  French777 Member Username: French777 Post Number: 201 Registered: 10-2006 |
Does anyone have good pic's of the Woodward and 8 mile bridge?!?!? | ||
Dan_the_man Member Username: Dan_the_man Post Number: 29 Registered: 07-2006 |
I don't have any pictures, but when I was driving by the other day, I found it really ironic that one of the pictures they put on the bridge was an old Detroit streetcar. | ||
Crew Member Username: Crew Post Number: 1346 Registered: 02-2004 |
One thing I find odd about the refurbished bridge is the street lights. The plan was to refurbish the bridge to it's 1950's/mid-century look which I personally can appreciate. They used bishop style lights from early 20th century which are very nice but I don't think complement the bridge very well. I know most of you don't appreciate mid-century architecture and may think the bridge should have been eliminated anyway but I think the lights just look out of place. | ||
Johnlodge Member Username: Johnlodge Post Number: 2051 Registered: 10-2003 |
So, this bridge is not anything special. It's a bridge, it has some lights on it, and a couple of black and white pictures stuck to the side of it. Whoop de doodle. You don't even see the pictures if you are going over the bridge, as they are on the ground level. | ||
Kpm Member Username: Kpm Post Number: 63 Registered: 08-2005 |
Article and photo here: http://www.candgnews.com/Homep age-Articles/2007/8-22-07/FF-8 MILEBRIDGE.asp | ||
Johnlodge Member Username: Johnlodge Post Number: 2052 Registered: 10-2003 |
What exactly about the bridge is "tri-level"? it seems it is a bridge with Woodward going over Eight Mile, like it was before. Did I miss something? | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 1444 Registered: 04-2006 |
There is a part that goes below ground level, the part that stays at ground level, and the part above ground level. | ||
Johnlodge Member Username: Johnlodge Post Number: 2053 Registered: 10-2003 |
So eight mile goes below ground level, but if you want to get onto woodward you ramp up and make the turn, but if you are through traffic on woodward, you just take the bridge over the whole ordeal? Alright, I guess I didn't notice. I went over the bridge on woodward and saw no pictures, so came back and stayed next to the bridge on ground level, but I was so busy looking at the bridge to figure out why it is interesting, I must have missed 8-mile beneath me. | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 1445 Registered: 04-2006 |
No, Woodward goes beneath 8 Mile. ETA: It would probably be better termed as a tri-level intersection... but I'm not a Civil Engineer, so I dunno. (Message edited by iheartthed on August 23, 2007) | ||
Professorscott Member Username: Professorscott Post Number: 683 Registered: 12-2006 |
No, Woodward goes over Eight Mile, Eight Mile goes underground, and the connecting ramps are more or less at grade. I drive on that frequently. Quite a few of us were hoping MDOT would replace the whole abomination with an at-grade intersection, but they didn't. | ||
Detroitnerd Member Username: Detroitnerd Post Number: 1296 Registered: 07-2004 |
No, Woodward goes beneath 696. Woodward leaps OVER 8 mile. | ||
Johnlodge Member Username: Johnlodge Post Number: 2054 Registered: 10-2003 |
Woodward goes over the bridge though. Now I'm confused. Screw it, I'll just go drive by it on my way home. I live like five minutes away. | ||
Detroitnerd Member Username: Detroitnerd Post Number: 1297 Registered: 07-2004 |
There is a citizens' group in the area that LOVES the bridge. I don't understand why, but whenever people started talking about replacing the bridge with an intersection at grade, this group would get very vocal, write letters, etc. (Message edited by detroitnerd on August 23, 2007) | ||
Johnlodge Member Username: Johnlodge Post Number: 2055 Registered: 10-2003 |
696 is a completely different intersection, thats at 10 mile. And Woodward goes both OVER and UNDER 696, depending on if you want to get on 696, or just stay on Woodward as through traffic. Woodward definitely goes over 8 mile., but perhaps some lanes go under it as well? | ||
Supergay Member Username: Supergay Post Number: 76 Registered: 05-2006 |
Five minutes away? I am pretty sure this wins the "lazy poster" award. (Message edited by supergay on August 23, 2007) | ||
Johnlodge Member Username: Johnlodge Post Number: 2056 Registered: 10-2003 |
Detroitnerd, I believe the name of that group is "Citizens interested in keeping Detroit pedestrians out of Ferndale by means of an inconvenient bridge that creates a bit of a psychological/physical barrier". or CIKDPOFMIBTCBP/PB for short. | ||
Johnlodge Member Username: Johnlodge Post Number: 2057 Registered: 10-2003 |
LOL Thanks SG. | ||
Motorcitydave Member Username: Motorcitydave Post Number: 82 Registered: 11-2004 |
Woodward goes over, 8 mile goes under, and both "service drives" stay in the middle! It definitely looks better than before... now if they would just re-do 8 Mile-75 bridge.  | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 1446 Registered: 04-2006 |
Okay, maybe I got it backwards. Anyway, there are three levels, I know that much. | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1920 Registered: 06-2006 |
JL: IHD doesn't even live in Michigan and has no idea what he's talking about... I used to live 1 mile from this intersection...8 mile goes underground, Woodward goes above ground, and there is like a service drive type deal that is at the ground level, which is how you get from one of the streets to the other... So it is a tri-level bridge...but it already was one before the renovation, which is why I'm astonished that it cost $17 million bucks just to clean it up a bit and add some pictures to the walls... (Message edited by thejesus on August 23, 2007) | ||
Detroitnerd Member Username: Detroitnerd Post Number: 1298 Registered: 07-2004 |
Wow! It has a streetcar on it? That's amazing ... Oh, it's a picture of a streetcar. Well, still, that's progress ... ;) | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 1449 Registered: 04-2006 |
Aww, TJ almost lived in Detroit once! I bet that was scary for you, wasn't it?! | ||
Detroitnerd Member Username: Detroitnerd Post Number: 1307 Registered: 07-2004 |
Haha. Oh, man. Here we go. | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1922 Registered: 06-2006 |
"Aww, TJ almost lived in Detroit once! I bet that was scary for you, wasn't it?!" I didn't think so...are you scared of black people or something? | ||
Burnsie Member Username: Burnsie Post Number: 1132 Registered: 11-2003 |
The super old-fashioned streetlights do look silly on that bridge, which never had them. Thejesus-- The $17 million is explainable if the deck was rebuilt, cracks on the piers and other parts patched, and that gray epoxy applied (which M-DOT has been applying to all concrete bridge surfaces). | ||
6nois Member Username: 6nois Post Number: 442 Registered: 11-2006 |
It cost $17 million because they didn't clean up the bridge they basically rebuilt it. I drove through the construction quite frequently and almost every piece was rebuilt. Its not like they took a bucket of soap to the bridge. | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 1450 Registered: 04-2006 |
I didn't think so...are you scared of black people or something? Oh, now Detroit = black people? Tell us how you really feel... | ||
Charlottepaul Member Username: Charlottepaul Post Number: 1497 Registered: 10-2006 |
"It cost $17 million because they didn't clean up the bridge they basically rebuilt it. I drove through the construction quite frequently and almost every piece was rebuilt. Its not like they took a bucket of soap to the bridge." Regardless, the bridge still has basically the exact same massing and look except for the new historic looking street lights and a coat of paint. | ||
56packman Member Username: 56packman Post Number: 1674 Registered: 12-2005 |
 Here's the 8 and Woodward we all remember so well................. | ||
Redvetred Member Username: Redvetred Post Number: 45 Registered: 04-2007 |
Wasn't the Last Chance also called Warner's? A neighbor worked as a bartender there for years. Looks like my father's car parked on the north side of the building. | ||
65memories Member Username: 65memories Post Number: 449 Registered: 10-2003 |
I don't know...maybe it's just me...but for 17 million dollars I thought the renovation would look better than it does. | ||
1953 Member Username: 1953 Post Number: 1449 Registered: 12-2004 |
I love how they make that bridge "historic." It's no more historic than horse poop. They just needed to justify keeping a divisive bridge. | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1924 Registered: 06-2006 |
"Oh, now Detroit = black people? Tell us how you really feel..." lol | ||
Defendbrooklyn Member Username: Defendbrooklyn Post Number: 461 Registered: 11-2005 |
THe bridge looks better then it did but is that what 17 million gets now a days? What else could they have done? | ||
Detroitnerd Member Username: Detroitnerd Post Number: 1310 Registered: 07-2004 |
Now they'll say we can't tear down this "historic" bridge. | ||
Professorscott Member Username: Professorscott Post Number: 686 Registered: 12-2006 |
The $17 million was to make major repairs. If you accept the bridge as necessary, then they had to spend the money. I would have much preferred to see it go away. The "historic" crap, the way it's painted and so on, that's a tiny bit of the total cost. MDOT justified keeping the bridge by saying it was necessary because of traffic; yet there's no bridge at Eight and Gratiot, no bridge at Eight and Mound, no bridge at Eight and Van Dyke, and somehow traffic moves through those intersections and gridlock is prevented. Does anybody know why MDOT was so hell-bent on keeping a bridge there, despite quite a bit of public opposition? | ||
Johnlodge Member Username: Johnlodge Post Number: 2071 Registered: 10-2003 |
Professor, that is really the million dollar question. Mayor Porter, despite his recent comments that are really just resignation to the fact that it's there now, was against it, and I believe the rest of the Ferndale council was as well. MDOT was on a crusade with this one. | ||
Johnlodge Member Username: Johnlodge Post Number: 2072 Registered: 10-2003 |
From the Legacy News: Statements made at the bridge hearing before Detroit City Council on November 13, 2003 suggested that ‘Land-Use and Redevelopment’ were the compelling issues behind Ferndale’s position to remove the bridge. Ferndale Mayor Robert Porter stated, “We want the bridge removed for development…of the community area” MDOT Director Gloria Jeff then asked Detroit City Planner Donald Ray-Smith “What was the basis of the Detroit Planning & Development Department’s recommendation?” Smith answered, “Land use, not transportation.” The results from the Community Visioning Session were also displayed, listing residents’ reasons for pride and their concerns regarding the 8-Mile/Woodward intersection. Issues of safety and pedestrian enhancement topped the list. MDOT used this information, along with traffic analysis, to help determine alternatives to be considered. | ||
Professorscott Member Username: Professorscott Post Number: 688 Registered: 12-2006 |
This was the last straw in Tom Barwin's back, and the reason he left Michigan. MDOT asks the public what we think, because it has to, but then ignores the information and does what it had planned to do all along. | ||
Detroitnerd Member Username: Detroitnerd Post Number: 1312 Registered: 07-2004 |
I think residents of Greenacres, the Detroit neighborhood at the southwest corner of Eight Mile and Woodward, were for the bridge/underpass. They wrote in to a local paper thusly: With faster traffic on the overpass and underpass, we feel safe at street level with only the slower turning traffic. According to local police department and Oakland County traffic figures, the Eight Mile-Woodward intersection is one of the safest in Oakland County. The Michigan Department of Transportation anticipates a 45-57 percent increase in the number and severity of accidents if the Woodward bridge comes down. Opponents of rehabilitating the Woodward overpass have yet to explain how bringing the 40,000 vehicles that cross the bridge daily down to street level will keep the intersection as safe as it is now. With nine bus stops in the intersection, pedestrian safety is critical. | ||
Johnlodge Member Username: Johnlodge Post Number: 2075 Registered: 10-2003 |
In that case, they should build a bridge at Orchard Lake and Maple, as that is one of the most dangerous interesections in Michigan. more than likely, they will put in one of those ever more popular roundabouts, like the one at Maple and Drake. All I can think of is European Vacation with Chevy Chase when I hear about these things popping up in our area. | ||
Dnvn522 Member Username: Dnvn522 Post Number: 267 Registered: 11-2004 |
The feds still pay 80% of the construction costs and they still had oversight for the project...no matter what MDOT, the cities, or a local community group might say. It would be DAMN NEAR IMPOSSIBLE to convince the feds to pay for a project that reduces safety as severely as replacing a bridge separated intersection with an at-grade intersection. Safety numbers are one of the top things the feds look at. When Ferndale says "Land-Use and Redevelopment" as their reasoning for an at-grade intersection...they know that it takes much less right-of-way. The excess then gets sold by the state...increasing development in the city...increasing their tax base. They just see more dollar signs. (Message edited by dnvn522 on August 24, 2007) | ||
Dougw Member Username: Dougw Post Number: 1858 Registered: 11-2003 |
quote: I remember that. The whole Greenacres opposition to removing the bridge was kind of baffling, I have to wonder why they felt so strongly about it. Greenacres is on the other side of Woodlawn Cemetary from the intersection, so it's not really *that* close. Mayhaps someone working for MDOT lived in Greenacres? Yeah, I suppose pedestrian safety might be slightly improved by leaving the bridge there, but the bridge kills any chance for walkable retail (or anything resembling a pleasant environment) around the intersection, so I'm not sure why that's such a focus. Also, the number and severity of accidents could be reduced by reducing/slowing traffic flow. (And reduction of traffic flow was probably the real source of opposition to bridge removal, despite the existing overcapacity.) | ||
Detroitnerd Member Username: Detroitnerd Post Number: 1321 Registered: 07-2004 |
Interesting theory, Dougw. It wouldn't take too much savvy to figure out that anybody defending the bridge from the north (not that Ferndale defended the bridge, by and large) would be tarred as a racist, but somebody writing from the Detroit side would get a "fair" hearing. Hmmmm. Well, it's all speculation. Anyway, if you're curious, read the whole letter by scrolling down here: http://www.metrotimes.com/edit orial/story.asp?id=6883 | ||
Dnvn522 Member Username: Dnvn522 Post Number: 268 Registered: 11-2004 |
quote:Not true. Currently, most of the traffic "bypasses" the intersecting traffic by either going over or under it. If you take all that traffic on the upper structure (Woodward) and all the traffic going under (8 mile) and send them all through a standard intersection, you've just greatly increased the number and severity of the traffic accidents there. quote:Correct. That is why Ferndale was against having the bridge there. | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 1460 Registered: 04-2006 |
^Actually, it might force some people to drive closer to the posted speed limit... | ||
Susanarosa Member Username: Susanarosa Post Number: 1628 Registered: 11-2003 |
There were residents in Green Acres, Palmer Park, and in Ferndale who were against the bridge demolition. Their concerns were primarily about the exhaust from idling cars and people cutting through their neighborhoods to avoid the intersection. I always wondered, if Barwin loved Ferndale so much, why did he live in Hazel Park? | ||
Detroitnerd Member Username: Detroitnerd Post Number: 1324 Registered: 07-2004 |
He was certainly approachable enough to ask directly... | ||
7051 Member Username: 7051 Post Number: 39 Registered: 02-2006 |
I recently heard rumors of a Whole Foods or Trader Joes as a tenant in the 8 Mile/Woodward retail project. Any city planning/development people that have some concrete information on this or the current timetable of the project? | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 5203 Registered: 08-2004 |
Would the removal of the Woodward bridge also have meant the infill of the 8 Mile underpass? Or was there never any opposition to the underpass? | ||
Professorscott Member Username: Professorscott Post Number: 693 Registered: 12-2006 |
The alternative plan, the one that didn't happen, was to make the entire intersection a normal, at grade intersection. There would have been neither bridge nor underpass. | ||
Granmontrules Member Username: Granmontrules Post Number: 145 Registered: 01-2007 |
Green Acres has a street that runs right into 8 Mile. Not all of GA is seperate from Woodward. | ||
Dougw Member Username: Dougw Post Number: 1860 Registered: 11-2003 |
I was wondering if that section of homes north of Woodlawn Cemetary was part of Green Acres, it sounds like it is. If that's the case, their involvement makes a bit more sense. |
