E_hemingway Member Username: E_hemingway
Post Number: 1640 Registered: 11-2004
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 7:45 am: | |
Freep story on the 50 buildings the city wants to raze as part of the bond proposal. I am surprised to see a Cass Corridor structure and the old factory on Iron Street on here. 50 eyesores could get date with wrecking ball http://freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll /article?AID=/20080408/NEWS01/ 804080322 Fifty abandoned buildings that Detroit officials call the city's most dangerous would be demolished under Mayor Kwame Kilpatrick's $300-million plan to use public works projects to aid the economy. Kilpatrick -- continuing to stump for his plan in the face of a deeply skeptical City Council that has called for his resignation because of the text message scandal -- is to discuss his administration's demolition plans today. At least one of the buildings earmarked for elimination has a rich history: The former theater and nightclub at 3067 E. Grand Blvd. that played host to performers like Stevie Wonder, Marvin Gaye and the Supremes under a variety of names such as the 20 Grand, the Latin Quarters or Grand Quarters. Also slated to be razed is the old McMillan Elementary School in southwest Detroit -- which burned in 2004 after closing in 2001 -- and a former nursing home at 18520 W. Seven Mile. If the council agrees to sell $300 million in bonds based on assumed growth in casino tax revenues, the plan would dedicate $10 million toward demolishing the 50 large, vacant commercial structures. Most are dilapidated apartment buildings or factories, including a 159,000-square-foot structure that is part of the massive, 3.5-million-square-foot Packard Plant site, abandoned since 1956. "These are clear and present dangers in these neighborhoods," said Amru Meah, director of the city Department of Buildings and Safety Engineering. "We can't just keep on mothballing buildings and leaving them out there." So far, the administration has selected 26 buildings for demolition while reviewing its records for another 24 to raze. Some remain privately owned, while the city has seized others because of unpaid taxes. The Packard Plant itself is not on the list, nor is the infamous Michigan Central Station. Officials said razing the train station would cost at least $10 million alone and make little difference for residents because there is little housing nearby. John Foster, 55, lives just down the street from an abandoned apartment building at Woodward and Owen that is on the demolition list. He said it has become a crack house. Even worse, he added, is that it's across the street from Detroit International Academy, the all-girls high school that once housed Detroit Northern High School. "It's awful," he said. "It needs to be torn down." Francis Grunow, executive director of Preservation Wayne, said while he recognized not every vacant building in the city can be saved, the best use of the money would be to rehabilitate a handful of structures and put them into use. "Frankly, without a plan to do something with the sites afterward, you're not talking about economic stimulus," he said. City officials picked the buildings based on the population density in the area and the level of danger they posed, Meah said. The buildings have been vacant for at least 10 years and, in some cases, for decades. The city spends about $7 million each year to demolish 700 to 1,000 abandoned houses. Meah said the money from the bond sale is vital to the demolition proposal. The mayor has mounted a massive public relations blitz to tout his economic stimulus plan, averaging a media event a day for the last week to tout portions of the program. Another is scheduled today. Kilpatrick has adopted a business-as-usual stance despite facing eight felony charges for perjury, conspiracy, obstruction of justice and misconduct in office for his alleged actions in the text message scandal. Councilwoman Sheila Cockrel, whose Budget, Finance and Audit Committee is one of two council committees that is to review the plan, said she won't be swayed by the effort. She questioned the wisdom of selling bonds to pay for demolition, a move that would require paying interest, when the city could instead divert money from housing demolition to raze the larger commercial structures. "It's a campaign, but bond proposals, it seems to me, shouldn't be about campaigns," she said. "Bond proposals are about making appropriate decisions." Contact ZACHARY GORCHOW at 313-222-6678 or zgorchow@freepress.com. |
Miketeevee Member Username: Miketeevee
Post Number: 46 Registered: 07-2005
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 9:18 am: | |
"The city spends about $7 million each year to demolish 700 to 1,000 abandoned houses." Does it really cost between $7,000-$10,000 to tear down an abandoned house in Detroit? That seems outrageous to me. |
E_hemingway Member Username: E_hemingway
Post Number: 1641 Registered: 11-2004
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 9:22 am: | |
I have heard those numbers thrown around before, too. Often razing a house requires more than knocking down the walls. Disposal, abatement, digging up the old foundation and filling the hole all add to the cost. I don't know how accurate those numbers are but they don't seem outrageous. |
Mwilbert Member Username: Mwilbert
Post Number: 188 Registered: 11-2007
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 9:26 am: | |
It isn't that outrageous. I have a one-story, 600 sq ft wooden outbuilding on sonotubes that someday should be removed. I have been quoted around $3000. A house would be a LOT bigger job, although the house would probably be more accessible to the street. |
Gravitymachine Member Username: Gravitymachine
Post Number: 2033 Registered: 05-2005
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 9:29 am: | |
which cass corridor building? i can't read their abysmall graphic. (someone please teach their graphics department how to use the "save for web" option in photoshop please!) |
Detroithabitater Member Username: Detroithabitater
Post Number: 134 Registered: 10-2006
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 9:52 am: | |
Is there a copy of the list around? |
Bobj Member Username: Bobj
Post Number: 4371 Registered: 11-2003
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 9:56 am: | |
more vacant lots coming your way |
E_hemingway Member Username: E_hemingway
Post Number: 1642 Registered: 11-2004
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 9:57 am: | |
There is a link to a graphic map that lists 26 of the buildings. As Gravitymachine pointed out it's hard to read. The address of the Cass building is 17111 Second. |
Hornwrecker Member Username: Hornwrecker
Post Number: 2005 Registered: 04-2005
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 9:59 am: | |
This sounds like a way to give Bobby Ferguson a lot of contracts while the Mayor still has a job. Of course he'll have to strategically lose one, just to make it appear fair. |
56packman Member Username: 56packman
Post Number: 2156 Registered: 12-2005
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 10:22 am: | |
$7,000-$10,000 to properly tear down a house and haul away the debris is about right these days, I know of several jobs lately and that's the going rate. |
Cub Member Username: Cub
Post Number: 289 Registered: 02-2007
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 10:58 am: | |
I didn't realise it cost that much to tear down a house. They need to try harder to come up with a way to put these homes in someones hands that will rehab them. Cut the red tape. At least the homes that are salvagable. I have seen a lot of houses that could have been rehabbed with little funds that were torn down and houses ablock away that are burned out. |
Spacemonkey Member Username: Spacemonkey
Post Number: 342 Registered: 03-2006
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 1:15 pm: | |
I have fond memories of seeing rock shows at the Latin Quarter. But it won't be much of a loss. Maybe someone will build a new concert venue there. |
Crumbled_pavement Member Username: Crumbled_pavement
Post Number: 328 Registered: 08-2007
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 1:18 pm: | |
They need to go all up and down Lahser/Outer Drive from I-96 to McNichols. |
Digitalvision Member Username: Digitalvision
Post Number: 708 Registered: 11-2003
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 1:34 pm: | |
It seems to me like a bond should be for something that lasts the length of the Bond payback period. |
Johnlodge Member Username: Johnlodge
Post Number: 6047 Registered: 10-2003
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 1:44 pm: | |
18520 W. Seven Mile - Nursing Home 12211 Dexter - Apartment 30 E. Philadelphia - Apartment 31 Woodland - Apartment 35 Owen - Apartment 3050-3080 Outer Drive - Plant 8611 Grinnell - No Description 5311-5343-5344-5300-5353 Concord - Plant 7800 Pierson - Apartment 18110 Weaver - Apaartment 2903 Elmhurst - Apartment 3265 W. Boston Blvd. - Apartment 2330 Vinewood - Warehouse 7036 W. Jefferson - Apartment 615 S. West End - School 2725 W. Fort -Warehouse 1982 W. Jefferson - Warehouse 1523 E. Jefferson - Apartment 282 ????? - No Description 17111 Second - Apartment 3067 E. Grand Blvd. - Theater 3185, 3171 Bellevue - Warehouse 1909 Erskine - Plant 2900-2902 Orleans - No Description That's the best I could do with it. Possible mistakes. (Message edited by johnlodge on April 08, 2008) |
E_hemingway Member Username: E_hemingway
Post Number: 1643 Registered: 11-2004
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 2:01 pm: | |
Yeah, that's pretty much what I saw when I looked them up on msn maps. I think a number of those apartments are on the apartment ruins tour. |
Ray1936 Member Username: Ray1936
Post Number: 2966 Registered: 01-2005
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 2:04 pm: | |
Anyone up to taking a few photos? I'd do it, but it's a long drive........ |
Bearinabox Member Username: Bearinabox
Post Number: 580 Registered: 04-2006
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 2:45 pm: | |
17111 Second is not the correct address. That's what it says on the graphic, I know, but 17xxx addresses on north-south streets are north of McNichols. 1711 Second, perhaps? |
Johnlodge Member Username: Johnlodge
Post Number: 6051 Registered: 10-2003
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 2:54 pm: | |
Right you are, 17111 is in Highland Park, in fact. 1711 is right by 94 by Wayne State. |
Danindc Member Username: Danindc
Post Number: 4107 Registered: 10-2003
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 3:00 pm: | |
Aren't bond proposals typically intended for projects that return something of economic VALUE? Who in the hell does KK expect is going to buy these bonds? This entire plan is flawed, top-to-bottom. Kwame needs to get his own oversized head out of his ass and think about strategies that will actually do more than just superficial good. |
Lifeinmontage Member Username: Lifeinmontage
Post Number: 83 Registered: 10-2007
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 3:10 pm: | |
he's just scrambling to make it look like he's made a difference come sentencing |
Danindc Member Username: Danindc
Post Number: 4108 Registered: 10-2003
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 3:15 pm: | |
Oh, Kwame will make a difference all right. The following is from a speech given by Richard Moe, head of the National Trust for Historic Preservation:
quote:Here’s the concept in a nutshell: Buildings are vast repositories of energy. It takes energy to manufacture or extract building materials, more energy to transport them to a construction site, still more energy to assemble them into a building. All of that energy is embodied in the finished structure—and if the structure is demolished and landfilled, the energy locked up in it is totally wasted. What’s more, the process of demolition itself uses more energy—and, of course, the construction of a new building in its place uses more yet. Let me give you some numbers that will translate that concept into reality. * According to a formula produced for the Advisory Council on Historic Preservation, about 80 billion BTUs of energy are embodied in a typical 50,000-square-foot commercial building. That’s the equivalent of 640,000 gallons of gasoline. If you tear the building down, all of that embodied energy is wasted. * What’s more, demolishing that same 50,000-square-foot building would create nearly 4,000 tons of waste. That’s enough debris to fill 26 railroad boxcars—a train nearly a quarter of a mile long, headed for a landfill that is already almost full. * Once the old building is gone, putting up a new one in its place takes more energy, of course, and it also uses more natural resources and releases new pollutants and greenhouse gases into our environment. It is estimated that constructing a 50,000-square-foot commercial building releases about the same amount of carbon into the atmosphere as driving a car 2.8 million miles. * One more point: You might think that all the energy used in demolishing an older building and replacing it is offset by the increased energy efficiency of the new building—but that’s simply not true. Recent research indicates that even if 40% of the materials are recycled, it takes approximately 65 years for a green, energy-efficient new office building to recover the energy lost in demolishing an existing building. And let’s face it: Most new buildings aren’t designed to last anywhere near 65 years. A report from the Brookings Institution projects that by 2030 we will have demolished and replaced nearly 1/3 of all existing buildings, largely because the vast majority of them weren’t designed and built to last any longer. How much energy will it take to demolish and replace those buildings? Enough to power the entire state of California for 10 years. http://berkeleyheritage.com/sp eeches/richard_moe.html And yet we wonder why more projects in Detroit aren't economically feasible. Insanity. |
Gogo Member Username: Gogo
Post Number: 1407 Registered: 11-2003
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 3:24 pm: | |
From Google Streetview. Some are approximates...
30 Owen
1523 E Jefferson
3067 E Grand
7036 W Jefferson
8611 Grinnell
1211 Dexter
30 E Philadelphia
31 Woodland
5XXX Concord
7800 Pierson
18110 Weaver
2903 Elmhurst
3265 W Boston
2330 Vinewood
1932 W Jefferson |
Patrick Member Username: Patrick
Post Number: 5324 Registered: 10-2003
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 4:10 pm: | |
Ah, the Somerset on Jefferson. I started a thread about this a while back. It's a shame. |
Masterblaster Member Username: Masterblaster
Post Number: 157 Registered: 03-2005
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 4:25 pm: | |
It is too bad that 3 large mid-rise apartment buildings located just off of Woodward in the North End neighbhorhood are on this list (Owen, Philadelphia, Woodlands). The apartment building across from the Old Northern High School was occupied only a few years ago. It would be nice if these buildings were mothballed for just a couple of more years. If that Woodward light-rail gets built by 2012, these buildings proximity to Woodward might lend them to restoration. ALSO, I knew the second I heard that part of Kilpatrick's speech that the Rich-Dex Apartment Building at 12211 Dexter was one of those buildings that were targeted for demolition. I really wish Southwest Solutions would create a Northwest Solutions and renovate that apartment building/storefront. What a shot in the arm that would be to the Dexter-Davison Area. But the building looks really bad.... ...BUT not nearly as bad as that school at 615 West End, or that half-burnt down apartment building at 7800 Pierson in the Warrendale neighborhood right next to Rouge Park. Y'all folks really to need to see these buildings, they look unbelievable! Lastly, those buildings on Vinewood and East Jefferson should be saved. Even though fire-damaged, that Vinewood warehouse would be great for artists lofts - it is very near to the Hubbard Farms neighborhood/Vernor Commercial district. |
Spacemonkey Member Username: Spacemonkey
Post Number: 352 Registered: 03-2006
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 4:53 pm: | |
My dad worked at the listed building on Iron Street. He worked at Warnock Spring Company there. They made springs for the auto industry. He was quality control manager. Went out of biz years ago, in the late 80's I think. |
Hornwrecker Member Username: Hornwrecker
Post Number: 2006 Registered: 04-2005
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 4:55 pm: | |
Looks like they're trying to sneak in part of the Packard plant, with the address listed on Concord. |
Spacemonkey Member Username: Spacemonkey
Post Number: 356 Registered: 03-2006
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 5:02 pm: | |
I used to work at the Fudge Packard Plant over there on Six Mile near Menjos. |
Neilr Member Username: Neilr
Post Number: 706 Registered: 06-2005
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 5:24 pm: | |
Gogo, thanks for posting the pictures. Masterblaster, I agree about the Northend apartment buildings. Especially 30 Owen. Many years ago, I included 30 Owen on a tour I developed of little-known beautiful Detroit doorways. If you like to see the beauty in interesting architecture that may have fallen into disuse and ruin, drive by this building and take a good look at it before it's gone. It's a 6 story apartment with 4 units per floor. Every apartment has ventilation on 3 sides. There are multiple bay windows that allowed much light and air to enter the apartments. This was especially important in the days before air conditioning and abundant electrical lighting. If you look upward, you'll see an extravagant use of terra cotta around the upper windows and cornice. Most of the windows are double-hung; but the corner sunrooms of the front apartments are multi-pane wooden casements. Finally, look past the weeds and steel plated security door at the fluted columns and broken pediment over the front door. As the saying goes, "They don't make 'em like that anymore." Once it's gone, I believe that it is quite unlikely to be replaced by anything so outstanding. It will be Detroit's loss. |
Ed_golick Member Username: Ed_golick
Post Number: 958 Registered: 10-2003
| Posted on Tuesday, April 08, 2008 - 6:30 pm: | |
Neilr, I agree with you. I look at the Owen building every day. It's a shame that it can't/won't be refurbished. |
Detroitrise Member Username: Detroitrise
Post Number: 1928 Registered: 09-2007
| Posted on Wednesday, April 09, 2008 - 7:36 pm: | |
Hey, if Kwame goes down, the city goes down with him (building by building, person by person). |
Bulletmagnet Member Username: Bulletmagnet
Post Number: 1187 Registered: 01-2007
| Posted on Wednesday, April 09, 2008 - 8:00 pm: | |
I say we keep all of the buildings in question, and raze the rest of the city. It's too far gone to keep, so lets do it. After all, it's just a matter of time...tic...tic...tic... |