Discuss Detroit » Archives - July 2007 » New Route Changes for SMART bus system. « Previous Next »
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Danny
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Username: Danny

Post Number: 6347
Registered: 02-2004
Posted on Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 11:04 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Here's the source:

110 West Jefferson-Biddle

Service discontinued. Alternate service available on Route 125 in River Rouge, on NEW Route 135 in Wyandotte, and on Route 830 in Trenton. Pick up a new Fort Street schedule for details.



125 Fort Street-Eureka Road

All trips now operate via West End, Jefferson and Outer Drive; direct commuter service from Lincoln Park and Wyandotte is available on NEW Route 135. Pick up a new Fort Street schedule for details.



135 Southshore Express

NEW route providing Weekday peak-hour service from Wyandotte and Lincoln Park to Downtown Detroit. Operates via Biddle, Goddard, Fort Street and I-75. Pick up a new Fort Street schedule for details.



140 Southshore

NEW route connecting Wyandotte, Ecorse, Lincoln Park, Allen Park and Dearborn. Weekday and Saturday service provided along Biddle, Southfield Rd, Allen Rd, Outer Dr, Fairlane Dr and Oakwood Blvd. Sunday service provided between Fairlane and Fairlane Green via Oakwood Blvd. Pick up a new Downriver Community schedule for details.



145 Carlysle

NEW route traveling along Monroe, Carlysle, Outer Dr, Fairlane Dr and Oakwood. Provides continued service to neighborhoods in Dearborn, expanded service to Fairlane Green and new service to Melvindale. Service available on Weekdays and Saturdays. Pick up a new Downriver Community schedule for details.



150 Allen-Wick

Route and schedule modified. All trips now start/end at Beech Daly & Goddard in Taylor; three Weekday, peak-hour trips are available in each direction. Route 275 now provides all-day service on Pardee and Goddard; NEW Route 190 provides peak-hour service on Ecorse Rd. Pick up new Downriver Community, Airport and Telegraph schedules for details.



160 Downriver

Saturday service now offered between Wyandotte and Trenton. Weekday trips also changed, with southbound service ending about an hour earlier and other minor adjustments. Pick up a new Downriver Community schedule for details.



185 Wayne Crosstown

Service discontinued. NEW Route 140, NEW Route 145 and NEW Route 245 provide service in most areas formerly served by Route 185. Pick up new Downriver Community and Western Wayne schedules for details.



190 Taylor Flyer

NEW route providing quick connections from Allen Park and Taylor to Metro Airport and Fairlane. Route travels via I-94, Ecorse Rd, Roosevelt and Southfield Fwy. Service in both directions provided during Weekday peak hours. Pick up a new Airport schedule for details.



200 Michigan Avenue

First Weekday Inbound trip shortened to start at Michigan & Middlebelt at 4:15am. Pick up a new Michigan Avenue schedule for details.



201 Wayne Rd Shuttle

Service discontinued. Route 200 and NEW Route 202 provide alternate service in most areas. Pick up new Michigan Avenue and Airport schedules for details.



202 Romulus

NEW route linking Wayne and Metro Airport via Romulus neighborhoods. Service available Weekday peak hours. Pick up a new Airport schedule for details.



245 Cherry Hill

NEW route traveling along Cherry Hill, Wayne Rd and Michigan Avenue. Service available Weekdays and Saturdays. Pick up a new Western Wayne schedule for details.



250 Ford Rd

Route modified. Service to Fairlane Green now provided by NEW Route 140 and NEW Route 145. Service on Ford Rd between Southfield and Evergreen eliminated. New service to Henry Ford Community College via Evergreen Rd. Trip adjustments on all days. Pick up a new Western Wayne schedule for details.



255 Ford Rd Express

Minor trip adjustments, including slightly reduced afternoon service. Pick up a new Western Wayne schedule for details.



265 Warren

Route modified to serve retail destinations near Mercury Drive. Service on Warren east of Southfield, along Greenfield and through Fairlane Meadows discontinued. Trip adjustments to accommodate new routing. Pick up a new Western Wayne schedule for details.




275 Telegraph

Most trips now travel via Goddard Rd and Pardee Rd in Taylor. Several Weekday peak-hour trips continue to serve Telegraph between Goddard and Eureka. Trip adjustments throughout the day. Pick up a new Telegraph schedule for details.



280 Middlebelt South

On Weekdays, last trip Northbound and last trip Southbound discontinued due to low ridership. Other minor adjustments on all days. Pick up a new Airport schedule for details.



305 Grand River

Weekday afternoon trip inbound to Detroit discontinued. Morning trips are unchanged. Pick up a new Farmington schedule for details.



400 Southfield-Orchard Ridge

Route and schedule modified. Southbound routing returns to 11 Mile Rd. Two morning trips discontinued due to low ridership; other minor trip adjustments. Pick up a new Northland-Northwest schedule for details.



405 Northwestern Highway

Route returns to Northwestern/M-10 between Northland and 10 Mile & Evergreen. Trips adjusted, including improved mid-day and Saturday service. Pick up a new Northland-Northwest schedule for details.



430 Main Street-Big Beaver Road

Mid-day, early morning and evening service discontinued. Weekday peak-hour service improved to every 30-40 minutes. Pick up a new Woodward schedule for details.



450 Woodward-Pontiac

Night service via North Oakland Medical Center discontinued. Pick up a new Woodward schedule for details.



445-475 Woodward Limited

Routes now serve a revised set of limited stops south of 8 Mile Rd. Customers may board or deboard at any limited stop at any time. Pick up a new Oakland Limited schedule for details.



465 Auburn Hills Limited

Stops and schedule modified. Route now serves a revised set of limited stops south of 8 Mile Rd. Customers may board or deboard at any limited stop at any time. Weekday Outbound trip departing Woodward & Larned at 4:40 a.m. discontinued due to low ridership. Pick up a new Oakland Limited schedule for details.



494 Dequindre

Southbound routing returns to 8 Mile and Woodward. Weekday early evening service includes some minor adjustments. Pick up a new Dequindre/John R schedule for details.



510 Van Dyke

Trip adjustments on all days, including more frequent service on Weekday afternoons. Pick up a new Van Dyke schedule for details.



515 Van Dyke Limited

NEW route providing fast, limited-stop service along Van Dyke. All Route 515 trips travel between Wal-Mart (23 Mile & M-53) and VA Hospital via Downtown Detroit. On Weekdays, two inbound trips in the morning and two outbound trips in the afternoon. Pick up a new Van Dyke schedule for details.



525 Groesbeck Shuttle

The Weekday trip departing 8 Mile & Van Dyke at 6:20am is extended to Macomb Mall. Pick up a new Van Dyke schedule for details.



530 Schoenherr

Mid-day service discontinued. Weekday peak-hour service to/from Detroit unchanged. Pick up a new Lakeside schedule for details.



580 Harper

Route modified. All trips now start/end at Metro Parkway & Harper in Clinton Township. Minor trip adjustments to accommodate new routing. Pick up a new Eastside schedule for details.



610-612 Kercheval-Harper-Jefferson

Route and schedule modified. Service to Eastland Center discontinued on both routes. Route 610 circles in front of Eastland on Vernier Rd and Kelly Rd on Sundays only; at other times, use Route 730. Inbound trips enter Downtown Detroit via St Antoine rather than I-375 Service Drive. Weekday service to Midtown Detroit travels via Woodward; service on Cass, Mack, John R and Canfield discontinued. Buses make limited stops between Downtown and Midtown. First and last bus stop at Wayne State is moved to State Hall, at Cass & Putnam. Trips completely revised on all days. Pick up a new Eastside schedule for details.



620 Charlevoix

Inbound trips enter Downtown Detroit via St Antoine rather than I-375 Service Drive. Pick up a new Eastside schedule for details.



635 Jefferson Express

One Weekday Inbound trip discontinued; other trips adjusted slightly. Inbound trips enter Downtown Detroit via St Antoine rather than I-375 Service Drive. Pick up a new Eastside schedule for details.



752 North Hill Farms

Weekday service after 9:00pm discontinued. Other minor trip adjustments on Weekdays, Saturdays and Sundays. Pick up a new Pontiac schedule for details.



753 Baldwin

Minor trip adjustments on Weekdays, Saturdays and Sundays. Pick up a new Pontiac schedule for details.



756 Perry-Opdyke

Weekday service after 7:00pm discontinued. Other minor trip adjustments on Weekdays and Saturdays. Pick up a new Pontiac schedule for details.



830 Downriver Park and Ride

Route modified to serve West Rd and Downtown Trenton. All trips start/end at West & Grange, travel via West Rd, Jefferson, King Rd, then pick up the current routing at Fort & King. Service on Fort Street south of King Rd discontinued. Minor trip adjustments to accommodate new routing. Pick up a new Fort Street schedule for details.



851 West Bloomfield-Farmington Hills Park and Ride

Route and schedule return to pre-construction levels. Pick up a new Westside Park & Ride schedule for details.



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What about bringing SMART buses back to Nazi-Livonia, Trainman? Not going to happen on these new schedules.
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Bob
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Username: Bob

Post Number: 1529
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 11:35 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Seems like SMART is trying to do the best it can with its meager resources and piecemeal of communities that are a part of the system. Wish we could fund transit better so we could actually has a system that runs with frequency to make it more viable but SMART works the best it can with what it has.
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Dannaroo
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Username: Dannaroo

Post Number: 126
Registered: 05-2006
Posted on Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 11:47 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Trainman in 3, 2, 1...
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Professorscott
Member
Username: Professorscott

Post Number: 628
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 1:17 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Note that "610-612" is a mistake (made by SMART, not Danny). It should read 610-615; there has never been a SMART route 612.

I always wondered about the 610 bus stopping at Eastland; in all the times I've been on that bus I've never seen anyone get on or off there, and it was a 15 minute detour off the line because Eastland makes the buses take the most circuitous route possible.

SMART's essential problem is it needs about three times as much money as it gets. I agree with Bob, I think they do the best they can with what they have.
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Scs100
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Username: Scs100

Post Number: 1390
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 1:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Goddammit, someone tell SMART to send the 610/615 downtown on Sundays! I might get around to that eventually...
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Professorscott
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Username: Professorscott

Post Number: 630
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 1:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The 615 doesn't run on Sunday at all. The 610 ends at Maryland in GPP and the idea is you can walk a block and transfer to the DDOT Jefferson bus, which runs every 25 minutes on Sunday.
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Scs100
Member
Username: Scs100

Post Number: 1391
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 1:46 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I've thought of that on several occasions, except the person I'm with at that point doesn't want to take DDOT from Wayburn.
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Danindc
Member
Username: Danindc

Post Number: 3006
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 1:56 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Can someone explain why SMART uses three-digit route numbering? I thought they only had 45-or-so routes. This just seems ridiculous, unless, of course, there is actually a method to the madness.
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Chris_rohn
Member
Username: Chris_rohn

Post Number: 324
Registered: 04-2005
Posted on Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 2:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

DDOT holds rights to the two-digit route numbers.

You wouldn't want someone to think a SMART route was actually a DDOT route or vice-vrsa would you? The horror!
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Danindc
Member
Username: Danindc

Post Number: 3008
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 2:17 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

^I understand that. But why can't SMART use 1-- or letters? It seems absurd (and confusing) that such a small system has routes numbered up to 8-- and 9--.
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Professorscott
Member
Username: Professorscott

Post Number: 631
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 2:30 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The first digit indicates the part of town:
1 = downriver
2 = Michigan Ave corridor
3 = Grand River corridor
4 = Woodward corridor
5 = Gratiot corridor
6 = East Side (Jeff/Harper area)
7 = north suburban crosstown
8 = Park and Ride
I'm not aware of any SMART route number starting with 9, not for many years.

The reason they use 3 digit numbers is exactly because they don't want customers to confuse SMART routes with DDOT routes, though it's probably overkill to say DDOT "holds rights" to the two-digit numbers. More accurate to say DDOT (well, DSR) was there first.

Also, though SMART doesn't operate very many routes at any one time, they change the routes in major ways every now and then (such as the reconfiguration of the downriver routes that started this thread), so by using 3 digit numbers they always have new numbers available.

DDOT uses route numbers in the 70s to indicate limited-stop buses; other than that their route numbering is more or less alphabetical. The Lahser bus weirdly had route number 99 assigned to it, but that bus doesn't run anymore anyhow.
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Danindc
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Username: Danindc

Post Number: 3014
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 2:37 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Cool. Thanks for clearing that up.
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Livernoisyard
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Username: Livernoisyard

Post Number: 3739
Registered: 10-2004
Posted on Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 3:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

A possible (albeit, unlikely) reason for bus line nomenclature:

Two digits => much easier for Detroiters. There are even a few single-digit routes. Unfortunately not enough of those are available without resorting to the alphabet.

Three digits => only a bit harder--suburbanites can generally cope, though.

Other alphanumeric combos => unknown, uncharted territory

(Message edited by Livernoisyard on August 14, 2007)
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Professorscott
Member
Username: Professorscott

Post Number: 632
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 3:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Weirdly, as Detroit eliminated bus routes from the 1980s to the most recent round in 2005 or 2006, the single-digit routes fared the worst. The two downtown loop buses, the Zoo Shuttle, the Broadstreet bus and the Buchanan bus all were single digit routes and all were eliminated.

Was there ever a bus route numbered "1"?
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Trainman
Member
Username: Trainman

Post Number: 500
Registered: 04-2006
Posted on Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 8:21 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The Middlebelt 285 SMART bus route had the highest rider-ship increase of any bus route from 2003 to 2006 based on data collected from the computers in the fare-boxes and the FTA database.

The citizens petition is to bring back SMART to connect the three counties together with qualified funds from many different revenue sources.
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Detroit_stylin
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Username: Detroit_stylin

Post Number: 4698
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Tuesday, August 14, 2007 - 9:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

quote:

A possible (albeit, unlikely) reason for bus line nomenclature:

Two digits => much easier for Detroiters. There are even a few single-digit routes. Unfortunately not enough of those are available without resorting to the alphabet.

Three digits => only a bit harder--suburbanites can generally cope, though.

Other alphanumeric combos => unknown, uncharted territory




This dude is an asshole for real...
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Professorscott
Member
Username: Professorscott

Post Number: 635
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 12:05 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Trainman, the three counties are well connected. I can get anywhere I need to go on DDOT and SMART, since I never have to go to Livonia or Rochester or Lathrup Village.

Petitions don't work, ever, period, unless it's an official petition to put something on a ballot.

If you want SMART service restored to Livonia, all you have to do is convince the citizens of Livonia to put it back in, or else convince Wayne County the next time they have a transit millage vote to make it county-wide like Macomb County did and not to allow opt-out.

Livonia opting out has very little effect on most of the rest of us.
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Russix
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Username: Russix

Post Number: 36
Registered: 11-2006
Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 1:11 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

If you live North, South, or East of Livonia its had an effect. The worst for me has been the complete loss of 305 route. Yes, you can take DDOT in the city to make up for it, but the 305 route covered large parts of Farmington/Livonia with limited stops in Detroit(also covered the longest route in Detroit). But here is the good news, its actually just as fast to bike down Grand River from 7 Mile to Warren than ride DDOT. I've done it the last two evenings and its been a pretty nice ride. The right most lane has been recently repaved and is void of parked cars in the evening. I've been getting off the 330 at 8:38 and getting home at WSU by 9:34.

Don't worry Livonia, as soon as that Wal-Mart opens, you will have bus service back. Its rather hard to find people who will work for minimum wage that drive cars.
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Professorscott
Member
Username: Professorscott

Post Number: 636
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 1:23 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I find it interesting that Michigan has more frequent SMART buses than DDOT, whereas Grand River has very frequent DDOT service but barely any SMART service. Woodward, Gratiot and Fort are pretty well covered by both.

I don't know what that means, if anything, but it seems curious to me.

Anyone have an idea why this would be so?
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Trainman
Member
Username: Trainman

Post Number: 501
Registered: 04-2006
Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 5:41 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

We need county, state and federal taxes and lots of fare-box money to optimize SMART bus service, in my opinion. Thanks for any comments because I did enjoy having SMART in Livonia and the bike racks. I don't need SMART because I must drive every day to qualify for my job but I want our area to have the best public transit as possible to attract more jobs, tourists and for quality of life. I think helping SMART get back to Livonia and into other communities should be for the benefit of everyone.
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Masterblaster
Member
Username: Masterblaster

Post Number: 74
Registered: 03-2005
Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 6:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mr. Professor
The opting out of Livonia eliminated some moderately used routes - 305, 810, 820, and 285.
The 810 and 820 were park-and-ride routes that were utilized pretty heavily by suburbanites living in Southfield, Livonia, Farmington, and such. (The 2 routes were combined into the 805)

I have 4 co-workers who live in western Wayne County, who used to take the 810. When it was eliminated, they just starting driving to work.

The 285 route, while not heavily utilized, directly linked the northwestern suburbs and western wayne county suburbs to the airport. The 305, while extremely LONG, was moderately used and was convenient for getting to/from downtown to the northwestern suburbs.

Just because you may live in Macomb County or the eastern Oakland County, you may not realize the effect Livonia opting out has had. (Although I think the elimination of 305 didn't have anything to do with Livonia.)
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Jb3
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Username: Jb3

Post Number: 233
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 6:45 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Screw Livonia! If Livonianites want bus service then get the hell out of that sprawling shithole!
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Jb3
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Username: Jb3

Post Number: 234
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 6:46 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks Danny!!
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Miketoronto
Member
Username: Miketoronto

Post Number: 619
Registered: 07-2004
Posted on Wednesday, August 15, 2007 - 10:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

A number of you have mentioned using the bus in this post and others.
How many of you are choice riders of the bus? Just wondering.

One thing SMART still must do is operate the spoke road buses together with DDOT. DDOT and SMART both need to share the routes on those roads. They could offer better service, while using less buses from each system, if they share.



(Message edited by miketoronto on August 15, 2007)
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Scs100
Member
Username: Scs100

Post Number: 1399
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Thursday, August 16, 2007 - 9:08 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

quote:

How many of you are choice riders of the bus? Just wondering.



I am.

(Message edited by SCS100 on August 16, 2007)
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Danny
Member
Username: Danny

Post Number: 6350
Registered: 02-2004
Posted on Thursday, August 16, 2007 - 10:58 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I like the the new Downriver SMART Bus routes. Providing new access to Trenton and Wyandotte area.
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Trainman
Member
Username: Trainman

Post Number: 503
Registered: 04-2006
Posted on Thursday, August 16, 2007 - 7:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The vast majority of the voters want SMART to come back. It was the lack of leadership in Lansing and DARTA that cost us our bus service. The two state leaders for Livonia (Mc$&*#@($$ and $*#@or) did nothing to protect any state money and both in fact openly supported more money to expand roads. They claim that it is for safety but expanding roads while not protecting and maintaining our existing mass transit is not SMART all all but is stupid. This is based on facts and is not my opinion.

A small one or two cent per gallion fuel tax increase can easily restore all bus service and get Livonia and many other communities to opt into transit authorities. Our fuel tax would still be low compared to other midwestern states.

I'm hoping to get our Livonia leaders and others just like them out of office and replaced with leaders who truly support the needs of everyone first by protecting mass transit's fair share of taxes from fuels.

At stake is about $300 Million dollars per year, so tell me DYer's. Is there is better way? How many of you DYer's believe that we can support bus service at the fare box? Do any of you support a county sales tax for SMART and DDOT? If so, would you want more state and federal funds from fuel taxes to be protected first?

Our leaders do indeed want to increase the state fuel tax. So, please DYer's if they do then please demand that the money go to help SMART. If any of you DYer's don't do this then you are not very smart.

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