  Detroitprincess Member Username: Detroitprincess Post Number: 7 Registered: 07-2007 |
Detroit is littered with bums. you can't walk 10 feet without 3 bums asking for money. I live on woodward and bum walked up to my porch. Unacceptable! We need to penalize people or fine them for handing bums money. They are making the problem worse. If people stop giving handouts they will eventually go away or hopefully get a job! They dirty the city and there is way to many of them. Any ideas or suggestions on what we can do to fix the problem? I am willing to help in any way. | ||
Charlottepaul Member Username: Charlottepaul Post Number: 1520 Registered: 10-2006 |
Charlotte..."is littered with bums." I think that bums will always be there (or everywhere). Detroit didn't seem to have that many. Here in Charlotte, I had to work 'til about 1am last week. On my three block walk in downtown Charlotte to the bus terminal I passed 12 (not to mention the number from when I got off my bus to walk to my house). They are very hard to avoid as well. They almost make me want to quit smoking as they always ask for one. The worst I think is when they approach you while you are sitting down eating dinner at a sidewalk restaurant with your family. I'm not sure if it is a matter of not giving them anything. There will always be homeless shelters and such that will give out food and clothing. Therefore they would at least be around those locations. It just happens that in Charlotte, those locations are right near downtown, and the homeless also know that downtown is where the money is at. | ||
Vetalalumni Member Username: Vetalalumni Post Number: 590 Registered: 05-2007 |
Many smaller cities also have this type of problem. I've witnessed the problem in Knoxville (TN), Champaign-Urbana (IL), Battle Creek (MI), Dayton (OH), Tulsa (OK), and Amarillo (TX), to name a few cities. | ||
Karl Member Username: Karl Post Number: 9588 Registered: 09-2005 |
Most cities have shelters that also provide food for sober folks who are down on their luck. If disruptive because of drugs/booze sorry no food/shelter - thus begging for handouts. Giving them cash revs up/prolongs the problem. I used to take 'em to McDonalds (or the place of their choice) and buy a meal - which almost always caused a look or 2 of frustration as they seemed to think they'd end up with cash rather than food, which is what they said they wanted all along. Oh well. | ||
Jimaz Member Username: Jimaz Post Number: 3042 Registered: 12-2005 |
Searching for humorous acronyms, I stumbled onto this: Balliol Undergraduate Mathematics Society (Balliol College, Oxford University). I tell ya, mathematicians get no respect.  | ||
Jams Member Username: Jams Post Number: 5884 Registered: 10-2003 |
I usually just give them a bus ticket and point out the nearest Woodward 450 bus stop and suggest Royal Oak is where the "Real Money" is.  Beats the Hell out of seeing some "dirty bum" lying dead in the street shot by a State Trooper. | ||
Charlottepaul Member Username: Charlottepaul Post Number: 1521 Registered: 10-2006 |
"which almost always caused a look or 2 of frustration as they seemed to think they'd end up with cash rather than food, which is what they said they wanted all along." yeah there was one guy here in Charlotte a few months ago, and I asked him "really what do you need?" So long story short I went to my car and got him a blanket. Took it to him and he said, "You aren't listening to me..." Then I bought him a breakfast meal at Bojangles and he seemed a bit happier. All in all though I didn't have that much on me and basically zero in my bank account where he wanted me to go and use my ATM card, LOL! | ||
Gazhekwe Member Username: Gazhekwe Post Number: 140 Registered: 08-2007 |
I think in Chicago they sell those newspapers. There are people on every corner selling the papers. If you buy one and carry it under your arm, the others don't bug you. What is that? I don't remember what the paper was about. | ||
Detroitprincess Member Username: Detroitprincess Post Number: 10 Registered: 07-2007 |
Gazhekwe-That is great, at least they are working for the money. | ||
Davetroit Member Username: Davetroit Post Number: 17 Registered: 03-2007 |
I think that the Chicago paper is called Streetwise... | ||
Oakmangirl Member Username: Oakmangirl Post Number: 177 Registered: 08-2007 |
Sorry to threadjack, but this is parallel to the heated thread on panhandlers. Try educating yourself before making generalizations; only around 26% of all homeless are addicts. http://www.nationalhomeless.or g/publications/facts.html In Chicago, you can see plenty of homeless who live in boxes under the overpasses near Lake Shore, and yes, they sell a newspaper (I lived in Chicago for a while.) So you all mean to tell me that you'd rather give your money to con-artists who sucker people/tourists with Three Card Monty because at least "they're working for the money"? Essentially a person trying to swindle another person is still begging but trying to trick at the same time; they're still not gainfully employed. Is that more palatable to dealing with "bums"? The homeless aren't going to find jobs anytime soon. Our unemployment rate is 7.4% and the state is thinning out pretty quickly, so suck it up and be grateful that person begging isn't you. | ||
Gazhekwe Member Username: Gazhekwe Post Number: 144 Registered: 08-2007 |
I like the newspaper idea because then you give to one person, and the other people leave you be. It might be a different person every day, but it's just one person. That's it, Streetwise. Does anyone know who sponsors that? Those Good Fellows people who risk their lives holding up traffic to raise money are similarly intrusive, but for a good cause. I like that you can buy one paper and then the rest know not to bug you. | ||
Cassie1717 Member Username: Cassie1717 Post Number: 62 Registered: 04-2005 |
What about advocating for and achieving adequate mental health care for some of those folks? Most of them are on the streets for addiction problems and psychiatric disorders. People complain about the bums being in the way and making life "not pretty", yet these same complainers don't want to pay taxes (or support other measures) to help get these people the care that they really need. Some of them truly need to be in a psychiatric hospital because adult foster care homes can't handle their cases. Oh wait, we don't have psych hospitals any more. They cost our taxpayers too much money. The same taxpayers complaining about bums on their doorsteps. I'm sure those bums love the life they're living. | ||
Cassie1717 Member Username: Cassie1717 Post Number: 63 Registered: 04-2005 |
Detroitprincess, what is unacceptable is how these PEOPLE are treated. They are people, too. | ||
Oakmangirl Member Username: Oakmangirl Post Number: 179 Registered: 08-2007 |
Cassie1717, See the panhandlers thread if you want to see the breadth of ignorance out here. On that thread, homeless people beg because they choose that lifestyle, or so almost everyone here believes. | ||
Gazhekwe Member Username: Gazhekwe Post Number: 147 Registered: 08-2007 |
Cool, Streetwise has a website, http://www.streetwise.org/ Here is some info. Is there anything like that here? What would it take to get it started here? About Us Since 1992, we have provided employment to more than 3,600 homeless men and women, enabling them to secure housing and buy food, clothing and personal necessities. Most importantly, StreetWise has served as the opportunity for their journey back to self-sufficiency. Since the first edition of our paper was issued on the streets of Chicago, we have relied on the support of the community's businesses, philanthropic organizations and volunteers to create a successful program. At the heart of it all is the motivation of our vendors to help expand and evolve our offerings. For these vendors, we are a bridge to full-time employment, economic stability and self-respect. StreetWise has created and delivered a unified voice that has expanded awareness of homeless issues to a diverse Chicagoland readership. Milestones, key dates and achievements chart our success. They include: 1992 Opened our doors and developed vendor ID badges. 1993 Hosted first annual vendor picnic and hired first full-time staff. 1994 Established vendor services and orientation programs. 1995 Formed United Airlines partnership and produced first color edition of the paper. 1996 Expanded to bi-weekly publication and established advertising department. 1997 Purchased new offices and hosted first annual StreetWise gala. 1998 Launched Work Empowerment Center. Help us celebrate 15 years! | ||
Mdoyle Member Username: Mdoyle Post Number: 182 Registered: 10-2006 |
The other night going into Lafayette Coney a homeless person asked a friend of mine for a cigarette, she offered her lit nearly 2/3 of a cig as we were going into coney. He complained and told them he wanted a whole one and then bitched at us when we went in. First thing that comes out of a friends mouth "Beggars can't be choosers" It was unintentional and the first thing that popped into their head but in hindsight I dont think it was that out of line. | ||
Buzzman0077 Member Username: Buzzman0077 Post Number: 104 Registered: 11-2006 |
The ones who harass me as I walk to a show, dinner, or game, and call me names when I don't give them money don't deserve to be treated with any respect. If they can't respect my right not to hand money to every person who asks for it then they don't deserve to be treated with any respect in return. That's why I don't mind giving some money to someone playing an instrument, or even just sitting back with a hat in front of them. I have a problem with the abusive one who verbally assault me. Also as I've always said "McDonalds is always hiring". Go take a shower at a center and get a job. If you won't work you don't deserve my money. | ||
Oakmangirl Member Username: Oakmangirl Post Number: 181 Registered: 08-2007 |
Could we start a thread for the clueless forum members called "Cure for Ignorance"? Research, read the facts, and cultivate a little compassion! | ||
Buzzman0077 Member Username: Buzzman0077 Post Number: 105 Registered: 11-2006 |
Why do they deserve any compassion beyond my tax dollars and charitable contributions that pay for organizations that are there to help them. They represent little more than a drain on society. While there is a portion which will pick up there lives and rejoin productive society, the majority have no purpose outside of harassment and the tarnishment of the city's image. | ||
Texorama Member Username: Texorama Post Number: 48 Registered: 12-2006 |
Look, the issue for this forum is not the causes of homelessness (research in that area is notoriously driven by advocacy anyway), nor who is really being "compassionate." If Oakmangirl wants to spend her time bringing the homeless blankets and dinner, I'm sure we'd all agree that's laudable, and I think we'd also agree that being threatened by a desperate individual is a major deterrent to frequenting the businesses in any given area. The question is how to manage the problem for the good of the city. Personally I think the combination of expanding services plus increasing enforcement is the way to go. In NYC, which already had an extensive service infrastructure, small efforts like cracking down on the squeegee men and keeping some major public spaces free of panhandlers made a very visible difference. | ||
Neilr Member Username: Neilr Post Number: 568 Registered: 06-2005 |
quote: Not necessarily. While I agree that taxpayers in Michigan in general may not want to pay for psychiatric care for street people, it is the downtown residents, like Detroitprincess who lives on Woodward, who have to bear the brunt of the results of this lack of care. I believe that she is absolutely entitled to not want to find a bum on her doorstep. While solving the all problems facing street people is beyond me, donating to the Open Door Ministry at Fort Street Presbyterian Church is something that I can do. http://www.fortstreet.org/Open %20Door/overview.html | ||
Danny Member Username: Danny Post Number: 6394 Registered: 02-2004 |
Detroitprincess Good for you. Helping the poor to return to society is Christian favor to do. I hope everyone in this forum should do the same. That is one part of the cure for BUMS. | ||
Rfban Member Username: Rfban Post Number: 179 Registered: 02-2004 |
There is a difference between bums and homeless people. We have way too many bums, a few hobos, and some real legit homeless people. I think more foot traffic would help the situation. nobody wants to get confronted one on one with a half crazy bum that wants a fix. At least if there are more people the bums would feel more opportunity and therefore not be as much of a problem. | ||
Detroitprincess Member Username: Detroitprincess Post Number: 13 Registered: 07-2007 |
Cassie171 Detroitprincess, what is unacceptable is how these PEOPLE are treated. They are people, too. Everyone has a choice. You are going to be treated by how you treat yourself. If you do not respect yourself, Why would anyone else? These people have a choice to get help. There are jobs out there. I dont care if they are picking up litter, mopping floors, taking out the trash etc. There are jobs. These people are lazy and on drugs and they dont want to better themselves. The ones that suffer mental disorders I would be happy to donate or pay a tax to put them in a hospital. The Chicago bums that sell papers. That is great you buy one paper and no one else approaches you. That is fine with me. I have a problem, when I am sitting on my porch. They walk up to my house asking for "35" cents. I hate when I want to walk downtown and I am approached by 20-30 bums during my walk. THEY ARE PART OF THE LITTER in Detroit. They leave there litter everywhere and they are filthy people. I have no respect for them. They don't act like people. They act like filthy animals. | ||
Oakmangirl Member Username: Oakmangirl Post Number: 182 Registered: 08-2007 |
What an attitude to have! "There are jobs out there. I dont care if they are picking up litter, mopping floors, taking out the trash etc." This type of job provides a livable wage? The unemployment rate in this state is higher than the national average; people are leaving the state, do tell, DPrincess, where are all these jobs? | ||
Kslice Member Username: Kslice Post Number: 149 Registered: 04-2007 |
2 problems with your plan Detroitprincess. 1. Where would the bums go? They can't very well just get in their car and leave. 2. How can you get everyone to stop giving them money? Have a cop on every corner waiting to arrest anyone who gives them some money? I like some of the bums. I see them outside tiger stadium with an old saxophone or something. I always give money to them since at least they're trying... | ||
Eric_w Member Username: Eric_w Post Number: 301 Registered: 02-2007 |
Bums a everywhere it seems. I saw a couple in Traverse City when I was there several weeks ago. I've seen them in little northern towns too. Guess they're like mosquitos-we'll never be rid of them all. I have little or no compassion for them -most are low-life scum. The ones with drug habits are the worst.They made a choice to use & got hooked on their own-what A-holes. | ||
Plymouthres Member Username: Plymouthres Post Number: 159 Registered: 02-2007 |
Take Oakmangirls advise and read the thread over there carefully. I love the way, when asked, that she provides plausible solutions to her assumptions!! She basically has invaded this thread, hoping to gather more people to her side here as most people on the panhandlers thread disagreed with her assumptions. Rather than having candid discourse on fixing the problem of the panhandlers, she basically attacks anyone who doesn't fit her way of thinking, choosing now to refer to those of us who disagree as "the breadth of ignorance out here. On that thread, homeless people beg because they choose that lifestyle, or so almost everyone here believes." Read my post 158 where I ask her opinion of what solutions she would provide to remedy the problem. Here is her reply: "I would gladly offer ideas for solving homelessness, but the solutions are tied to the reasons we have it in the first place: lack of jobs at a livable wage, lack of affordable housing, domestic abuse, laissez-faire govt., false assumptions that the homeless "choose" their lifestyle." Some solution, huh? I was kind of thinking a paragraph on how she was going to spearhead a grass roots organization that would intervene as advocates for the homeless/bums/panhandlers, providing legal representation, medical support and most importantly, the psychiatric counselors that are so desperately needed. I thought maybe, if really enamored of this issue, she would declare that she has formed a crack legal team to assail the current legislation dealing with these issues, pro bono, and that she would also lobby the State legislature to change laws relegating the tax revenues to be more evenly spread out amongst the needy areas that this state so woefully ignores. I thought that if she were really driven, she would announce that she had volunteered her time to form a new organization that would be approaching businesses and soliciting donations to rehab and open some of the beautiful older buildings in Detroit to help house and care for these individuals. But, alas, no luck there either. I agree with her that something must be done to help these people out, but her failure to provide any ideas and her personally condescending remarks weaken her argument and her lack of suggestions to help out are an insight into her own biases and "rose colored view" of the situation. See her insightful post 154 where her apparent disdain for people who live in Plymouth and Northville is stated. Later she tries to back out of the bashing by saying she was speaking in generalities (post 159). Here is her response to that. What a gem! "I generalized about the suburbs to elucidate for you just how much you were generalizing about panhandlers. Not surprised it didn't work." Astounding! I come to this website because in the two years that I have been coming here, I have learned more about Detroit than I learned in my previous forty five years! I enjoy the candid and sometimes vehement positions that people share with each other and I never fail to learn something that I hadn't been aware of before. The funny part of the whole thing is, and to get back on topic, the bums/panhandlers/homeless in this city are aggressive and definitely a deterrent to Detroit and it's revitalization and for most people who have spoken out here, with personal stories on how they have been accosted. We all agree that something must be done as well. Once again, I invite some ideas for solutions. I still contend, if you are not part of the solution, then you are a part of the problem. | ||
Warriorfan Member Username: Warriorfan Post Number: 778 Registered: 08-2005 |
quote: This isn't about the homeless, it's about PANHANDLERS. So even assuming that the 26% figure cited on that pro-homeless website is accurate, who do you think are the ones out there panhandling every day? The ones who are genuinely down on their luck, or the addicts? You don't NEED to panhandle to get money for food, there are plenty of shelters and agencies across Detroit that provide food to the homeless. They also provide clean clothes, showers, and a warm place to sleep. The ones who are PANHANDLING are doing that because the one thing that the shelters and relief agencies don't provide is drugs and alcohol, the only way they can get money for that is to panhandle. Have you noticed that the vast majority of panhandlers in the city are adult males? Even your own website acknowledges that single adult males make up the majority of homeless substance abusers. Where are the homeless children? The young single mothers? They aren't out panhandling, and there's a reason for that. Because there is no reason to panhandle other than to feed your habit. Food, clothing, shelter for those in need are available to the homeless people who genuinely want it. The ones who either can't or won't obey the rules at the shelters (no drugs, no booze, no stealing, no fighting, no causing trouble, etc) are the ones who bug the shit out of you for money on the street. |
