Discuss Detroit Archives - January 2008 Best years for Detroit could be in the future Previous Next
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Miketoronto
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Username: Miketoronto

Post Number: 850
Registered: 07-2004
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 8:11 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I have watched the Detroit Riverfront video, and I have really been thinking. Detroit and many other cities while they have lost jobs due to the decrease in industry; also might have a brighter future.
Just looking at the riverfront, most of it was full of dirty industry that no one ever went down to visit. Now these old industrial places are being reclaimed as people places. You see this in Pittsburgh, Cleveland, Detroit, Buffalo,and tons of other cities.
It will take a while to bring jobs back, etc.
But could a more exciting and clean city be on the verge of happening, due to the reuse of these amazing sites that were turned over to smoke stacks for much to long??????

If you think about it, for the first time our cities are about being clean, vibrant, and amazing places, instead of places for smokestacks and dirt.
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Alan55
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Username: Alan55

Post Number: 1420
Registered: 09-2005
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 8:38 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

How will people walking around in clean, vibrant, and amazing places get the garbage picked up or the burned-out street lights changed? More to the point, where will the money for performing these services come from? Where will the jobs to generate the tax money to perform these services come from? In 1946, Detroit had countless thousands of jobs, an ample city budget, and was not clean or amazing.

You are making the "Disneyworld" mistake.
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Mwilbert
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Username: Mwilbert

Post Number: 153
Registered: 11-2007
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 9:25 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The future is long. In the future, there is no reason to think street lights would burn out. In the future, perhaps robots will pick up the garbage.

Nonetheless, in the short term Detroit has a lot of challenges. I don't know that we are on the verge of anything in particular.
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Rel
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Username: Rel

Post Number: 591
Registered: 02-2008
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 9:34 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mike,

This is the most optimistic thread I've seen here (even though I've only been on here in early Feb).

Thanks for writing it. It's nice to see a strictly positive opening post. I think your statement could be true...
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Jjw
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Username: Jjw

Post Number: 519
Registered: 10-2005
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 9:42 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mike, That is a great post and you are correct. Baby steps. One day at a time.
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Craig
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Username: Craig

Post Number: 689
Registered: 02-2007
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 10:04 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I appreciate the optimism, but all of that dirty industry was the reason for our being.

I believe that there's a flash of 'deep' & brilliance in Bruce Springsteen's lyric for 'Youngstown' (singer lamenting the passing of steel): "Those factories fed my children, made my pay; them smokestacks reaching like the arms of God into a beautiful sky of soot and clay."

I prefer dealing with industrial waste as a spill-over of prosperity to the present state of rebounding ecology and economic hopelessness.
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Dbest
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Username: Dbest

Post Number: 95
Registered: 03-2007
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 10:50 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hey Alan I think you are mistaken about the city in 1946, it was clean to a certain extent considering how owners cleaned there storefronts back then, I'll agree Detroit downtown has never been a poster child for cleanliness but the lack of abandon buildings and run-down areas of the downtown in 1946 made for a nicer downtown.
Don't take my word for it;

www.detroit.lib.mi.us/GoldenJu bileeExhibit/GJ%20WEB/index.ht m

Video from the fair:

http://video.aol.com/video-det ail/detroit-1946-golden-jubile e/3849473570

Looks kind of vibrant to me?
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Paulmcall
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Username: Paulmcall

Post Number: 820
Registered: 05-2004
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 11:22 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

When the world is turned upside down or folks take responsibility for their own actions. It will help if the leaders set a better example too.
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Gannon
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Username: Gannon

Post Number: 12043
Registered: 12-2003
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 11:28 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It is tough for some to imagine change, tougher to dream up a path to progressive change.


If only we could design the CBD to eliminate car traffic on the surface streets, kinda like how Chicago has a lower-level alley and parking sub-city in their loop, we'd go a long way towards showing the world that Detroit can and will survive the demise of the motorcar as we know it now.

I can envision it...the whole area contained by the People Mover devoid of exhaust, except that catalyzed through vents from below...filled with walkers, bikers, bladers, boarders, joggers, wheelchairs, and the occasional Segway.


The Motor City has to morph into something else to survive, because multi-national corporations and the capitalist elite have already largely given up on us.


One can only hope that Generous Motors and Ferd will rise above petrol politics and rush forward with some solutions that can spin the world...unfortunately, I do NOT see Chrysler surviving this Private Equity emptying of their valuables...but I don't see it coming from these other two, either. Too conservative to spark true change towards progress.



I was introduced to another set of amazing individuals last night at a houseparty in North Corktown...and lingeringly left knowing that the urban agriculture movement will be strong through the coming crises. I was honored to be amongst such earthy and beautiful people.


(even the West Bloomfield fellow who crashed the bonfire and felt compelled to talk about how many gasoline-burners he owned for his fun...I had to walk away before I said something brash, but didn't feel too compelled to warn him that he was boasting to a crowd he should be listening to!)
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Gannon
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Username: Gannon

Post Number: 12045
Registered: 12-2003
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 12:17 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

(cannot forget the Bicycle Rickshaw's, sorry)
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Macknwarren
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Username: Macknwarren

Post Number: 18
Registered: 10-2007
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 12:38 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I take Alan55's post as an assertion that even at its industrial zenith, whether that was 1928, 1946, 1952 or whenever, Detroit could be an unforgiving, smokestack-belching place that never was as bountiful as some people claim today. Miketoronto's dreams might seem more real if there were jobs of any sort taking the places of the jobs that have been leaving. It's impossible to predict the distant future, but the next five years seem pretty clear: Continued out-migration from both Detroit and metro Detroit as the auto industry continues struggling; perhaps some more improvement in downtown and midtown, but continued deterioration of Detroit (and, gradually, suburban) services as everyone's tax base continues to disappear..
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Livernoisyard
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Username: Livernoisyard

Post Number: 5661
Registered: 10-2004
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 1:17 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

How much of this nonsensical celebrating will continue after the 2010 Census figures are in...

Showing the continuing severe job losses over this current decade... And Michigan will still be in a one-state recession err. depression. Hell, a recession longer than 24 months is a depression. Detroit's two major firms--Ford and GM--together are worth far less than Nissan, Honda, or Daimler, separately, and only about 1/8 to 1/7 of what Toyota is worth (net asset value). The others get larger, while GM and Ford (and the yet-weaker Chrysler) flounder toward becoming much smaller firms. Ford and Chrysler will probably go broke...

Showing Detroit's population to be under 800,000 and sinking further... And the same phony baloney crowd will complain that the 2010 US Census Bureau's count was wrong, again and again. Knowledgeable futurists and security analysts predict no stopping of the job losses in Michigan before 2015, at the earliest. How many un- or under-employed will stick around, mired in Detroit, for another decade without jobs?

Showing that SE Michigan continues to lead the nation in many negative areas. Need we continually run through a litany of them? We all should know by now what those litany items are.
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Warrenite84
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Username: Warrenite84

Post Number: 286
Registered: 01-2007
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 2:02 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The infrastructure improvements in the CBD, especially along the river have definitely helped change visitors perceptions about our renewal. For those who don't visit often, the change has been more obvious.

Sure, when I see other websites that show skyscrapers popping up like mushrooms in other cities, our growth seems glacial by comparison.
I do get a little jealous about that.

IMHO, our biggest problems to beat is our lack of working together, a lack of entrepreneurial college graduates, and cooperation and integrity missing from our elected officials.
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Warrenite84
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Username: Warrenite84

Post Number: 287
Registered: 01-2007
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 2:12 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I tend to see Detroit's developments in a glass is half full sort of way.

Not to be ignorant of Detroit's problems, but to see them as having solutions that we can achieve.
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Sparty06
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Username: Sparty06

Post Number: 59
Registered: 03-2007
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 6:29 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'm sure Detroit will have a net loss of residents in the 2010 census but this doesn't show the whole picture. A lot of areas like midtown/downtown etc. are experiencing new residents move in who are relatively affluent/educated and these are the residents these particular areas need to experience positive growth and development. So while I do predict a net loss I see a positive trend in the types of people who are choosing to move into the city (people who would've never considered doing so 5 years ago). This is particularly true of certain parts of the city like downtown, which also happen to be key parts of the city that need to grow and develop for the city to rebound as a whole.
Unfortunately, just as Detroit experiences some positive growth and new developments downtown we get caught in a potential national recession and a single state recession/depression that really hampers all the good things going on the city. These are problems that are out of the hands of Detroit and it's unfortunate that they will play a role in stalling the city's development.



(Message edited by sparty06 on March 30, 2008)

(Message edited by sparty06 on March 30, 2008)
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Capnhook
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Username: Capnhook

Post Number: 44
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 7:39 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

When I was doing research on my house in Old Redford, I came across newspaper advertisements from the papers in 1915 selling land the general vicinity as a new development just a short 20 minutes away from the soot and noise of Detroit and just a short way away from the lake district in Oakland. Funny this is that years later, it all held true even with personal cars for transport. Escaping the crush/bustle of the city has been a theme going back years and years. The escape now is somewhere out in oakland township up north or between Plymouth and ann arbor out west.
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Alan55
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Username: Alan55

Post Number: 1428
Registered: 09-2005
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 7:47 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

What is more interesting to me than the touristy projects that add glitz and glitter to our showcase areas, the news like that of Rock Financial moving to the City is much more encouraging. All of the new lofts and condos that have been built over the last decade will not generally be seen by visitors, or reporters, but add they to the stability and vitality of the city. The same goes for the improvements and repairs in Corktown and other neighborhoods. Not fancy, not high-profile, just basic renewal from the ground up.
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Livernoisyard
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Username: Livernoisyard

Post Number: 5669
Registered: 10-2004
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 8:11 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hey Sparty!

How does your assessment (or opinion) fit in with all the recently failed condo projects downtown and in Midtown involving only a few hundred condos (if even that high a figure)? How is that any different from the usual Detroit model of one step forward, three steps backwards? Except now, even the downtown is going retrograde, and there's even less forward.

Downtown Detroit is much a ghost town compared to cities with vibrancy. At some point, you gotta smell the coffee and realize that Detroit's not going to survive in the manner you think. Receivership will occur because there's little to stop it.

Hadn't Detroit been so welfare based (and corrupt), it would have already occurred. Detroit continues to borrow heavily at the ends of its fiscal years. That debt has to be repaid; remember that! Pontiac will probably succumb to bankruptcy this year.
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Living_in_the_d
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Username: Living_in_the_d

Post Number: 151
Registered: 01-2008
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 8:20 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yeah, I concur with the positive comments in this thread. The best is yet to come.
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Sparty06
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Username: Sparty06

Post Number: 60
Registered: 03-2007
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 8:27 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Livernois,
I see a failure of some, not all, of the condo projects downtown as part of a larger trend of national recession and credit crunch and not as a reflection or indication of the state of the city. As I mentioned, I think it's unfortunate that just as Detroit is taking positive steps forward national trends (of which we play little to no role in) are causing problems for us.
Sure, I'll concede your point that Detroit is a "ghost town" compared to other similar sized cities but this is changing with many of the successful new developments and retail going in downtown. As has been mentioned, Rock Financial and others like Compuware moving their corporate HQs downtown will make a huge impact on the pedestrian traffic in the city as thousands of new workers will be downtown.
I've tried to remain objective up until this point but I also think there' s something special about the character and people of Detroit that will not let the city merely fade away into the margins of history.
As for the city's financial situation... I'll let someone with better knowledge of that situation tackle that question.

(Message edited by sparty06 on March 30, 2008)

(Message edited by sparty06 on March 30, 2008)
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Livernoisyard
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Username: Livernoisyard

Post Number: 5671
Registered: 10-2004
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 9:19 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It's far more than the national economy. Detroit has always been just a development or three away from its turnaround for the past four decades. Sure, there are new buildings.

But Chicago had some fifty real skyscraper-sized projects started within the past few years. Detroit's final real skyscraper was built fifteen years ago. And just a total of six of them within the past 31 years.

Quicken Loans may or may not move from Livonia. That's too far into the future. The Northern Group's project downtown is even iffier than Quicken's maybe move. Besides, QL is now a fraction of its headier days two years ago. There's nowhere 4000 or 5000 employees in its entire operation--let alone in metro Detroit.

There is zero pedestrian traffic short of the homeless downtown during the times where typical office employees work. Only very little at other times. Where do those people come from when they say that it's so busy in downtown Detroit?!

The city already faded away as far as being commercial is concerned. There's only so much room for new establishments because, in Detroit's case, it's not even a zero-sum game. It's a negative-sum game (because the city is dying), and any increased competition just makes it insufferable for the already established businesses there. Dreams seldom come true, especially for those who constantly dream about the improbable.
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Sparty06
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Username: Sparty06

Post Number: 62
Registered: 03-2007
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 9:45 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'll try and respond to your post at length later but it seems like some good advice for the short term would be to start a new forum called DetroitNO!

You might find more support for your views there.
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Mwilbert
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Username: Mwilbert

Post Number: 154
Registered: 11-2007
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 9:48 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Receivership almost certain, but I'm not sure what it has to do with success or failure of condos--it will probably be a positive thing for the city, if not for people dependent on the city for funding.

I would agree that overall housing/finance issues are a big problem for new housing in Downtown/Midtown. Also, I am no expert but a lot of the projects seem to be aiming at unrealistic price points. What I expect to happen is that the developers will learn from this, and build more sensible projects. And the projects that haven't sold will be repriced.
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Sparty06
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Username: Sparty06

Post Number: 63
Registered: 03-2007
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 9:51 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mwilbert, I agree to a certain extent with your post. I also think that you're also going to see more of the condo/loft developments open up for rent/lease as a way to deal with the credit crunch and as a general good business practice to entice first time and reticent buyers/renters to try out living in the city.
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Daytwa
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Username: Daytwa

Post Number: 15
Registered: 10-2007
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 9:52 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I think Detroit's turnaround will occur when several strong men are employed to pull the massive bug out of Livernoisyard's ass.
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Lifeinmontage
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Username: Lifeinmontage

Post Number: 67
Registered: 10-2007
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 10:06 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Does anyone remember the computer game "Sim Tower"? It was a spin-off of all the other Sim City games, except that the player focused on building a giant, mixed-use high rise. You could build restaurants, shops, office space, even a movie theater, but condos were easy to build; quickly and cheaply the player could build an endless number of condos that virtual sims would buy up in an instant. Eventually, once the player had flooded the market with condos, the sims started selling their condos, and the player was left with an empty shell of a building with dozens, if not hundreds of "for sale" signs. The lack of residents made the business all go under, and suddenly the player was left with a ghost town.

I wish more developers had played this game before their escapades downtown.

(I don't wish to bring down the mood of this thread. I do believe that Detroit's best days are ahead of us.)
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Jimaz
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Username: Jimaz

Post Number: 4941
Registered: 12-2005
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 10:06 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ma gavte la nata.
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Livernoisyard
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Username: Livernoisyard

Post Number: 5673
Registered: 10-2004
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 10:18 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

quote:

I'll try and respond to your post at length later but it seems like some good advice for the short term would be to start a new forum called DetroitNO!

You might find more support for your views there.

You think so? Let's see who might own DetroitNO...
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Fishtoes2000
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Username: Fishtoes2000

Post Number: 477
Registered: 06-2005
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 10:33 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Gannon wrote:
quote:

I was introduced to another set of amazing individuals last night at a houseparty in North Corktown...and lingeringly left knowing that the urban agriculture movement will be strong through the coming crises.


It wasn't these "individuals" was it?
http://www.allyeargear.com/200 8/goats-and-the-city/
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Miketoronto
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Username: Miketoronto

Post Number: 852
Registered: 07-2004
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 10:33 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

On the comment about Downtown Detroit being a ghost town. Yes the downtown area could be more busy. However there are sections with lots of activity like Greektown.
In terms of life in downtown, I think cars kill alot of the vibrancy. I have been in downtown Detroit late at night, and you know what? There are a ton of things going on in the restaurants, clubs, theatres, etc. Yet the streets are dead. Why? Because people drive up to where they are going, walk inside, and that is it. They never hit the pavement for a two three block or anything, because their cars are taking them right to the front door of where they are going for the most part.

Capnhook about the ads showcasing moving out of the city, etc. That is because of industry. Our cities back then were very dirty places, and people did want to escape the pollution from the factories. It is sometimes hard to think it could be so bad, but places like Pittsburgh had such bad pollution that streetlights had to come on in the afternoon.
While Detroit was not that bad, I am sure the pollution from the factories had their effect.

That is why many people moved out of our cities in the first place.

That is why with our new clean economies, etc our cities can be reclaimed. People want to live in the city again, because now cities are cleaner more nicer places to live, then when they where full of smokestacks.

So that was my whole comment. It may be happening slow. But the future can be very bright if all the assets are used to their full advantage, like the Riverfront, etc.

The chance to rebuild the city into a clean places that people will not want to flee because of smoke and pollution is big.

We saw video footage and shots of some midwest cities back in the 20-30's. And man the pollution was just horrible, and I can see why some people decided to flee.
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56packman
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Username: 56packman

Post Number: 2134
Registered: 12-2005
Posted on Sunday, March 30, 2008 - 10:49 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It's especially cleaner since we sent all of those nasty, dirty manufacturing jobs to third world countries where they don't have an EPA,OSHA or lawyers like cockroaches.
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Livernoisyard
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Username: Livernoisyard

Post Number: 5677
Registered: 10-2004
Posted on Monday, March 31, 2008 - 3:36 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The pollution was so terrible in the 1920s and 1930s (even with an unemployment rate over 50% during the Great One) that Detroit had to import residents and, especially, workers because of the daily high mortality rates. Otherwise, Detroit may have peaked at 7 or 8 million residents instead of only 2 million. Undertakers were so busy with all that extra business, so they subcontracted much of that excess with the exburbs and outstate.

It's probably still a secret, but Detroit's cemeteries only have a small portion of the total mortalities buried there. The vast majority were cremated on the sly, and they were allowed to further increase the pollution when their remains were disposed of in the open air, along with the filth and belch from the industrial smokestacks.

Fortunately, that's all behind us now while we await Detroit's best times yet to come... someday at a theater near you. Because, like Hollywood's movies, that nonsense is all make believe.
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Rid0617
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Username: Rid0617

Post Number: 2
Registered: 03-2008
Posted on Monday, March 31, 2008 - 4:15 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'm one of the plus comments for Detroit. The economy in the country is in the tank. Detroit offers cheap land and homes, prices that are offered no where else. Detroit is a city people can come, buy a home and rebuild from their own financial disaster. Here in the south they relied totally on textiles the same as Detroit relied on autos. When textiles went overseas this area went through a depression but began attracting new light industries. Our unemployment averaged 9-10%. While the wage scale is low there is plenty of work building a different economy. I'm afraid Detroit's $28 an hour jobs are gone because of outsourcing but with cost of living lowered it could rebuild. That's why I started the post "greetings from Greenville, SC". Requesting advise from the folks who currently live there.
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Sean_of_detroit
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Username: Sean_of_detroit

Post Number: 47
Registered: 03-2008
Posted on Monday, March 31, 2008 - 6:18 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Some quotes from my post in the "Greetings From South Carolina" topic:

"...here's my understanding of what is going on in Detroit right now. The city lost to many residents to maintain itself properly. Many structures were abandon for years, and many things did not get fixed when they were supposed to (even the freeways were neglected). As things got worse we could not attract many good city employees/politicians (becoming a politician in Detroit might be considered political career suicide by some)..."

"...the overall idea for Detroit seems to be based on downtown. The way of thinking here is that Michigan had no urban areas. Detroiters apparently realized there was a real opportunity to turn itself around based on that assumption. By creating a vibrant downtown, Detroit would effectively have a destination that people would want to live and work in, and an area that would attract entrepreneurs that, hopefully would see opportunities that were being missed."

"The plan seems to be to push development outward from downtown to the surrounding neighborhoods, and then to the areas surrounding those neighborhoods. There is much debate if this will actually work. Many people seem to either see the glass half empty or have full. In reality, that doesn't matter. All that matters is that the glass contains milk. Meaning you can either drink the milk, or fill it more. It could go either way depending on you and your neighbors actions, efforts, and beliefs."
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Sumas
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Username: Sumas

Post Number: 82
Registered: 01-2008
Posted on Monday, March 31, 2008 - 7:47 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I remember years ago visiting Boston. The visitor center ran a documentary on "Where's Boston" it was a serious look at it's ethnicity and neighborhoods. I wish Detroit would do something similiar. I don't have the ability to put that production together. I do know that Detroit has a vibrance that is not seen by many.
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Hockey_player
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Username: Hockey_player

Post Number: 412
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Monday, March 31, 2008 - 8:36 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Quote: "On the comment about Downtown Detroit being a ghost town. Yes the downtown area could be more busy. However there are sections with lots of activity like Greektown.
In terms of life in downtown, I think cars kill alot of the vibrancy. I have been in downtown Detroit late at night, and you know what? There are a ton of things going on in the restaurants, clubs, theatres, etc. Yet the streets are dead. Why? Because people drive up to where they are going, walk inside, and that is it. They never hit the pavement for a two three block or anything, because their cars are taking them right to the front door of where they are going for the most part."

Greektown's what - all of three blocks?

People are driving and not parking because there's nothing to walk to. Who's going to walk a half-mile between destinations? You've got some illusion of density here that simply isn't real.

Have you ever been to Detroit?
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Postbop
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Username: Postbop

Post Number: 99
Registered: 09-2007
Posted on Monday, March 31, 2008 - 10:37 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Do you think that, as the droughts continue in the south and south-west, there will be a returning migration to Michigan and Detroit because of its accessible water?
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Sayitaintso
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Username: Sayitaintso

Post Number: 9
Registered: 03-2008
Posted on Monday, March 31, 2008 - 10:58 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'd expect the CBD to be a somewhat ghost town, outside of 7-9am, noon hour, and 4-6pm Monday - Friday. People commute to and from work. That's the case in any other major US city. The surrounding neighborhoods is where you want to see activity. In several areas, Corktown, Midtown, Eastern Market, etc there's a decent amount of activity. For the next 5-7 years or until a tipping point, when SE Detroit transitions from a predominantly one industry economy to diversified multi industry economy the population will decrease. Also a small city doesn't necessarily equal a bad city. Several examples of small, vibrant US cities: SF, Boston, Denver, etc.
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Umbound
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Username: Umbound

Post Number: 72
Registered: 02-2008
Posted on Monday, March 31, 2008 - 2:05 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hate to sound like an Asshole but the move of Quicken Loans does not seem that big of a deal to me. it kind of just replaced Comerica, so think about it one corporation moved out and another came in so it is even really. but i do got to say hope more and more people move downtown and midtown so it is a actual 24 hour district.
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Defendbrooklyn
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Username: Defendbrooklyn

Post Number: 790
Registered: 11-2005
Posted on Monday, March 31, 2008 - 5:04 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Clean...I hope so. This may be a stretch. Michganders seem to like dirty streets/environments...I have never lived in a place/state where garbage is constantly blowing in all direction. Why is this so?
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Dbest
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Username: Dbest

Post Number: 97
Registered: 03-2007
Posted on Monday, March 31, 2008 - 7:37 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hey Brooklyn you must not be familiar with a large percentage of the state. Go to the Au Sable river for a canoe ride, or to Sleeping Bear Dunes for a swim in Lake Michigan and you will see "Pure Michigan" you might be surprised by what Michigan has to offer.
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Ray
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Username: Ray

Post Number: 1109
Registered: 06-2004
Posted on Monday, March 31, 2008 - 7:58 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The paper today says out-of-state investors are buying houses in Detroit because they have more faith in the city than its suburbanites.

http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs .dll/article?AID=/20080331/BUS INESS06/803310318
Detroit's housing slump is attractive to investors
Some buyers look to get 100 or more
BY GRETA GUEST FREE PRESS BUSINESS WRITER March 31, 2008
Investors from as far away as Hong Kong and Hawaii are coming to Detroit to make their fortune buying foreclosed homes in bulk.
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Rid0617
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Username: Rid0617

Post Number: 10
Registered: 03-2008
Posted on Wednesday, April 02, 2008 - 12:51 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Postbop said: "Do you think that, as the droughts continue in the south and south-west, there will be a returning migration to Michigan and Detroit because of its accessible water?"

While that is not the reason we are considering it, I have said that identical thing to my wife. Let's look at it. Foreclosures are rampant here too. Our economy except for Atlanta is mostly small business and service industry. Another possibility is people who have lost their homes in the south moving to Detroit to buy some of the extremely low cost housing which does not require as much income to maintain. If the city does not have service type or small business jobs people instead of commuting into the city could commute outside the city to obtain jobs. People down here think nothing of driving 20-25 miles to work or 8-10 miles to the grocery store.
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Livernoisyard
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Username: Livernoisyard

Post Number: 5700
Registered: 10-2004
Posted on Wednesday, April 02, 2008 - 12:58 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Rid0617: The way things are going, you could move here, but keep your job down there. People down there think nothing of driving 800 miles to work. But OTOH, there are plenty of grocery stores in SW Detroit. Several within a mile or two radius.

But that 1600-mile daily commute would leave you with a very short work day...
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Rid0617
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Username: Rid0617

Post Number: 12
Registered: 03-2008
Posted on Wednesday, April 02, 2008 - 1:25 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

LOL yep that would be tough. What will help us is my wife has 20+ years in restaurant management, currently a waitress and prefers to stay that way because of all the years as a manager. We figure since Detroit is used to large wages there should be plenty of waitress jobs at $2.13 an hour plus tips which is what she currently earns.

I draw disability from the VA, build computers on the side for sale and sell coins on ebay.
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Paulmcall
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Username: Paulmcall

Post Number: 844
Registered: 05-2004
Posted on Wednesday, April 02, 2008 - 8:19 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Does the Twilight Zone work in reverse?

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