  Downtown_remix Member Username: Downtown_remix Post Number: 440 Registered: 03-2007 |
A friend of mine was told last month he has weeks to move out of his loft on Grand river and 1st due to demolition. Just behind it is the moose building, which he said is also coming down. These 2 building being demolished will get the haters all over the little ceasers giant. | ||
Emu_steve Member Username: Emu_steve Post Number: 422 Registered: 11-2006 |
? How is a building at Grand River and 1st related to a new arena? Seems to be completely outside the footprint. | ||
Danny Member Username: Danny Post Number: 6283 Registered: 02-2004 |
RUMOR VOLAT! Downtown_remix You're friend may have to move out from its loft, but Illitch haven't made any plans to build a new hockey area, yet. Therefore you're friend have to move out so that the building will be demolished for a gravel lot indicating for a "PREMIER DEVELOPMENT OPPORTUNITY." | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1706 Registered: 06-2006 |
"Seems to be completely outside the footprint." Not necessarily...the new arena is going to be put on existing parking... so not only will the area go from 2 pro sports arenas to 3, but it will be losing parking at the same time, which means additional parking will have to be built... it takes a lot more land than simply the size of the building...there are many other considerations... | ||
Downtown_remix Member Username: Downtown_remix Post Number: 441 Registered: 03-2007 |
Stood outside the building last night, the only lasting storefront building in the area. It's going rto be torn down(gasp) along with the Moose lodge(gasp again). I guess all the work inside the moose was prep work for demolition. | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 3384 Registered: 02-2005 |
Do you mean the building at Grand River and Elizabeth across from where 1st empties into GR? That would be sad. http://local.live.com/default. aspx?v=2&cp=r1p99782bv1n&style =o&lvl=1&tilt=-90&dir=0&alt=-1 000&scene=5649347&encType=1 Sad that a building that has tenants-- i.e. not abandoned-- will be removed. Overall, the direct impact of the arena in terms of lost buildings will be less than Comerica Park, but still sad. All parking better be vertical and not surface lots for this, but Ilitch has a track record of favoring surface lots (so stupid IMO)...look around the perimeter of Comerica Park. Ilitch invests a lot downtown, but in the end I think he has a vision of a modern, suburbanized downtown, not one that buildings on existing strengths. | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1897 Registered: 02-2007 |
I just hope that the Film Exchange building, benefits from the Hockey Arena and doesn't suffer. (I'd hate that building on Cass and Elizabeth to go as well along with the Engineering institure) It's nothing wrong with a Suburbanized Downtown in the long run. Look at Atlanta and Chicago? I still wouldn't mind a Wal-Mart or something nearby. It will surely bring people downtown daily. | ||
Johnlodge Member Username: Johnlodge Post Number: 1415 Registered: 10-2003 |
Could you have a Wal-Mart in an urban building? Like say the first two stories of an already existing Detroit building downtown? I guess the problem would be getting back to your car with all your purchases. | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 3386 Registered: 02-2005 |
Sorry, there are a lot of things wrong with that. Look at Boston, NYC, San Fran...they do just fine. Preservation, preservation, and infill is what Detroit needs. | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1898 Registered: 02-2007 |
"Could you have a Wal-Mart in an urban building? Like say the first two stories of an already existing Detroit building downtown? I guess the problem would be getting back to your car with all your purchases." What's wrong with building one in the desolated South End of Midtown? If not, they ould get one on Tiger Stadium if no plans fall in place as Mackinaw suggested. Mackinaw, the difference between Us and Boston, NYC and San Fran is that no one Abandoned their downtowns and let the Buildings rot. Most developers unlike when those buildings were built are the ones that prefer the Suburban style buildings. I would love to see many of the buildings downtown preserved, but there's not a huge demand to do so yet. (Message edited by Urbanize on July 28, 2007) | ||
Russix Member Username: Russix Post Number: 16 Registered: 11-2006 |
A terrible waste, if more buildings like this(3-6 Story Mixed Use) were filled in this neighborhood, this would easily become the most desireable neighborhood in Detroit. Its sphere of economic influence would spread north by northwest prompting growth along Grand River and Cass Corridor. When these priceless gravel quarries are developed into a new stadium, another 20 blocks around it will be demolished for more parking. Im sorry Detroit, you've run out of space, you can't build anything big downtown without leveling almost double the area you've just redeveloped(One step forward, Two steps back). Fix your transportation problems, eliminate the need for all this parking and then maybe consider development. It is also a crime that when these two stadiums were built, that a massive parking structure for them wasn't built, instead they unleashed a fury of destruction on the surrounding neighborhoods. Anyone care to post the list of buildings demoed(if its been leveled, and rebuilt into anything else then a parking structure, don't count it)? | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1899 Registered: 02-2007 |
In March 2006, Wal-Mart sought to attempt to appeal to a more affluent demographic, with the opening of a new supercenter in Plano, Texas, and is intended to compete against stores that some view as more upscale and appealing, such as Target.[16] The new store features wooden floors, wider aisles, a sushi bar, a coffee/sandwich shop (with free Wi-Fi Internet access), and higher-end items such as microbrew beer, expensive wines, and high-end electronics. The exterior sports the less-common hunter green background behind the Wal-Mart letters instead of the trademark blue. or Wal-Mart Neighborhood Market Main article: Wal-Mart Neighborhood Market Wal-Mart Neighborhood Markets are a chain of grocery stores that average about 42,000 square feet (3,900 m²).[17] They offer a variety of products (including a full-line of groceries, pharmaceuticals, health and beauty aids, photo developing services, and a limited selection of general merchandise). The first Neighborhood Market opened in 1998 in Bentonville, Arkansas. As of May 31, 2007, there were 118 Neighborhood Markets in the United States.[20] "Wal-Mart's strategy for the new format complements its existing food programs in supercenters and discount stores. Some customers may avoid the large supercenters when seeking a few grocery items, yet discount stores may not offer fresh produce and meat needed for an evening meal. The Neighborhood Market targets that middle ground between the two formats, and it could potentially serve as a vehicle to give Wal-Mart entry into metropolitan areas that lack sufficient real estate for a supercenter." ^^^Detroit need some of those desperately. (Message edited by Urbanize on July 28, 2007) | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 3387 Registered: 02-2005 |
Great point, Russix. I agree, parking has to be vertical not horizontal. You look at an aerial photo of downtown Detroit and it looks scarred, like there was a war. The riots didn't do it. Our cars did. It was voluntary. | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 4971 Registered: 08-2004 |
Getting back on the thread topic. The Moose Lodge was sold by Blair McGowan (a staunch preservationist) to Ilitch Holdings. Supposedly one of the stipulations in the sales agreement was that it was NOT to be torn down. If they do try to "shoehorn" the new arena over onto the smaller Grand River site, it may be because the Alibri family refuses to sell Ilitch the 3 parcels that they own at Columbia and Clifford, smack dab in the middle of a logical arena footprint between Cass and Park Ave's. | ||
Emu_steve Member Username: Emu_steve Post Number: 423 Registered: 11-2006 |
Thanks, Gistok. As I was trying to imply (above), our assumptions have always been (aside from an occasional poster who wants the arena in midtown)that it would be in the Park/Cass blocks and that those 3 parcels (Alibri owned), not the Moose Lodge, become the focal point of land acquisition (to complete the necessary footprint). Concatenting a few ideas, maybe Ilitch has the Alibri parcels and is acquiring auxiliary parcels which will sit adjacent to the arena???? If I were advising Ilitch, I'd say acquire the parcels for the footprint and try to acquire all of the parcels which RING the footprint. I just can't see the arena anywhere else... | ||
Emu_steve Member Username: Emu_steve Post Number: 424 Registered: 11-2006 |
quick follow on: I doubt Ilitch wants to build his arena and have someone else put up their parking garage next to it. Likewise, does Ilitch want someone else building a Hockeytown next to his new arena? Likewise, Ilitch might like to acquire underutilized land and hold it for 10+ years and flip it for a nice profit. By then the GAR and Moose Lodge might be restored. The value of all land in that area might become much more valuable. (Message edited by emu_steve on July 28, 2007) | ||
Rhymeswithrawk Member Username: Rhymeswithrawk Post Number: 821 Registered: 11-2005 |
Looking at that photo Mackinaw posted above, it helps fuel the gut feeling that the GAR Building won't be redeveloped by Ilitch after all. I mean, he owns all of those lots, the building across Cass from the GAR (well, technically his wife owns it), the Chin Tiki can be had for cheap, I'm betting. Wouldn't it look funny to have the GAR sitting out front of a new hockey arena? | ||
Downtown_remix Member Username: Downtown_remix Post Number: 442 Registered: 03-2007 |
the Gar building will be saved, its not in the way. Theres only one storefront on the section of grand river, a very attractive one at that. the 1st floor looks like it was being renovated. The friend of mine that lives above this space claims the building owner thinks he has 2 months to clear out, but they only have weeks. | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 4973 Registered: 08-2004 |
I agree EMU_steve and Downtown_remix. The GAR is NOT in any danger. And the arena should be built east of Cass, where there's more room, although the west of Cass triangular piece of land is big enough to hold a new arena. But that would likely mean the Moose would have to be moved... and I thought that one of the stipulations of Blair McGowan's sales agreement was NO demo and NO moving it. Although a move wouldn't be so bad (although that would mean that Chin-Tiki is history). | ||
Emu_steve Member Username: Emu_steve Post Number: 425 Registered: 11-2006 |
I hate to get on the case of someone whom is only a name to me, "Alibri family", but my guess is they are probably the only ones holding up or can stop an arena in its "natural location" ("east of Cass"). To me, it would be a monumental loss if the arena could not be placed in that "east of Cass" footprint. An arena is too big of a development to be placed in its '2nd choice' location. It needs to go where it naturally fits and would foster natural development of the adjacent areas. | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1707 Registered: 06-2006 |
"... and I thought that one of the stipulations of Blair McGowan's sales agreement was NO demo and NO moving it." what's your source on this? seems unlikely... | ||
Rjlj Member Username: Rjlj Post Number: 372 Registered: 11-2003 |
The Film Exchange building is garbage. It will never become anything. | ||
Deals21 Member Username: Deals21 Post Number: 1 Registered: 03-2007 |
Hello, I work at MCC. Rumor has it Ilitch bought the gas station and the area across the street from the casino to build the new Joe. It is said he will put in a skywalk to the casino. I would think this would have to pass gaming. He can't even shuttle to Wings or Tiger games. Only Lion games, per Mi Gaming law. | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 3392 Registered: 02-2005 |
Across Temple St. from a housing project? I'd be very surprised. I don't mind that location...it could do great things for the depressed area between Cass and the Lodge, but I'd be annoyed to have the parking lot moonscape behind the Fox stay with us. | ||
Andylinn Member Username: Andylinn Post Number: 462 Registered: 04-2006 |
what would be SWEET but would never happen, would be to build it over the goddamn freeway... that would be very interesting... like either over 375 or over the lodge... (next to cass?) if there was infinite money to throw at this project, that would be ideal... COVER THE FREEWAYS! | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1905 Registered: 02-2007 |
"The Film Exchange building is garbage. It will never become anything." Oh right, keep the Worthless, low density/low rise buildings. | ||
E_hemingway Member Username: E_hemingway Post Number: 1281 Registered: 11-2004 |
It probably will not go across the street from the casino and there definitely will not be a sky bridge connecting the new Joe to any casino because of two words: Tim Donaghy. That gambling scandal, which is just getting started, will force all major sports franchises to back away from any sort of gambling. No way the NHL, which is the only scandal free major sport right now, will allow any of its franchises to get any closer to the gambling world. It won't make a fuss about Marion Ilitch owning the MCC because that is already established and the Ilitch family is held in high regard in hockey. But any MCC new Joe combo plans are DOA in light of the Donaghy scandal. | ||
Scs100 Member Username: Scs100 Post Number: 1278 Registered: 12-2006 |
^Brilliant. | ||
Kslice Member Username: Kslice Post Number: 118 Registered: 04-2007 |
SOOOOOO many parking spots/empty lots in that picture and I count 15 cars in the whole picture. Sad... | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1912 Registered: 02-2007 |
^^^May of them are fenced off as well and the rates are outrageous, even for Downtown. Well don't they have to worry TOO much about parking. They could convert a couple of those abandoned (standing) buildings into Garages. The one on Clifford will be beyond big enough if it's fixed up. |
