  East_detroit Member Username: East_detroit Post Number: 1107 Registered: 11-2003 |
If I notice that my house voltage drops to as low as 96 volts whenever the heat outside goes above 85 (more or less depending on humidity)... and I report it to DTE and they stall until the heat dissipates and then says its fixed... What recourse do I have against this monopoly? I believe they added the electric for new condos down the street just by hanging them off the lines on our block (I only see one transformer for the whole block) and that this has caused it. I've been reporting the low voltage for over a month and they just say "we're looking at it" and then "fix it" when the temp drops (and the voltage returns to 115). We can't use A/C or even the washer/dryer during the day without popping fuses because of this. The last guys out disconnected our house and then verified it was not our house causing it, but then said it was "fixed" with a "spanner replacement." It is not fixed. Anyone had success fighting "the man" in this type of situation? | ||
Bobj Member Username: Bobj Post Number: 2331 Registered: 11-2003 |
Try calling the Michigan Public Service Commission, they regulate DTE | ||
East_detroit Member Username: East_detroit Post Number: 1109 Registered: 11-2003 |
Excellent... thanks! | ||
Jimaz Member Username: Jimaz Post Number: 2565 Registered: 12-2005 |
I'd pick up a generator in the mean time. | ||
Yvette248 Member Username: Yvette248 Post Number: 713 Registered: 10-2006 |
Got a power outage from the storm this weekend. I cheered like a teenager when a truck roared down our street a couple hours later. DTE had us back up and running within 3 hours. | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1604 Registered: 02-2007 |
"Got a power outage from the storm this weekend." How did you get a power outage from a storm that hasn't even occurred yet?  | ||
Livernoisyard Member Username: Livernoisyard Post Number: 3363 Registered: 10-2004 |
Would you prefer being disconnected instead? Sheesh! The power grid cannot be compensated everywhere during brownout (heat wave) conditions! This Wiki paragraph explains the usual scenario: rolling brownout | ||
Mikem Member Username: Mikem Post Number: 3377 Registered: 10-2003 |
Sounds like you need a capacitor bank added to the neighborhood circuit. What are you using to determine the voltage? Is your air conditioning off while you have this low voltage? How did this condition reveal itself? Are you in Eastpointe or the east side of Detroit? | ||
Chitaku Member Username: Chitaku Post Number: 1465 Registered: 03-2006 |
Dte sucks | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1609 Registered: 02-2007 |
That's exactly what I was thinking when I saw the Thread LY. This happens everywhere, despite how many transformers there may be. Besides, a company doesn't have to be Corrupt just because they don't see your ONE complaint as an issue. DTE works at power issues according to the amount of complaints about them and how large and issue is, not by one person. If you want to talk about a Corrupt Monopoly, then let's speak AT&T or Comcast or Viacom. (Message edited by Urbanize on July 08, 2007) | ||
East_detroit Member Username: East_detroit Post Number: 1110 Registered: 11-2003 |
As I stated above, I've been reporting this for a month... not just because it got hot this weekend. Hardly a "rolling brownout." They admitted there was a problem in the last note left on my door and then closed the ticket. They also said that they were working on it many times (and that it will be "fixed within an hour" or "fixed by 9:35" or whatever the standard comment was). So, they did see it as an issue.. and havent done anything about it. They even had me call the "Power Quality Department" last time (a week ago), where I left a message and never heard back. I didnt say they were "corrupt." I did say that they are a monopoly and therefore I implied and state explicitly now that their customer service is not motivated to keep a customer as a company that competes would be. Nevertheless, 96 volts for most of a month is not acceptable. I measured the voltage 2 ways (while everything was off except the refrigerator and UPS, including unplugging "warm" devices such as the TV). 1) my computer UPS reports it (and yes, I did turn off the computers) and 2) a multimeter in different circuits. When they came out, they disconnected the whole house and measured it, wrote a report that there is a problem and then closed the ticket. When I called back (800-477-4747), the representative acted like it was the first time I called (as all the others did) and suggested that I call the "Power Quality Department" in Mt Clemens on Monday. Deja vu. This is in SCS. | ||
East_detroit Member Username: East_detroit Post Number: 1111 Registered: 11-2003 |
Mike, to answer your other question... the condition revealed itself because a window a/c was laboring and blowing fuses. So, I left the fuse blown for a while, checked the UPS (on another circuit) and the multimeter (on multiple circuits) and got the readings. Right now, as the night cools (and probably people on the block are using less a/c) the voltage is up from 96 to 103. Can't run my a/c though. | ||
Livernoisyard Member Username: Livernoisyard Post Number: 3365 Registered: 10-2004 |
You're probably experiencing an actual brownout. Many houses in Detroit were fed with a 5KV phase, and a few houses today still have only 117 V, 60 A service (only two wires). The point is that those older neighborhoods just do not have the power capacity of newer neighborhoods that have higher-voltage transmission lines with standard 234 V, 200 A service drops. Because homes use a lot more energy during heat waves, your neighborhood probably cannot deliver more than the power capacity for which it was designed way back when. Air conditioners are really dehumidifiers, so when the relative humidity rises, your and your neighbors' AC units kick in and draw down your voltage. Back in 1970, I picked up my own pole pig power transformer from the Milwaukee electric utility for its $9.65 salvage value. I might use it to supply power (4000 V DC @ 1 A) for my low-powered ham rigs over the years. It has a conservative rating of 5200 V @ 5 KVA. (Message edited by Livernoisyard on July 09, 2007) | ||
Yvette248 Member Username: Yvette248 Post Number: 715 Registered: 10-2006 |
Shut up, Urbanize! LOL | ||
Lowell Board Administrator Username: Lowell Post Number: 3959 Registered: 10-2003 |
For your valuable electronics, it might be wise to consider investing in a UPS or uninterruptable power supply device. A lot of people think of their value as giving one several minutes of battery power, depending on their capacity, to save files etc. but their best value is in levelizing voltage when the utilities 'steal' it while protecting against massive surges. | ||
Livernoisyard Member Username: Livernoisyard Post Number: 3366 Registered: 10-2004 |
levelizing? Merriam-Webster: The word you've entered isn't in the dictionary. Click on a spelling suggestion below or try again using the search bar above. Suggestions for levelizing: 1. Levalloisian 2. leveraging 3. revalorizing 4. level crossing 5. leave-takings 6. lyophilizing 7. revictualling 8. lovelessness 9. lyophilising 10. revictualing I reckon we could eliminate #6 or #9 because they're primarily used with freeze-drying blood plasma... (Message edited by Livernoisyard on July 09, 2007) | ||
Mikem Member Username: Mikem Post Number: 3378 Registered: 10-2003 |
96 Volts is way out of wack for anything other than a momentary drop - I never see anything lower than 116 but I'm only a few blocks from my substation. I don't know where in SCS you are, but for several years DTE has had a portable remote-controlled generator in the south end of town to help support the voltage there. They have rebuilt a major substation in Eastpointe which was suppose to help with the problem, although maybe they haven't yet replaced the circuits to your area. Keep after them, but the solution may be in the works already. If it involves a major installation or reconfiguration of your local loop, it could be months before they get around to it. Have you checked your neighbor's voltage? | ||
East_detroit Member Username: East_detroit Post Number: 1114 Registered: 11-2003 |
We're in the 12 and Jefferson area, so, not the South end... If they would simply tell me the truth (instead of the runaround) then at least I could see the light at the end of the tunnel (pun intended)... assuming that they indeed had plans in place to fix the situation. Neighbors have the same problem, though they had just assumed the dim lights were something that happens in Summer... and nobody on the block has called this in except for me (according to DTE). My UPS protects the computers (boosting voltage when it needs to), so I probably wouldnt have noticed except for the blowing fuse. I am sure that its taking life off of my new fridge, etc. | ||
East_detroit Member Username: East_detroit Post Number: 1115 Registered: 11-2003 |
Today's customer service representative: "The Power Quality Department has had a report on this since June 23. I will escalate this to my supervisor by filling out the 'Escalation Callback Form'." | ||
Johnlodge Member Username: Johnlodge Post Number: 977 Registered: 10-2003 |
"Then I will place the 'Escalation Callback Form' into the "Callback Form Deposit Recepticle' AKA the garbage can. | ||
_sj_ Member Username: _sj_ Post Number: 1948 Registered: 12-2003 |
I do not have this service, but DTE has a service where they charge less money but cut back on the electricity to your home during extreme times. I would make sure you also not part of that electric plan. | ||
Jimaz Member Username: Jimaz Post Number: 2572 Registered: 12-2005 |
quote:That's interesting. I would expect with a plan like that, they'd temporarily cut off the power rather than reduce the voltage. How does that plan work? | ||
Livernoisyard Member Username: Livernoisyard Post Number: 3370 Registered: 10-2004 |
quote:That's a (rolling) brownout. | ||
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1 Post Number: 9521 Registered: 10-2003 |
quote: I would think as consumers people would expect DTE to upgrade the capacity to stay with the times. The idea that people should expect less or tolerate it because they live in an older area is crazy. Our dollars go to help build new infrastructure in new areas I would expect that some of those dollars could help upgrade the utilities in older neighborhoods. Seems to keep in line with the Michigan mentality. | ||
Livernoisyard Member Username: Livernoisyard Post Number: 3371 Registered: 10-2004 |
Depends... I'd hardly expect DTE to upgrade their prairie facilities anytime soon. But again, there aren't many AC units running there. | ||
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1 Post Number: 9523 Registered: 10-2003 |
It is a SCS location spoken about above. There are a lot of dense areas in the city and inner rings with outdated capacity and infrastructure. There is no excuse to have all taxpayers cover the costs of new infrastructure at 32 mile road but leave the older communities with poor infrastructure. | ||
Jimaz Member Username: Jimaz Post Number: 2573 Registered: 12-2005 |
Livernoisyard, thanks. I found this: brownouts. Just before moving here from Phoenix, I lost a lot of electrical equipment (mostly TVs and computers) to unexpected power fluctuations. I didn't mind then because I avoided moving all that junk. Still, that seems a terribly counterproductive way to economize. | ||
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1 Post Number: 9524 Registered: 10-2003 |
Taxpayers should say utility payers above. | ||
East_detroit Member Username: East_detroit Post Number: 1116 Registered: 11-2003 |
LY, don't you mean rolling blackout? Jt1, I agree with your comments... same goes for the roads and other infrastructure... like concrete falling off bridges while new roads are paved into the former wilderness and DEQ lands. Fact is, new condominiums were added in greenspace (a bunch of neighbors sold half their property) and they simply latched onto the same lines as us. Seems that they should have at least required the new construction to help with additional infrastructure. Anyway, "Miss C_____" the supervisor called me back and told me that the "Power Quality Department" will "get to it when they get to it" and I asked for clarification and she said at least 2 weeks. Then I noted that its been in their hands for over 2 weeks and she sighed and said they will call me. I then filled out an informal complaint with the MPSC online and got an immediate email stating they require a response from DTE within 10 days. If that response is not adequate then its time for a "formal complaint" which apparently starts including lawyers. Meanwhile, 99 volts currently, no A/C possible and Mother Nature will hopefully give us some relief soon. | ||
Steamaker Member Username: Steamaker Post Number: 20 Registered: 03-2007 |
"That's interesting. I would expect with a plan like that, they'd temporarily cut off the power rather than reduce the voltage. How does that plan work?" Jimaz, here in Nevada they used to have a plan where they would place a transmitter on your air conditioner. During peak times when not enough electricity was available, they would shut off your air for about 10 minutes per hour. They stopped this practice after more power plants were built. I don't know if they ever started it back up. | ||
East_detroit Member Username: East_detroit Post Number: 1118 Registered: 11-2003 |
DTE has that, also: Our Interruptible Air Conditioning Program could save you up to 20% off your basic service rate. To take advantage of this special rate, your central air conditioner or heat pump is wired to a separate meter and radio control unit. By allowing us to briefly cycle your service by remote control on very hot days or when there is a high demand for electricity, you save over the basic residential rate. The cycles are limited to 15 minutes maximum at a time followed by at least 15 minutes of operation and limited to no more than eight hours in a 24-hour period so they should not noticeably affect the temperature inside your home. | ||
Livernoisyard Member Username: Livernoisyard Post Number: 3372 Registered: 10-2004 |
A rolling blackout is essentially the same as a rolling brownout. Some equate a brownout as a rolling blackout. So, according to that, the rolling part is redundant. However, others differentiate between (a) a brownout due to loading down the line sufficiently so as to have the voltage being too low and (b) one that results from the utilities effecting it--their lowering the voltage a bit. So my adding the rolling part indicates that the brownout is the latter type, above. | ||
Digitaldom Member Username: Digitaldom Post Number: 643 Registered: 08-2004 |
The plan you speak of does NOT turn off you power.. It cycles you air-conditioning in high temp conditions.. or in emergencies.. in turn you get a discount on your power rate.. | ||
East_detroit Member Username: East_detroit Post Number: 1131 Registered: 11-2003 |
On Friday a DTE engineer called and left a message saying that he fixed it, giving me his phone number and asking me to verify its fixed with the next heatwave. So far we have gotten 117-120 volts, which is amazing because the most we've ever had was 115 and I thought that would be our target. I noticed something new on the line, but not sure if thats the fix. Can anyone identify this? Inline capacitor?  | ||
Wazootyman Member Username: Wazootyman Post Number: 232 Registered: 02-2006 |
Wiring that low on the pole is always low voltage - typically communications. I assume in that picture you're looking at a junction box for telephone wiring. Likely they replaced transformers. In my neighborhood, we lost an entire 120VAC leg on my block. DTE came in and replaced all of the 1950's vintage transformers with brand new units, and since then I have never seen my voltage dip low. I doubt the designers of the original systems back in the 50's or earlier had any idea we'd require the amount of power we do now. | ||
East_detroit Member Username: East_detroit Post Number: 1132 Registered: 11-2003 |
Interesting... I'll have to go look for new transformers. Funny thing is that we didnt lose electricity during the fix, but maybe they have a way of bridging equipment while they swap? | ||
Livernoisyard Member Username: Livernoisyard Post Number: 3453 Registered: 10-2004 |
The electrical service will be at the top of the power poles--not half or 2/3 the way up. Just trace your service drop back to the line and locate the pole pig. And kids: Don't hook these up to your telephone at home... (Message edited by Livernoisyard on July 16, 2007) | ||
Courtney Member Username: Courtney Post Number: 153 Registered: 06-2004 |
We believe that those larger black things on the telephone lines are related to the At&t Lightspeed project. (can't remember what they are marketing it as now) They started appearing in the last yearish here on the southern end of SCS. | ||
East_detroit Member Username: East_detroit Post Number: 1133 Registered: 11-2003 |
Will my DSL be faster now or is that totally different? | ||
Livernoisyard Member Username: Livernoisyard Post Number: 3454 Registered: 10-2004 |
What is fast for DSL today? The CNET speed check on my Comcast broadband is usually 4 to 6 Mbs, while some outliers are 13 or 15 Mbs. I don't know what to believe... I once did get a 65 MB download from Sun Microsystems in 8 seconds, according to the stats. Couldn't believe it. | ||
Mikem Member Username: Mikem Post Number: 3383 Registered: 10-2003 |
That is a telephone cable splice. | ||
Livernoisyard Member Username: Livernoisyard Post Number: 3455 Registered: 10-2004 |
I moved to SW Detroit ten years ago--still overhead phone lines, but all my previous (rural) phone lines were underground since the 1970s. The overhead cable splice next door keeps SBC/AT&T busy... No problems with Comcast and VoicePulse VoIP ($15/mo) here. | ||
East_detroit Member Username: East_detroit Post Number: 1140 Registered: 11-2003 |
Not sure what an array of capacitors might look like, but I did find some interesting pole pigs down at the end of the block. Mini-pig up on top?  This pig looks new...  This pair of pigs looks really new...  | ||
Mikem Member Username: Mikem Post Number: 3395 Registered: 10-2003 |
Bottom photo is a set of voltage regulators, the rest look like transformers. | ||
Livernoisyard Member Username: Livernoisyard Post Number: 3459 Registered: 10-2004 |
A typical pig might be 14.4 KV @ 15 KVA. [My obsolete (retired) pig is only 5200 V @ 5 KVA.] The larger ones were probably installed to account for the condos/apartments recently added. The older ones were either still used or kept there for reserve. Capacitors are used for power-factor correction of inductive loads (motors, etc.). They are typically used on the secondaries and usually near the loads. Also, the transmission lines act as long antennas. So, if one is observant, he would notice that the high-voltage lines are criss-crossed every few hundred feet or so in order to reduce some unwanted reactances. | ||
Terryh Member Username: Terryh Post Number: 390 Registered: 11-2006 |
I participate in the one time purchase fee direct stock purchase dividend reinvestment plan DTE offers. I WANT DTE to hold a monopoly.. |
