Aiw
Member Username: Aiw
Post Number: 4760 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.70.116.110
| Posted on Monday, October 17, 2005 - 10:30 pm: | |
Hornwrecker, Yes those are all part of the Ford Complex. In the photo above you can see the waterfront plant (demolished) the Powerhouse (the twin stacks) that is still in use. In the rear is this plant: Still in use but threatend with closure. It was built in 1937 by Kahn. The power house was 1922, also Kahn. |
Aiw
Member Username: Aiw
Post Number: 4761 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.70.116.110
| Posted on Monday, October 17, 2005 - 10:32 pm: | |
Ford City (later East Windsor) was amagamated into Windsor in 1935. So anything you find Labeled as Ford or Ford City or East Windsor is pre-amalgamation. |
Hornwrecker Member Username: Hornwrecker
Post Number: 250 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 63.41.24.69
| Posted on Monday, October 17, 2005 - 10:56 pm: | |
I redid the top photo to include all of the factories in the original. Here are a couple of Ford City shots, the second on I guess is the town hall, as the sign says Post Office on it. I saw mini-doc about the powerhouse on one of those channel 9, local architecture spots. I look forward to them, I wish a Detroit station would do the same thing. |
Aiw
Member Username: Aiw
Post Number: 4764 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 209.216.150.127
| Posted on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 - 11:43 am: | |
Hornwrecker, you got it. That was the City Hall. It became redundant with amalgamation, and was used as the post office only for many years. It was demolished in the 1970's. The photo above that, shows the front of the Riverfront plant, and coporate offices (the smaller building on the right). That scene was almost directly across the street from the one above. |
Jjaba Member Username: Jjaba
Post Number: 2574 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 24.22.82.162
| Posted on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 - 3:46 pm: | |
There's little Andrew standing there in East Windsor. He's the kid with the Russian fur cap, prepared to go into the N. Ontario wilds just in case. A little cold for bikes, eh. Those Ford plants are some of the purest Albert Kahn bldgs. you'll ever see. Imagine all those right-hand drive cars shipped to the Empire from that dock. G-d save Ford, G-d save the Queen of England. jjaba, enjoying this series. |
Hornwrecker Member Username: Hornwrecker
Post Number: 259 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 63.41.40.198
| Posted on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 - 5:20 pm: | |
Kessler Motor Co Detroit, MI (1921-22 ?) I can't find any other info on if they ever made a car, or only made motors. I did find some info that they made two models of aircraft engines, but not what they were used in. No addresses have been found so far, but maybe one of these buildings will look familiar. (If anyone is a model railroader, it would be pretty easy to model out of a DPM kit.) What I found from an aviation source: Kessler 200 (1921 Angle Encyclopedia) 1917 - 200hp at 2400rpm 531.63ci supercharged geared 6LW. Ran a four-stroke cycle, but at the bottom of the intake stroke ports were opened to admit added air under pressure, governed by a rotary valve connected to the throttle, into the combustion chamber, which reportedly produced a compression ratio as low as 3.66:1. Kessler 6C-400 (1921 Angle Encyclopedia) 6C-400 1918 - 400hp 855.3ci 6LW; dry wt: 578#. Six-valves experimental; POP: 1. |
Jjaba Member Username: Jjaba
Post Number: 2578 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 192.220.139.5
| Posted on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 - 6:09 pm: | |
jjaba is impressed with all the windows and light coming into the workshops. Pure Detroit. Whether Albert Kahn or not, Detroit factories sure were advanced, eh. Great photos. Thanks. jjaba |
Ndavies Member Username: Ndavies
Post Number: 1155 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 129.9.163.106
| Posted on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 - 6:13 pm: | |
Actually Jjaba, I don't think they had much choice with the windows. Light bulb technology wasn't what it is today. Those shops would have been very dark during the day without those windows. |
Hornwrecker Member Username: Hornwrecker
Post Number: 261 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 63.41.24.101
| Posted on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 - 10:35 pm: | |
I think that if the factory owners wanted to turn (get it?) out accurate part, they'd make sure the lathe operators had some decent light. I know that when I'm turning on the old Atlas, I have lots of task lighting. These lathes are pretty plain, but still show some of the design details that machine makers liked to put on their work back then. There are some hints of it shown, which in later machinery would be of purely utilitarian design. Aiw Has anyone kept track of the names, dates, and addresses of the Windsor area factories that have been in this thread so far? I'd go back and re-read it for the twelfth time, but you know how it is. If it exists. I'd be glad to format it, and add it to be attached to the bottom of THE LIST. |
Mikem Member Username: Mikem
Post Number: 2037 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.43.15.105
| Posted on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 - 10:35 pm: | |
Here's what I have on Kessler from Szudarek's "How Detroit Became...":
quote:"Martin Kessler designed an engine for the Chalmers Motor Co in 1907, and worked as an automotive consultant afterwards. In 1917, the Kessler Motor Company was formed to manufacture aircraft engines during the First World War.The Kessler Motor Co announced its plans for automobile production in January of 1920. The factory was located at 1297-1309 Terminal Avenue, at East Jefferson and the Terminal Railroad... "...In September 1921, the Kess-Line Motor Company was formed...Martin Kessler was president, and W.H. Radford, prominent in car manufacturing since 1903, was V.P....The former factory of the Liberty Motor Car Company, on Lycaste Avenue and the Detroit Terminal Line, was leased for production. The factory had 70,000 square feet of floor space with a production capacity of 60 cars per day. "The Kess-Line had a 119" wheelbase and used a 167 cubic inch tandem-four cylinder engine with a supercharger that produced 90-100 hp. The first car built was given 8,000 miles of the roughest road tests to prepare for production. The car was shown at the Detroit Auto Show in 1922, but never made it into production. "The Kess-Line Motor was reworked and used in the Balboa produced in Fullerton, California in 1924-1925, with the help of W.H. Radford."
The ex-RCH, ex-Liberty, Kess-Line factory, previously posted on page 10: https://www.atdetroit.net/forum/mes sages/5/56056.jpg |
Hornwrecker Member Username: Hornwrecker
Post Number: 262 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 63.41.24.101
| Posted on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 - 10:48 pm: | |
Thanks Mikem. I'm glad I now know the reason why I couldn't find anything about any cars that those two companies made; they never went into production. A big puzzle piece just fell into place! List updated, a few more blanks filled. |
31ford
Member Username: 31ford
Post Number: 249 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 152.163.100.195
| Posted on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 - 10:53 pm: | |
Damn good thread still!!! I'm going to dig thru my filing cabinets and see if I can come up with anything that hasn't been posted yet........... |
Mikem Member Username: Mikem
Post Number: 2038 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.43.15.105
| Posted on Tuesday, October 18, 2005 - 10:55 pm: | |
quote:"Good light had always been a concern of factory owners, but until the second decade of the twentieth century, discussion of lighting focused primarily on windows. Getting daylight , considered the best light for work, into factories required innovations in building and window design. As late as 1915, harry Franklin Porter, an engineer, wrote, "Window glass and white paint are better than electric lamps in the daytime for supplying factory illumination." Accordingly, industrial architects such as Albert Kahn enlarged factory windows by experimenting with reinforced concrete construction and changing the fundamental design of factory buildings, allowing the exterior wall to be almost all glass. The large windows installed in factories in that era concerned some employers, however. Some wanted translucent glass so that workers could not waste time by looking outside; others argued that a distant view gave the operative's eyes and mind an important rest from factory work."
Lindy Biggs, "The Rational Factory" |
Aiw
Member Username: Aiw
Post Number: 4778 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.70.116.110
| Posted on Thursday, October 20, 2005 - 12:06 am: | |
So... As anyone who goes to a library to research anything knows, you'll always find more than you bargain for... I found this old brochure from 1943: I have scanned it and posted it on my website in .pdf format. If interested, click here and click the cover to download... |
Aiw
Member Username: Aiw
Post Number: 4779 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.70.116.110
| Posted on Thursday, October 20, 2005 - 12:09 am: | |
Here is an old photo from the newspaper of Chrysler Plant #5 in Windsor... Until tonight I didn't know there was a plant five. I had been able to locate Plant 1,2,3 (still in operation) & 6 (built in 1976 & recently demoished). I always figured that 4 & 5 were elsewhere in Canada.
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Aiw
Member Username: Aiw
Post Number: 4780 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.70.116.110
| Posted on Thursday, October 20, 2005 - 12:11 am: | |
Kirt Motor Car Company made motorcycle engines? To add to the mystery.... It never ends... |
Aiw
Member Username: Aiw
Post Number: 4781 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.70.116.110
| Posted on Thursday, October 20, 2005 - 12:14 am: | |
Here is a newspaper clipping from December 1969. Demolition of Plant 1 of the Ford Motor Car Co. of Canada. This was the plant that was on the watefront. I said the 1970's I was close, demo work carred on into 1970.
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Aiw
Member Username: Aiw
Post Number: 4782 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.70.116.110
| Posted on Thursday, October 20, 2005 - 12:15 am: | |
All this because I was dumb enough to drop into the library to browse old Polk's to try and track down a few more factories... I never did get to the Polk's.... I do have more to sort through. So expect some more questions to be raised in the next few days. |
Aiw
Member Username: Aiw
Post Number: 4783 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.70.116.110
| Posted on Thursday, October 20, 2005 - 12:26 am: | |
MikeM or anyone... I can't remember, have we covered Tudhope's yet? I just came across some info on the Windsor side about the plant and the company... |
Mikem Member Username: Mikem
Post Number: 2039 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.43.15.105
| Posted on Thursday, October 20, 2005 - 12:33 am: | |
No, never heard of it. Crittenden must have been a Grosse Pointer to be buried from Verheyden's, a/k/a Chuck's Body Shop. |
Hornwrecker Member Username: Hornwrecker
Post Number: 265 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 63.41.40.13
| Posted on Thursday, October 20, 2005 - 12:33 am: | |
I don't recall that name, Tudhope, so far in this thread. Interesting about Crittenden, working for Chrysler and the V twin engine. I saw on CBC 9 today, one of those Windsor memories segments about the Seagrave fire truck plant in Walkerville that is still standing. |
Aiw
Member Username: Aiw
Post Number: 4784 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.70.116.110
| Posted on Thursday, October 20, 2005 - 7:52 am: | |
Hornwrecker, You're right, the only pictures I have of it are lousy. I will shoot it again and post some pics. It's really sorry looking and being on a main road, it's constantly in danger of Demolition. As for the Tudhope Motor Car Co., I'll transcribe the article later, it's from 1918 and was in the Windsor Paper at the time. A big article about the "Plant to employ 1000 men over 10 acres". I personally don't think it was ever built, this is the first I've ever heard of it. It sounds like it would be under the Kelsey-Hayes Plant... It was the brain child of Barney Everett (of E-M-F fame for those without a score card). |
Hornwrecker Member Username: Hornwrecker
Post Number: 270 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 63.41.8.107
| Posted on Thursday, October 20, 2005 - 10:41 pm: | |
LeBaron-Detroit (1928-42)- 3100 Meldrum & Charlevoix, cb, Briggs (d) The fire destroyed the Briggs factory on Meldrum in 1963. This plant was formerly used by LeBaron-Detroit, a division of Briggs to design the coachwork of some of the finest cars ever built in Detroit. The fire was so intense that it spread to and burnt down Our Lady of Sorrows Catholic Church. For more info on LeBaron-Detroit: http://www.coachbuilt.com/bui/l/lebaron/lebaron.htm I found mention of a Briggs plant on Mack, maybe around Beaufait, and found these photos a dFunk that identify it as a Briggs factory. This building came up on the last page, but is this source correct? The coachbuilt.com page says that LeBaron was on the 4th and 5th floors of the Mack factory. Mack Stamping? www.detroitfunk.com/archives/2005/09/briggs_manufact.html Newly found info may make this the former American Auto Trimming Co. plant that was on Meldrum, between Mack & Benson. This was sold to Briggs Mfg in 1925. This company also had a plant in Walkerville, and also made trucks. So another Windsor plant for you to find Aiw, here's some help: http://www.coachbuilt.com/bui/a/american_auto_trim/american_auto_trim.htm (Message edited by Hornwrecker on October 20, 2005) |
Bob_cosgrove Member Username: Bob_cosgrove
Post Number: 299 Registered: 03-2005 Posted From: 207.74.110.163
| Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 12:20 am: | |
From 1925-1926 Ray Dietrich of LeBaron was at 1601 Clay in a now-blue aluminum clad building across from Russell Properties in the what is now known as the Milwaukee Junction area. At the time he was designing bodies for Packard. He may have had other facilities at the same time or occupied space in body builders such as Briggs. Bob Cosgrove |
Jjaba Member Username: Jjaba
Post Number: 2599 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 24.22.82.162
| Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 12:32 am: | |
Wow, what a fire. AIW, never heard of Tudhope. Lay it on us, eh. jjaba |
Hornwrecker Member Username: Hornwrecker
Post Number: 272 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 63.41.8.107
| Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 12:37 am: | |
Dietrich Inc. (1925-36)- 1601 Clay St., cb, also used 1331 Holden Ave Lincoln plt For more than you ever wanted to know about Dietrich: http://www.coachbuilt.com/bui/ d/dietrich/dietrich.htm I'll have to re-read the LeBaron/Briggs/Dietrich pages to straighten out in my mind, if the Dietrich studio was a separate entity from the Briggs owned one. It gets almost as confusing as the numerous endeavors of Barney Everitt. I'm going systematically through all of the pages at this website to find any Detroit coachbuilders that we may have missed, or some new info and addresses. |
Bob_cosgrove Member Username: Bob_cosgrove
Post Number: 300 Registered: 03-2005 Posted From: 207.74.110.27
| Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 8:31 am: | |
At the time he was at 1601 Clay, 1925-26, Ray Dietrich was a separate entity and I believe conintued that way, but Hornwrecker can tell us for sure when he completes his reseach. Bob Cosgrove |
Bate Member Username: Bate
Post Number: 41 Registered: 02-2005 Posted From: 4.247.134.163
| Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 4:39 pm: | |
Hornwercker, isn't the detroit funk photo link (Briggs) the same building we were trying to read the sign on 20, or so, posts back? I think it might be... |
Bate Member Username: Bate
Post Number: 42 Registered: 02-2005 Posted From: 4.247.137.218
| Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 4:55 pm: | |
Mikem's post (Friday, October 07, 2005) does show the same building. Anyone know if the recent warehouse fire relates to any auto plant? Some of the photos on the detroit funk site show a building that must have some type of factory. |
Jjaba Member Username: Jjaba
Post Number: 2610 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 24.22.82.162
| Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 5:49 pm: | |
FOCUS ON CANADA. The TUDHOPE cars were built in Orillia, Ontario, a sleepy place of a town hard by Lake Simcoe. The place is colder than a well-digger's ass even in July. They built the "Everitt" showing association with Barney Everitt later of E-M-F and Studebaker. That was 1908-13. In 1914, Frank E. Fisher, mgr. of the Walkerville Studebaker plant bought a failed Tudhope and churned out a Fisher car with Tudhope and other spare parts lying around in Walkerville. The Fisher car was sold until 1918. After that, these guys made auto parts until 1928, the real end to Tudhope and Fisher. So Andrew can take a ride with wife Lori to Orillia and see what the hell's left up there. It would be wise to invest in a fur coat and knickers. WINDSOR, WALKERVILLE, CHATHAM, AMHERSTBURG These four Canadian cities produced an amazing number of name plates in bus, car, and truck rolling stock. Here are some of the names that were produced in these towns. Ford Studebaker Packard Dodge Chrysler Mc Laughlin Buick Hupmobile General Motors Menard Gramm Reo Gotfredson Tate Tudhope Fisher E-M-F Denby Joyce Two-in-One Symes Warford Colonial Brock. Anybody who could sell all these guys screws nuts bolts tires wheels body parts batteries glass, you name it, must have made $$$ millions. Windsor sure did put the British Empire and Canada on wheels. jjaba |
Noggin Member Username: Noggin
Post Number: 14 Registered: 09-2004 Posted From: 68.40.107.240
| Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 5:53 pm: | |
Rickenbacker Super Sport - Pretty neat looking car |
Noggin Member Username: Noggin
Post Number: 15 Registered: 09-2004 Posted From: 68.40.107.240
| Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 5:56 pm: | |
Rickenbacker Vertical 8 (top) Rickenbacker 6 cylinder sport (bottom) |
Mikem Member Username: Mikem
Post Number: 2040 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.43.15.105
| Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 6:03 pm: | |
We covered LeBaron and Briggs to some extent on page 1. Regarding Gotfredson, I thought their only plant was on Gratiot; I didn't know they owned any other property. From the Coachbilt - American Auto Trim link above:
quote:In 1924, the Gotfredson Corporation acquired the Wayne properties from the Harroun Motors Company. On September 14, 1917, the Harroun Motors Corporation was incorporated for ten million dollars. While waiting for their 24,000-unit-per-year factory to be built, the Harroun Company took possession of the former Prouty and Glass Carriage Company. It is believed that the slow settlement by the government for munitions Harroun had made, and not finding new investors in the wake of the post-war recession, may have dealt the end to the Harroun Motors Corporation in June 1922. The factory lay abandoned until the Gotfredson Truck Corporation purchased the complete automotive plant and about 45 acres of land in 1924. All advances hinged on the sale of their existing plant on [3100] Meldrum Avenue (between Mack and Benson) in Detroit. On Tuesday, May 12th 1925, the sale was announced of the American Auto Trimming Company plant of the Gotfredson Corporation to the Briggs Manufacturing Company for approximately $1,500,000. The American Auto Trimming Company, with the merger of Gotfredson during the previous year, became the motor body division of the Gotfredson Corporation, which was one of the largest independent auto paint and trim plants in the industry. According to Mr. B. Gotfredson, the sale was made after the Gotfredson Corporation had completed plans for expansion beyond the limits of the Meldrum Avenue factory. The motor body division of the corporation was to occupy temporary quarters in the body plant of the Kelsey Wheel Corporation on Kirby to continue production until the entire plant could be moved to the Gotfredson properties in Wayne, Michigan.
I looked in my 1925 directory and found these listings: American Auto Trimming Co. Benjamin Gotfredson pres, Robert B Gotfredson v-pres, Mark H Coleman sec-treas 3100 Meldrum Av Gotfredson Body Corp Benjamin Gotfredson pres, Robert B Gotfredson v-pres, Mark H Coleman sec-treas, Mfrs of Automobile Bodies and Tops, Automobile Painting and Trimming 3100 Meldrum Av Phone Melrose 6400 Gotfredson Land Co. Benjamin Gotfredson pres, Robert B Gotfredson v-pres, Mark H Coleman sec-treas, 3100 Meldrum Av Gotfredson Truck Corp Benjamin Gotfredson pres, Robert B Gotfredson v-pres, Mark H Coleman sec-treas Mfrs of Motor Trucks and Motor Busses 3601 Gratiot Av Phone Melrose 6412 Gotfredson Truck Corp Benjamin Gotfredson pres, Robert Gotfredson v-pres, M H Coleman sec-treas 3579-3601 Gratiot Av Wayne, Michigan Gotfredson Body Corp C S Briggs mgr no address given From this, my understanding is Gotfredson started American Auto Trimming to paint and trim bodies, and the Gotfredson Truck Corp to make trucks. They merged in 1925 to form the Gotfredson Corp. The American Auto Trimming plant on Meldrum was sold to Briggs and was used by LeBaron for a time. I have an article about Dietrich that I will look through later. If my memory is correct, Dietrich moved to his Clay Avenue studio from Meldrum Avenue. The plant burned in 1963. If you drive by today, a new factory has been built on the site, but you can see parts of the old foundation and old driveways leading off of Meldrum and Beaufait into the brick walls of the new building. The site of Our Lady of Sorrows is now a parking lot for a Baptist church across the street. I'm skeptical about the old brick building at Mack and Beaufait being Briggs, unless it was leased for part of its history by Briggs. The Detroit Funk site also says Briggs made small engines, i.e., "Briggs & Stratton", however that's a different company; no relation to Walter Briggs. Maybe he is confusing the plant at Beaufait with the former Mack Avenue Stamping. Lastly, I'm trying to picture Kelsey Wheel plant on Kirby. My directory says Kirby and Vermont Avenues. ??? |
Hornwrecker Member Username: Hornwrecker
Post Number: 276 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 63.41.40.127
| Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 6:06 pm: | |
No sir, I don't like it. You can't tell me that putting brakes on all four wheels isn't overkill. You boys over at Rickenbacker are just padding the bill with your fancy hydraulic brakes, and anyway, two wheel brakes were good enough to get us this far. And while I'm at it, you damn kids get off of my lawn. /punch drunk from sorting out coach builders |
Mikem Member Username: Mikem
Post Number: 2041 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.43.15.105
| Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 6:09 pm: | |
Also, old paint on the side of the Mack & Beaufait factory is barely readable. There are several layers, but I can make out the following words: "Used, New, Rebuilt" "All Guaranteed" and "DA____ ___REST & CO" It gave me the impression that it was a machinery dealer or remanufacturer. |
Sven1977 Member Username: Sven1977
Post Number: 122 Registered: 04-2004 Posted From: 209.220.229.254
| Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 7:26 pm: | |
When I was exploring the Sandborn Maps, I am pretty sure that there was a small Briggs plant on the other side of Beaufait. |
Mikem Member Username: Mikem
Post Number: 2043 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.43.15.105
| Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 7:31 pm: | |
Looking at older aerial photos, I think the Kelsey Wheel plant at Kirby and Vermont was razed for the construction of I-94. Kirby is now the eastbound I-94 service drive, and Vermont crossed Kirby a block east of where the GTW tracks cross I-94: 1949: TerraServer
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Mikem Member Username: Mikem
Post Number: 2044 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.43.15.105
| Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 8:02 pm: | |
Briggs also had a factory on Harper near the Milwaukee Jct which burned down in the 1920's: Reading Coachbuilt's entry for Briggs, I found this interesting passage which explains why I show a Briggs plant on the Ford Highland Park property on the 1947 maps I posted on page 1:
quote:Just as Ford was ramping up for the introduction of the Model A, a huge fire leveled Briggs’ Harper Ave. factory, leaving them with little to no space to manufacture the thousands of bodies they had hoped to sell to Ford. Since their other three plants - Mack Ave., Meldrum Ave, and Vernor Highway – were busy with other projects, a deal was struck with Ford where Briggs leased the 1.64 million sq. ft. Highland Park Model T plant which had been mothballed following the end of Model T production. Briggs signed a five-year renewable lease at $800,000 per year. Remarkably, the lease did not prohibit them from manufacturing bodies for other auto manufacturers, and for many years Briggs built Chrysler bodies inside a portion of the huge plant.
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Aiw
Member Username: Aiw
Post Number: 4797 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.70.116.110
| Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 8:19 pm: | |
Mike there were a Godfredson or Two on my side of the river as well.... This was at one time the Godfredson plant in Windsor. They acquired the property from Studebaker, not sure if the building was Studebaker's at one time. The Studebaker plant was across the street and 1/2 a block west. There's more to the plant, but this is the only photo I have handy... The plant is at the crest of where the road descends under the rail road tracks. As a result photos of the front are taken looking up...
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Aiw
Member Username: Aiw
Post Number: 4798 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.70.116.110
| Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 8:20 pm: | |
This is part of the Dominion Forge Complex. In 1918 they were supplying the Rouge Fordson Plant with drop forged parts...
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Aiw
Member Username: Aiw
Post Number: 4799 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.70.116.110
| Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 8:22 pm: | |
This was the Windsor Kelsey-Hayes Plant. Now in use as a stamping plant. The photo was taken about a half hour ago... So excuse the dusk.
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Aiw
Member Username: Aiw
Post Number: 4800 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.70.116.110
| Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 8:31 pm: | |
Here's a pair of mystery sites. This whole corridor is the Windsor Milwaukee Junction. This was the birthplace of the Canadian Auto industry. So I'm sure these two were at one time or another Automotive Related.... The red brick portion at the very left was the first part of this plant. Across the street was the site of the long demolished Chrysler Plant 1. This was the Essex Wire Corp. factory - They made "wire coling" I think this was the L.A. Young Facotry, that later made Divco Milk Trucks. (Message edited by aiw on October 21, 2005) |
Aiw
Member Username: Aiw
Post Number: 4801 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.70.116.110
| Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 8:37 pm: | |
Another topic we haven't covered yet are the phantom parking lots.... You know when a plant is gone, yet the employee parking lots remain. The old Dodge Main ones come to mind. I recently discovered these parking lots for the old Chrysler Plant 1. It's been gone for 30 years and there is nothing else around.
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Aiw
Member Username: Aiw
Post Number: 4802 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.70.116.110
| Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 8:43 pm: | |
Here's the plant one Sandborn, along with the location of the above Phantom Lot.
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Hornwrecker Member Username: Hornwrecker
Post Number: 277 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 63.41.8.185
| Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 10:16 pm: | |
Briggs timeline: 1877-Walter O. Briggs was born in Ypsilanti, Michigan on February 27 1904-hired to take charge of the upholstery shop for B.F. Everitt Co 1909-Walter O. Briggs buys B.F. Everitt Co. for $50k, worked way up to V.P. 1917- buys Sterling Auto Top Co Detroit, Detroit Curled-Hair Works, Murphy Chair Co (on Harper and MCRR) formerly C.H. Dunks Co, Detroit {bedsprings} 1923- buys Michigan Stamping Co of Chesterfield, (Mack Avenue Stamping(1916)) 1924-buys American Auto Trimming Co. (3100 Meldrum) and plant on Vernor Hwy 1927-buys LeBaron, moves to Mack plant called LeBaron Studios 1927- rumors of Briggs buying Murray, Hank Ford quashes it 1928-fire destroys Harper plant (ex-Murphy Chair) moves them to HP Ford plant 1929-buys Phillips Custom Body Co 1930-closes LeBarons NY office and Bridgeport, CT plt, moves to Detroit 1932-starts Briggs Motor Bodies Ltd. in Dagenham, England 1933- the Briggs Strike 1933-Briggsteel Beautyware bathroom fixtures started 1935- Walter Briggs assumes total ownership of the Detroit Tigers until his death 1937-strike at Meldrum plant 1942- LeBaron-Detroit named dropped due to in-house designs 1946-purchased the Abingdon Sanitary Manufacturing of Abingdon, Illinois 1952-Walter O. Briggs Sr. dies 1953-Chrysler buys Briggs plants for $35 million -10 in Detroit, and 1 in Youngstown, OH and Evansville, IN, plant in England sold to Ford, Conner plant leased to Packard. 1953- Briggs family keeps Briggs Beautyware division 1963- Briggs sell off to the Case Manufacturing Co. of Robinson, Illinois 1973-Briggs builds Knoxville Steel Plant, largest porcelain-on-steel plumbing ware plant in the world. 1997-Briggs purchased by Cerámicas Industriales, South America (CISA) http://www.coachbuilt.com/bui/ b/briggs/briggs.htm www.briggsplumbing.com LeBaron/Dietrich timeline: 1894-Raymond H. Dietrich was born in the Bronx, NY 1913-Dietrich works for Brewster & Co, where he meets Thomas Hibbard 1920-Dietrich and Hibbard form LeBaron, Carrossiers in NYC 1921-autoshow LeBaron coachwork on Leland's Lincoln 1923-merged with Bridgeport Body Co. 1924-started designing for Lincoln Motors, made by Murray 1924-Murray makes bid for LeBaron, and move ops to Detroit, bid fails 1925-Dietrich forms own studio in Detroit with 50% Murray ownership, 1601 Clay St. 1925-LeBaron Inc formed 1926-Briggs begins negotiations for LeBaron 1926, Dietrich Inc. moves to former-Leland Lincoln plant 1331 Holden Ave 1927-LeBaron-Detroit formed, uses 4th and 5th floors of Mack Stampin 1928-moves to 3100 Meldrum, bodies for Stutz, Chrysler, Lincoln, Pace-Arrow, Packard, and Hudson 1930-closes LeBarons NY office and Bridgeport, CT plt, moves to Detroit 1930-Ray Dietrich resigns. Ops transferred to one of the Murray plants 1931-Dietrich does independent designs, then works for Chrysler 1936-last use of Dietrich label, by Murray for Packard 1938-Dietrich consults for Checker 1942-Lebaron-Detroit names ceases to be used, Meldrum plant known as Briggs 1948-Dietrich conults for Tucker 1948 Raymond Dietrich Inc formed, Grand Rapids, MI, consults with Nash, Lincoln, Packard, Checker 1953-Dietrich Inc folds, 1958-LeBaron names reappears on Chrysler Imperial until 73 1963-Dietrich approached by Gibson Guitars, designs the Firebird to little success 1977-Chrysler ressurects LeBaron name for new model 1980- Raymond H. Dietrich dies at age 86 1982-infamous K-car based Chrysler LeBaron. (How the mighty have fallen.) 1985-death of the K-car LeBaron http://www.coachbuilt.com/bui/ d/dietrich/dietrich.htm http://www.coachbuilt.com/bui/ l/lebaron/lebaron.htm |
Jjaba Member Username: Jjaba
Post Number: 2614 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 24.22.82.162
| Posted on Saturday, October 22, 2005 - 2:33 am: | |
Hornwrecker, your research brings tears to our eyes. You are THAT good. jjaba |
Jjaba Member Username: Jjaba
Post Number: 2615 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 24.22.82.162
| Posted on Saturday, October 22, 2005 - 2:36 am: | |
Obviously, the flame under AIW is back. He's up and running with the Windsor photos. When he strikes Orillia poses, we reward him bigtime. But dress warm, AIW. Tis colder than a well-digger's ass up there any time of year. jjaba, on this northside of the Intl. Border. |
Aiw
Member Username: Aiw
Post Number: 4811 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.70.116.110
| Posted on Saturday, October 22, 2005 - 5:52 pm: | |
Here is the transcription of the Tudhope article... From the Evening Record Nov. 16, 1912
quote: Windsor Secures New Auto Factory That Will Employ 1,000 Men; Site Covers 10 Acres ______________________________ __________________ Barney Evirett (sic), the automobile king of Detroit, is starting mammoth industry in this city and will make the fur fly. ______________________________ __________________ BUILDINGS ALONE TO COST $75,000 ______________________________ _____________________ Factory district now practically sold out and city is arranging for purchase of 23 additional acres to satisfy new firms that want to locate here. ______________________________ __________________ Ald. W. W. Lanspeary, chairman of the Industrial Committee of the City Council, announces the decision of the Tudhope Automobile Manufacturing Co. to locate a mammoth plant in Windsor, occupying ten and a half acres in the factory district. After some weeks spent in negotiations, Ald. Lanspeary succeeded in overcoming all obstacles and landing this big industrial plum for the city. He holds in his pocket an agreement executed by the firm to purchase the required land for a site and to begin the erection of a factory building not later than April 15, same to be completed by July 15, 1913. A certified cheque for $300 has been deposited with the city as evidence of good faith in carrying out the agreement. The Bylaw has been prepared and will be given the first reading at City Council meeting on Monday night. It will then be presented to the rate payers at the municipal election for ratification. The new firm will spend $100,000 on buildings and site, exclusive of machinery and supplies. There will be a thousand men employed when the factory gets running to full capacity. The man behind this big industry is Barney Everitt of Detroit, who was one of the founders of the E.M.F. Co. He knows the automobile business from alpha to omega, backwards and frontwards, and then some. He is recognized as a factory organizer of the first order and if anyone can make a success of an auto industry it is Barney Everitt. The plant will be located between McDougall and Mercer, starting at Sheppard Ave. and running back to the Moloney Plant.
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Jjaba Member Username: Jjaba
Post Number: 2619 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 24.22.82.162
| Posted on Saturday, October 22, 2005 - 7:35 pm: | |
Excellent AIW. That story is consistent with the jjaba material posted above. jjaba is hoping AIW can get up to Orillia, Ontario with a full report on Tudhope and others. Be sure to wear your winter socks and a good coat. It's colder than a well digger's wife's ass up there. Tell us Andrew, do Lipton Tea workers take coffee breaks? jjaba, LOL. |
Hornwrecker Member Username: Hornwrecker
Post Number: 288 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 63.41.40.96
| Posted on Saturday, October 22, 2005 - 11:18 pm: | |
That old Barney sure kept his fingers in it, didn't he. I ought to do a time line on his dealings, as I having trouble keeping track of his adventures in entrepenuership. He reminds me a bit of Edison and P.T. Barnum. Thanks for the compliment Jjaba, but the reason I did it was so I could get things straight in my mind, and not have to refer constantly back to some huge web pages, or books. So much better to have everything out in the open (even though Mikem beat me to the punch about the Briggs Harper factory, even had the same fire pics ). I'm finding more coachbuilders that we haven't covered, and I suspect that there are also a bunch of truck mfgs that we don't even want to get into yet, I hope. |
Jjaba Member Username: Jjaba
Post Number: 2622 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 24.22.82.162
| Posted on Sunday, October 23, 2005 - 1:14 am: | |
Yes, a number of the names jjaba listed of Canadian motor companies were truck, bus, and specialty shops. Detroit had been a big carriage builder before automobiles with engines so the transition to cars was natural. Beaudette for example in Pontiac, made 2 million Ford bodies alone. Fords called them "Pontiacs". It took a lot of coach builders to keep the assembly lines going. The manufacturers jobbed alot of this work out to specialty shops. Body by Fisher had a historic coach as their logo. There was good reason for that. jjaba. |
Hornwrecker Member Username: Hornwrecker
Post Number: 291 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 63.41.8.141
| Posted on Sunday, October 23, 2005 - 1:58 pm: | |
Aiw, Jjaba: Here is some info on Tudhope. http://www.coachbuilt.com/bui/c/carriage/carriage.htm Since we seem to be on a fire trend currently, here are a couple of photos that I found of a fire at the Packard plant, sometime in the 1950s.
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Jjaba Member Username: Jjaba
Post Number: 2627 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 24.22.82.162
| Posted on Sunday, October 23, 2005 - 6:53 pm: | |
Hornwrecker, you are the best. In your article, there's about all you'd ever want to know about Tudhope. Now if AIW, Goat or some other Canadian can get to Orillia, Ontario, we got the pictures, each worth a thousand words. But careful, it's cold than a well digger's daughter's sister's ass up there. Wear good socks and crank up the heater on the carriage. Go quickly before you'll need a Tudhope cutter to get around town. jjaba, American. |
31ford
Member Username: 31ford
Post Number: 251 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 152.163.100.195
| Posted on Sunday, October 23, 2005 - 8:01 pm: | |
Too bad one couldn't buy CD of this thread... Lots of great info compiled into one source.. Could make for a great Forum fundraiser. Anyone have any info on the old Wills St. Claire plant? I think Chrysler took it over and added on greatly to the original structure. For those who don't know C.H. Wills was the cheif engineer, metallurgist for Henry Ford. He left Ford in the late teens to produce his own car. The Wills St. Claire.. It was a fine automobile, but not many flivver mechanics cold repair it properly due to it's complex overhead cam chain driven system, much like today's Escorts, etc.... |
Hornwrecker Member Username: Hornwrecker
Post Number: 293 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 63.41.40.121
| Posted on Monday, October 24, 2005 - 12:10 am: | |
I'm keeping a copy of all of this thread on my hardrive, including the Continental thread which I think started this whole mess. Someday I'll burn some CDs of it to give out, when somebody decides that this is done. Working through all of the local coachbuilders, I learned something that is obvious, but never realized until I read this sentence: ...brokered a deal whereby the C.R. Wilson Body Co., J.W. Murray Mfg. Co., Towson Body Co., and J.C. Widman & Co. would merge, forming the Murray Body Corporation under the leadership of John W. Murray That one sentence saved me hours of searching. Coming soon: the overly long, and probably incomplete list of Detroit Area Coachbuilders. 31ford I just found out that Erdman-Guider Co. made the bodies for the Ste Claire. No clue as to where the plant was. |
Bob_cosgrove Member Username: Bob_cosgrove
Post Number: 302 Registered: 03-2005 Posted From: 207.74.110.110
| Posted on Monday, October 24, 2005 - 12:28 am: | |
C. Harold Wills (1878-1940) and his wife, the former Mary Coyne,from 1914 to 1932 lived at 8344 East Jefferson in Indian Village on the south side of East Jefferson immediately to the west of John Owen Park at the foot of Iroquois. The house was removed c.1976. It was originally built for Carl Graham Fisher (no relation to the Fisher brothers as far as I know) a native of Indiapolis, who was founder of the Presto Lite Company and the Indianapolis Speedway and an organizer the Lincoln Highway Association. The Fishers lived there only one year, 1913, before returning to Indianapolis. The Wills purchased the their riverside estate (although house was not particularly large or imposing as the other river side homes were like J. B. Ford's or Edsel & Eleanor Ford's. Some of Carl Fisher's papers are in the Burton Historical Collection. These include a remembrance by Mrs. Fisher who wrote that their short stay was the result of the "smoke from the freighters" on the Detroit River. This is somewhat hard to believe. A more likely source of the once prevelent soot and cinders was the Morgan & Wright tire works (later UniRoyal)on East Jefferson at Helen just west of the Belle Isle Bridge. The Fisher/Wills site is still vacant although reportedly a second Belle Maison apartment building will be built there. Bob Cosgrove |
Mikem Member Username: Mikem
Post Number: 2052 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.43.15.105
| Posted on Monday, October 24, 2005 - 1:12 am: | |
31Ford, somewhere on page 10 we mentioned that the Wills-St Claire factory was loacated in Marysville, Michigan, a small town on the St Clair River south of Port Huron. Pictures can be seen here: Marysville Chrysler did buy the factory in the 1930's and I think they used it as a shipping point for much of what they built during the war. http://info.detnews.com/joyrid es/story/index.cfm?id=453 I show the Erman-Guider Co at 320 Beaubien in 1925, mfrs of auto bodies. (Message edited by MikeM on October 24, 2005) (Message edited by MikeM on October 24, 2005) |
Mikem Member Username: Mikem
Post Number: 2053 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.43.15.105
| Posted on Monday, October 24, 2005 - 1:48 am: | |
Hornwrecker, my 1925 directory entries... C.R. Wilson Body Co C Haines Wilson pres, George D Wilson v-pres and genl mgr, Edward J Connolly v-pres incharge mfg, Magnus M Burgess treas, Joseph M Brown sec, Charles McMillan asst sec and treas manufacturers automobile bodies 1660 Clay av J.W. Murray Manufacturing Co John W. Murray Chairman, James R Murray Pres, George Shanahan V-Pres, Fred J Krumm Sec-Treas, Mfrs sheet metal parts for motor cars, trucks and tractors, and sheet metal stampings Executive offices 1440 Clay av, Phone Empire 6900 Plant 1975 Clay av, Phone Empire 5000 Towson Body Co Morris Towson (Cleveland, O) pres, Gordon Fairgrieve v-pres, Wm P MacFarland sec, Wm M Locke treas auto body manufacturers 1424 Aberle av Aberle is a short, dead end-street northeast of the Milwaukee Jct area, running east off of Russell, a block south of Clay Ave. This map is from 1926: I couldn't find it on a 1947 map. Why? I guess because it essentially became an entrance drive into the future Russell Industrial Center: http://terraserver-usa.com/image.aspx?T=4&S=9&Z=17&X=3303&Y=46937&W=3 J.C. Widman & Co John C. Widman pres, Charles H Widman v-pres sales-mgr George H Widman treas, Wilfred S Gibbs assit treas manufacturers of automobile bodies and glass beveling 14th av cor Kirby av w 14th and Kirby is a block west of Vermont and Kirby, location of one of Hayes Wheel Corp's plants in my post #2043 above. |
31ford
Member Username: 31ford
Post Number: 252 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 152.163.100.195
| Posted on Monday, October 24, 2005 - 1:54 am: | |
Thanks Hornwrecker & MikeM.. I finally dug thru my junk and found some stuff that is postworthy.. been Downsizing pics this eve. |
Mikem Member Username: Mikem
Post Number: 2054 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.43.15.105
| Posted on Monday, October 24, 2005 - 2:56 am: | |
Who asked about Gray Motor Co? Gray Motor Corporation Frank L Klingensmith Pres, Frank F Beal V-Pres, H W Burritt Sec-Treas and Genl Mgr Motor cars and motors Mack av and Detroit Terminal Ry Phone Hickory 8000 This history of Gray is condensed from Szudarek's book: Ora Mulford, a boat manufacturer in Grand Rapids, moved to Detroit and with the backing of David Gray, designed his own marine engine. The Gray Marine Motor Co was formed in 1905, with a plant on 18 acres on Mack Avenue at the Terminal Railroad. In the spring of 1920, David Gray backed Frank Beal, a former Packard VP, and William Blackburn, a former Cadillac superintendent, and took over the plant for the purpose of manufacturing an automobile called the "Gray". After a year without production, Frank Klingensmith, former VP and treasurer of Ford Motor, became the president of Gray Motor Corporation. The Gray automobile was introduced in 1921, and went head-to-head with the Model T, but had additional refinements, such as a three speed selective transmission and and improved suspension. The sales volume never came close to the Model T even after additional improvements. Klingensmith resigned in 1925 and the company went out of business in June 1926. Another source I have, Motormen and Yachting by Michael Dixon, indicates that the Gray Motor Marine Corp first built its engines at a factory at Leib and Congress in 1907. In 1910, the company became a subsidiary of the United States Motor Corporation and moved production to a factory on Oakland Avenue in Highland Park. Apparently this plant later became part of the Chrysler HP complex. The move to Mack Avenue was in 1917, and Dixon says the plant was on Mack Ave at the Belt Line Road, near the Eastern Market. (I'm not sure which author has the correct railroad--I'm going with my Polk's directory and the Detroit Terminal RR. However, I think Dixon has the correct date for the move to Mack Avenue; Szudarek makes it sound as if the plant opened initially on Mack in 1905.) A few years after the reorganization to become an auto producer, Mulford exchanged his investment for sole ownership of the marine engine division, and relocated production of marine engines to the former factory of the Northern Manufacturing Company at 6910 E. Lafayette, corner of Canton, near the Belle Isle Bridge: Link to map Mulford died in 1944, and to settle his estate, the Gray Marine Motor Comapny became a subsidiary of Continental Motors, until 1969. The Gray factory closed in 1963 and production was moved to the Continental plant in Muskegon, where Grays were produced until 1968. |
Psip Member Username: Psip
Post Number: 398 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 69.246.13.131
| Posted on Monday, October 24, 2005 - 4:36 am: | |
Thanks MikeM (Message edited by psip on October 24, 2005) |
Hornwrecker Member Username: Hornwrecker
Post Number: 295 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 63.41.8.116
| Posted on Monday, October 24, 2005 - 12:54 pm: | |
Detroit Coachbuilders American Auto Trimming Co -(1909-25) 3100 Meldrum, also Walkerville American Motor Body Corp (1922-28)- ???, Stutz bodies Anderson Carriage Co.-(1895-1907) 416 Clay St> Anderson Electric Car O.J. Beaudette-(?-1922 )- ?? >Baldwin and Kennet Roads, Pontiac, bought by Fisher 1922 Briscoe Mfg. Co. -(1910s-1920s) Briggs -(1909-54) Mack Stamping, Vernor Hwy, Meldrum Ave. HP Ford, E. Outer Dr., Connor, (10 plts around Detroit) Clayton & Lambert Mfg. Co.-(1915-1970)- started in Ypsilanti 1882, Devine St. & Conner> Hudson 1929 (Kahn 1925), moved to ??? Columbia Body Co. -(1915-1930), ??? commercial Model T bodies, woodies Creative Ind. -(1949-1991)- ???, showcars, Daytona& Superbird,>Masco Tech, Taylor Detroit Auto Products Co.(1916?) 38 Sherman St, Ford bodies Detroit Body Company (1911-?)- Clay and St Aubin St, Spider cyclecar, Cadillacs Detroit Carriage Co. -(1898-1910) -???, Olds bodies Dietrich Inc. (1925-36)- 1601 Clay St., cb, 1331 Holden Ave former Lincloln plt England Mfg Co-?????? Detroit??? Erdman-Guider Co-(1913-35)-320 Beaubien , woodies, Paige, Ste Claire bodies Everitt, B.F.- (1899-1927) 63-65 Fort St. coachbuilder Everitt, B.F.- (1909 or 11) Beaufait & Mack, later Columbia plant 1916 Everitt Bros. Mfg. (191?-2? )- ??? East Jefferson> Briggs Fabric Body Corp.-(1923-1928)-fabric covered bodywork Fisher Body (1908->)- W. Fort & Livernois Fisher Body Plant #2 (wood kiln)- St. Antoine (d) 1925 Fisher Body Plant #4- Oakland Ave. Fisher Body Plant #7- Harper Ave / see parking lot behind F21 (d) Fisher Body Plant #10- 5140 Riopelle (Cadillac) Fisher Body Plant #12 -1961 E. Milwaukee (d) Fisher Body Plant #18 (aka Cadillac Fleetwood Plant)- 261 West End Ave (d 1993) Fisher Body #19 - Piquette and Hastings. Fisher Plant #21>GMC NATP (1919-1990?) - 601 Piquette (s) Fisher Body #23- used as GMC NAPT assembly 1990-94 (s) Fisher Body #27- (1925>)-E. Milwaukee & Hastings now NewCenter (8 mile movie site) (s) Fleetwood Metal Body Co-(1926->) 261 West End Ave, Fisher #18 (d) Fox Bros. & Co.-(1912-? )-??? associated with Kelsey-Herbert (Tiffany window Newberry Hall) Gotfredson Body Company -(1924-1927) 36253 Michigan Ave. Wayne, MI, Sainte Claire bodies, (Wayne Body Co?) Griswold Body Co. (1909-1932)-5800 block of Commonwealth St, cb, Paige bodies Guider-Sweetland-(1913-3?)-??? Lincoln hearse and ambulances Hayes Mfg Co.-(1904-24)-??? Hussey Auto & Supply (1902-03)- Beaubien & Trombley, 1st Cadillac body LeBaron-Detroit (1928-42)- 3100 Meldrum, cb, Briggs (d) Michigan Auto Body Co. - Michigan Body Co. -(1910s) - Milford Model Body Corp -(1920s) ???? fabric body? Monroe Body Company -(1910-1916) - ??? Pontiac, Michigan> Chevy Murray Mfg (1913-24)- Fordyce St and Morrow St., 1600 Clay St. Murray Body(1924-55)- 7590 Russell, 1975 Clay Ave Pontiac Body Co. - (1902-1916) - Pontiac > Oakland Sievers & Erdman-(1875-1910)- Brush & Woodbridge, Jefferson & Beaubien Springfield Body Co.(?)- ??? Detroit, cb Standard Wagon Works-(188?-1908)- Albert Fisher (uncle) Fisher#1? W.F. Stewart Co.-(1868-1939) - Flint, Pontiac, Grand Blanc, >GM Testagruzza Brothers Body Co - 1950s - Oxford, Michigan, fiberglass Towson Body Co. -(1922-1925) -1424 Aberle Av Detroit, Michigan (Anderson Body Co.?) >Murray Trippensee Mfg.(1908-2?)- 2679 East Grand Blvd, cb, bought by Everitt Wadsworth Mfg-( 1919-25)-Kercheval and Conners > Chrysler (MI Steel Boat Co.) Wayne Foundry & Stamping Co (1939->)- 3100 Hubbard Ave J.C. Widman & Co. -(1900-1925) - Trombley and Orleans St > Murray J.C. Widman & Co 15th St., Kirby St. & GTWRR Wilson, C.R.-(1897-1924) 1600 Clay, Milwaukee Jct. cb . Murray Wilson-Hayes Mfg. (1903-16)- 750 Bellevue Ave, cb John McArthur of Detroit Michigan built the aluminum bodies for the DAC or Detroit Air-Cooled Car of 1922-23. Described as a veteran auto body builder. |
Bob_cosgrove Member Username: Bob_cosgrove
Post Number: 306 Registered: 03-2005 Posted From: 207.74.110.208
| Posted on Monday, October 24, 2005 - 2:26 pm: | |
There are two "Belt Railways" in Detroit. The Inner Belt was the Michigan Central line that ran between Beaufait and Bellevue. After passing under East Jefferson and servicing the Morgan & Wright later UniRoyal) tire plant it turned west and became the Michigan Central controlled Detroit Transit Railway. The Transit railway ran on Franklin and Wight streets almost to the Grand Trunk's Dequindre cut east of St. Aubin. It served numerous waterfront industries including Parke, Davis & Company pharmaceuticals, Michigan Stove Company, Riley Stoker, Berry Brothers Paint & Vanish, etc. The Outer Belt still exists. Officially, it is the Detroit Terminal line (owned equally by the Grand Trunk Western, Lake Shore & Michigan Southern and the Michigan Central - the latter two being subsidiaries of the New York Central). It paralles between St. Jean and Connor crossing East Jefferson to the DTE Point on the Detroit River. The Outer Belt went around the city and some of the western end has been removed. Bob Cosgrove |
Jjaba Member Username: Jjaba
Post Number: 2635 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 24.22.82.162
| Posted on Monday, October 24, 2005 - 2:30 pm: | |
jjaba congratulates Hornwrecker on his list. A real comprehensive piece of work. Thanks, jjaba. |
Mikem Member Username: Mikem
Post Number: 2060 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.43.15.105
| Posted on Monday, October 24, 2005 - 8:01 pm: | |
All addresses from 1925-1926: American Motor Body Corp 12262 Kercheval From page 3; "American Motor body was bought by Chrysler in 1925 giving them a 700,000 sq ft body manufacturing plant. This came to be known as the Chrysler Kercheval plant."} https://www.atdetroit.net/forum/mes sages/5/40097.jpg I also have an American body & Wagon Works 1623 Michigan Av O.J. Beaudette Walnut St, Pontiac (no number) Clayton & Lambert Mfg. Co. sheet metal stamping 6282 Beaubien Columbia Body Co. 49 Selden Detroit Auto Products Co. auto supplies 701 Livingston Av Fabric Body Corp. office 12-224 General Motors Bldg Gotfredson Body Corp 3100 Meldrum Av Guider-Sweetland Co. auto trimmers 10226 Woodward Av Model Body Corp 7201 Six Mile Rd Sievers & Erdman Co automobile painting 320 Beaubien (same as Erdman-Guider) W.F. Stewart Co 1023 Harriet, Flint Trippensee Closed Body Corp 5685 12th St corner Stanley Av |
Aiw
Member Username: Aiw
Post Number: 4821 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 209.216.150.127
| Posted on Monday, October 24, 2005 - 8:03 pm: | |
Hornwrecker, I plan to cross refence that list against some old Polk's on this side and see if there were any "branch plants". |
Mikem Member Username: Mikem
Post Number: 2063 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.43.15.105
| Posted on Monday, October 24, 2005 - 8:42 pm: | |
"Auto Body Manufacturers" Polk's 1925-1926
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Kathleen Member Username: Kathleen
Post Number: 1004 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 69.14.122.57
| Posted on Monday, October 24, 2005 - 10:25 pm: | |
There were a couple mentions (and even a separate thread) about the Packard Proving Grounds earlier this year, but somehow the dedication of their new historic marker was overlooked. I saw an article on the front page of this week's Tech Center News and checked out the Packard Proving Grounds website to find that the marker was dedicated back in August. "On Wednesday, August 17, 2005, a ceremony was held at the Packard Proving Grounds Historic Site to dedicate a State of Michigan Historical Marker containing the following text: The Packard Motor Car Company began building a proving ground on this site in 1926. Packard, like its competitors, had previously tested cars on city streets. Architect Albert Kahn designed the principal buildings. By 1929 the complex included the Gate Lodge, warehouses, laboratories, a high-speed test track, and twelve miles of roads simulating the worst conditions of the day. During World War II (1941-1945) Packard built aircraft and marine engines while leasing the grounds to Chrysler for tank testing. Packard ceased production in 1958, and the Ford Motor Company purchased the site in 1961. In 2000 Ford and the Packard Motor Car Foundation began working to preserve the design complex portion of the site. The backside of the marker contains this additional text: In 1899 brothers James Ward and William Doud Packard founded the Ohio Automobile Company in Warren, Ohio. In 1902 Detroiter Henry Joy and several other local investors purchased the company, moved it to Detroit and renamed it the Packard Motor Car Company. During the 1920s and 1930s, Packard set the standard for luxury and design. Under the direction of chief engineer Jesse G. Vincent, Packard, known as “America’s Master Motor Builder,” also made advances in aviation technology. Vincent contributed to the development of the Liberty aircraft engine during World War I and predicted the growth of commercial aviation. He considered a proving ground to be essential to high quality. Over 100 people attended the ceremony including local business people, civic leaders, senators, representatives, and officials from Ford. ..." Here's a link to their page with photos, including one of the marker:http://www.packardmotorfdn.org /Marker%20dedication%20page.ht m Planning a drive out to Shelby Township to see the marker and enjoy a meal at the Packard Grill!!! |
Mikem Member Username: Mikem
Post Number: 2066 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.43.15.105
| Posted on Monday, October 24, 2005 - 11:36 pm: | |
Here are a few pics of Cadillac's Clark Street factory during the war. Cadillac won an Army-Navy Production Award ("E" Flag) in December, 1942. I could say that it's similar to a Ford Q1 flag, but that doesn't seem right, does it? Anyway, a few generals, a marching band, and Mayor Jeffries came to the plant to give some congratulatory speeches to the workers: Cadillac started war production in March, 1939. Their first task was to build parts for liquid-cooled aircraft engines. In 1941 they started building a light tank, the M-5, followed by other models later in the war. It was for their output of M-5 tanks that they won the award. A brochure from the awards ceremony shows a few pictures of the factory. The first two are peacetime production and the last two, war time production, demonstrating how Cadillac was suited for both. I suppose the last night shot emphasizes how the factory was in production around the clock.
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Hornwrecker Member Username: Hornwrecker
Post Number: 296 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 63.41.40.13
| Posted on Monday, October 24, 2005 - 11:45 pm: | |
When I was clicking through what seemed like hundreds of pages on that web site, I was wondering if this angle of attack would be useful for tracing some of these OCFs. I'm glad that this may prove to be useful, and unleash the urban explorers to see if any of these still exist. Thanks for the info Mikem, and I'll update the CB list (when I feel like it), adding new addresses and builders, and for the Gray stuff. I think I can find some photos of the cars and maybe a factory now. One thing that I found interesting was that the Cadillac stamping plant on Conner, nee Hudson, was originally built for Clayton and Lambert in 1925 by Albert Kahn. Hudson must have really wanted that capacity, as the plant was only a few years old when they bought it in 29. It might have been mentioned before in this thread, or another, but I may have completely forgotten about it. |
Hornwrecker Member Username: Hornwrecker
Post Number: 297 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 63.41.40.13
| Posted on Monday, October 24, 2005 - 11:54 pm: | |
The Production E is like the Navy Battle E that is awarded to the top performing ship of each type, in each fleet, on its yearly workups and inspections. It was, and still is a big deal; today the E is awarded as a ribbon, and in the past an E was sewn onto ones uniform sleeve. Somewhere I have a Production E lapel pin that was given to the employees. I imagine there was much boasting in the local beer gardens after work, when you walked in wearing it back then. |
Hornwrecker Member Username: Hornwrecker
Post Number: 306 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 63.41.8.33
| Posted on Wednesday, October 26, 2005 - 10:51 pm: | |
I finally have some limited info to add about Gray Motors. Looking at a bunch of ads, their original plant was on Lieb St, near Larned. This one seemed to have an address that was under constant change, or copy editors had worse eyesight than I do. Lieb shows up as: 18, 24, 31, 33, 37, and 124; it might have been long building. The next address I found on a letterhead is 614 Charlotte near Woodward (1911) An enlargement of the plant from a better source: The address that I found on Mack was 2102 Mack Ave. No photo of factory found yet... An ad for the 1923 Gray: ...and the car. Other addresses: (1912) 11309 GMC Bldg, 160 US Motors Bldg, (1906) 447 Gouin St., and (1926) 220 Lafayette, east of Canton. There is and address for a Canadian plant in Walkerville, it is either 31 or 614 River Front Drive (1910). (Message edited by Hornwrecker on October 26, 2005) |
Aiw
Member Username: Aiw
Post Number: 4833 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 209.216.150.127
| Posted on Wednesday, October 26, 2005 - 11:06 pm: | |
Humm... River Front Dr ? Riverside maybe? However it was called Sandwich St. back then... Sounds like some further investigation is required. I'll have to go through the 1910 Polk's and see what I come up with... |
Aiw
Member Username: Aiw
Post Number: 4834 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 209.216.150.127
| Posted on Wednesday, October 26, 2005 - 11:11 pm: | |
Also, I had an email today from a Gentelman is Switzerland. He found the thread through Google, and is looking for some information. Maybe we can help him out.... He bought an old American car. It is a 1913 Wahl from Detroit. He was able to find 3089 E. Grand Boulevard in old magazine ads from 1913-14, as the factory address. He was wonder if the factory was still around? If the numbering system is similar today as it was in 1913, that would put it near the intersection of Woodward.. He found that Bate had posted a little about Wahl in #3, and is signing up for an account to information hunt. Any ideas? |
Aiw
Member Username: Aiw
Post Number: 4835 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 209.216.150.127
| Posted on Wednesday, October 26, 2005 - 11:16 pm: | |
Could this be the answer to the above Hornwrecker?
quote:Gray-Dort's originated in the Chatham carriage works of William Gray & Sons Company Ltd, founded in 1855 by William Gray. In the mid 1900's Robert Gray (William's Father, then president of the company) began to build Ford bodies for the Walkerville Factory. They continued to do so until 1912. During this period, they also built bodies for the locally built Chatham car. In 1915 Robert Gray obtained the Canadian rights to manufacture the Dort Automobile from Flint automobile manufacturer J. Dallas Dort, of the Dort Motor Co., and that year Gray-Dort was formed. They produced two cars the first year, a Model 4 roadster, and a Model 5 touring car. Over the years Gray-Dort became known for their cars of reliable quality--ones that easily started in all weather conditions. In 1923, after several years of successful but stressful business, J. Dallas Dort decided he wanted out of the automobile business. Try as he might, Robert Gray could not dissuade him. A few months later, Dallas Dort died while playing golf. Their easy access to U.S. sources of engineering and mechanical parts having abruptly come to a close, the company began to lose money. Gray-Dort scrambled to find new a U.S. based partner to no avail, and the last few years of its life were spent liquidating assets. Over the course of it's lifetime, Gray-Dort manufactured around 26,000 quality automobiles
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Hornwrecker Member Username: Hornwrecker
Post Number: 307 Registered: 04-2005 Posted From: 63.41.8.33
| Posted on Wednesday, October 26, 2005 - 11:19 pm: | |
Here's a closeup of the street name, though I question the address, because I've seen the same number used for both Detroit and Walkervile in the ads, the other 614. Here's a postcard of Windsor that I found from around 1900. In the bottom of the card is Gray carriage makers, not affiliated with Gray Motors, that is until they got together with Gray-Dort from Chatam and London, during the 1920s.
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Aiw
Member Username: Aiw
Post Number: 4836 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 209.216.150.127
| Posted on Wednesday, October 26, 2005 - 11:39 pm: | |
I have that postcard. That is not Walkerville, and is in those days, not close. I think a trip to sort through the directories may be in order. Sadly they aren't always accurate either! |
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