  Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 1792 Registered: 04-2006 |
>Michigan Are you on x or something? Calm your hyper ass down. | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 1793 Registered: 04-2006 |
Maybe because they run Detroit and they are in the majority? Just a guess. I wouldn't expect the black community to save Holland Michigan but that is just me. So who saved DC, and Philadelphia, and Atlanta? | ||
6nois Member Username: 6nois Post Number: 529 Registered: 11-2006 |
http://www.michigannow.org/arc hives.php Listen to the two interviews with the NY Deputy Mayor. Very interesting and hits on most of the points here and talks about how New York did it, and how things could be done here. As for property there are alot of white suburbanites holding properties with the highest potential for growth at prices that are not viable. I was talking to one of my Architecture professors about commercial properties on Livernois near the University, and he was doing research for a project and the cheapest properties are starting at $300,000 and that needs alot of work probably another 100-300 thousand. So over inflated prices with people waiting to make tons of money is a problem for redevelopment, specifically in areas where development is viable. | ||
Dougw Member Username: Dougw Post Number: 1940 Registered: 11-2003 |
quote: You are correct, transportation is the biggest problem. However, I would still put crime as a close second, a very significant problem. Schools are pretty much irrelevant to Detroit's recovery, though, for several reasons. | ||
Michigan Member Username: Michigan Post Number: 1280 Registered: 04-2007 |
Who saved Philly? Obviously no one since the police are begging residents to get off there butts and do something to try to stop the city's descent into utter criminal chaos. 10,000 vigilantes, that ought to do it! I would love to see the national response if the police asked white men to go out and act as vigilantes for them. Atlanta? Ted Turner DC? Marion Barry, oh wait sorry. Maybe the entire frigging federal government is what saved it? Especially since the purse strings are controlled by the feds. Even with all that, drive around DC, it is still a burned out husk of itself in many areas. (Message edited by michigan on October 08, 2007) | ||
Danindc Member Username: Danindc Post Number: 3430 Registered: 10-2003 |
quote: Yeah--just like the federal government saved DC from declining through the Sixties, Seventies, Eighties, and Nineties. You're obviously and painfully unaware of how little the federal government cares about the District. Keep making excuses for Detroit, though. See how much that accomplishes. | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 1794 Registered: 04-2006 |
You are correct, transportation is the biggest problem. However, I would still put crime as a close second, a very significant problem. I am not saying that crime is an insignificant problem in Detroit. My position is that it's not the most significant problem, and it certainly isn't primarily responsible for Detroit's heavy population loss. | ||
Perfectgentleman Member Username: Perfectgentleman Post Number: 3459 Registered: 03-2006 |
If transportation is the biggest problem in Detroit than Detroit is doomed because there is no source for the billions of dollars needed to build a system. The other problem is transportation to what? Do we need a rail system to provide transportation to all of the empty buildings in the city? Never mind the fact the entire area was developed around personal transportation for the most part. Detroit prospered in the past without mass transit. The streetcar system died for a reason. The failure of the People Mover also left a bad taste in people's mouths. If that is the idea of a transit system, forget it. | ||
Oldoak Member Username: Oldoak Post Number: 34 Registered: 09-2007 |
6nois -- true about over inflated prices -- in at least one case I have knowledge about; Crumbling old Victorian building, owned by a man who has several crumbling buildings, couple BEGGED him to sell it -- he won't budge off his porch with his booze buddies to accept an offer less than one million. When people see dollar signs they sure can go batty. Meanwhile the property gapes open and abandoned. Stupid. | ||
6nois Member Username: 6nois Post Number: 530 Registered: 11-2006 |
I would disagree, a large part of Detroit's populations loss was sprawl, and public transit could have held that down, as well as prevent the sprawl that did happen from moving so far out. In the NYC area something like 90% of all development is within 1 mile of a subway stop. One can reasonably assume that it would be easier to repopulate and jump start Detroit if there was public transportation because it makes getting around cheaper and easier for all citizens. So I think development of public transportation along with working out the tax to service ratio in the city would be huge steps to bringing Detroit back. | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 1796 Registered: 04-2006 |
Never mind the fact the entire area was developed around personal transportation for the most part. Please stop lying. If this was the case then why are buildings being razed for parking downtown when it's a lot less dense than it was during it's heyday? | ||
Danindc Member Username: Danindc Post Number: 3431 Registered: 10-2003 |
quote: Well, other than the federal government, which is spending billions on New York's Second Avenue Line alone. But, you can't get what you don't ask for. quote: How about jobs??? quote: Patently false. quote: When was this? quote: Which is? | ||
Perfectgentleman Member Username: Perfectgentleman Post Number: 3460 Registered: 03-2006 |
Well that is a chicken and egg argument. Did the transit system fail due to lack of riders because people were leaving the city. I must say the only time I hear about people citing mass transit as the panacea to solve all of our problems is on this forum. In the real world, it is on the list somewhere but not that high up. I don't find it odd that a region whose main industry was building cars found itself relying on personal transportation more. | ||
Perfectgentleman Member Username: Perfectgentleman Post Number: 3461 Registered: 03-2006 |
Danindc - What jobs? The region is designed around the automobile, I am not talking about just Detroit here. Detroit was doing well in the 1950's, the streetcar died around then. If anything the decline in the city killed the transportation system not the other way around. You need RIDERS to support a system. | ||
Danindc Member Username: Danindc Post Number: 3432 Registered: 10-2003 |
So the DSR had no ridership in 1956, just as the 140,000 people a day who ride DDOT in 2007 are inconsequential? | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 1797 Registered: 04-2006 |
You need RIDERS to support a system. You probably also need management of the system that doesn't have competing interests with it's prosperity... | ||
Hutt Member Username: Hutt Post Number: 26 Registered: 10-2005 |
Don't forget the poor city services. I have a water main down the street that has been gushing for the past 5 days. If this were anyplace else around here chances are it would be fixed by now. Just more waste--and a waste of time to call about it. Trust me, you will only get pissed off listening to them tell you "its on the list." Detroit SUCKS. | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 1799 Registered: 04-2006 |
Don't forget the poor city services. I have a water main down the street that has been gushing for the past 5 days. If this were anyplace else around here chances are it would be fixed by now. Just more waste--and a waste of time to call about it. Trust me, you will only get pissed off listening to them tell you "its on the list." Detroit SUCKS. Doesn't that fall under Detroit Water and Sewage? The people currently investing money into extending a pipeline past Flint? | ||
Perfectgentleman Member Username: Perfectgentleman Post Number: 3462 Registered: 03-2006 |
quote: Apparently not enough riders to warrant building more mass transit. Does DDOT make money or is it subsidized? | ||
Danindc Member Username: Danindc Post Number: 3433 Registered: 10-2003 |
So even today, it's okay to tell 140,000 (mostly poor) people to go fuck themselves? Does I-75 make money, or is it subsidized? Food for thought: quote: http://www.heritagetrolley.org/articleTennyson.htm (Message edited by DaninDC on October 08, 2007) | ||
Livernoisyard Member Username: Livernoisyard Post Number: 4224 Registered: 10-2004 |
Back during KK's second election campaign, KK stated that DDOT only had a 70% attendance rate of its drivers and mechanics. This utterance raised some eyebrows, but DDOT was probably even then oversupplying Detroit with bus service, albeit replete with waste because of the 30% daily truancy of DDOT's workforce. The bus stops don't have many, if any, passengers except for those that are morning and afternoon work-related. Except for certain routes and times of day, the typical bus is rarely crowded. | ||
Perfectgentleman Member Username: Perfectgentleman Post Number: 3464 Registered: 03-2006 |
quote: No, but it means that there is no money to expand the system. I-75? That is paid for by people from all over the state and even the country. | ||
Detroit_stylin Member Username: Detroit_stylin Post Number: 5118 Registered: 10-2003 |
Even those that have no cars nor use them eh PG? Sounds fair to me... | ||
Professorscott Member Username: Professorscott Post Number: 852 Registered: 12-2006 |
PG is apparently not aware that every public transportation system in North America is subsidized, and not paid for 100% by its own users. This is also true, of course, of the roads; I have to pay taxes to support the maintenance of I-96 even though I absolutely never drive on I-96. Toll roads are the only kind of transportation infrastructure on this continent that pay for themselves. Taxes support everything else. LY, you are not seeing the buses I ride. About half the time I'm on a bus, DDOT or SMART, it is full to standing. There are some lightly-used routes, but those create their own problem. If a bus only comes once an hour, that discourages people from riding it. | ||
Perfectgentleman Member Username: Perfectgentleman Post Number: 3467 Registered: 03-2006 |
quote: Actually I am aware of that. The question becomes to what degree? | ||
Perfectgentleman Member Username: Perfectgentleman Post Number: 3468 Registered: 03-2006 |
quote: Do you really want to have a discussion about taxpayer subsidies for services that most of us don't use? | ||
Detroitsuperfly Member Username: Detroitsuperfly Post Number: 105 Registered: 07-2005 |
Perfect gentleman "Totally unrealistic. I would not sacrifice my family or their quality of life to save a city." But you'll demand other families do that for Baghdad? Please go immediately to Ebay and buy yourself a spine. (Message edited by detroitsuperfly on October 08, 2007) | ||
Perfectgentleman Member Username: Perfectgentleman Post Number: 3469 Registered: 03-2006 |
quote: I am not demanding anyone go to Iraq. I support the volunteer military. If and when they decide Iraq is a lost cause I won't argue with them. As it is, that is not what they are saying, in fact progress is being made. Please buy yourself a brain. | ||
Detroit_stylin Member Username: Detroit_stylin Post Number: 5120 Registered: 10-2003 |
quote: Please by all means and don't get argumentative or rationalize when I post other 'entitlements' that most of us will never see yet we pay for... | ||
Detroitsuperfly Member Username: Detroitsuperfly Post Number: 106 Registered: 07-2005 |
" If and when they decide Iraq is a lost cause" Most of the world has Volunteer army? They go in as volunteers, but anti-troop republicans keep them in against their will and ALL military deployment standards by increasing combat time from 12 to 15 to 18 mos, then shorten re-deployment time beyond military standards. Volunteer? You're amazingly amusing! You haven't posted one true fact in the dozens of posts I've seen of yours. You should be embarrassed, but somehow you are arrogant. Simply amazing! |
