Discuss Detroit » Archives - July 2007 » Palmer Woods Home Purchase « Previous Next »
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Artistic
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Username: Artistic

Post Number: 62
Registered: 09-2006
Posted on Thursday, November 15, 2007 - 6:17 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I am strongly considering a home purchase in Palmer Woods. I am very familiar with the neighborhood as a visitor to open homes and the holiday home tour. I was wondering if anyone on this site lives there or knows residents in the neighborhood. I was hoping to find out things such as actual utility bills on a 4000 sq. ft home there. Taxes...insurance....home owners association dues...things like that.I have wanted to live there as long as I can remember but work and other events took me out of state. So if any one has any information they would like to share I would really appreciate. Thanks
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Rfban
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Username: Rfban

Post Number: 197
Registered: 02-2004
Posted on Thursday, November 15, 2007 - 6:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Depending on a lot of variables, including rising energy costs, you are looking somewhere in the neighborhood of $200-$350 per month for energy on the budget plan. Association fee is most likely going to be about 4-500 hundred per year. Are you looking at something particular? Foreclosure?
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Artistic
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Username: Artistic

Post Number: 63
Registered: 09-2006
Posted on Thursday, November 15, 2007 - 6:46 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

From an investment perspective I am reviewing the foreclosures, I do want some specifics as far as architecture.
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Rfban
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Username: Rfban

Post Number: 198
Registered: 02-2004
Posted on Thursday, November 15, 2007 - 6:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

That's good-it's a great time to buy! I have been looking at a few in the area as well. Taxes are really my worry.
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Artistic
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Username: Artistic

Post Number: 64
Registered: 09-2006
Posted on Thursday, November 15, 2007 - 7:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yes the taxes and insurance are going to play in the picture. I plan on touring some of them when I return to Detroit next month
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Renfirst
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Username: Renfirst

Post Number: 111
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Thursday, November 15, 2007 - 7:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Artistic,

I've been itching to get a client to buy a fixer-upper in Palmer Woods... If you're interested, let me know and I can e-mail you a list of foreclosures/distressed properties that are ripe for renovation (I'm not a realtor). The company I work for does renovation loans, so you could imagine how amazing the before and afters could be with the type of homes in Palmer Woods.

I've been living vicariously through our clients... my imagination runs wild with that neighborhood, amazing architecture. The taxes are an issue though for many...
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Artistic
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Username: Artistic

Post Number: 65
Registered: 09-2006
Posted on Thursday, November 15, 2007 - 7:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Renfirst,

I am most interested. Is this a specific home? I'm interested in the line of work you do....renovation loans???? Is this hooked up with the first mortgage? My line of work is in the architectual design world...ironically my company name is Brush Park Studio....I seem to hooked on Detroit. Definitely feel free to email me at artisticjr@earthlink.net. I really appreciate it.
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Renfirst
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Username: Renfirst

Post Number: 113
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Thursday, November 15, 2007 - 7:45 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Will do.

http://www.renovatefirst.com
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Granmontrules
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Username: Granmontrules

Post Number: 257
Registered: 01-2007
Posted on Thursday, November 15, 2007 - 8:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Remember it is in the NEZ area. Should get about a 30% tax break.
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Artistic
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Username: Artistic

Post Number: 66
Registered: 09-2006
Posted on Thursday, November 15, 2007 - 8:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The NEZ status is a big draw, I also need to get information on insurance
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Rfban
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Username: Rfban

Post Number: 199
Registered: 02-2004
Posted on Thursday, November 15, 2007 - 8:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Renfirst, it’s my understanding, from the website that your company is primarily focused on single family proprieties, is this true? I have tried to get rehab loans before--needless to say it didn't work out. There were many hurdles and eventually it ended as a no-go. I have heard others having a very difficult time getting rehab loans--what makes your company different? Is it different? I briefly overlooked the site but didn't see any specific information such as, 1) can you lend for residential multi-family and commercial proprieties? And 2) how are the interest rates, generally, compared with other banks of the same level?
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Patrick
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Username: Patrick

Post Number: 5146
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Thursday, November 15, 2007 - 9:34 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

What I want to know if that crescent-shaped Tudor across from the Alfred Fisher mansion is for sale. The house would mook sweet if the owners actually maintained it. It looks abandoned. I heard on here that the owner does it for tax purposes?? Beats me.
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Renfirst
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Username: Renfirst

Post Number: 115
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Thursday, November 15, 2007 - 11:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Rfban,

While our focus is on single family properties, we do have loan programs for residential duplexes, but unfortunately not commercial. In regards to your past experience, I can say that our program is unique in that it was created with the desire to alleviate the issues one normally faces in attempting to obtain renovation financing.

Typically it's been put on the borrower to assemble all that is needed for a renovation loan, such as inspection reports, contractor estimates, etc. with minimal input from the lender. With our program, you've got a team of experts to assist during each stage to ensure you have the support you need. We have a network of contractors and inspectors to estimate repair costs, we have a team of real estate professionals to assist in determining market values, before and after renovations, and we have an in house renovation specialist that works on your loan from start to finish to ensure things run smoothly, and on time. Our smaller size in comparison to the larger renovation lenders (Countrywide, Indymac, Wells Fargo) gives us an edge. Renovation lending is all we do.

And to answer your question about interest rates, yes, our rates are comparable to other lenders, and in some cases, are lower, of course it all depends on what you qualify for, and whether you're an investor or owner-occupied borrower... Renovation financing is more difficult than regular financing, but offers more to the homeowner...
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Jrvass
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Username: Jrvass

Post Number: 322
Registered: 01-2007
Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 1:29 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

My great grandparents built the house on 179?? Lowell Dr. I'd have to dig in my files to find the address.

My mom tells stories of ringing the cardinal's doorbell and having the nuns chase her away!
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Quinn
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Username: Quinn

Post Number: 1539
Registered: 01-2005
Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 12:19 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

To be honest, I'm happier in IVA than I ever would be in Palmer Woods.

I've got a few friends there, and I love them, but couldn't live there with them. The attitude is SO snobby...seriously. They voted on a measure to close off the subdivision entirely and have a gated entrance a few weeks ago. It was a straw poll, so was meant only to gauge interest, but it won by a vast majority. How are you ever going to influence the rest of the city, let alone those neighborhoods nearest you, if you are so closed off? Anyway...

Another annoying this is those damn rocks...I hate those.

Homes are beautiful for the most part. But eh.

I'm a big proponent of IVA for several reasons.

1. Far more liberal, but more organized than, say Woodbridge.
2. Closest to downtown of all the "grand home" historic districts (sorry Cork Town...not 'dissing)
3. Proximity to river and park (future) system.
4. Pricing here has really plumeted...you can get a bigger bang for the buck over here.
5. IVA is more working class, and because of that a closer and more "hip" community. I find PW to be a little stale. Too many attorneys and doctors. Not enough graphic designers and artists.

Anyway...my two cents. If you've already investigated IVA, then shut me up. If not...take a look before taking the plunge in Palmer Woods.
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Iheartthed
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Username: Iheartthed

Post Number: 2211
Registered: 04-2006
Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 12:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

How exactly would Palmer Woods pull off a gated entrance with so many entrance/exits? And what would they do with the boundary between them and Sherwood Forest?
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Swingline
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Username: Swingline

Post Number: 945
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 12:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Insurance for Palmer Woods home will be $3,500 minimum. Double that for the 8,000 sq. ft. places. Redlining at its most profitable level.
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Firstandten
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Username: Firstandten

Post Number: 123
Registered: 05-2006
Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 12:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

(lheartthed)" How exactly would Palmer Woods pull off a gated entrance with so many entrance/exits? And what would they do with the boundary between them and Sherwood Forest?"

I believe they are mostly looking at the entrance/exits to Woodward more so than 7-mile. The PW folks just like the SF,GC,UD areas are very concerned with the increase in crime going on and they are probably trying to make the area more manageable for their security patrol. Also I don't believe you can directly drive from Sherwood Forest to Palmer Woods without going on 7-mile.
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Steelworker
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Username: Steelworker

Post Number: 1027
Registered: 02-2004
Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 12:59 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Not looking to hijack the thread but I am looking to buy aswell. But in a significantly lower price range im looking at no more than 70,000. On a similar line, how much lower can you get a bank to go on their price? I have been looking and most of the homes available right now seem to be bank owned.
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6nois
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Username: 6nois

Post Number: 576
Registered: 11-2006
Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 1:00 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The perception of these neighborhoods on the fence issue really isn't helped any by the university across the street with the huge fence.
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Firstandten
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Username: Firstandten

Post Number: 125
Registered: 05-2006
Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 1:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

(lheartthed)" How exactly would Palmer Woods pull off a gated entrance with so many entrance/exits? And what would they do with the boundary between them and Sherwood Forest?"

I believe they are mostly looking at the entrance/exits to Woodward more so than 7-mile. The PW folks just like the SF,GC,UD areas are very concerned with the increase in crime going on and they are probably trying to make the area more manageable for their security patrol. Also I don't believe you can directly drive from Sherwood Forest to Palmer Woods without going on 7-mile.
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Swingline
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Username: Swingline

Post Number: 946
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 1:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Steelworker, that number might interest the banks that own some of the Indian Village homes that were victimized by mortgage fraud, and then by house strippers. In other words, the properties would be massive fixer-upper projects. That number will not get you anything in move-in condition in any of the upscale neighborhoods, even if the property is REO.
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Artistic
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Username: Artistic

Post Number: 67
Registered: 09-2006
Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 1:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Quinn:

Thanks for the info. I had no idea about the possibility of a gated entrance, I sure understand people want to feel safe however I don't believe gated communitys are the answer.

Swingline: Thanks for the insurance insight. It adds to list of reasons not move forward with the purchase.

Any stats on the crime issue in Palmer Woods?
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Quinn
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Username: Quinn

Post Number: 1540
Registered: 01-2005
Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 1:27 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

From what our friends told us, there were three proposals when they voted.

1. To completely close all entrances to Palmer Woods and leave on open with a Gate with either a full-time attendant and keypad...or just keypad.

2. Close entrances off Woodward only.

3. Do nothing.

#1 won the majority of votes in the straw poll.

Their main issue is with the drive throughs from 7-mile to woodward, the speed of people taking this route and the perception that it allows for faster get-aways for robbers.

I'm just opposed to gated communities in general. Some traffic management can be accptable in my view though...

Swingline, yep that price around here would be a massive fixer upper...we're talking no heat or plumbing. So you'd have to figure 100K just to make it liveable.

There are great deals on finished homes here though... like:

$199,900
4 Bed, 2.5 Bath
4,000 Sq. Ft.
0.21 Acres 1049 Seminole
Detroit, MI 48214
Property Type: Single Family Home
Single Family Property, County: Wayne, Approximately 0.21 acre(s), Year Built: 1909, Three story, Basement, Dining room ... View details.

This is on realtor.com http://homes.realtor.com/searc h/listingdetail.aspx?zp=48214& typ=1&sid=f442ce712b1a4cdfb074 f4f0b7400876&sdir=0&sby=2&pg=6 &lid=1087427423&lsn=54&srcnt=1 98#Detail

I know that house hasn't been ransacked by anyone and is move-in ready.

Anyway...alot of good stuff over here. Check us out. Also more info at http://www.historicindianvilla ge.org
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Crawford
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Username: Crawford

Post Number: 159
Registered: 10-2006
Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 1:53 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Does Indian Village have private security?

I have heard anecdotal info on many break-ins and intruders, especially in comparison to other prime Detroit hoods. Is this true?
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Quinn
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Username: Quinn

Post Number: 1542
Registered: 01-2005
Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 2:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

No more than anywhere else in the city. We do have private security that is also tied to home security systems...it's called Dusing Security. They've stopped many crimes from happening, and have cought many people in the act.

No doubt about it...we're in Detroit. It's not lily-white and super safe. Nowhere really is. I've lived here for 16 years and I've never had a break in once. On the other hand, I lived in Williamston for 4 years when I was a child, and we had a home invasion there.

Go figure.

Once thing that may be a plus for someone looking at Palmer Woods...there's a police precinct across the street from them.
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Patrick
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Username: Patrick

Post Number: 5147
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 2:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I dunno about IV being "super" safe. I have heard some nightmare stories from IV from the past couple years. But hey, crime happens everywhere...just more in some areas.
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Swingline
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Username: Swingline

Post Number: 948
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 2:52 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Artistic, while the insurance companies do obscenely gouge Detroiters for homeowners insurance, you need to be aware that insuring the kind of home found in Palmer Woods is much different than insuring the newly built production home with a two story great room in Novi. The underwriting involved to issue a replacement cost policy for an 80 year old custom home with a slate roof, plaster throughout, boiler/radiator heat, and 3-4 real fireplaces will result in a much higher premium cost per $1000 of market value than would be true for new construction homes of similar size. The $750K Novi home will cost $750K to rebuild. The $500K architect designed historic Detroit home will cost $2 million to rebuild. To a certain extent when underwriting the risk, it doesn't matter that much where property is located. Big, old houses are always going be expensive to insure. The large 1920's-built Grosse Pointe homes provide an illustration as well. While people fortunate enough to live in those homes don't pay nearly as much as Detroiters for insurance, they pay far more than the folks moving into similarly priced and sized houses in those fancy new Northville subdivisions. Crime and fire loss is nearly non-existent in both places.
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Artistic
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Username: Artistic

Post Number: 68
Registered: 09-2006
Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 3:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Swingline

Yes I do agree with you on the old home versus new home insurance story. It becomes relivant on the overall price point when you begin to compare Novi or any other outer burb to a Detroit historic home....there the cost for 4000 sq ft can be up to say...750,000 or so and insurance will cost you 1200 - 1500. In Detroit you can find 5000 sq ft......today...for as low as 250,000 with insurance at least twice that of the suburbs.
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Patrick
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Username: Patrick

Post Number: 5149
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 3:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

There are newer homes in Palmer Woods built in the 560's and 60's. I guess they were filled in when wealthy families sold off chunks of property. The whole south side of the Fisher lot was sold off and at least 3 or 4 homes were built where their backyard golf course once was.
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Artistic
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Username: Artistic

Post Number: 69
Registered: 09-2006
Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 3:23 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

There are also a couple of late 80's early 90's homes in Palmer Woods as well. I'm not a fan of the new stuff at all.
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Renfirst
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Username: Renfirst

Post Number: 118
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Friday, November 16, 2007 - 7:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Steelworker, each lender has its own guidelines for accepting offers. It really comes down to who you work with and how you make your offer. You've got to work with someone that knows what each lender is looking for and has the relationship with the loss mitigation dept's. It's all about who you know these days...

If you're going to need financing, you've got to get a full pre-approval. You could call XYZ mortgage and have them type something up, but that means nothing. You need to gather all your documentation, submit it to your broker, and obtain a fully underwritten pre-approval. That means more to these lenders than anything. In many cases they'll take a lower offer knowing you have an underwritten pre-approval.

If you're looking to make a short-sale offer, I would really urge you to work with someone, you only have one shot at an offer on a foreclosure, and there's a great opportunity in the next 6 weeks to make an offer, the loss mitigation dept's for the lenders are all looking to clear up as much Detroit inventory as they can, so working with someone that can put it all together is totally worth it (and costs you nothing, the seller pays for that service)

Good luck, November and December are really great chances to get huge discounts on foreclosures. It's the 4th quarter, and these are all publicly traded companies... they want to clear up their inventory's as much as they can, and there is no desire to hold on to Detroit properties.
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Dougw
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Username: Dougw

Post Number: 1995
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Saturday, November 17, 2007 - 11:29 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

quote:

the loss mitigation dept's for the lenders are all looking to clear up as much Detroit inventory as they can


Heh, that's got to be a fun job these days. The lenders holding onto these foreclosures are pretty much fucked, they're not even going to get 50% of the mortgage amount back on average in Indian Village, and probably in many other neighborhoods as well. So, don't be afraid to bargain them down.
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Renfirst
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Username: Renfirst

Post Number: 122
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Sunday, November 18, 2007 - 12:33 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It works to the homebuyers favor, especially when it comes to neighborhoods like Palmer Woods, Indian Village, etc... They see Detroit and assume it's a bad neighborhood... It's somewhat insulting in my opinion, but the homebuyer really reaps the benefit, they get a home for a huge discount.

And frankly, it's reached the point where the suburbs are thrown in as well... they see Troy or Novi, Michigan and think Detroit.

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