 
Jhartmich
Member
Username: Jhartmich
Post Number: 84
Registered: 04-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 18, 2008 - 8:05 pm: |    |
I had an interesting conversation tonight with some well-educated friends. They were discussing issues in the suburbs that neighbor Detroit. Some friends were from Ferndale/Berkley areas and were describing how many people are moving out. One person told of an apartment building in Ferndale down from the Pizza Hut that the cops are there all the time – which happens to be predominately black. They also were talking how ghetto Rosie O’Grady’s has become.
My question: Are blacks moving in / whites moving out THAT bad in the neighboring suburbs? Are blacks really leaving the city of Detroit in droves like one person suggested? One friend suggested that 9-mile will be the new 8 mile within the next TWO years!•••
Just curious as to peoples thoughts. Living in Detroit as I do, I didn’t realize that there is “white flight” going on in the suburbs as we speak. This was news to me since I seldom go there. I haven’t read much about it in the news. |
Detroitrise
Member
Username: Detroitrise
Post Number: 1797
Registered: 09-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 18, 2008 - 8:18 pm: | |
This thread not only is worn out (not to mention the exact same title), but wayyyy behind it's time.
M-59 is the new 8 Mile rd. at this point (realistically).
(Message edited by detroitrise on March 18, 2008) |
Ray1936
Member
Username: Ray1936
Post Number: 2876
Registered: 01-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 18, 2008 - 8:19 pm: | |
Wait a couple of years. It'll be M-72. |
Tk65
Member
Username: Tk65
Post Number: 46
Registered: 12-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 18, 2008 - 8:23 pm: | |
Yes |
Viziondetroit
Member
Username: Viziondetroit
Post Number: 1497
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 18, 2008 - 8:43 pm: | |
99 Mile Road |
Zrx_doug
Member
Username: Zrx_doug
Post Number: 15
Registered: 03-2008
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 18, 2008 - 9:13 pm: | |
I never liked the term "white flight." It wasn't representative of the truth then, and it isn't now..should be called "cash flight," since anyone with sufficient funds was getting on their scooter and pedalling away as fast as they could then, same as they are now..
My parents moved out of Detroit to the 'burbs (with a five year old me) in '68..but so did three of our black neighbors who could afford to make the move. So did ANYONE with enough cash to latch onto a home somewhere away from the craziness..left the city to the poor & took their dollars with 'em when they went.
Can ya blame 'em? |
Fmstack
Member
Username: Fmstack
Post Number: 53
Registered: 06-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 18, 2008 - 9:21 pm: | |
That seems weird to me -- I'm an outsider, to be sure, but from that outsider's perspective Ferndale and Berkley both seem like really nice places. Frankly, unless there's some serious statistical evidence about crime rate spikes or something like that offered to the contrary, I'd say that people moving out of Ferndale (of all places) right now have to be motivated by straight-up fear of black people. |
Bulletmagnet
Member
Username: Bulletmagnet
Post Number: 1045
Registered: 01-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 18, 2008 - 9:24 pm: | |
Jhartmich, I live in Ferndale just down the street from Rosie’s, and everything your friends are saying is TRUE! But instead of calling this "White Flight" (from Ferndale/Berkley) perhaps we should call it "The Black Ghetto Invasion". Sounds kind of groovy that way... |
Gertrude
Member
Username: Gertrude
Post Number: 42
Registered: 05-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 18, 2008 - 9:27 pm: | |
This thread is exhibit A in why we need to remember that we are all in this together. Every community and every neighborhood is interconnected and running to 99 Mile Rd won't do much to help things in the long run. |
Focusonthed
Member
Username: Focusonthed
Post Number: 1743
Registered: 02-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 18, 2008 - 9:28 pm: | |
I don't think it's so much white flight as it is the older (lifetime) residents of Ferndale and other inner ring cities dying or moving South. Their homes are filled by both whites and blacks, rich and poor, but the overall level of blacks goes up in this way. |
Andylinn
Member
Username: Andylinn
Post Number: 768
Registered: 04-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 18, 2008 - 9:28 pm: | |
the flight of the 50s, 60s, and 70s WAS white flight... Whites left (and as you mention, especially rich whites)... Wealthy blacks didn't begin the cycle until the 1980s 1990s.
And ALL middle and upper class whites didn't leave... My parents STILL live in Detroit. Just because you're white doesn't mean you can't live in Detroit - I sure as hell plan to stay, just like my parents. Being white is no excuse, that's shameful. |
Rocket_city
Member
Username: Rocket_city
Post Number: 725
Registered: 04-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 18, 2008 - 9:44 pm: | |
Well, whites still do tend to leave neighborhoods when blacks settle nearby. That social problem still exists today, even if whites aren't firebombing blacks homes like they did in the 40s 50s and 60s.
Today's white flight may be more integrated and class related, but whites still lead the intolerance gap in American lifestyle.
And yah, I've been told many times that 696/12 Mile Road is the new 8 Mile...depending on where you're at. If you live in Warren south of 12 Mile, you're "Detroit". People are stupid sometimes. |
Zrx_doug
Member
Username: Zrx_doug
Post Number: 17
Registered: 03-2008
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 18, 2008 - 10:34 pm: | |
Andylinn, if you're talking to me, you are WAAY off base. I've been at the same address in Detroit for just about twenty years now, and I love it here. Also, I didn't say my parents were "rich" whites..they scraped like hell to afford a place in Farmington Township..but we didn't move until three of my black schoolmates on the block had already skated off to the 'burbs or down south..none of these families were what you would call "wealthy," they just had enough cash to get out and enough sense to do so for their kid's sakes..people with cash got out ASAP after the riot, people who were living paycheck to paycheck took a little longer..something about seeing your street occupied by National Guard tanks does that to some folks, yanno?
Not saying my story or the way I saw others' story is EVERYONE'S story, just saying that to call it "white flight" when EVERYONE WHO COULD was flyin' is a generalization.. |
Wilus1mj
Member
Username: Wilus1mj
Post Number: 252
Registered: 05-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 18, 2008 - 10:54 pm: | |
Please, Ferndale and Berkley are 95% white....nobody's "flighting". Sprawl is definitely continuing North of M59 and West of Haggerty. |
Zimm
Member
Username: Zimm
Post Number: 56
Registered: 10-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 18, 2008 - 11:06 pm: | |
i've noticed an increase in non-white tenants in the rental housing around me in Ferndale. i've attributed it to a decrease in prices (due to a glut of rentals available) which has tempted folks to move to Ferndale from Detroit/the crappier parts of Oak Park, Hazel Park, Madison Heights, and Warren |
Whithorn11446
Member
Username: Whithorn11446
Post Number: 214
Registered: 03-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, March 18, 2008 - 11:18 pm: | |
The White flight from the East side of Detroit was somewhat slower than Northwest Detroit. It depended greatly on the neighborhood. A good number of working class residents that lived west of City Airport ( ex.Harper & Van Dyke) left in the mid to late 1960's and moved to places like East Detroit, south Warren, Roseville.
Meanwhile, whites of better economic means that were not living paycheck to paycheck(ex.Harper & Whittier, Gratiot & 6 Mile)tended to stay longer into the 1970's and when finally moving were able to afford houses in Sterling Heights, North Warren, Clinton Township.
Basically, white flight at least on the east side is complex. It wasn't necessarily "rich whites" or middle class whites that left first. |
Danny
Member
Username: Danny
Post Number: 7194
Registered: 02-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 19, 2008 - 12:02 am: | |
Jhartmich,
White flight for the inner ring suburbs to the Ex-urbs has already begun. White folks who live on the others side of 8 Mile Rd. Redford TWP. Dearborn, Dearborn Heights, Harper Woods are slowly packing up their bags and moving on when about 10 to 20 black families moving into the old cookie cutter homes. The trend is happen on Eastpointe, Harper Woods, Oak Park, Southfield and Redford TWP.
However White folks who are now living in the Grosse Pointes ( a.k.a Snobbyvilles,) Lincoln Park, Melvindale are not yet giving up their home pride properties to blacks and other ethnic families. They are even raising the rents up from $750.00 to $1,100.00 monthly with good credit and a salary based jobs and doing racial steering of real estate just to keep blacks and ethnic folks out. White folks want to keep suburban cities clean and white for a long time and keep the ghettos from reaching their doorsteps.
The suburbs are the boondocks to blacks and ethnic folks and they want to move there to escape from the crime, blight, gangs, drugs, poor schools, empty promises from city leaders and poor police protection. |
Danny
Member
Username: Danny
Post Number: 7195
Registered: 02-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 19, 2008 - 12:04 am: | |
Bulletmagnet.
Ferndale is not only having a "Black ghetto invasion" but a homosexual invasion as well. |
Focusonthed
Member
Username: Focusonthed
Post Number: 1744
Registered: 02-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 19, 2008 - 12:11 am: | |
quote:They are even raising the rents up from $750.00 to $1,100.00 monthly with good credit and a salary based jobs and doing racial steering of real estate just to keep blacks and ethnic folks out. White folks want to keep suburban cities clean and white for a long time and keep the ghettos from reaching their doorsteps.
Please. You're not speaking for me. Your tying rent increases, credit checks, and income minimums to racism is specious, at best. A landlord wants a good tenant for their unit--white or black. In this case, it has everything to do with money and creditworthiness. If black people in that geographic area tend to be poor and have no credit, tough, that's not racism.
Correlation is not causation.
Keep cities clean? Hell yes. Keep the ghettos away? Hell yes. Keep cities white? I could care less what color a city is, as long as it is clean and ghettoless. |
Focusonthed
Member
Username: Focusonthed
Post Number: 1745
Registered: 02-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 19, 2008 - 12:12 am: | |
quote: Ferndale is not only having a "Black ghetto invasion" but a homosexual invasion as well.
Welcome to 10 years ago. Your homophobia is tiring. |
Hudkina
Member
Username: Hudkina
Post Number: 141
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 19, 2008 - 12:17 am: | |
It doesn't matter if you're in the inner-ring or not, if there is a large presence of apartment complexes and rental units, you will see a large minority population. That doesn't mean that the surrounding neighborhoods are seeing white flight. It just means that areas are becoming more diversified.
Look at Taylor, the city has seen its black population double in the last few decades, but the majority of the population lives along the Eureka Rd corridor near the southern end of the city. It's not as if the neighborhoods closest to Detroit are transforming from majority white to majority black, followed by the next neighborhood over, followed by the next neighborhood over, etc.
It just means that more and more minorities are moving to the suburbs. Hell, I work with several young black Detroit residents who are planning on moving out of their parents homes into apartment complexes in Westland, Taylor, Southgate, etc. Part of the reason is that apartments in the city are either too expensive or they aren't in the nicest neighborhoods. |
Raggedclaws
Member
Username: Raggedclaws
Post Number: 161
Registered: 08-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 19, 2008 - 6:43 am: | |
Zzzzzzzzzzzzzz..... |
Dave70
Member
Username: Dave70
Post Number: 47
Registered: 08-2007
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 19, 2008 - 8:45 am: | |
"Ghetto Invasion" sounds like a good term to use, with no reference to race.
I can see how the original/older Harper Woods residents want to leave because the Ghetto Invasion now has come to their doorstep. Check the crime stats and you'll see what I mean. The Detroit area bordering HW is riddled with car theft, robberies and home invasions now. |
Funaho
Member
Username: Funaho
Post Number: 32
Registered: 11-2007
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 19, 2008 - 9:56 am: | |
It's sad but amusing in a way watching everyone make the futile attempt to stay one step ahead of the spreading wave of crime, instead of doing the sensible thing and working together to help fix up the City so there isn't so much crime to spread. It reminds me of a person who has cancer, and instead of having the tumor removed they just keep removing tissue around it to give it room to grow. |
Detroithabitater
Member
Username: Detroithabitater
Post Number: 128
Registered: 10-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 19, 2008 - 10:13 am: | |
I can't wait until the next census to see what the population trends are. |
Scooter2k7
Member
Username: Scooter2k7
Post Number: 85
Registered: 10-2007
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 19, 2008 - 10:26 am: | |
You are not considering that there are enclaves of black communities that have existed north of 8 mile for a long time i.e. Mount Clemens, New Haven, and Pontiac. |
Danny
Member
Username: Danny
Post Number: 7196
Registered: 02-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 19, 2008 - 11:56 am: | |
Detroithabitater,
When the 2010 Census comes out for Detroit this would be the population:
Detroit pop. 810,756
74% Black
8% White
8.2% Hispanic
1.9% Asian
4% Arabs, East Indians
2% other |
Debitdog
Member
Username: Debitdog
Post Number: 3
Registered: 03-2008
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 19, 2008 - 12:52 pm: | |
Actually, there is crime reported by citizens north and south of Ferndale, not just Detroit.
Go to wikistreetwatch.com and enter 'Ferndale MI'.
The source of these postings on the Google map is the news media:
- Detroit News
- Detroit Free Press
- clickondetroit.com
- WXYZ Detroit
You can link back to the original news article. Detroit does not have a monopoly on crime, it's regional. |
Single_malt
Member
Username: Single_malt
Post Number: 24
Registered: 02-2008
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 19, 2008 - 12:55 pm: | |
Didn't know being an Arab or East Indian classified under the census. Or even under the same category. They're not from the same region to class them them the same.
Also what is "Other"? Where are the Italians, Greeks, Polish, and the like. |
Screamingfit
Member
Username: Screamingfit
Post Number: 39
Registered: 03-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, March 19, 2008 - 1:26 pm: | |
I'm leaving Ferndale next week to head to the far north extravaganza known as Berkley. Wasn't anything to do with "fleeing" - my lease was up and I just found a nicer/bigger house to rent in Berkley than what I could find in Ferndale. No love lost as my two favorite places in Ferndale (Record Time and Xhedos) have gone bye-bye and it is starting to feel a bit too much like Royal Oak, anyway.
Honestly, I haven't noticed an increase in any particular ethnicity and the WASP level seems to be the same as it ever was.
I've been in O'Gradys a couple of times in the past year. Seems to be more like a Madison Heights/Hazel Park invasion than anything else! :D |