 
Miketoronto
Member
Username: Miketoronto
Post Number: 625
Registered: 07-2004
| | Posted on Monday, August 20, 2007 - 7:39 pm: |    |
Would you guys say that overall residents of the pointes are more supportive of Detroit and feel more connected to the city, then other rich areas of the metro region?
I met a couple on the theatre tour from Grosse Pointe. Now I know they were there because they were interested in that stuff. But overall they seemed very intune with the city and seemed to love the city and were saying how they hope to move into a downtown condo, etc.
Would you say overall that more Pointers are like this then anti city?
They were a very nice couple. Not all stuck up or anything like the sterotypes. And like I said, very pro city. |
Detroitplanner
Member
Username: Detroitplanner
Post Number: 1369
Registered: 04-2006
| | Posted on Monday, August 20, 2007 - 7:53 pm: | |
You could say the same thing about folks from River Rouge, Ecorse, or Melvindale. I would think that border cities within Wayne County see the line as blurred at best. |
Patrick
Member
Username: Patrick
Post Number: 4828
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Monday, August 20, 2007 - 7:59 pm: | |
Pointers cant afford to be anti-Detroit since they live right on the border. Geography can make a world of difference in viewpoints. |
Ahartz
Member
Username: Ahartz
Post Number: 5
Registered: 04-2007
| | Posted on Monday, August 20, 2007 - 8:57 pm: | |
I grew up going downtown, Windsor etc..No one I knew was ever afraid to go downtown or to other places in the city. ..I think alot of pointers feel the connection your talking about. I am not sure you could say the same of kids who grew up in Romeo, wixom, or the like... I also can't disagree with patrick either. ..andy |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 3621
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Monday, August 20, 2007 - 9:22 pm: | |
What Patrick said. You can't turn your back on a city that you live less than a mile from, or, in many cases such as mine, a one-minute/few minute walk from.
There is a good sized crowd of GP-ers who are harshly critical of Detroit (i.e. they aren't afraid of the city or swear to stay out of it like people in distant suburbs, but they say lots of bad things about the mayor, etc, or consider Detroit kind of a joke), and a good sized crowd of old-timers who are still pissed about how the city fell from its high position (and some of these people can be racist too, like many old people). But plenty of old and young folk in GP are really sensible about Detroit, and a great deal more are optimistic, relative to other metro Detroiters.
The proximity to downtown makes the GPs a place where a great percentage work there, and/or go there for nights out or events. This all leads to a heightened sensibility and care for the city. |
Digitalvision
Member
Username: Digitalvision
Post Number: 288
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Monday, August 20, 2007 - 10:01 pm: | |
Grosse Pointe and Detroit have had a uniquely intertwined relationship, as GP is truly the first suburb for the well-off. Many of the original Detroit power brokers lived in Grosse Pointe, and their families, as it is an old community, in many cases are still there.
Many lawyers also live in GP that work downtown, to take advantage of a short commute and great schools.
So yes - it's my experience that "Pointers" are much more Detroit-friendly. If you look around, downtown has quite a share of liberal ex-Grosse Pointers ;-) and one not-so-liberal one I can think of... |
Hudkina
Member
Username: Hudkina
Post Number: 42
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 21, 2007 - 12:48 am: | |
I would think that part of the reason is that many of the people in the Grosse Pointes actually work in Detroit, whereas people from Bloomfield Hills/Birmingham tend to work in Troy/Southfield.
For example:
Only 9% of the people who live in Birmingham/Bloomfield Hills/Bloomfield TWP work in the city of Detroit, while 20% work in Southfield or Troy.
On the flip side, 28% of the people who live in the Grosse Pointes work in the city of Detroit, while only 8% work in Southfield or Troy. |
Danny
Member
Username: Danny
Post Number: 6370
Registered: 02-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 21, 2007 - 10:10 am: | |
Snobbyvilles supportive to Detroit. HAH! They do have police to keep the crackheads, pimps and prostitutes from crossing Alter and Mack Rd. |
Pgn421
Member
Username: Pgn421
Post Number: 117
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 21, 2007 - 1:33 pm: | |
I know a couple of GPers, who dont step foot in to Detroit. What a shame. Tunnelvision. |
Thejesus
Member
Username: Thejesus
Post Number: 1890
Registered: 06-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 21, 2007 - 1:42 pm: | |
For the handful of GPers I know, I don't think Detroit is really on their radar...they live, work, and kids go to school in the suburbs...
Once every few years they might venture downtown for a Tigers game or show at the Fox, but that's about it...
I recently went to a baseball game downtown with a group of people and there was one girl in the group from GP who I didn't really know all that well, but she kept reminiscing about some memory of going downtown once when she was like 10, and how she remembered seeing the Spirit of Detroit statue, but she hadn't been there since then...
I think this is pretty typical of many residents of the northern and eastern suburbs...
I can say that before last year when I started going downtown pretty regularly and saw all it had to offer, Detroit wasn't really on my radar either...I grew up in the suburbs and could probably count on both hands the number of times I had been downtown in my lifetime
(Message edited by thejesus on August 21, 2007) |
Miss_cleo
Member
Username: Miss_cleo
Post Number: 809
Registered: 05-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 21, 2007 - 2:29 pm: | |
How many communities outside of Detroit are you in touch with? I am puzzled by the point of this thread.
Do you know whats going on in Mesick? How about Marquette?
Do you think the people there moan about the rest of the state paying no attention to them?
Not meant as bashing, but this really makes no sense to me. Seems like you guys want everyone to focus on Detroit all the time. Other communities have their own worries and problems. They arent going to sit around and wonder whats happening in the D. In fact, I beleieve most people who live in SW, NW and NE Michigan are sick of Detroit dropping the ball on so many things year after year. After awhile, they stop caring. |
Eric_c
Member
Username: Eric_c
Post Number: 1030
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 21, 2007 - 4:19 pm: | |
"I can say that before last year when I started going downtown pretty regularly and saw all it had to offer, Detroit wasn't really on my radar either...I grew up in the suburbs and could probably count on both hands the number of times I had been downtown in my lifetime." -Thejesus
I just felt it was important for this to be repeated. Carry on. |
Iheartthed
Member
Username: Iheartthed
Post Number: 1417
Registered: 04-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 21, 2007 - 4:30 pm: | |
^And suddenly it makes sense. |
Thejesus
Member
Username: Thejesus
Post Number: 1892
Registered: 06-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 21, 2007 - 4:39 pm: | |
^says the New York resident who hates the suburbs of Michigan and the American auto industry... |
Iheartthed
Member
Username: Iheartthed
Post Number: 1418
Registered: 04-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 21, 2007 - 4:40 pm: | |
^I love American cars! |
Gazhekwe
Member
Username: Gazhekwe
Post Number: 63
Registered: 08-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 21, 2007 - 4:49 pm: | |
Hey, that's a great question! What IS going on in Mesick? Or Paradise, or Hell, for that matter? Nirvana, anyone? |
Thejesus
Member
Username: Thejesus
Post Number: 1893
Registered: 06-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 21, 2007 - 5:07 pm: | |
"I just felt it was important for this to be repeated. Carry on."
Yes, because anyone who grew up in Detroit would piss and moan like you that a new FBI office is being built that you can't touch from the street...
oh wait, the mayor grew up in Detroit, and he approved the plan...but given your arrogance, I'm not surprised you think your opinion speaks for the rest of the city more than his does... |
Eric_c
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Username: Eric_c
Post Number: 1031
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 21, 2007 - 5:12 pm: | |
 |
Jazzstage
Member
Username: Jazzstage
Post Number: 74
Registered: 08-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 21, 2007 - 5:28 pm: | |
From my experience, GP has suported Detroit financially through the times when people from other places didn't venture downtown as much. In particular, I am remembering a gig I had at Pinkey's before it closed down. There was a high percentage of GP'ers. I have had similar experiences in Intermezzo, the DAC, the Castle, The Gem, The Rattlesnake Club, Pewabic pottery, the players club, the Scarab Club, the DYC and the Detroit Club.
Besides proximity, I think it has much to do with the small amount of good restaurants and adult nightclubs in GP.
That list made me realize I used to get out alot before marriage. |
Tkshreve
Member
Username: Tkshreve
Post Number: 137
Registered: 07-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 21, 2007 - 5:45 pm: | |
I spent every day of the summer swimming at the Boat Club on Belle Isle until I was 12. That is when this historical club was left to die. I don't remember Detroit jumping in to save the building or the people that migrated into the city for months on end to be there.
Think what you must, but many "attractions" that once drew suburban populations, and GPer's for that matter, have since been lost that otherwise should have been preserved. |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 3622
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 21, 2007 - 10:08 pm: | |
"I don't think Detroit is really on their radar"
-TJ
Dead fuckin' wrong, TJ.
Why are you surmising that for most GP-ers Detroit doesn't matter just because of one girl and one anecdote? Like I said, there are plenty of people there with a more typical suburban outlook, but the relationship between the places is pretty real for most people that live in GP. Sure you get alot of shelter from the city there if you live along Lakeshore up towards 8-mile, and for that handful of people, who live in a more typically suburban landscape anyway, often Detroit is more irrelevant. Maybe that's were that girl was from. For most other parts of the GPs, the city is a stone's throw away and it just makes sense that going there is a regular thing, if not a daily thing. |
Scs100
Member
Username: Scs100
Post Number: 1424
Registered: 12-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 21, 2007 - 10:16 pm: | |
quote:For most other parts of the GPs, the city is a stone's throw away and it just makes sense that going there is a regular thing, if not a daily thing.
That pretty much summarized what I'm like. I dunno about a stone, but I could throw a tennis ball or a baseball, and it would probably end up across Mack. (Ok, that might be a stretch.) Point is, we do have to be aware of where we are positioned. There are plenty of ignorant Grosse Pointers out there, such as that girl you mentioned and the 20 or so I can think of off the top of my head. But there are others like myself, Mackinaw, Ahartz, and the other Grosse Pointers on this forum who do care about the city and what goes on. It really depends on who you talk to. |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 3623
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 21, 2007 - 10:49 pm: | |
The idea that Detroit isn't on GP's radar is so far-fetched. The GPs might be wealthy on average, like the OC suburbs, but that's about where the similarities stop. Patrick stated the most obvious reason why, and it's geography.
But for culture and other factors, Detroit dominates the radar for people in GP, as it should for the entire area. |
The_rock
Member
Username: The_rock
Post Number: 1923
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 22, 2007 - 6:51 am: | |
Patrick and Mackinaw hit the nail right on the head.
Danny bangs his thumb. |
Thejesus
Member
Username: Thejesus
Post Number: 1895
Registered: 06-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 22, 2007 - 9:43 am: | |
"But for culture and other factors, Detroit dominates the radar for people in GP"
I think this is the kink in your theory...you might be overestimating how important "culture and other factors" are to the typical suburbanite...and I'm not saying they shouldn't be...but from my experience, most people in the suburbs (including GP) that don't work downtown tend to only go downtown for the occasional Tigers game or show at the Fox...the rest of their lives are pretty well sustained without leaving the 'burbs...
The good news is, with the Tigers doing well for the first time in two decades, more people from the 'burbs are coming down to watch the games and incidentally seeing that Detroit isn't the Detroit they remember from 10 or 20 years ago... |
Craggy
Member
Username: Craggy
Post Number: 262
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 22, 2007 - 10:08 am: | |
As someone raised in Grosse Pointe, (and soon to move back)I can say that most of my friends and neighbors spend a lot of time and money in the city. When we go out, its almost always somewhere in the city. When I shop, many of the places I go are in Detroit. Unfortunately, many of the stores I used to shop at on Warren are gone. M&M hardware comes to mind. What a great place that was.
That said...there are still many places that I shop at in the city. Its not a conscious thing, its just a proximity thing. |
Miss_cleo
Member
Username: Miss_cleo
Post Number: 815
Registered: 05-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 22, 2007 - 10:17 am: | |
Hey, that's a great question! What IS going on in Mesick? Or Paradise, or Hell, for that matter? Nirvana, anyone?
------------------------------ --------
Not much happening in Mesick, but Buckley just had its Old Engine Show. Biggest steam engine show in the NATION. Now you would thing that OK or KS or some such state would hold the biggest steam engine show, but nope, the honor goes to Buckley Mi.
We went it was very cool,1000 steam tractors on display and they ran everything at the show, foundry, blacksmith shop, lumber yard, all ran by steam engine. Never saw so many old men in bib overalls in my life. We saw plates on cars from OK, KS, Iowa, Nebraska, TX etc. People came from all over the states to see this show. I guess that our own little culture up in the North. lol |
Iheartthed
Member
Username: Iheartthed
Post Number: 1425
Registered: 04-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 22, 2007 - 10:29 am: | |
So cosmo... |
Detroitbill
Member
Username: Detroitbill
Post Number: 296
Registered: 09-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 22, 2007 - 10:29 am: | |
I know many GPers and they are all very city connected,luv coming downtown to the restaurants, theater etc, and are very willing to come downtown to visit me, and are very excited when they see new residential activity downtown.,,This is a stark contrast to my friends living in Royal Oak and Bloomfield, they tend to have a far more negative attitude about Detroit, still criticize even good things when they happen and do not seem to like to visit me much when I invite them. They much prefer I drive to them . I also find many people from Dearborn and downriver who like to come to the city all the time, they dont seem to have many hangups either. This is just in my personal life but I have many times noticed this pattern even in new people I meet. I have always found this a very curious situation.
(Message edited by DetroitBill on August 22, 2007) |
Tkshreve
Member
Username: Tkshreve
Post Number: 138
Registered: 07-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 22, 2007 - 10:33 am: | |
You may not be aware of it Thejesus, but there are many other things to do in the CoD than you suspect. Suburbanites go into the city to dine at fine restaurants, visit the art shows and music festivals, and visit their swanky yacht clubs in the city.
A majority of these commuters being of younger age. Younger people tend to explore more often then older people. Older people could be drawn to the city if there was some decent shopping to be had. Unfortunately, that is not the case. Currently, the only main attraction for the older suburbanite crowds are tigers games, private clubs, some dining and Fox theater.
On the other hand, Thejesus, the younger crowds fill the city on a nightly basis for clubs, sporting events, dining, cruising, casinos, drugs, visiting friends and other various things. A great deal of these people are from GP and I know this first hand. |
Thejesus
Member
Username: Thejesus
Post Number: 1898
Registered: 06-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 22, 2007 - 11:01 am: | |
Tkshreve:
I'm well aware of it...my point is that, in my experience, most suburbanites are not...the shear fact that businesses (think restaurant chains and retail) tend to flourish in the 'burbs and struggle in the city should be evidence enough that most suburbanites aren't spending much money/time downtown
when I bring up Detroit to someone from the suburbs, the reaction I get is often something like, "Oh yeah, Detroit, I went there a few years ago for some show at the Fox..."
and I sort of feel like I'm being ganged up on and attacked for even sharing this, which seems retarded...I wish people from the 'burbs would spend more time downtown, but I don't see the point in pretending like it's a bigger factor in their live than it really is...
The trend in recent years has been more and more people from the 'burbs spending time downtown, and the more this happens, you'll see the common view in the suburbs that Detroit doesn't really have much to offer start to change |
Miss_cleo
Member
Username: Miss_cleo
Post Number: 816
Registered: 05-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 22, 2007 - 11:06 am: | |
suburbanites aren't spending much money/time downtown
------------------------------ ----------
what about the people who already live in the city? Are they spending time/money there........or are the people from the suburbs supposed to swoop in and bail the city out? You have already stated there is nothing but attractions for them, no shopping etc, so why would they? |
Thejesus
Member
Username: Thejesus
Post Number: 1899
Registered: 06-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 22, 2007 - 11:16 am: | |
^I'm not sure what you're saying/asking with that last post...
But nobody is talking about "bailing out" the city...
We're basically talking about Detroit's ability to compete for the region's entertainment dollars |
Miss_cleo
Member
Username: Miss_cleo
Post Number: 817
Registered: 05-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 22, 2007 - 11:24 am: | |
You know, in most threads you guys bash the 'burbs and the people who live there. Then in other threads you moan the fact that they dont spend enough time/money downtown. which is it? YOu cant have it both ways
I guess suburbanites are bad, but their money is good?
and if you only want the down there for *entertainment* then they come down and leave when said entertaiment is over. There is nothing sustainable to keep them down there other than entertainment. That only last so long. The D needs some good shopping. |
Thejesus
Member
Username: Thejesus
Post Number: 1902
Registered: 06-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 22, 2007 - 11:49 am: | |
Miss_cleo...
I don't bash the suburbs...I live in and grew up in the suburbs...I'm simply saying that Detroit has more to offer than people from the suburbs realize, it's a different city than it was 10 or 20 years ago and continuously improving itself, and as more and more people start coming downtown for things like Tigers games, the suburban myths about Detroit will start to change...
At present though, people in the 'burbs tend to forget that the city is even there |
Tkshreve
Member
Username: Tkshreve
Post Number: 140
Registered: 07-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 22, 2007 - 11:53 am: | |
Thejesus-
I don't know what areas people you are talking to in regards to the 'burbanites, but this thread pertains to GP'ers and their committment to visiting the D.
Perhaps you don't spend enough time out of the city and you have gained an unfavorable and outdated image of the suburbs and the people that reside in them.
And when are we going to get a Churches Chicken in the suburbs? Are they worried we won't be able to support one of the establishments?
(Message edited by tkshreve on August 22, 2007) |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 3624
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 22, 2007 - 3:57 pm: | |
Tkshreve is right. There is alot more "culture" in the city than shows at the major theatres and sports. A hell of a lot more. TJ seemed to imply that, for most suburbanites, those limited cultural events were the extent of their trips to the city. That's pretty much true. Since this thread is about GP residents, let's focus on them. My point, when I said that Detroit dominates the cultural radar for GP folk, is that their experiences in the city usually far exceed your standard sports events and big shows. Lord knows there's not too much culture in GP, as nice as it may be (all the theatres are gone and there are very few unique restaurants), but since a lot of people there crave culture, they turn to Detroit.
That is the distinction we need to make, and I think TJ reverts back to suburban generalizations rather that noting this distinction, which this thread was getting at from the beginning.
And I really don't get miss_cleo at all. |
Detroitbill
Member
Username: Detroitbill
Post Number: 302
Registered: 09-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 22, 2007 - 4:20 pm: | |
I agree with Mackinaw, the GPers I know are very intune with culture,, be it theater, history or sports that Detroit offers. In my own experiences they often are very keenly knowledgeable and interested in the History of Detroit, far more than my friends in other suburbs,, Maybe its just many of them come from different backrounds or maybe just a coincidence but the interest factor they show is definitely there. Many friends in Dearborn and downriver come downtown very often and they too show a very real interest in the city.. I just don't find the same interest in my OC friends. I think it's probably because those areas have built their own mini- cities and it is only natural for one to become insulated to their surroundings. I find myself the same way with the city. I find I have little interest in what Royal Oak or Birmingham has to offer because it is of no interest to me. I view driving there as something I only do when I have to. Many suburban people view Detroit the same way.
To each their own I guess. |
Tkshreve
Member
Username: Tkshreve
Post Number: 144
Registered: 07-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 22, 2007 - 11:30 pm: | |
Yes DB, but what really is ironic about the entire thing is how people from RO and Birmingham can make it downtown via 75 or 10 as quick or quicker than the GP'ers and SCS'ers who use Jefferson as means for travel.
Once you get out into deep OC does the drive become longer. |
Craggy
Member
Username: Craggy
Post Number: 263
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, August 23, 2007 - 10:26 am: | |
Getting downtown from GP...the great thing is, there are many alternate routes. 94, Jeff, Warren, Mack...all are good options.
Its too bad the Chrysler expansion took Charlevoix and Vernor out of commission. Those were two great ways to get in and out of town. |
Tkshreve
Member
Username: Tkshreve
Post Number: 146
Registered: 07-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, August 23, 2007 - 10:29 am: | |
AKA - T-bone alley ^^^^^^^^^ |
Craggy
Member
Username: Craggy
Post Number: 264
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, August 23, 2007 - 10:41 am: | |
exactly! |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 3626
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, August 23, 2007 - 11:11 am: | |
Ah, Tkshreve, but Jefferson is so much more scenic, if slower due to the lights. |
Detroitbill
Member
Username: Detroitbill
Post Number: 303
Registered: 09-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, August 23, 2007 - 11:19 am: | |
I have never understood that element either, when traffic is normal, its only 20 mins downtown Detroit to Royal Oak and the reverse ofcourse..GP has taken me longer. |
Tkshreve
Member
Username: Tkshreve
Post Number: 147
Registered: 07-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, August 23, 2007 - 12:17 pm: | |
The Jefferson lights are timed to get traffic into the city on weekday mornings, reversing at some point to let traffic out of the city via Jefferson around 3-7 PM weekdays. Catch a wave....
The weekends are a crapshoot as far as I can tell. |
Iheartthed
Member
Username: Iheartthed
Post Number: 1439
Registered: 04-2006
| | Posted on Thursday, August 23, 2007 - 12:20 pm: | |
^Grand River is the same way. |
Gistok
Member
Username: Gistok
Post Number: 5165
Registered: 08-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, August 23, 2007 - 5:21 pm: | |
According to the Channel 4 News poll discussed in the "Detroit is a cool place to play" thread, suburbanites come to Detroit more often than some posters on this thread perceive... |
Lefty2
Member
Username: Lefty2
Post Number: 32
Registered: 07-2007
| | Posted on Thursday, August 23, 2007 - 5:41 pm: | |
More in tune with the city than whom? |
Tkshreve
Member
Username: Tkshreve
Post Number: 150
Registered: 07-2006
| | Posted on Friday, August 24, 2007 - 1:33 am: | |
Lefty, the first sentence in this thread answers your question.
Unless of course you are being sarcastic. I can't tell anymore. |
Gps
Member
Username: Gps
Post Number: 1
Registered: 08-2007
| | Posted on Saturday, August 25, 2007 - 4:25 pm: | |
Grosse Pointers are more supportive of the city than other metro residents, no question.
The GP families that don't support Detroit have already relocated to Oakland County.
I think Jefferson Ave in Detroit is going through a rebirth and property values in GP will increase in the long term as a result of this growth. |