  Brian_fitzcarraldo Member Username: Brian_fitzcarraldo Post Number: 17 Registered: 10-2007 |
I'm moving into the city soon and will need to pick a Catholic parish in the city. I'd like a church with impressive architecture, traditional music (I can't stand guitar mass) and, ideally, a liberal pastor. Any suggestions? | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 4263 Registered: 02-2005 |
Cool. Well you should do a tour for your first few months, since there are so many great old parishes. You will get a lot of enjoyment out of this, and will make an informed decision. The first place that popped into my mind was Sts. Peter and Paul on Jefferson and St. Antoine. Very historic, liberal pastor, and a fairly traditional music ministry (although I can't say the choir is particularly GOOD)--they mix new and old music. If you want to be blown away and really feel some spiritual weight in the air, go to St. Joseph, St. Mary-Greektown, Assumption Grotto, or St. Josaphat. Sweetest Heart of Mary is no slouch either. The Blessed Sacrament Cathedral would also be a nice choice. Those places all have great music ministries...I'd say St. Joseph and St. Mary's are the best in the city. St. Joseph and Assumption both perform orchestral masses on feast days. Both have choirs at their Sunday Latin Masses (as does St. Mary), and talented organists at the other Masses. The Cathedral and St. Peter/Paul are among the few venues in the city with a choir for their vernacular masses. I've not attended mass at St. Anne by the bridge lately but that is clearly a most beautiful building. "Liberal pastor" is kind of a strange term. What does that mean? That he doesn't follow the order of the Mass closely and ad libs prayers Jesuit style (this is common liturgical abuse)? That he doesn't harp on pro-life issues (even though we should assume all priests are pro-life)? That he doesn't support the use of Latin and allot a place for the Latin Mass in the parish? That he votes democrat? I don't want to start that discussion...I'll just assume that you'll know the type of priest you like when you hear him. I guarantee you won't find a priest you like at Assumption, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't go there...good to be challenged, right? Now, some websites: www.saint-joseph-detroit.org www.sweetestheartofmary.org http://www.oldstmarysdetroit.c om/ http://www.sspeterandpauljesui t.org/ http://www.assumptiongrotto.co m/ http://www.gbjann.com/stjosaph at/ http://www.detroitlatinmass.or g/jospht/home.htm http://www.aodonline.org/nr/ao d/customapplications/parish/pa rish.asp?InstitutionID=1&FRAME LESS=true&NRNODEGUID=%7b2FF929 41-2657-4A86-A99A-0010DE364035 %7d | ||
Bulletmagnet Member Username: Bulletmagnet Post Number: 954 Registered: 01-2007 |
The Presumptuous Church of the Presumptuous Assumption of the Blinding Light, on the corner of Fifth & Vermouth. Welcome to Detroit  | ||
E_hemingway Member Username: E_hemingway Post Number: 1476 Registered: 11-2004 |
Welcome to Detroit. I'd like to throw in a recommendation for Sts. Peter & Paul Jesuit, www.sspeterandpauljesuit.org. It's one of the arch diocese's first cathedrals, stunning historic architecture, located in downtown attached to UofD Mercy's Law School. We're a very open minded and diverse parish with a traditional choir. Plus, we also have the last mass in town at 7:35 p.m. on Sundays. I guess you could call our parish more on the liberal side. The church has a warming center, which specializes in helping homeless people get on their feet and finding a job. However, it's not a shelter. We are also in the midst of trying to make the church more environmentally friendly. The first step is changing all of the lights to more energy efficient ones, something I have posted on before here: https://www.atdetroit.net/forum/mes sages/5/122182.html?1197659634 Anyways, welcome to the city and DetroitYes! We hope you'll enjoy your time here. | ||
Irish_mafia Member Username: Irish_mafia Post Number: 1168 Registered: 10-2003 |
I'll throw in the pitch for St. Ambrose. Beautiful church. More liberal pastor (depending on what you mean by that I guess)and a strange mix of good and bad music. When they play the classics, it can be very good... when they fall off the dark side into the St. Louis Jesuits...well... A great parish family though..good ccd program (depending on the teacher) for the kids and probably one of the strongest St. Vincent de Paul conferences in the city. Welcome! | ||
Kjwick Member Username: Kjwick Post Number: 75 Registered: 11-2003 |
also check out st. aloysius on washington blvd. across the street from the book building. i think it meets your criteria. | ||
E_hemingway Member Username: E_hemingway Post Number: 1477 Registered: 11-2004 |
St. Al's is a great place. The people there were very friendly. However, the last time I was there there was a Franciscan brother playing guitar in the choir. A cool sight no doubt, and it might not even be the norm there anymore, but I think Brian asked for non-guitar mass. None-the-less, a great place to at least check out. | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 4264 Registered: 02-2005 |
Well said, Mafia. That's how I would characterize that church. | ||
Mwilbert Member Username: Mwilbert Post Number: 44 Registered: 11-2007 |
Our Lady of the Rosary has a great pastor. I don't know what the state of their music is. It is a pretty nice church, but it is in a poor area and is very much about supporting its neighbors. I grew up in Gesu, and I really like the way the the church looks, but it isn't exactly traditional. However, the windows and the ceiling are very attractive. I haven't been there for a while so I don't know what the services are like now. St. Aloysius is a very cool church. Not sure impressive is exactly the word I would use, but a must-see for any church-architecture enthusiast. The Cathedral is impressive in a traditional way, but I doubt it would be very liberal these days--I used to go there when Dearden was the archbishop, but times have changed. | ||
Onthe405 Member Username: Onthe405 Post Number: 29 Registered: 11-2007 |
It depends on what you mean by "liberal". However, if this is what you are looking for: All of God's children are welcomed equally and without qualification. Ordination of women and marriage for priests. Full inclusion of gays/lesbians Full financial accountability/disclosure to the parishioners, who control the budget. Traditional catholic liturgy, reverent music. Historic architecture, urban, diverse congregation, community outreach. Here are two Episcopal parishes downtown: Christ Church Detroit http://christcd.org/ Cathedral of St Paul http://www.detroitcathedral.or g/ | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 4265 Registered: 02-2005 |
^^Nice places to visit...but I don't think Brian could fulfill his obligations there. | ||
Royaloakian Member Username: Royaloakian Post Number: 91 Registered: 05-2004 |
Sacred Heart Parish in Detroit is very alive on Russell. Fr Norman Thomas, wonderful choir. Involved with the community and involves the entire parish people. Check out their web site. | ||
65memories Member Username: 65memories Post Number: 499 Registered: 10-2003 |
I agree with Royaloakian. Sacred Heart Parish would seem to be an excellent choice for you. Fr. Norman Thomas is a wonderful pastor and his insistence on full parish involvement and participation is commendable. And as a plus, the Choir at the 10:00 Mass is great. When I was looking at different Catholic parishes 35 years ago, I found Sacred Heart. Even though it some miles from my home, I haven't wanted to go to any other parish since. Sacred Heart is located right behind the McDonalds when you get off I-75 at Mack. | ||
Lo_to_d Member Username: Lo_to_d Post Number: 34 Registered: 07-2007 |
We joined St. Patrick's behind the DSO after moving to the city. We really like it, but unfortunately Fr. Mark is leaving. It's sister parish with St. Al's. Very interesting mix of diverse people. | ||
Detroitstar Member Username: Detroitstar Post Number: 864 Registered: 01-2006 |
St Joseph's is right outside my front door, and is the place where I go the most. I have also spent plenty of time at (and with the people of) St Josaphat and St Mary's-greektown. All are great parishes with great people. | ||
Sirrealone Member Username: Sirrealone Post Number: 68 Registered: 01-2007 |
Transfiguration Catholic church is great. Father Andy is wonderful and the facilities are beautiful. Make sure to check out the grotto across the street from the main entrance of the church. It's off Mound south of McNichols. http://www.transfiguration-par ish.org/ | ||
Wash_man Member Username: Wash_man Post Number: 533 Registered: 05-2006 |
"Sacred Heart Parish in Detroit is very alive on Russell." Except that it is on Eliot St. | ||
Ednaturnblad Member Username: Ednaturnblad Post Number: 22 Registered: 09-2006 |
Please join us for Mass at St. Josaphat's - corner of Canfield and Chrysler Service Drive. English Mass is at Noon on Sundays (we have a Latin Tridentine Mass...pre-Vatican II ... at 9:30am, but I'm guessing you're not looking for that). We're a small friendly congregation in a beautiful historic church. We have recently restored our many chandeliers, high pulpit, Blessed Mother altar and St. Joseph altar. We have incredible dinners every month in our parish hall that are great fun. Check us out! | ||
Royaloakian Member Username: Royaloakian Post Number: 92 Registered: 05-2004 |
Thanks you Wash_man, I drive it so often I never think of the street names. Sacred Heart Church. 1000 Eliot · Detroit, MI 48207. | ||
Brian_fitzcarraldo Member Username: Brian_fitzcarraldo Post Number: 18 Registered: 10-2007 |
Thanks for all the suggestions, everyone. I'll have a long list of churches to tour. Looks like it'll be a while before I can settle on one, but I'm sure I'll learn a lot in the process. To clarify my original post about wanting a "liberal" pastor: I'm the kind of Catholic who feels sick when his priest rolls out a video instructing the congregation to vote to write anti-gay discrimination into the state constitution (as my parish did in '04). More broadly, I often have a hard time supporting the Church when I feel the archdiocese has turned its back on the city (I attended Notre Dame Harper Woods) and that the Vatican has its priorities backward on issues like condoms and AIDS, gay ministry and women's ordination. (On the other hand, I find the whole Jesuit approach to Mass annoying -- it strikes me as self-consciously and only superficially progressive, and it seems silly to throw ancient and beautiful traditions out the window if you're going to stick with some backward doctrine.) Basically, I'm a borderline hippie/renegade Catholic, and I need a priest and congregation that will prevent me from converting to Episcopalianism. The ideal would be someone effectively defiant of the conservative direction the Church has taken -- think Bishop Gumbleton -- but failing that, I'll at least need a pastor who clearly isn't excited about it. Any ideas? | ||
Mackcreative Member Username: Mackcreative Post Number: 152 Registered: 08-2006 |
Bishop Gumbleton still has mass occasionally at St. Leo's on Grand River near Warren. | ||
Royaloakian Member Username: Royaloakian Post Number: 93 Registered: 05-2004 |
One last plug, Bishop Gumbleton along with Fr Norm Thomas are a part of the Detroit Pastoral Alliance. http://www.detroitcatholicpast oralalliance.com/history_of_dc pa.html also http://www.sacredheartdetroit. com/ Three weeks ago Sacred Heart had Charlie Kernaghan speak in their parish hall as a part of Human Rights day. I know exactly what you mean as I attended mass with my son at another parish a few years back and he even picked up the vote for Bush speech that the priest tried to pass off as a homily. Good luck to you in your search. I hope you find a home. | ||
Onthe405 Member Username: Onthe405 Post Number: 30 Registered: 11-2007 |
Brian: These spiritual matters speak to the very essence of our souls and who we are. Each person experiences both God and his representation on earth (i.e. the Church) very differently. I admire your desire to thoughtfully gather information and ponder this decision carefully. My intent is in no way to hijack or subvert the thread. I can only share my own experiences, as they appear to be similar to yours. After much discernment, long in-depth discussions with clergy & close parishioners, and failed attempts to initiate change within the Roman Catholic church (even in my comparatively "liberal" CA parish) on many of the issues you outlined, I came to the realization that change simply couldn't come in my lifetime. Unfortunately, this is the only (earthly)lifetime given to us. For me, it was either suppress/compromise my quest for what I perceive as fairness, equality, & social justice within the church or find another denomination that more closely represented the mission of the church in my eyes. My spiritual journey brought to me the Episcopal church. The Eucharist, liturgy, and catechism are virtually identical. Only then did I fully realize that Roman is just one of the catholic churches, Anglican catholics are another. Both are rich in tradition and span centuries in history. We share more than we differ. But, again, the right parish matters. I have visited the two I listed earlier, and they had a vibe similar to my own. Like you, I feel traditional, reverent hymns are essential to worship. This is valued highly in most ECUSA parishes. I found a spiritual home, and have more enthusiastically & passionately given of myself than I ever dreamed possible. Whatever your decision, Godspeed & God Bless (Message edited by onthe405 on January 03, 2008) | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 4277 Registered: 02-2005 |
Well that puts an appealing face on heresy. Perhaps that "fairness and justice" will arrive with the Second Coming...which has nothing to due with our lifetimes and the fact that we'd like to see fairness and justice. | ||
Davidruffin Member Username: Davidruffin Post Number: 8 Registered: 12-2007 |
The Anglican Church is not Catholic. I was created by Henry VIII for the reason (among others) that the current pope would not grant him an annulment. Onthe405, you are right that there are more Catholic rites than the Roman one but the Anglican church is not a rite of the Catholic church. | ||
Livernoisyard Member Username: Livernoisyard Post Number: 4727 Registered: 10-2004 |
There's only a fine line of difference among the Anglican, Episcopalian, and various Catholic denominations. All of those mentioned possess mostly the same line of Apostolic Succession. Even the Chaldeans (whose brand of Catholicism is even older than the "Roman" variety) living in Michigan practiced Roman Catholicism rites in Metro Detroit until they imported their own bishop from Iraq about a decade ago. There are greater differences among Roman Catholics themselves than between the core theologies of the Anglican or Roman Catholic religions. (Message edited by LivernoisYard on January 04, 2008) | ||
65memories Member Username: 65memories Post Number: 501 Registered: 10-2003 |
Brian...if Bishop Gumbleton is your kind of Bishop then Fr. Norm Thomas at Sacred Heart is your kind of pastor. | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 4283 Registered: 02-2005 |
Your last point is oh so true, LY. Further, it's often difficult to imagine the Catholic Church as completely unified when one sees all the different formats and degrees of solemnity that the Mass takes on in different parishes. And, as you said, theology itself is always being debated, or, more appropriately put, disregarded and challenged by many people who remain Catholic. |
