 Lincoln, plant w/ C.H. Blomstrom- Leib & Wright St.
Gray Motor Corp.-(1922-26) 124 Lieb St. Stationary, and marine engines c.1900


Hammer-Sommer (1903-04) 573 Gratiot
Hammer-Sommer- 298-300 W. Columbia
Hammer Motor Car (1904) 313-315 Riopelle
Henry Ford Co. > Detroit Auto Co (1901-02) 1363 Cass Ave.
Herreshoff (1908-14) used E.R. Thomas factory- Woodward
Huber Auto Car (1903-07) -248 Jefferson
Hudson- (1909- ) Mack & Beaufait former Aerocar bldg
Hudson- 12601 E. Jefferson & Conner (d)
Hupp (1915-41) Milwaukee & Mt. Elliott
Hupp (1908-15) Bellvue St.
Hupp (1911-12) became RCH- 115-185 Lycaste & Jefferson Ave
Hupp- 1300-1324 Jefferson & Concord (?)
Hupp Yeats Electric (1911-12) 285 Monroe St. (115-185 Lycaste St)
Hussley Auto & Supply (1902-03)- Beaubien & Trombley

Keeton- (1908-?) 11600-11649 Lawton
Kelsey Hayes Wheel Corp- 3600 Military
Kelvinator- 14250 Plymouth Rd.
King Motor Car Co (1911-23) 1559 West Jefferson (5700-5799 Concord)
Kess Line-(1922-?) 657 Lycaste {1st Liberty factory}
Kessler-Detroit-(1921-??) motors, aero engines ???
K-R-I-T (1909-10) 2600-2795 Wight St & Lieb (former C.H Bloomstrom)
K-R-I-T (1911-15) 1608 E. Grand Blvd {former Owen factory}

LaSalle(1927- )-McGraw Glass- ex-DeSoto, (Buick?) Liberty engs, ex-Saxon
Leland & Faulkner (1893) > Cadillac Plant #2 -1899 Trombley & Dequindre
Liberty- (1916-23) 657 Lycaste, Charleviox & Conner, acquired by Columbia
Lincoln-(1917-) 6200 W. Warren & Livernois
Lozier (1910) - 3703 Mack Ave & St Jean

Marvel (1906-08) 284-290 Rivard & Mullet
Massnick Mfg. Co. (1904-08) Lafayette & Meldrum
Massnick Mfg. Co.-8400-8499 River Ct.
Maxwell (1910- )
Maxwell-Briscoe (1906)-sales office 243-246 Jefferson
Mercury (1938-) 6200 W. Warren & Livernois (Lincoln)
Metzger (1910-12) used Jacob Meire Truck plant- Dequindre & Milwaukee
Metzger (1912- ?) > Maxwell (1910- ) > Fisher - 1961 E. Milwaukee (d)
Miller Car Co (1911-14) 1638 Russell St, used Detroit Excelsior Works- S.W. Custer & Richmond
Motor Products- 11801 Mack Ave
Murray Body- 7590 Russell

Northern- (1905-?) ???
Northway (1922-?) Warren & Grand River
Oakland- (1907-32) Oakland & Grove, Pontiac
Olds Motor Works (1900-01)- 1308-1318 Jefferson & Concord (d) fire 1901
Owen (1910-11) 1608 East Grand Blvd {later K-R-I-T factory}

Packard (1904-58)- E.Grand Blvd (s) some buildings demolished 2000
Page-Detroit - (1922- )West Warren
Page- McKinstry ???
Paragon Motor Car- (1906-?) Rivard & Mullet (sold to Marvel)
Plymouth- (1928-) Lynch Road Assembly
Puritan Machine > Deluxe Auto Parts (1911-24) 51-57 10th St & factory 413-415 Layafette Bl.
Princess Motor Car -(1905-??) 1201-1215 Frederick & Bellevue

RCH- (1911-?) 115-185 Lycaste & Jefferson Ave
Regal (1907-18) 201 Piquette & Woodward
Regal- Harper & Hastings
Reliance (1903-07) 87-89 Fort St E.
Rickenbacker- (1922- ) 4815 Cabot (s)
Ritter- 1305 Bellevue

St. Clair- (190?-07) ? a Ste Claire (1919-28) in Marysville
Saxon Motor Co-(1914-22) former Abbott factory Beaufait & Waterloo
Scripps Motor Car- 5817 Lincoln
Sibley (1910-11) used Detroit Valve Co plant- Solvay & Mackie
Sommers Motor Car (1904-05) 298-300 Columbia St E.
Standard Motor Truck- 1111 Bellevue (s)
Studebaker- Piquette (d) ex-E M F plant, fire 2005
Studebaker- Fort & Clark

Templeton-Dubrie (1910) 687 Mack Ave.
Thomas, E.R.- (1905-?) Woodward Ave
Timken Detroit Axle- Fort & Clark
Traveler- 5786-5845 Commonwealth

U.S. Rubber (Uniroyal) 6600 E. Jefferson
Vandyke (1910-12) West Fort & 36th St
Wahl- (1913-?) 3089 E. Grand Blvd
Walker Motor Car (1905-06) 107 East Fort St.
Warren Motor Car (1910-13) 1331 Holden (s)
Wayne Auto Car (1904-08) Piquette & Brush
Welch-Detroit (1911-?) Jefferson & Brush, 1st made above Metzger showroom
Wheeler Mfg Co. (1903-04) 10-16 Baltimore Ave.




`'*:-.,_,.-:*'``'*:-.,_,.-:*'` `'*:-.,_,.-:*'``'*:-.,_,.-:*'` `

Whew!

Updated to include the Fisher Body info, and added Lasalle.

(Message edited by Hornwrecker on October 06, 2005)

(Message edited by Hornwrecker on October 06, 2005)
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Jjaba
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Username: Jjaba

Post Number: 2483
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Posted From: 24.22.82.162
Posted on Thursday, October 06, 2005 - 4:25 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

This is an exhaustive list. Thanks. Excellent Hornwrecker scholarship.

jjaba will add Edsel to his own damn list.

jjaba would love for somebody to name the cities and addresses of the 39 Albert Kahn Ford assembly plants in N. America. Those would be a challenge to see also.

jjaba
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Bob_cosgrove
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Username: Bob_cosgrove

Post Number: 266
Registered: 03-2005
Posted From: 207.74.110.156
Posted on Thursday, October 06, 2005 - 5:03 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

How about our southern suburb, Windsor?

Bob Cosgrove
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Sven1977
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Username: Sven1977

Post Number: 116
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Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Thursday, October 06, 2005 - 12:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I found my bad Xerox from the microfilm. The addresses by the office are blurred but I can tell that there are two street numbers for the same building. The map is from around 1915. I cannot tell from the map if it is the same building as the picture but, the train spur is in the right place, and the buildings in back are in the same place with a multi-pitched roof. The big bulding to the side could be an ice storage house to match the map.

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Mikem
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Username: Mikem

Post Number: 1957
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Thursday, October 06, 2005 - 1:22 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

So it looks like Liberty was on the west side of Lycaste, south of the RR spur.

http://terraserver-usa.com/image.aspx?T=4&S=10&Z=17&X=1690&Y=23460&W=2

Liberty1

The building in the first picture of the complex I posted is looking in the direction of the blue arrow. The second one, Kennelly & Sisman, is across the street, looking in the direction of the yellow arrow:

Kennelly&Sisman
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Jjaba
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Post Number: 2487
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Posted From: 24.22.82.162
Posted on Thursday, October 06, 2005 - 1:37 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Kennelly & Sisman? Who are they?
jjaba had a hard time figuring out anything about them although they won a prize for international trade in the 1980s. Thanks for the mighty fine photo of their bldg., letters in stone for posterity.
jjaba
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Mikem
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Username: Mikem

Post Number: 1958
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Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Thursday, October 06, 2005 - 2:01 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

This 1924 map shows several southwest Detroit factories. What caught my eye was the Buick factory on Wyoming at McGraw. This plant was the Chrysler DeSoto/McGraw Glass factory. On page nine, I posted a 1926 map with the plant listed as General Motors. If our research is correct, the plant was built for Saxon? but maybe never used by them, then used to produce Liberty airplane engines during WWI, then passed to GM to build Cadillac's LaSalle line, then it passed on to DeSoto.

Buick-LaSalle

How did Buick fit into this? Was the Buick division just the owner on paper? Did GM intend to build Buicks there, or did they? Which years was the LaSalle made?
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Mikem
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Username: Mikem

Post Number: 1959
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Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Thursday, October 06, 2005 - 2:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Also, I'd like to know more about Holly Carburetors. I didn't realize Holly was that old; I went to high school with a Holly girl, and I thought her father was the owner/founder, but it must have been her grandfather. We are eastsiders too, and I thought the main Holly factory was eastside, maybe on Nine or Ten Mile in Warren.

Was the Holly factory (next to Lincoln on the map above) on Epworth St? That's the first street east of Livernois that parallels Livernois and the tracks, between Tireman and Warren.
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Mikem
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Post Number: 1960
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Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Thursday, October 06, 2005 - 2:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I found one more picture of the Kennelly & Sisman building on Lycaste. The address I have is 554 Lycaste. The detail was interesting; for some reason it looks pre-WWI to me.

554 Lycaste
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Sven1977
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Posted on Thursday, October 06, 2005 - 2:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

This is the Sandborn Map of the building across the street and down a bit from the Liberty building. The address doesn't match with the existing address but as I said earlier, there is conflicting addresses on the street in 1915. The building at the bottom of the map matches the overhead configuration of the spy photo of the Kennely Bldg.

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Mikem
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Post Number: 1961
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Posted on Thursday, October 06, 2005 - 3:02 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I can barely make out the companies: Zenton Carburetor?, Lake Side Foundry, Detroit Transmission Co, and _______'s Box Co.?

The addresses were renumbered in 1921.
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Mikem
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Post Number: 1962
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Posted on Thursday, October 06, 2005 - 3:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

This building is at 6511 Epworth "behind" the Lincoln Motors factory. Looks like a school, but industrial buildings are connected to it, so maybe the company offices? The buildings and the street itself seem to be a dumping ground now. The city's website says Presstron Industries. Any ideas?

6511 Epworth
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Bate
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Username: Bate

Post Number: 40
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Posted From: 4.247.239.188
Posted on Thursday, October 06, 2005 - 3:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hornwrecker,

The list is back. I offer some Fisher fixes based on past data from the thread.

Fisher Body- W. Fort & Livernois
Fisher Body Plant #2 (wood kiln)- St. Antoine (d) 1925
Fisher Body Plant #4- Oakland Ave.
Fisher Body Plant #7- Harper Ave / see parking lot behind F21 (d)
Fisher Plant #10 - 5140 Riopelle (Cadillac)
Fisher Body Plant #12 -1961 E. Milwaukee (d)
Fisher Body Plant #18 (aka Cadillac Fleetwood Plant)- West End Ave
Fisher Body #19 - Piquette and Hastings.
Fisher Paint & Trim (aka. Fisher #21)- 700 Piquette (s)
Fisher Plant #23(1919-1990?) - 601 Piquette used as GMC NAPT assembly 1990-94 (s)
Fisher Plant #27 (1925>)-E. Milwaukee & Hastings now New Center Stamping (8 mile movie site) (s)
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Sven1977
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Post Number: 119
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Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Thursday, October 06, 2005 - 3:37 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yeoman's Box Company
-
Mfg's of Wooden Boxes

The center of the roof has the raised area and the side building is there too. The photocopies are hard to read. The other buildings from the top are:
The Zenith Carburetor Co., Lake Shore Foundry Co., Detroit Transmission Co., National Forging Co., and Yeoman's.
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Bob_cosgrove
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Post Number: 268
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Posted From: 207.74.110.119
Posted on Thursday, October 06, 2005 - 3:52 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

On Sven's 1915 Sandborn map, that's probably Zenith Carbeurator.

Bob Cosgrove
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Hornwrecker
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Posted From: 63.41.40.67
Posted on Thursday, October 06, 2005 - 4:53 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Bate You can can have the list back anytime. I updated the Fisher info. Thanks. You sure? I can send it to you.

Jjaba Were Edsels made in the Rouge Plant? Where were Mercurys made?

Mikem & Sven I'll start on the Liberty photos this weekend, they might help in piecing this together. That sure is a crappy Xerox, will try to enhance the lines. From the sat photos, it looks like old building footprints in those lots.

What is that Dodge Bros. plant on the river in Mikem's recent map?
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Toolbox
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Posted From: 65.196.220.198
Posted on Thursday, October 06, 2005 - 5:02 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

Holly Corprate History Page


In 1896, Bradford, Pennsylvania was like any other small town - except it was home to the Holley family. It was during this time that George and Earl Holley took an interest in motorcycle racing.

At nineteen years of age, George designed and built the Runabout. The Runabout, a three-wheeled vehicle powered by a single cylinder engine, could impressively reach speeds of 30 miles per hour.

This invention of the Runabout shifted the Holley brothers' interest from motorcycles to the emerging automotive industry. George and Earl founded the Holley Motor Company and introduced the Motorette in 1903, which inspired Henry Ford to request Holley to produce a carburetor for his Model T. The carburetor, called the Iron Pot, quickly became an automotive success and became standard on Ford vehicles as well as the curved-dash Oldsmobile.

By 1907, 600 Motorettes had been produced in Bradford. Currently, three Motorettes are known to exist, including a completely restored model on display at the Holley corporate headquarters. By the end of '07, the Holley brothers had redirected their manufacturing efforts to carburetors and ignition systems for Buick, Ford, Pierce-Arrow, and Winston. The company's name changed to The Holley Brothers Company as a result.

The change in direction influenced George and Earl to relocate their headquarters from Bradford to Detroit, Michigan. Late in 1907, the doors opened to the first Holley plant in the Detroit area. Thanks to the booming automotive industry and a diversified industrial approach (due to World War I), the company changed its name to The Holley Carburetor Company in January of 1918.

In 1927, Holley created an aviation division to develop carburetors which could be found on aircraft belonging to Curtiss-Wright, American Airlines, Pan-American Airlines, as well as the armed forces of the United States. By 1933, Holley was manufacturing ignition devices and fuel pumps. During World War II, nearly half of the vehicles in the United States armed forces bore the Holley name in the form of carburetors and fuel metering devices.

In 1948, Holley entered the automotive aftermarket, supplying carburetor repair kits and authentic Holley parts to garages and service stations. Kentucky and Tennessee became home to new plants, in order to meet ever-growing production requirements. By 1951, Holley had relocated its headquarters just north of Detroit in Warren, Michigan.

The following year, a new 250,000 square foot manufacturing plant was opened in Bowling Green, KY. Holley's product development continued and led to the first modular carburetor, the 4150, in 1957. After introduction, the 4150 quickly became standard equipment on the 1957 Ford Thunderbird. By 1965, the 100,000,000th carburetor came off the Holley assembly line.

1968 would see the merger of Holley with Colt Industries. Under the Colt Industries banner, the Holley original equipment and aftermarket business continued to thrive and expand. The Holley Replacement Parts division was created in 1979 to meet customer demand and to promote continued growth of the company. This divisional approach allowed more emphasis to be placed on the development, promotion and sales for the replacement and performance aftermarket. Expanded product lines were added to an already broad carburetor and performance product line, which included: electrical and ignition components, intake manifolds, fuel pumps and Mickey Thompson performance products. Fuel Injection systems and components would soon be added to this list as well. As Holley became the automotive performance leader of the world, the 1980's saw the opening of the Remanufacturing plant in Springfield, TN.

In 1994, Holley underwent major changes. The original equipment division was sold to Borg-Warner, which led to the relocation of Holley Replacement Parts' headquarters to Bowling Green, KY. At this time, the company's name became Holley Performance Products.

Over the next several years the Holley name was placed on Hirel Technologies Fuel Injection, Weiand Automotive Industries, Lunati, Hooker Headers, Flowtech Exhaust, Earl's Performance Plumbing, and NOS. These acquisitions have allowed customers to purchase any performance product, all made with the Holley approach to quality.


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Jjaba
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Posted on Thursday, October 06, 2005 - 5:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks for the report on Holley, Toolbox. You got the job done for the people.

Edsel was made at Lincoln-Mercury, W. Warren and Livernois. jjaba can remember the lot full of them. They were a fairly nice car, but not accepted by the market. They looked and felt alot like a Mercury in the same model year.
jjaba
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Mikem
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Post Number: 1963
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Posted on Thursday, October 06, 2005 - 5:59 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

After the war, in 1948, Ford built Mercury plants in the LA suburb of Pico Rivera, at Metuchen (Edison), NJ, and on the south side of St Louis. In 1952, a forth Mercury plant was built in the Detroit suburb of Wayne. By the early 1970s, I think Mercury production was consolidated at the St Louis plant and the Pico Rivera and Metuchen plants were closed by 1983.

Thanks TB for the Holley report -- that's H-o-l-l-e-y. I knew it didn't look right on the map. I thought Holley was more recent than 19th century; muscle car era or slightly before. Here is an empty Borg-Warner plant on Nine Mile in Warren. I'm guessing this was the Holley HQ that they moved to in 1951?

Holley in Warren
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Mikem
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Post Number: 1964
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Posted on Thursday, October 06, 2005 - 6:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I've seen the Dodge Bros. as owners of that property at the mouth of the Rouge River on several maps. I wonder if it's property they got when they were partners with Henry Ford. Or in lieu of cash/stock? Maybe they planned to build a factory there in the future, but I don't know of anything being there before the Rouge River power plant. I suppose they made a killing selling the property to Detroit Edison.

AIW, could we get a new page please?!
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Rsa
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sidebar: the metuchen, NJ plant was home to mustang production from 1966-1974 (i think). this was supplemental to dearborn assembly and the san jose plants to keep up with the demand.
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Jjaba
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Posted on Thursday, October 06, 2005 - 6:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Delete jjaba's comments about Edsel production at Livernois and W. Warren. It must have been a holding depot, not manuafacturing.

Edsel Manufacturing, 1958, 1959, 1960.
1958 model year:
Edsel Citation. Los Angeles.
Edsel Citation. Sommerville, Mass. (now Mall at Assembly Square.)
Edsel Citation and Corsair. Wayne, Mich.
Edsel Rangers, Pacers, Bermuda and Villager Wagons. Mahwah, NJ and Louisville, Ky.
Edsels, various models, San Jose, Calif., now Great Mall of the Bay Area.

1959-60 model years.

Edsel, all models. Louisville, Ky.
Edsel Ranger and Corsair. Oakvile, Ontario, Canada.
Edsels. Mostly experiments. None left factory. Allen Park, Mich.

The Edsel was the largest monumental failure in 20th Century automobile marketing and manufacturing. They had 1,200 dealers, mostly through Lincoln-Mercury.

New Edsels would arrive dealerships with a missing parts list taped to the steering wheel. The brakes seldom worked on new deliveries.

Edsels were built on regular Ford or Mercury assembly lines. The workers never were trained and didn't identify with the car. This was a huge lesson for Saturn when GM started that company.
Parts were co-mingled with other brands so workers put the wrong parts on ther wrong cars.
Cars would roll by and there were no parts so they went without.

At 70 MPH, the Edsel hood ornament would rocket off the car. Other parts would just fall off.
It was "an Olds sucking a lemon." It was a "Pontiac pushing a toilet seat."

Dealer mechanics did not know how to fix the push button transmission controls mounted on the steering wheel.

Edsel engines were built in Ford factories.
Ecomony Six or Ford V-8 engines.
Made in Cleveland, Dearborn, or Wayne, Mich.

Transmission were by Borg-Warner.

Colors were single color, 2 tone, Tri-color.

Tires by Goodyear, Firestone, BF Goodrich.

People started driving remaining Edsels to Saturn rallies and even today, people are petrified to break down in an Edsel. Of the 110,000 Edsels made, 6,000 remain. Message: Saturn, you're the next Edsel. Saturn executives all had to read the books about the Edsel failures.

Edsel base prices in 1958-60. $2,500 to $3,500.
After 3 dismal years, Edsel was kaput.

jjaba.
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