Discuss Detroit Archives - January 2008 LIGHTS, CAMERA, ACTION: Michigan wants bigger share of $60B U.S. film industry Previous Next
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El_jimbo
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Username: El_jimbo

Post Number: 470
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 10:00 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

http://detnews.com/apps/pbcs.d ll/article?AID=/20080103/BIZ/8 01030390

I think this is a smart idea. Any economic activity is good economic activity.
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Mcp001
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Username: Mcp001

Post Number: 3144
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 11:59 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

So why subsidize only movies?
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El_jimbo
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Username: El_jimbo

Post Number: 474
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 12:19 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

meaning what? TV shows? How many non-reality TV shows are filmed on location outside of LA or New York?
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Gsgeorge
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Username: Gsgeorge

Post Number: 536
Registered: 08-2006
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 12:24 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

quote:

Nothing has been finalized, but as a target, she'd like to rebate at least 35 percent on film production costs here, which would be tops in the country. She also wants to see if the financial community could be enticed to offer low- or no-interest loans to help finance film projects.



Having worked at several film production companies in Los Angeles, I can say from experience that a rebate of this size in Michigan would be quite unprecedented and I am sure producers from all over the US would jump at the chance to film here. What some people don't understand is that offering incentives to film here would vastly improve the local economy. Film crews are massive in size, numbering up to 1000 persons at a single day's shoot, and all those people need to be FED and TRANSPORTED; EQUIPMENT needs to be RENTED; STREETS need to be closed (and it costs LOTS OF MONEY to do that); etc.

Basically if you offer enough incentive for a film crew to come here, it's like bringing in an extra couple thousand very rich tourists for a month to buy food from your restaurants, help local businesses, pay the police department and the city for permits and street closures, use local labor, rent our cars, basically live in our cities for as much as a month at a time or more.

Think about it.
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Gsgeorge
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Username: Gsgeorge

Post Number: 537
Registered: 08-2006
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 12:25 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

El_jimbo, they're talking about feature films. 90-150 minutes, big stars, big budget films ($5-$100 million). This is not your everyday makeover show or Real World.
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Smogboy
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Username: Smogboy

Post Number: 6806
Registered: 11-2004
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 12:27 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

When other states are offering 20-25% incentives to shoot there, we'd best get on the bandwagon and start offering incentives to shoot here as well! Why not? We've got the production talent here that could use the work.
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Gsgeorge
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Username: Gsgeorge

Post Number: 538
Registered: 08-2006
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 12:28 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Just to add to my first post, when I was in LA I kept pushing Michigan as a great place to film. Natural areas, urban areas, modern glass skyscrapers, poor derelict neighborhoods, suburbs, lakes, Great Lakes, rivers, small towns, rural areas. Basically the producers all said "sounds great, but what can they offer." And Michigan can't offer sh*t, so the producers pick somewhere like Vancouver or Connecticut, NY or LA.

If we can offer anywhere near 35 percent tax credit, these producers would change their minds pretty quickly.
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El_jimbo
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Username: El_jimbo

Post Number: 475
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 12:34 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

gsgeorge,

That was the point I was trying to make when I responded to MCP's "So why only subsidize movies comment".

Also, one thing you forgot to mention is that all these people need places to stay while they are here. I figure a 1000 person crew could occupy a few hundred hotel rooms in a hurry.
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Mcp001
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Username: Mcp001

Post Number: 3145
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 12:40 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Slippery slope, people.

Then why shouldn't we subsidize renewable fuels?

Technology?

Transportation?

Alternative power sources?

Shall I continue?
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El_jimbo
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Username: El_jimbo

Post Number: 476
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 12:47 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

you mean we already aren't?

the government subsidizes transportation by paying to maintain the roads we drive on and tax breaks are offered in all the other sectors you mention as well.
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Mcp001
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Username: Mcp001

Post Number: 3146
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 12:49 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

By the State of Michigan?
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Digitalvision
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Username: Digitalvision

Post Number: 484
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 12:51 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Uhh... we already do some of those things, MCP. Whether it's Next Energy, Automation Alley, etc... those programs already exist.

I don't like incentives on principle - but the reality is that you have to do it to get the jobs. Also, incentives are sexy. You feel like you "got something" in return, and feel "special." Business is an ego game as much as a facts game - ESPECIALLY Film & Tv.
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El_jimbo
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Username: El_jimbo

Post Number: 477
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 12:57 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Transportation- Where do you think roughly half of MDOT's revenue comes from? state money.

Technology- Wasn't it governor granholm offering state tax credits to get Google here in Michigan?

Doesn't Techtown receiver some sort of tax breaks in order to keep costs down for startups?

What about the 21st Century Jobs fund providing venture capital for technology startups?

Renewable Fuels- didn't the state offer tax breaks for the new ethanol plants?

Alternative energy- Among other things, the MEDC has alternative energy zones which provide a variety of benefits for the study and implementation of alternative energy
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Mcp001
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Username: Mcp001

Post Number: 3147
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 1:03 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

True, some of them do.

I'll toss in a few of my own then.

How about "The Invest in those remaining in Michigan" - incentive.

We can take the $259 million that we were stiffed by Lansing, and rebate it back to those taxpayers still living in Michigan.

We can use it on more useful items like filling up our gas tank, making a trip to the grocery store or paying the mortgage.

That also helps the local economy and helps strengthen local communities.
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El_jimbo
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Username: El_jimbo

Post Number: 478
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 1:12 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Or we could take that money and put it in a rainy day fund so we don't have to constantly be in fear of a government shutdown or have annual fluctuations in taxes or services.
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Jt1
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Username: Jt1

Post Number: 11133
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 1:13 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Or put a bunch of money aside so next time someone like Engler is in office he can spend it like a drunken sailor.
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Gsgeorge
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Username: Gsgeorge

Post Number: 539
Registered: 08-2006
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 1:14 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

quote:

That was the point I was trying to make when I responded to MCP's "So why only subsidize movies comment".


Sorry, sometimes Internet communication gets complicated.

There would definitely be TV shows and reality shows coming in and out, but their production budgets may be too small to get the 35% tax credit -- usually states with tax incentives will only give you the credit if you spend more than $250,000 of your film in the state, sometimes more, usually not less.

If anything it would put Michigan on the map as a "film friendly" state, and productions of all types would be coming in.
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Mcp001
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Username: Mcp001

Post Number: 3148
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 1:16 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Nahhhhhhh!

Then they'll never address the real structural deficit problem if they have any extra money burning a hole in their pocket.
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Jiminnm
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Username: Jiminnm

Post Number: 1562
Registered: 02-2005
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 1:25 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

New Mexico got into this on a serious basis 2-3 years ago and it is finally becoming productive for the state.
http://www.sic.state.nm.us/fil m.htm
http://www.nmfilm.com/
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Flyingj
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Username: Flyingj

Post Number: 66
Registered: 08-2006
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 2:04 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Jiminnm, New Mex got great results immediately. If they're going to do this now's a good time while everyone's tied up in the strike(i.e.; nothing in the pipeline 'til a decision is made) & the loonie is so strong. There's still the potential to f this up. Sam Raimi was going to film "Darkman" to Detroit-it was a done deal, but Coleman Young's office called them & said "you owe us 20k for the overtime salaries of Detroit Police officers for XYZ Murders(Crimewave)" of course Universal Studios knew nothing of that, had no interest in paying that & overnight Detroit lost millions yet got the unexpected bonus of a hard-to-work-with rap in Hollywood. Raimi did go & use the Bonaventure Hotel(same architect as the Ren Cen)as a consolation in Downtown L.A. Probably the other interesting thing is a British production designer I knew did a movie set in Detroit, but they couldn't afford to film here. The guy spent several weeks researching over in the mid 90's in Rivertown. He's lived all over the world, lived in a London squat with the Sex Pistols... he said staying in Rivertown & seeing this city & the state it was in left him "gobsmacked". He's used his research here on several projects since, which I found interesting.
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Dan
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Username: Dan

Post Number: 1480
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 5:49 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Who was that flyngi?

What projects did he use his research on?
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Lefty2
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Username: Lefty2

Post Number: 839
Registered: 07-2007
Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 10:39 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

this is one subsidization that would actually create many added monetary benefits to the economy by a multiple of three.
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Mcp001
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Username: Mcp001

Post Number: 3152
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Friday, January 04, 2008 - 8:40 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'm disgusted by those shallow and callous individuals I read so far.

Absolutely no one supports the "The Invest in those remaining in Michigan" - incentive.

:-(
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Fnemecek
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Username: Fnemecek

Post Number: 2682
Registered: 12-2004
Posted on Friday, January 04, 2008 - 7:35 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Going back to one of the big concerns mentioned in this thread, I'd love to live in a world where there was no need to have tax incentives for any particular industry. However, we've gotten to the point where all of the other states are offering tax incentives that are much more lucrative than what Michigan has.

Michigan then has a choice:

a) Actively competing by offering incentives, such as the ones that the Governor proposes;
b) Convincing the other 49 states to get rid of their tax incentives; or
c) Sit back and watch all of that money pass us by.

Since every tax incentive ultimately means more money coming into the state treasury than their would be without an incentive, I happen to think that option A is our best bet.
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Lefty2
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Username: Lefty2

Post Number: 847
Registered: 07-2007
Posted on Friday, January 04, 2008 - 9:43 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

California subsidizes "The Indy" Canada subsidizes the indy, many other states and countries as well.
When the benefit to the state and citizens FAR outweighs the expenses, it is what the MBA kids call a "no brainer"
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Lefty2
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Username: Lefty2

Post Number: 848
Registered: 07-2007
Posted on Friday, January 04, 2008 - 9:59 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Gsgeorge correct.
This is at least a double payback on money not spent by government. Michigan just reaps rewards of money spent by outsiders who would otherwise not visit here. They just wont tax it so high. Local businesses win, and the money will recirculate.

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