Discuss Detroit » Hall of Fame Threads » Old Car Factories » Old Car Factories - 15
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Jjaba
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Post Number: 2865
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Posted From: 24.22.82.162
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 3:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

More than anything, the 1941 PACKARD CLIPPER TAXIS were a huge publicity stunt for the Packard Motor Car Company. The taxis were sold through regular dealers and suddenly appeared on city streets from Boston to Portland to Brisbane.
It was hard for Checker to compete with Packard, and ofcourse Packard had these moving adverts all over the world with those taxis.

These Clippers were loved by their drivers and and nobody could beat the comfort for passengers.
They had an early form of air conditioning for summer comfort. The back windows were raised so the system could recycle the cooler air. By raising the rear window in summer, this allowed air to enter the trunk. Thus, stowaway kids in trunks could easily breathe when a carload entered an amusement park. The savings of ten cents per child meant something to a family on a budget.

1941 Packard Taxi owners bought siphon hoses. During WWII rationing, taxis carried unlimited "T Ration Cards." They had huge gas tanks. Owners would meet family cars in dark alleys at night and exchange gas through siphon. Family cars carried "A Ration cards." (In jjaba's neighborhood, we already knew that "money talks, bullshit walks"- but in the context of our merchants.)

Those were the days my friends, we thought they'd never end...

jjaba, Westside Memories.
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Hornwrecker
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Posted on Sunday, December 11, 2005 - 10:43 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I've sent off the latest version of the OCF list database to AIW, version 2.2. New to the list is a column added for photos/maps; p for a photo in this thread, and an s if there is a Sanborn map. I did this to help keep track of what's been posted so far. Also added were the cyclecar makers mentioned in Szudarek's book, and any other name that had at least the name of the previous owner of the factory, which could help on the map searches.

I started to add a column for what page of the OCF thread the factory had been discussed, but this proved to be too daunting a task. Some, like Briggs seem to pop up on almost every page. If someone else would like to give it a try...

If anyone wants a copy of it as an Excel spreadsheet, email me at my username @gmail.com
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Hornwrecker
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Posted on Saturday, December 17, 2005 - 12:27 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The Cartercar factory at 220-230 First St, from 1907-09, they later moved to 40 Frankilin St, Pontiac from 08-15


Cartercar factory 1st St
DPL/NAHC

1907 Cartercar

1907 Cartercar

1913 Cartercar Ad

1913 Cartercar advertisement
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Hornwrecker
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Posted on Tuesday, December 20, 2005 - 1:07 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Some interior photos of the Cartercar factory on 1st.








DPL/NAHC

Does anyone know what cross streets this was close to?
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Mikem
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Posted on Tuesday, December 20, 2005 - 2:23 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

220-230 First Street during those years was between State and Bagley. 230 was at the southeast corner of First & Bagley.
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Hornwrecker
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Posted on Tuesday, December 20, 2005 - 11:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks Mike, one of these days we've got to start mapping the OCF database, maybe even an interactive one tied to the db entries. Needs someone knowledgeable in internet mapping programs, or web sites.

Here's a bit of info that I found on Byron Carter.

Byron J. Carter, of Jackson, Mich., built a steam car in 1902 and joined with two fellow Jackson investors, George Matthews, owner of Fuller Buggy Co., and Charles Lewis, president of Lewis Spring and Axle Co., in 1903 to form Jackson Automobile Co. to manufacture steam and gasoline engine cars. Carter left to pursue his idea of friction drive with the Cartercar and Jackson built gasoline cars until 1923. Matthews, who had taken over the company, sold it in 1923 to Associated Motor Industries, which also acquired Dixie Flyer, of Louisville, and National, of Indianapolis. All were gone by the end of 1924.

http://www.waitansee.com/Laram ie/MoreHorselessCarriages.html /

The beginnings of Oakland, which Cartercar figures in.

On Aug. 28, 1907, Walter M. Murphy, incorporated the Oakland Motor Co. Murphy is said to have chosen the Oakland name for his car venture, located in the Oakland County, MI, city of Pontiac, because crosstown rival Pontiac Spring & Wagon Works already was making a high-wheel motor wagon under the Pontiac name. Both the Oakland Motor Company and Pontiac Spring & Wagon Works Company decided to merge together in November 1908 under the name of the Oakland Motor Car Company. The operations of both companies were joined together in Pontiac, Michigan to build the Cartercar

In January 1909, General Motors Corp. President, William C. Durant, purchased a 50% interest in the Oakland Motor Car Company. Later that year GM, bought out the other 50% after the unexpected death of Walter M. Murphy at the age of 45. Also in 1909, GM also purchased the Rapid Motor Vehicle Co.

This was the beginning of the General Motors Company.


http://www.scripophily.net/pos pwawo.html

Then there's the interesting story about how he died, and what came from it...

(Message edited by Hornwrecker on December 20, 2005)
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Hornwrecker
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Posted on Monday, December 26, 2005 - 2:33 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

A drawing from an early Cartercar catalog, I liked that art noveau dealy under the name, so I PSed it into this jpeg.

Cartercar catalog pic

What, nobody wants to research Byron Carter's death and its impetus for what developed from it? It may be a legend, as I've heard various versions of it.
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Jjaba
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Posted on Monday, December 26, 2005 - 4:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Nice work on Cartercar and Byron Carter.
Your scholarship and photos to backup are really appreciated. This thread should win awards from somebody. It is so extensive. Tours should be organized by MikeM, and Hornwrecker. Excellent.
jjaba, old Westside Detroiter and Carshop John.
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Toolbox
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Posted From: 65.196.220.198
Posted on Tuesday, December 27, 2005 - 2:33 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

Hornwrecker

What, nobody wants to research Byron Carter's death and its impetus for what developed from it? It may be a legend, as I've heard various versions of it.




He died as a result of pneumonia while in the hospital recovering from injuries he got crank starting a car. The electric starter was desigined by Charles Kettering as a result of his death.
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Hornwrecker
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Posted on Sunday, January 01, 2006 - 10:40 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I found a detailed story of how Carter influenced the electric starter:

http://www.theautochannel.com/ mania/industry.orig/history/ch ap5.html

Among the many auto companies which William Durant bought for General Motors in its first few years was one owned by Byron T. Carter, who designed the friction-drive Cartercar.

In December, 1910, Carter stopped to help a woman whose car had stalled on Detroit's Belle Isle Bridge. As Carter hand-cranked her engine, it backfired, spinning the crank backward. The crank broke Carter's arm and shattered his jaw. Two Cadillac engineers passing by on the way to work took Carter to a hospital, where he developed pneumonia and died.

Cranking engines by hand was the way to start them in those early years and it was a hazardous undertaking. It took considerable strength to turn the engine with the crank and if the cqar backfired, the crank could suddenly turn with great force. Broken arms and other injuries were not uncommon.

Henry Leland, head of GM's Cadillac Division, knew Carter and was horrified when he heard of his death. He assigned a group of Cadillac engineers to find a solution to the problem of cranking engines to start them. They did: Charles F. Kettering.

While an engineer at National Cash Register Co. in Dayton, Ohio, Kettering had invented a small, high-torque electric motor to replace the hand crank on cash registers. Kettering and Edward Deeds, who had been sales manager at NCR, set up their own company, Dayton Engineering Laboratories Co. (Delco) to make and market an automotive ignition system Kettering had designed. One customer was Cadillac.

Two months after Kettering and his associate, William A. Chryst, began work on the auto starter, they gave a demonstration of it and Cadillac bought it. In fact, Cadillac bought more than a starter, because Kettering had integrated the starter -- adapted from the cash register motor -- into a complete ignition and electrical system which included a battery recharged by a generator run by the engine and electric headlights to replace acetylene lamps The system was installed on Cadillac's 1912 model, one of those very few cars that was truly an automotive milestone.

Kettering's system -- basically still used by every maker in the world -- opened motoring to a vastly greater public.



Copyright 1996, Richard A. Wright
Published by Wayne State University's Department of Communications
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Livernoisyard
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Posted on Sunday, January 01, 2006 - 10:53 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I had a Renault during the 1960s that had a hole in the front for a crank. It was fun to do it unless you held your thumb in the wrong position...
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Jjaba
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Posted on Monday, January 02, 2006 - 4:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

When did the French actually get a Kettering starter? Long live the French.
jjaba
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Scrippsbooth
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Posted on Wednesday, January 04, 2006 - 3:38 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I think I can give some input to the Scripps-Booth plant on Beaufait Ave. and also the Saxon plant there too.

The Scripps Motor Co. plant illustration at 629 Lincoln Ave [also used 650 and post 1921 it was 5817] was used in the first Scripps Booth Cyclecar Co. sales folders, but only the prototype and first one or two show models were built in a small corner of this large plant by the newly formed in late 1913 Scripps-Booth Cycle Car Co. Uncle Will Scripps owned this well established marine engine firm that lasted till 1956 and was also a large stockholder in the cyclecar company. The early 1914 Scripps-Booth Cyclecar Co. sales folders listed its address at Lincoln Ave and the M.C.R.R. railroad.

In January of 1914 it was announced that the Scripps-Booth Cyclecar Company had purchased the plant at Beaufait Ave and Gratiot Ave. which appears on the DPL’s 1915 Baist’s Real Estate Atlas map [I visited the DPL several times on vacation in the 1987 to 1998 period] as about a 100 by 100 ft square building – and the picture in some sales folders shows it as a 3 story building. This building was labeled in this map as just a “Cycle Car Co.” which was located across the street on the east side from the lots of 1019 and 1021 Beaufait Ave which goes along with the listed address of the 1915 Scripps-Booth Co. at 1020-1030 Beaufait Ave. Then about the time WC Durant, WH Little, and Chevrolet Motor Co. took over the Scripps-Booth Co. when it was merged with the Sterling Motor Company in July 1916, the office at least was moved down the street to 981 Beaufait Ave. for 1916 to 1920.

Sometime after Chevrolet joined GM Corp. in May of 1918, GM took over control of Scripps-Booth Corp. from Chevrolet and it was Scripps-Booth who GM purchased the ex Saxon new plant [McGraw and Wyoming] for in 1919 from the government for which Scripps-Booth moved into in early 1920. When GM discontinued the Scripps-Booth in April 1922, the plant was turn in to a reported Buick Closed Body plant [not Fisher Body]. When Fisher Body bought the large ex Durant plant in Flint - this Flint plant was converted into Fisher Body Plant No. 1 in 1926 to supply Fisher Closed Bodies to Buick, and when Buick moved out - the LaSalle moved in. Then Saxon expanded its factory space by taking over the old Scripps-Booth Beaufait Ave. facilities.

(Message edited by Scrippsbooth on January 04, 2006)
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Hornwrecker
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Posted on Wednesday, January 04, 2006 - 1:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Welcome to the OCF thread and the forum ScrippsBooth, and thank you for the information. I'll put it into the database (eventually), and figure out how to keep the McGraw stuff straight. That plant must hold the record for the most number of marques from a single factory of any of the Detroit factories.

I wonder if word of this thread is working its way around the old car collectors, or if you noticed the web hits from this site? Would a mention to then antique car community, like in Hemmings, or one of the main clubs be fruitful in gaining more info about Detroit's OCFs?
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Mikem
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Posted on Wednesday, January 04, 2006 - 6:52 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hello ScrippsBooth, thanks for your contribution! That helps to fill some gaps in our research.

A poster named Larry started a brief thread over a year ago about the Federal Screw Works plant on the west side:
http://atdetroit.net/forum/messages/23585/33132.html

Today, I was driving down John Kronk when the faded, painted word "Federal" at the top of a building caught my eye:

FSW

Upon closer inspection, I noticed these details near the top of the office portion of the factory (my camera was having a hard time with the drizzle today):

FSW1

FSW2

The building is on the west side of Martin, stretching between Kronk and Bruckner:

FSW3

FSW4

I know Federal Screw expanded to the suburbs and I think they recently went bankrupt. Was Federal Screw a Detroit-based company? How much of their product was dedicated to the auto industry?
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Mikem
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Posted on Wednesday, January 04, 2006 - 7:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

A stone's throw from Federal Screw is this worn out plant at 7175 Edward, just east of Central:

Edward 7175

The blue color caught my eye because it reminds me of what I informally call Mopar Blue - that blue color Chrysler painted everything in the late '60s. I thought maybe this could be a west side Chrysler plant since we're close to the former McGraw Glass Plant and the Paige factory on W Warren, which Chrysler operated briefly.

The paint has faded but it looks like the sign says "Central _______ ". Then I noticed the detail above the first floor windows:

wire wheel

I have a feeling there was a company called Central Wire Wheel or something similar. Any ideas?
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Kathleen
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Posted on Wednesday, January 04, 2006 - 10:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Welcome, ScrippsBooth, to the Forum and this wonderful Old Car Factories thread. How did you find us? And are you that into the Scripps-Booth cars?

As an extension of my interest in Cranbrook and the Booth and Scripps families and their many contributions to the city as well as the automobile industry, I went to a lecture on James Scripps Booth and an exhibit of his artwork. And I seen a couple Scripps-Booth cars on display as well. Fascinating!!!
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Hornwrecker
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Posted on Wednesday, January 04, 2006 - 11:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mikem, great details on a building with really ugly additions. I have no idea if Federal was based in Detroit, but will keep eyes open. There probably are a hell of a lot more fastener plants around Detroit, if one really looked for them. The only other wheel company that we don't have listed is Disteel somewhere in that area.

Here are a couple of aerials from 1949 for the Scripps-Booth locations. The first is Gratiot and Beaufait, and the second one for Lincoln and Holden, though I couldn't pick out if the S-B factory is anywhere in the photo.

Gratiot & Beaufait Sripps-Booth factory aerial

(photo removed for correction)

(trying to figure out why the first pic at 49.00k kept getting rejected for being over 50k. Scimping on the bandwidth Lowell?)

(Message edited by Hornwrecker on January 05, 2006)
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Livernoisyard
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Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 12:26 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Federal Screw Works was a Tier 1 supplier until 1994 or so and was HQed in the Buhl Bldg until around 2000. Dates back to 1917, according to its web site, but I saw a reference somewhere that mentioned 1913. Possibly a merger or name change? I pass by the Edward plant at times but never really paid much attention to it.

Perhaps there was a connection to the Federal Truck Company on Federal and Hammond near St. Hedwig's. They made big garbage-type trucks in the 1920s, maybe earlier, I think. My mother was born just across the street from it on Hammond.
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Livernoisyard
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Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 3:04 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

A 1910 reference to the Federal Motor Truck Company lists its address as 108 Leavitt. Just where might that be?
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Scrippsbooth
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Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 4:30 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yes - you might say I am into the Scripps-Booth cars, the company history and the factory and people that made my car. The way I found the OCF site was while doing a Google search on the name "Scripps Booth" I saw you link. I have a 1918 Scrippps-Booth Model G roadster that is my best driving car and I enjoy taking it on the Chev 4 Cylinder Tour each summer.
I also own the ex-Harrah's 1912 Little Four runabout which was built at the Flint Wagon Works plant in western Flint. So naturally I am very interested in Flint OCF's too. The last vetern car I have is a 1918 Chevrolet Model D-5 "Eight" touring car that was built at the NYC plant in January 1918, so over the years I have researched this plant that was closed down in August 1918.
The great 1949 Photo of Beaufait Ave shows the original Scripps-Booth plant roof located just above the letter S. The long building to the south must had been added at some later date.
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Livernoisyard
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Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 5:48 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Attn: Bob_cosgrove

Re: "Louis Kamper (1861-1953) married Emelie Kling (1871-1846)on July 20, 1890. He was then practicing as an architect having trained with the famed architectural partnership of McKim, Mead and White in New York City."

I guess Louis married right. His bride was 19 when they married, apparently got younger every year, and died at the age of -25!
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Mike
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Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 9:02 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

999
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Aiw
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Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 9:37 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

1000
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Itsjeff
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Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 9:42 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

A great milestone for the most interesting thread on the forum, ever.
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Sven1977
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Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 2:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

This is the location for the small Scripps plant on Holden.

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Sven1977
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Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 3:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Around 1915, the building above the Saxon factory (the long white-topped building in the Google pic) was the Sunnyline Appliance Co.

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Aiw
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Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 3:34 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

To answer MikeM's question above:

The federal factory:

01

Is the same one that Larry was asking about before...

Here it is in the 1924 Sandborn map...

fed
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Sven1977
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Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 5:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Lots of pictures of Federal Trucks if you go to the website below.
http://www.federalmotortrucks. com/images/federal/index_pics. htm
The truck company and screw workd must have been separate companies since the address I found listed Federal Truck being on Federal Street.
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Livernoisyard
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Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 7:01 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Sven:

Where's 108 Leavitt, Federal's first? location in 1910? The Ford Museum has a Federal truck on display from 1910.
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Sven1977
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Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 7:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Could Leavitt actually be Lovett? That would place the factory near Federal St.
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Livernoisyard
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Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 8:30 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Since I saw it in an ad as "Leavitt," I would doubt "Lovett." In addition, there would be no way for a 100 block unless the addresses were numbered differently back then. But as I recall, Ste. Hedwig had a "low" number around the turn of the Century on Junction (formerly Lover's Lane) before being renamed "(something) Junction" and being shortened to "Junction."

However, my street was erroneously spelled from its intended name eons ago and this is "Detroit!"

Check last graphic for "Leavitt"
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Livernoisyard
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Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 8:34 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

But again, I know Russian and German, but no French. Is there a "Leavitt" in Pontiac?
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Mikem
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Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 8:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Federal Screw and Federal Motor Truck are separate companies; I don't believe there is any relation. I always thought Federal Screw was a Chicago company, but maybe not. Federal Motors was squeezed between the tracks, east of Livernois, west of Junction:

FMT site

I don't know how much of the factory is left, if any. Two views from 1981 and 2003:

Federal Motor Truck 1981
Federal Motor Truck 2003

http://terraserver-usa.com/image.aspx?T=4&S=9&Z=17&X=3261&Y=46878&W=3

The few buildings on the east side of the site don't look significant enough for that sort of production, but I can't rule them out. The wider building in the aerial with the sawtooth roof is now the Mexicantown Flea Market. A visit to the site last year shows that I was at least a year or two too late. All that remains are the foundations, loading ramps, and a stack:

Standing on Federal Street looking north:

FMT01

looking northeast:



east:



northwest:



Next to the flea market is an alley which leads back to an older building. It's the narrow building in the aerial with the sawtooth roof:



The roof is now gone and workmen were back there either refurbishing or dismantling the building.
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Mikem
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Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 8:59 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I can't find Leavitt Street either, on any map I have going back to 1918. Possibly an earlier street name change?

I did find this Scripps Booth factory on Beaufait, south of Gratiot, on a 1918 map. Maybe I posted it before?

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Livernoisyard
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Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 9:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Some of the buildings north of Federal off Junction had collapsed roofs when I last checked them out six years ago.

My uncle's father-in-law worked at Federal Motor Truck and reused some of the wood in the shipping crates of Federal's when he (father-in-law) "remodeled" the basement in his home during the 1940s, where I now live. I tore out some of that and noticed the Federal name on some boards. Maybe I should have saved some of those boards.

It's a coincidence that my mother was born across the street from Federal - now a parking lot for the paint company that might still be there near the corner of Hammond and Federal.
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Hornwrecker
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Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 10:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Here's the corrected 1949 aerial of Scripps-Booth on Lincoln, and a closeup of the Beaufait and Gratior plant with different parts of that plant in different colors. My guess is that the green outline was the original Saxon plant.

Scripps-Booth factory Lincloln

Scripps-Booth factory Beaufait

The address that I have in the OCF db for Federal Truck is 5780 Federal.
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Livernoisyard
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Posted From: 69.242.223.42
Posted on Thursday, January 05, 2006 - 11:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I've had the Federal Street address before. My interest is in knowing Federal's Detroit roots. Apparently it started in or around 1910 in Pontiac, most likely under a different name. But just where was Leavitt located in 1910?

Two big troubles with Detroit addresses are name changes or streets being assimulated totally out of existence by industrial development. Another is where the logical continuations of one "street" having several small chunks, but having several different names.

For instance, take "Federal." The old Union Belt terminal railroad had some facilities (possibly an office, listing the location as "Federal & Michigan." Just where would that be around 1920? If one part of Federal were extended towards Michigan, it would be near the I-96 & I-75 interchange near Michigan. If the Junction part of Federal is extended (roughly a right angle with the other part) it would intersect Michigan near Lovett.

BTW, if "Lovett" were extended south of Michigan, it would be smack within the main part of Cadillac, by Clark. That part of Clark by Michigan was the original ROW for the Michigan Central (NYC) that Cadillac forced the RR to cede to GM after 1945 (or risk losing its future business). That's why Detroit has been plagued with the "10-mph curve," snaking around the old Cadillac plant. knorek's site
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Livernoisyard
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Username: Livernoisyard

Post Number: 55
Registered: 10-2004
Posted From: 69.242.223.42
Posted on Friday, January 06, 2006 - 1:42 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Don't know where it is (was) but know its origin:

(1) "Leavitt, named for land owner, A.E. Leavitt; 1873"



(2) "Lovett Ave, named for W.E. Lovett, formerly of Scotten & Lovett; 1875"

At least, I now know see why Lovett and Scotten are nearby parallel streets. Both attorneys, perhaps?

(3) "*Lovers' Lane; a favorite meeting-place, for old and young; 1857, later changed to Junction Ave, March 19, 1887"

(4) "Central Ave; named as it runs through the center of a land tract; 1873."

For Wade: (5) "Clippert Ave; named for Conrad Clippert; landowner; 1873"

Non-existent "Federal" (6) "*Federal; named for political party name; 1872, later changed to Leland, June 3, 1885"

(7) "Holden Ave; road leading to the Theodore G. Holden Farm; 1828"

(8) "McGraw Ave; named for land owner, Thomas McGraw; 1880"

(9) "Milwaukee Ave; road leads to Milwaukee Junction; 1882"

(10) "Piquette Ave; named for daughter of B. Campau, Angelique Piquette; 1876"

(11) "Scotten Ave, named for land owner, Daniel Scotten; 1867"

(12) "Shoemaker Road; named for land owner, W. Shemaker; 1850"

(13) "Utica Plank Road changed to Mt Elliott Ave March 19, 1887"

(14) "Vernor; named for prominent citizen, Benjamin Vernor; 1880"

(15) "West End Ave;(Springwells) from it location on the West end of Springwells; 1875"

(16) "Wabash; locted at the depot of the Wabash RailRoad; 1882"

(17) "John R; named for large land owner and prominent citizen, John R. Williams; 1835"
[mayor of Detroit for six different terms between 1824 and 1846]

Origin of Street Names - Detroit


Wayne County Townships/Communities that no Longer Exist - Look for this link: Return to Wayne County MALHN Main Page >> Extinct Townships, Villages, Settlements, ect...



(Message edited by LivernoisYard on January 06, 2006)
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Gmhistorian
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Username: Gmhistorian

Post Number: 1
Registered: 01-2006
Posted From: 86.132.146.189
Posted on Friday, January 06, 2006 - 4:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I was extremely pleased to find this site through my friend and colleague Scrippsbooth. I have been researching for many years it seesm now the history of GM's Canadian plants in Walkerville/Windsor. I have written a draft text that tales us from the formation of Fisher of Canada around 1915 through the Canadian Products Division plants in Walker Road, to the ex-Chalmers, and two Fisher Plants. These include the leasing off of one Plant to Chrysler which was then used for De Soto. The big problem we have had though is trying to establish exactly where the three Fisher Plants were in relation to each other from street directories and company records. Also for definitive proof as to whether Chevrolet & Pontiac cars were indeed ever assembled in Walker Road in 1930 Model Year as despite the allegations there appears to be no firm evidence although Chevrolet trucks were 1929-32, and GMC and Chevrolet Heavy Duty [foreunner of Maple Leaf] in a former Fisher building say 1930 to at least 1933. The story of the Regina, Saksatchewan Plant [1929-30; 1931; 1937-41] has also been written but that's not for this forum!

In addition I have with SB wriiten a draft text on the history of GM IN Canada, and GM's antecedents from 1900 to 1921 with the assistance of a Canadian lady who married into the Hyslop family of Toronto who were Olds, Cadillac, etc. importers. This includes Olds assembly by Packard of Canada, plus Buick pre-McLaughlin, McLaughlin, Durant-Dort Carriage, Dominion Carriage, Little, Cartercar, Oakland, Rapid and Reliance Truck, GMC, etc. and Chevrolet, Toronto and Oshawa. If anyone feels that they would be interested in the subject and can assist with more information please let me know. Eventually at least one of thes texts will become a book but the idea is to better CARS OF CANADA in the areas mentioned and also correct some misinformation.

May I also appeal for any help in identifying where Fisher Engineering's buildign was? There are photos in my possession of prototype cars on the roof of the Fisher building behind the GM building in Detroit but how many floors did they occupy say?


David in Southampton, England
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Kathleen
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Username: Kathleen

Post Number: 1082
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 140.244.107.151
Posted on Friday, January 06, 2006 - 4:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Welcome, gmhistorian, to the DetroitYes Forum, and to our Old Car Factories thread. I'm sure that some information will be flowing your way...and we look forward to information that you may be able to provide us.
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Sven1977
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Username: Sven1977

Post Number: 149
Registered: 04-2004
Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Friday, January 06, 2006 - 6:28 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Views from my recent The Henry Ford visit.










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Hornwrecker
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Username: Hornwrecker

Post Number: 676
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 66.2.149.118
Posted on Friday, January 06, 2006 - 11:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Welcome to the juggernaut GMhistorian, and hope that we can help you with your inquiries, as well as add new information, for this beast must be continually fed.

I posted a link to this thread over at the AACA forum, Antique Automobile Club of America, to let there members know about the OCF. Here's the link to what I posted, not sure if it was the correct place to post it, but it was the only one where I didn't need an account.

AACA forum to OCF announcement

Found this old Maxwell photo in WSU/VMC, and with some tweaking in PS, shows some detail. I really like the flooring, probably a carriage house. No clue as to the year, early is my guess.

Old Maxwell

...and a radiator badge from the Smithsonian.

Maxwell Badge

Have we covered Maxwell in depth yet? I can't recall reading Jjaba's Jack Benny stories yet.

(Message edited by Hornwrecker on January 06, 2006)
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Scrippsbooth
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Username: Scrippsbooth

Post Number: 3
Registered: 01-2006
Posted From: 4.232.219.133
Posted on Saturday, January 07, 2006 - 5:34 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

. Thanks everyone for the postings of the Beaufait Ave photos and maps. The 1915 Baist's map shows looking East with the Cycle Car Company [Scripps-Booth] plant in the square building located at the 1020-1030 street address. I figure the 981 street address used from 1916 to 1920 was on the westside of Beaufait Ave.

(Message edited by Scrippsbooth on January 07, 2006)
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Hornwrecker
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Username: Hornwrecker

Post Number: 678
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 66.2.149.71
Posted on Saturday, January 07, 2006 - 2:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I've found that it is best not to place too much importance on the addresses from these early automakers, aside from using to narrow down the location so Sven can find it on a Sanborn map. :-)
Other times the address is for some roving business office, moving from lease to lease.

Besides the makers moving around a lot to escape creditors or expanding, mailing addresses seem haphazard. I remember one instance of about six different numbers being used for the same building on advertisements, not including the numbering standardization that took place in the 1920s.

Gmhistorian, another place to look is the archives at Wayne State U of the old Edison Electric aerial surveys that start in 1949. Looking at some of these, it appears that the coverage goes in at least a mile from the Detroit River of Windsor/Walkerville area.

http://www.culma.wayne.edu/aer ial_photos/index.htm
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Livernoisyard
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Username: Livernoisyard

Post Number: 59
Registered: 10-2004
Posted From: 69.242.223.42
Posted on Saturday, January 07, 2006 - 5:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

True, addresses may be deceptive. Take Federal Screw. Their main office was in the Buhl Building downtown on Griswold. Doubtful if there ever were any screws or heat treatment done there. Another thing about Federal Screw was its importing from the Pacific Rim as of late.

Still, I still would like knowing where today's non-existent streets or intersections once were, such as Leavitt Street or Federal Street & Michigan Avenue.
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Hornwrecker
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Username: Hornwrecker

Post Number: 680
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 66.2.148.168
Posted on Sunday, January 08, 2006 - 12:57 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

A couple of truck finds on ebay: first is an ad for the Signal Truck Co, the only info in the db is that existed in 1915-??, no address known yet.

Signal Truck ad

The next ad is for a new discovery, the Hall Truck made by the Lewis-Hall Ironworks located at Ferry & GTRR. Eastside Ferry? It appears to be WWI vintage.

Hall Trucks ad


"Put the Hall in you haulage."
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Mikem
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Username: Mikem

Post Number: 2266
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Sunday, January 08, 2006 - 1:16 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Nothing on Signal, but I have:

Lewis-Hall Iron Works
Harry S Hall, Pres and Genl Mgr
Structural Steel, Cast, Ornamental and Wrought Iron Work
Trusses, Girders, Columns, Beams, Channels and Angles
Sheet and Plate Iron Work, Smokestacks, Tanks, Etc
Office and Factory, Ferry Ave E and Grand Trunk Railroad
Phone Melrose 5440
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Hornwrecker
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Username: Hornwrecker

Post Number: 682
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 66.2.148.168
Posted on Sunday, January 08, 2006 - 1:24 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Cool Mikem, we'se gots us atother one. If I hadn't have seen the ad, I would never have guessed them for a truck maker.

I feel we've only scratched the surface on the truck makers, as it seems anybody back then could make a truck. If it worked, you didn't need any styling or marketing ability, you were in the truck business,... and I don't even want to start thinking about parts suppliers.
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Mikem
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Username: Mikem

Post Number: 2268
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Sunday, January 08, 2006 - 2:03 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

In my 1925 directory under the general category of Truck or Motor Truck Manufacturers are these companies:

Acason Corp, 3938 Chene
Commercial Vehicle Equpment Co, 3979 Grand River Ave
Detroit Industrial Vehicle Corp, 1809 Washington Blvd Bldg
Detroit Scoop Truck Co, 993-1003 Osborn Pl
Dodge Bros, 7900 Joseph Campau Ave
Elwell-Parker Electric Co, 5860 Cass
Federal Motor Truck, 5780 Federal
Ford Motor Co, 14310 Woodward Ave, HP
Gotfredson Truck Corp, 3601 Gratiot
Graham Bros Truck, 1102 Kresge Bldg
Newman-Allen Co, 1754 Blaine Ave
Stuebing Truck Co, 116-20 David Whitney Bldg
The Six Wheel Co, 12262 Kercheval Ave
Weber & Pitcher, Fullerton Ave & Penna RR

We've covered to some extent DIVCO, Dodge, Federal, Ford, Gotfredson, Graham, and possibly Acason. For the remainder, there is no more information other than the address, except for these four:

Commercial Vehicle Equpment Co, Distributor United Motor Trucks, Motor Truck Bodies and Cabs

Detroit Scoop Truck Co, Mfrs of Scoops for Coal, Grain, etc

The Six Wheel Company - Manufacturer of Motor Busses, Motor Coaches, and Motor Trucks

and the Stuebing address was for an agent of the company.
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Mikem
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Username: Mikem

Post Number: 2273
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Sunday, January 08, 2006 - 7:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Just a few notes regarding the Saxon & Scripps factory on Beaufait -

The long building on Beaufait south of Gratiot highlighted in the aerial picture above and labeled with an address of 981 Beaufait (which is a pre-1921 address), is curently owned/leased by Hamilton Steel and has a lot of activity, with trucks constantly delivering steel coils for processing. The northern end of the building is much older than the south end, and the faded paint sign on it reads "Production Steel Products". My '46 Yellow Pages lists Production Steel Products at 4000 Beaufait (this building) and in the 1961 phone book, Production Steel Products had moved to 20001 Sherwood, placing it at the northwest corner of Sherwood and E Outer Drive, with a warehouse at 4000 Beaufait. If you drive by today, it looks as though an older brick building on the end closest to Gratiot has been demolished...probably the ScrippsBooth portion.

A 1925 directory lists Scripps Motor Co at 5817 Lincoln, but lists them only as marine motor manufacturers.

I've checked the '25 directory for the McGraw Avenue plant but find nothing listed for Scripps, Saxon, GM or any of its divisions including La Salle.

By coincidence, I found an address for Buick Motor Co, Plant 75, Michigan & Western Aves? The only plant I can visualize near there is a Coca-Cola bottling plant.
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Mikem
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Username: Mikem

Post Number: 2274
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Sunday, January 08, 2006 - 7:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Oh, and I found a listing for the Sunny Line Appliances Inc, washing machines, 4058 Beaufait, as shown in Sven's Sanborn map. Here is the north end of 4000 Beaufait I was referring to, showing the shadow of smaller building now gone. Either this building or the demolished one was Scripps and/or Sunny Line.

4000 Beaufait
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Livernoisyard
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Username: Livernoisyard

Post Number: 65
Registered: 10-2004
Posted From: 69.242.223.42
Posted on Sunday, January 08, 2006 - 7:43 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Michigan & Western is where SER Metro is now. But that's fairly new. There's plenty of room between Western & Stecker for an older plant to have been once located. That would have been north and west of Rickenbacker on Cabot.
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Mikem
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Username: Mikem

Post Number: 2275
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Sunday, January 08, 2006 - 8:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Going back to this map, I see Eaton Spring was located just west of City Airport. Their address was 9771 French Road which puts them at the NW corner of French and Grinnell (a short street lined with interesting looking factories I'd like to know more about). Looks like it is gone now, and the Dept of Public Lighting has a warehouse/shop farther down the street and I think they use this land for storage. They even have a little telephone pole farm set up for linemen to train on.

1939


1981
Eaton Spring 1981

2003
Eaton Spring site

http://terraserver-usa.com/image.aspx?T=4&S=9&Z=17&X=3351&Y=46963&W=3

I think I've seen the word Eaton on the building across the street on the east side of French Rd, but this is the only picture of it I have:

 Eaton Spring?

I don't want to go too far down the road on parts manufacturers unless they had a significant presence in the city, a unique building, or made a high volume basic part, i.e., Kelsey-Hayes, Federal-Mogul, Briggs, Holley, etc.
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Mikem
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Username: Mikem

Post Number: 2276
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Sunday, January 08, 2006 - 10:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Chrysler addresses from 1961:

1
2
3
4
5

Of note:

Clairepoint Plant on Freud
Detroit Universal Division on Kingsly?
Eight Mile Plant
Imperial Assembly Plant on W Warren (Graham-Paige)
Internal Operations Group on Wyoming (same as McGraw Glass but different address)
Marysville MoPar (Willis-St Claire)
Stamping Plants on E Outer Drive (Briggs), two on Vernor (Briggs), Mack (Motor Products)
Winfield Plant (Foundry - gone)
Wyoming Plant, same as Internal Operations address.
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Lkingsr
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Username: Lkingsr

Post Number: 1
Registered: 12-2005
Posted From: 4.155.249.34
Posted on Sunday, January 08, 2006 - 10:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I would like to learn more of the King Motor Car Company and its founder Charles Brady King. I have an address of 110-112 St. Antoine for Charles B. King's first company in Lauer's Shop, and and address of 1300-1334 Jefferson Avenue and 1559 West Jefferson Avenue.
thanks,
ltk
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Mikem
Member
Username: Mikem

Post Number: 2277
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Sunday, January 08, 2006 - 11:00 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Fisher Body addresses from 1961:

General Offices 30001 Van Dyke, Warren
Divisions & Plants:
Die & Machine 601 Piquette
Fleetwood W Fort & West End
Livonia Plant 28400 Plymouth, Livonia
Parts 6051 Hastings
Plant 21 6051 Hastings
Palnt 37 950 E Milwaukee
Plant 40 Plastics 1500 E Ferry
Willow Run Plant Willow Run, Ypsilanti


Cadillac addresses:

Factory & General Office 2860 Clark
Part Dept 5140 Riopelle
Sheet Metal Plant 10865 Devine


Miscellaneous GM addresses:

Buick Service Parts Warehouse 4635 Lawton
Delco Radio Division 57 Harper
Parts Division 8211 Decatur


American Motors addresses:

all 14250 Plymouth except
Special Products Division 12155 E Vernor
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Dodgemain
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Username: Dodgemain

Post Number: 77
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 68.41.191.58
Posted on Sunday, January 08, 2006 - 11:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Lkingsr, Welcome to the Motor City's biggest history class. Judging from the number of first posters lately, It looks like this thread is getting good publicity.
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Hornwrecker
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Username: Hornwrecker

Post Number: 687
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 66.2.148.43
Posted on Sunday, January 08, 2006 - 11:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Welcome to the OCF thread Lkingsr. If you look at page 13 of the OCF archives linked at the top of this page, you will find what information that we have, so far, on the King Motor Car Co, and Charles, B. King. I'm hoping that you probably have more info to add. Bob_C might have some, but he's probably busy with his new job.

This is the perfect time for me to post this photo of a King radiator badge from the Smithsonian collection.

King radiator badge

Mikem, I added the truck info to the db, and now you post all this! Someday I'll get around to adding all of the Briggs plants with individual entries. The spreadsheet is approaching 350 entries.
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Mikem
Member
Username: Mikem

Post Number: 2278
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Sunday, January 08, 2006 - 11:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Could someone (AIW) rearrange Sven's pictures so that this page isn't so wide?

The Fisher Plastics Plant #40 at 1500 E Ferry puts it across the street from the incinerator. An older looking factory is still there.

Cadillac Parts at 5140 Riopelle is the building just north of E Warren in these photos from page 4 (also was Fisher plant #10):

http://atdetroit.net/forum/mes sages/5/40545.jpg
http://atdetroit.net/forum/mes sages/5/40546.jpg

The Cadillac Sheet Metal plant on Devine is the former Hudson plant on Conner, between harper and Gratiot, from page 5:

http://atdetroit.net/forum/mes sages/5/40927.jpg
http://atdetroit.net/forum/mes sages/5/40928.jpg

Buick Service Parts Warehouse is the location of the former Northway plant, from page 11:

http://atdetroit.net/forum/mes sages/5/57074.jpg

Delco Radio @ 57 Harper is essentially on Harper at Woodward. Can't picture what's there now.

8211 Decatur is far west side, north of Tireman. Looks like a warehouse.
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Hornwrecker
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Username: Hornwrecker

Post Number: 688
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 66.2.148.43
Posted on Sunday, January 08, 2006 - 11:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Here is a photo of a 1907 Thomas-Detoit Flyer from the Benson Historical Library at UofM. It is labeled "Our Thomas-Detroit in 1907."

1907 Thomas-Detroit Flyer

The sign at the upper left reads "Park Automobile Co" and the sign on the upper right reads "Entrance to Annex." This is most probably a dealership somewhere.
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Scrippsbooth
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Username: Scrippsbooth

Post Number: 7
Registered: 01-2006
Posted From: 209.178.129.183
Posted on Monday, January 09, 2006 - 2:20 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks Mikem for your research and post today – both Scripps-Booth and Saxon only made it till 1922 before stopping production. The Buick company then serviced spare parts for the S-B models into the 30’s.

sbplant

This is a section that shows 1020-1030 Beaufait Ave plant from the 1915 Baist’s map that I copied eithier at the the DPL or across at the Wayne State Library around 1989. Of course by 1915 the Scripps-Booth Cyclecar Co. was reorganized into building the regular Model C roadster [ dropping the Cyclecar from its name] as the Scripps-Booth Company.

Notice in the 1949 aereial photo posted on 10/12/05 the first S-B square building was still standing but in the current aerial photo posted on 11/10/05 it is mising. It was not there in 1989 when I first visited the site. Unfortunately I did not notice that the long white roof factory building that extends to the south to Syvester St. was once part of an auto plant. I was looking for a large plant on the west side of street for the odd numbers where the street number would of been at 981 Beaufait Ave. We now know this long building was once part of the Saxon factory plants at some time and most likely also part of the S-B Corp before they moved out to its new plant on the West side at McGraw. This would had been the same time that the Sunny Line washing machine company moved into the former S-B plant at 1020-1030.

Don Bent in his new book on the history of the Flint Buick Plants reports that Buick used the 2416 Ford Road address for its Detroit Body Plant No. 75. The address of Michigan Ave and Western seems like a stretch but appears to be about a block south of McGraw and Ford Road? This plant was 40 acres of property with the floor space being 360,000 sq ft.

The only address I can find so far for the plant when S-B was in it was it was being called the Springwells Ave. Plant. They were supposed to had moved in on January 1, 1920 but had to wait a few months while the government had moved it stuff out.

The Chevrolet plant at 1145 WGB was also a Scripps-Booth plant in 1916 to about 1919 since it was the result of the merger of the Sterling Motor Company and the Scripps-Booth Co. Actually Chevrolet shared this plant with Sterling from the fall of 1912 until Chevrolet was moved to Flint in August 1913 – then Sterling took over the whole plant to build the Little and Chevrolet six cylinder engines a and small 4 cyl engine for the general trade incuding S-B.
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Livernoisyard
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Username: Livernoisyard

Post Number: 66
Registered: 10-2004
Posted From: 69.242.223.42
Posted on Monday, January 09, 2006 - 5:17 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Buick moved around 1925 from Detroit. Where was 2416 Ford back then? Nearby Wyoming is about 10000 West today. A plant before 1925 w/o railroad access doesn't seem realistic.

If it were south of Michigan by Western, then Buick #75 could have been serviced by the spurs off the Michigan Line in Junction Yard by Rickenbacker or Ferrous. Springwells is about 8000 West, a couple blocks west of Central. Cannot place any RR near that street unless near the Detroit Line 1/2 mile south of Vernor or by the Exposition Spur through Delray. The Exposition Spur is the more likely because the Detroit Line is not at grade.
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Hornwrecker
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Username: Hornwrecker

Post Number: 691
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 66.2.148.82
Posted on Monday, January 09, 2006 - 1:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I think that the only info that we have that the McGraw plant was Saxon was from a map, and the street name Saxon. Perphaps the mapmaker mixed things up a bit.

Cross checking the db with S-B's info, I find that Saxon bought the old Apex factory in Ypsilanti in 1922 (no address yet known.) This was obviously the last gasp of Saxon as the plant was sold to the Commerce Truck Co in 1923. Apex was in existance from 1919-22.

Sterling Motor?... checks db... Arrgh, not another missing entry. Dates of existance?
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Scrippsbooth
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Username: Scrippsbooth

Post Number: 8
Registered: 01-2006
Posted From: 4.232.219.219
Posted on Monday, January 09, 2006 - 4:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Sterling Motor Company was organized by Durant in Flint in August of 1912. It purchased the ex Buick No. 2 engine plant on West Kearsley St. but never moved in with this plant being sold to the Mason Motor Co. Instead Sterling set up shop in the Chevrolet WGB plant under the management of Bill Little. Little traded Durant his Chevrolet stock to buy out and run Sterling as a some what independent opertation in October 1913 eventhought Durant and the Chevrolet company retained large stock holdings. Sterling built all the 1913-15 Chevrolet 6 cyl engines [about 1500] and the 1915-17 Scripps-Booth Model C engine, 1917-8 Monroe M3 engine, 1915 Cornelian and the 1915 Grant engine. The Sterling Motor Co was merged with the S-B Co. to form the S-B Corp. in July 1916 with Sterling then becoming a division of S-B Corp. It is likely the WGB property was sold by GM about 1919-20.
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Hornwrecker
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Username: Hornwrecker

Post Number: 692
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 66.19.20.123
Posted on Monday, January 09, 2006 - 11:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks for the Sterling info, and I think that I have the S-B, Saxon thing sorted out so it almost makes some sense.

Lkingsr brought up the King plant on Jefferson and Concord, former Hupp plant, with an address around 1300 (old system) which I guess is around 7000 (new system). Here is an aerial photo from 1949 of the area, but it doesn't help in deciding which of the two early Hupp factory photos I have is the correct one. I suspect it is the one with the large sign above, as the other has a rail spur nearby. I'll clean up the photo for later posting.

Jefferson and Bellevue aerial 1949

Jefferson and Concord aerial 1949

There was also some discussion of King on OCF page 14.
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Hornwrecker
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Username: Hornwrecker

Post Number: 693
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 66.19.22.71
Posted on Tuesday, January 10, 2006 - 2:48 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I received a request to ask for any information on the Beals & Selkirk Trunk Co. in Wyandotte and Flint. While a little outside of our area, they also made the original trunks which were carried on the rear of early autos, and not that far from Detroit.

Here's what I dug up on a lucky google search. PSed the photos to my liking.

Beals & Selkirk Trunk Co

Beals And Selkirk Trunk Factory, located at the railroad tracks on Sixth Street near Superior.

Beals & Selkirk Trunk Co interior

Beals and Selkirk Trunk Factory which was at Sixth and Superior on the Railroad tracks. This photo was found in a home at 603 Elm, formerly 181 Elm.This house was occupied for decades in the early part of the 20th century by Frderick Kruger who was a trunk maker at the factory

http://www.wyandotte.lib.mi.us/vewebsite/index.htm

Anybody know anything else about B&S? There are supposedly some old postcards of the factory out there, but nothing on ebay at this time.
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Livernoisyard
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Username: Livernoisyard

Post Number: 69
Registered: 10-2004
Posted From: 69.242.223.42
Posted on Tuesday, January 10, 2006 - 3:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Be advised that Wyandotte originally went by the name of Ford, in case it comes up.

John Baptiste Ford (1811-1903)
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Mikem
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Username: Mikem

Post Number: 2284
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Tuesday, January 10, 2006 - 3:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

1925 listings-

Wyandotte:
Beals & Selkirk Trunk Co
P E Davis Pres, W E Adams V Pres
James A Venable Sec, J I Forsyth Treas
trunk Manufacturers
Chesnut & MCRR

Detroit:
Joseph H Fee, mgr
25 Grand River E

nothing in Flint.
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Hornwrecker
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Username: Hornwrecker

Post Number: 694
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 66.19.19.55
Posted on Tuesday, January 10, 2006 - 5:33 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

...and from "The Book of Detroiters" 1908...

ANDERSON, William Kyle, capitalist; born near Owensboro, Ky., Mar. 24, 1847; son of James B. and Mary A. Anderson; educated in private schools at Owensboro; University of Michigan, A. B., 1868, A. M., 1871; post-graduate studies University of Berlin, 1868-69; married at Detroit, Jan. 26, 1870, Cornelia M. Cook. Began active career as cashier Owensboro Savings Bank, Owensboro, Ky., 1871, continuing until 1877; removed to Detroit and was manager Detroit Seed Co., 1877-78; treasurer and director Michigan Car Co., Detroit Car Wheel Co., Baugh Steam Forge Co., Detroit Iron Furnace Co., Detroit Railroad Elevator Co., Detroit Iron Mining Co., Detroit Transportation Co., Duluth and Atlantic Transportation Co., etc., all of them known as the Newberry & McMillan corporations, 1879-92; treasurer Michigan Peninsular Car Co., 1893-94; not in active business since 1894, except in management of his own private affairs. First vice president and director Detroit Home Savings, director Detroit Savings Bank, Security Trust Co., Detroit Railroad Elevator Co., Detroit Iron Furnace Co.,Beals & Selkirk Trunk Co., Manufacturers’ Commercial Co., New York, etc. Deputy collector internal revenue, 2nd district, Ky., 1871-74; United States consul at Hanover, Germany, 1897-99 (appointed by President McKinley). Clubs: Detroit, Old Club, Country, Detroit, Detroit Boat, and Automobile. Office: 902 Union Trust Bldg. Residence: 739 Jefferson Av.

OK, now this is getting scary: I get an email at 1147, by 1310 we have photos and contact info for a firm that has been out of business for who knows how long. This is setting too good of an example for research.
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Hornwrecker
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Username: Hornwrecker

Post Number: 696
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 66.19.19.30
Posted on Wednesday, January 11, 2006 - 12:36 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

While looking for the old King nee Hupp factory on Jefferson and Concord, I came upon a lot of photos of various Hupp factories around Detroit, and was finally able to determine which was which. No mean feat with unlabeled photos. Expect in the coming days a large amount of Hupp photos once I get them all PSed, and put into a logical order.

I remembered that I had a few King ads that I snagged from ebay for some future use, I guess the future is now. Some of these are of low quality, but they show the marque going up-market in their advertising.

1912 King ad
1912 King

1913 King ad
1913 King

916 King ad
1916 King

1918 King ad
1918 King
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Psip
Member
Username: Psip

Post Number: 825
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 69.246.13.131
Posted on Wednesday, January 11, 2006 - 4:53 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Here are some pix of Fisher 12. (I spent more time making sure they were not posted before then actually finding the photos :-) )
1961 E. Milwaukee was home to the J.Lee Hackett Machinery Company. It was torn down for the Poletown Plant in 1981
1A

1

2

3

4

What does the sign say about the stalls? a gentle reminder
4A

5

6
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Mikem
Member
Username: Mikem

Post Number: 2288
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Wednesday, January 11, 2006 - 9:20 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

When did Fisher pull out? My '25 directory lists a J. Lee Hackett, manufacturers agent, General Motors Building, but no business or factory address, and by 1946 his company has occupied the E Milwaukee Blvd shop.
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Psip
Member
Username: Psip

Post Number: 826
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 69.246.13.131
Posted on Wednesday, January 11, 2006 - 11:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I did a little fine tuneing with PS and highlighted the name on the buidling.
Plant 12
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