 
Ggores
Member
Username: Ggores
Post Number: 69
Registered: 10-2007
| | Posted on Friday, May 02, 2008 - 8:12 am: |    |
friday - it is now day five of the mighty Mover's trucker's strike/protest against a 20% paycut (I repeat - OUCH!). gotta hand it to those four fella's, they may be fighting a losing battle, but they gots heart. |
Strathcona
Member
Username: Strathcona
Post Number: 8
Registered: 03-2008
| | Posted on Friday, May 02, 2008 - 8:35 am: | |
Electric cars may stall public transportation. |
Ggores
Member
Username: Ggores
Post Number: 70
Registered: 10-2007
| | Posted on Friday, May 02, 2008 - 11:29 am: | |
there is now six picketeer's. |
Mwilbert
Member
Username: Mwilbert
Post Number: 210
Registered: 11-2007
| | Posted on Friday, May 02, 2008 - 12:30 pm: | |
"Electric cars may stall public transportation."
It is possible. Certainly not having electric cars is going to spur public transit, because gas costs are going to be more and more difficult for a larger and larger segment of the population to deal with. The problem is that right now, electric cars (as opposed to glorified golf carts) are too expensive for that segment of the population as well.
I am somewhat surprised I haven't seen more people switching to motorcycles, scooters, or electric bikes. But people are still in the process of adjustment, so perhaps I will. |
Spacemonkey
Member
Username: Spacemonkey
Post Number: 524
Registered: 03-2006
| | Posted on Friday, May 02, 2008 - 8:06 pm: | |
Gas prices are really high these days. |
Sean_of_detroit
Member
Username: Sean_of_detroit
Post Number: 216
Registered: 03-2008
| | Posted on Friday, May 02, 2008 - 8:29 pm: | |
I don't think it will. It's all speculation, but I see a split coming. Many will pick public transit, as that will appear to be the cheapest option. The ones who need their cars, and the ones who will try to keep their cars no matter what, will be more inclined to buy electric. Even those people with electric cars will probably still utilize mass transit. I really think they could, and should all have a place. |
Detroitrise
Member
Username: Detroitrise
Post Number: 2039
Registered: 09-2007
| | Posted on Friday, May 02, 2008 - 8:33 pm: | |
Not trying to throw off the topic, but I will be laughing in my grave if Detroit were to finally get mass transit but no one used it anymore because we were flying hover carts.  |
Sean_of_detroit
Member
Username: Sean_of_detroit
Post Number: 218
Registered: 03-2008
| | Posted on Friday, May 02, 2008 - 8:50 pm: | |
That's irrelevant. It's still the same idea as a car. Many would still rather have someone else drive. Even a self driving unit would require someone ready to be able to take over if there was an emergency. |
Jimaz
Member
Username: Jimaz
Post Number: 5268
Registered: 12-2005
| | Posted on Friday, May 02, 2008 - 9:23 pm: | |
|
Strathcona
Member
Username: Strathcona
Post Number: 9
Registered: 03-2008
| | Posted on Friday, May 02, 2008 - 9:38 pm: | |
where is that station? When was that photo taken? I paid $4.29 for diesel the other day. |
Jimaz
Member
Username: Jimaz
Post Number: 5269
Registered: 12-2005
| | Posted on Friday, May 02, 2008 - 9:46 pm: | |
I snagged that image from http://www.mckenziebanner.com/ 2005/2005news/news_Sep07_05.ht m then hacked it.
I know nothing. |
Jrvass
Member
Username: Jrvass
Post Number: 649
Registered: 01-2007
| | Posted on Sunday, May 04, 2008 - 8:53 am: | |
4.29-.39 is the norm... |
Jrvass
Member
Username: Jrvass
Post Number: 650
Registered: 01-2007
| | Posted on Sunday, May 04, 2008 - 8:57 am: | |
http://www.detroitgasprices.co m/index.aspx?s=Y&fuel=A&area=B irmingham&area=Bloomfield&area =Bloomfield+Hills&area=Clarkst on&area=Pontiac&area=Waterford &area=White+Lake+&station=All+ Stations&tme_limit=12&site=Det roit&srch=0&list=0 |
Darwinism
Member
Username: Darwinism
Post Number: 739
Registered: 06-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, May 04, 2008 - 10:50 am: | |
This is the reality of the matter, and please spread this information to every person you know. The majority of experts have predicted the problem of reaching 'peak oil' for a long time. Unfortunately, Americans and the world population continue to ignore the wrath of nature, or perhaps just ignorant of what lies ahead. Since 2002, the trend has been universally moving upwards sharply. Yes, there was a short few months of decline in 2006, but then since that point ..... the rise is becoming even worse.
It is normal to see price fluctuations from time to time at the pump, but don't be fooled. Don't start celebrating and going out to buy the newest gas guzzler. Price drops could happen from time to time ranging from a few straight days or even a few straights months - however, the declines will be minimal compared to the magnitude of increases.
Always keep this in the back of your mind and let others know, because it is our responsibility to educate those who are unaware. |
Parkguy
Member
Username: Parkguy
Post Number: 273
Registered: 04-2007
| | Posted on Sunday, May 04, 2008 - 1:20 pm: | |
Darwinism--
It's interesting to note that there have been three drops in the last 12 years: 97-99, 2001, and 2006, all of them about $15 per barrel. The first drop happened over two years, the second over one year, the third over five or six months... then in each case, back to a steep rise. How long will the next drop last... two or three months? I think that's what a lot of analysts predict, in a sense. Lots of volatility in the price of oil. It won't take much to cause a drop in prices, but it will take even less to cause sharp increases. And it will always trend upward for some time to come. Oil will never be cheap again, or at least not for long. |
3rdworldcity
Member
Username: 3rdworldcity
Post Number: 1122
Registered: 01-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, May 04, 2008 - 2:42 pm: | |
Parkguy is correct in his analysis. If you're an oil producer, "the trend is my friend."
I find it difficult to understand why so many folks are against SUV's. There's no gas shortage; their use of more gas per mile is not taking gas out of anyone's tank. Failing to buy them deprives the car companies of their biggest money makers and, hurt them, their employees and the communities in which they operate. SUVs are generally safer than smaller cars; I wouldn't want to hit by an SUV while driving a Cooper Mini. SUVs are far more comfortable than smaller vehicles in my opinion. Drivers of SUVs have a higher and therefore better view of the road. Many have off-road capability which is important to me and a lot of folks. Anyone with the money or ability to borrow it can buy any vehicle they can afford.
Could it be that the folks who villify them most vociferously are those who can't afford them?
And is you can afford an SUV and prefer another type of vehicle, that's fine, but does that make your neighbor who does buy one a bad guy? Or the SUV an evil machine? |
Sstashmoo
Member
Username: Sstashmoo
Post Number: 1378
Registered: 02-2007
| | Posted on Sunday, May 04, 2008 - 3:28 pm: | |
I'll try to think like a Bushite..
"Just think how much gas would be if we hadn't invaded Iraq" |
Retroit
Member
Username: Retroit
Post Number: 45
Registered: 04-2008
| | Posted on Sunday, May 04, 2008 - 4:02 pm: | |
Sign of the times: People not adjusting for inflation:
http://www.inflationdata.com/i nflation/images/charts/Oil/Gas oline_inflation_chart.htm
Another sign of the times: Speculators driving up the price of oil futures:
http://www.senate.gov/~levin/n ewsroom/release.cfm?id=257862 |
Jimaz
Member
Username: Jimaz
Post Number: 5279
Registered: 12-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, May 04, 2008 - 4:08 pm: | |
Fire Exit |
3rdworldcity
Member
Username: 3rdworldcity
Post Number: 1124
Registered: 01-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, May 04, 2008 - 5:09 pm: | |
Re: the second link above: Levin hasn't the foggiest idea what he's talking about. I take that back; he's a very smart guy and he does know, but he's a politician first and he's trying to make points with his constituants by shoveling the BS.
Levin says the market - I presume he's talking about about the NYMEX - should be policed to make sure it's keeping supply and demand in balance.
The fact is the NYMEX is a FUTURES market. Traders are betting on what they think supply and demand will be in the FUTURE.
The price of oil has a geopolitical risk factor built in and traders have to cope with what's in the minds of OPEC and other producers re: the U.S. dollar, and hence how much they will produce.
Oil prices are high (actually, they may be too low for all we know) because of politicians like Levin who fail to have more than a superficial knowledge of how the oil markets work, and for failing to pass a meaningful energy policy. |
Rustic
Member
Username: Rustic
Post Number: 3240
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Monday, May 05, 2008 - 8:01 pm: | |
Not Detroit but anyway ...
http://www.newsweek.com/id/135 638/page/2
Down on Its Luck
Las Vegas used to be a recession-proof oasis. Not anymore.
Steve Freiss
Newsweek Web Exclusive
Updated: 4:29 PM ET May 5, 2008
[The recession is] even hurting the city of Las Vegas, the economy of which was once thought to be impervious to the economic swings suffered by the rest of the country. Not anymore. ... [gambling revenues have] fallen 4 percent [this year], the number of conventions held has dropped 10.4 percent, and average daily room rates were off 3.8 percent in the first two months of 2008, according to the most recent data available. ... The stock price of MGM Mirage, owner of Bellagio, Mirage and eight other Strip resorts, has halved, from $100.50 in October to about $49 on Friday. In recent weeks the company eliminated 440 middle management jobs to save $75 million annually. "We made a structural change in our company to become more efficient and provide the same level of service, but we did have to advance that effort because we were also seeing a softening in the marketplace," says MGM Mirage spokesman Alan Feldman.
...
It doesn't help that the city's convention business is slipping. Several annual conventions have seen fewer attendees show up and have seen those who do come stay for shorter periods.
...
... Nearly 7 percent fewer cars crossed the Nevada-California border along Interstate 15 through February ... three airlines with substantial service to Las Vegas—Aloha, ATA and Champion—are going out of business.
Even the mortgage mess and the subsequent credit crunch have taken a toll on Vegas. Several major construction projects on the Strip are delayed due to financing problems ... [others] may be in jeopardy after developer ... defaulted on a $760 million loan ...
Despite such problems, ... [t]here is more than $30 billion in new construction scheduled for the Strip. And assuming those projects don't get squeezed by the credit crunch, some 40,000 new hotel rooms will be added to the current 136,000 by 2011, resulting in 100,000 new service sector jobs.
...
... Last week the Las Vegas Convention and Visitors Authority launched a $12 million three-month national TV ad blitz called "Vegas Right Now" that insists "that there are new reasons why you ought to come," ... In one [ad], called "The Dangers of Thinking," an announcer urges the audience to "do without thinking. Do Vegas right now." ... |
Sean_of_detroit
Member
Username: Sean_of_detroit
Post Number: 267
Registered: 03-2008
| | Posted on Monday, May 05, 2008 - 9:10 pm: | |
On the bright side, the years of Devil's Night arson should be over. It's just to expensive, and many criminals probably have other things to worry about now.
Bad joke? |
Dhugger
Member
Username: Dhugger
Post Number: 415
Registered: 03-2005
| | Posted on Monday, May 05, 2008 - 9:27 pm: | |
Visual observations from the inner ring of Detroit.
More people with bad teeth.
Older rusted cars including my 13 year old shoe box on wheels.
Food prices rising on a weekly basis.
Eating beans & vegetables & fruit like I did in college.
My recession diet is really much healthier. |
Lilpup
Member
Username: Lilpup
Post Number: 4195
Registered: 06-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 06, 2008 - 12:18 am: | |
That Vegas article is a prime example of how screwy thinking about the economy has become. A place almost 100% dependent upon disposable income dollars is believed to be recession proof?
...an all service economy, yeah, right.
edit for new news: Tropicana Entertainment files for Chapter 11 protection
(Message edited by lilpup on May 06, 2008) |
Retroit
Member
Username: Retroit
Post Number: 60
Registered: 04-2008
| | Posted on Tuesday, May 06, 2008 - 6:04 pm: | |
3rdworldcity, thanks for your views. The reason I selected that link from numerous others was because I wanted to debunk some of the arguments that people were making that it was solely supply and/or demand that was driving up the price of oil, and I figured that a report co-released by a Democrat & a Republican Senator would be as credible as any other source.
Now if I may attempt to refute your arguments:
The Senators are not interested in keeping supply and demand in balance as you allege, but rather that the price of oil should reflect the supply and demand and NOT the run up in price caused by financial speculators.
Yes, I realize that in an efficient and rational free market economy, traders factor in all the risks when determining buy and sell prices. But would you not admit that investors have, in the past, irrationally run up commodity prices (i.e. oil, gold, silver, etc. in the late 70's) as well as many other investment categories at other times (i.e. Real Estate in early 2000's, Tech stocks/NASDAQ in late 90's, Asian "Tiger Economies in mid 90's, Japan in mid 80's,......, Dutch Tulip Bulbs 1600's, etc.)?
If you disagree, I would be interested in your reply. |
Peachlaser
Member
Username: Peachlaser
Post Number: 178
Registered: 08-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 07, 2008 - 9:51 am: | |
Stupid Urban Vehicles (SUVs). I bet if everyone parked their SUVs for one week, the cost of gas would go down at least $1 a gallon. If you have a job where you need a big SUV, go for it. If you have a SUV just because it is big and it makes you feel powerful or stylish, ditch it.
I really wish they would start teaching basic math and science in schools again. No one seems to be able to calculate the following... If there are only 10 gallons of gas, the distance to be travelled is 100 miles and there is only one person per vehicle, how many vehicles can share the 10 gallons of gas?
1. If you get 10 mpg, how many vehicles can travel the 100 miles?
2. If you get 20 mpg, how many vehicles can travel the 100 miles?
3. If you get 30 mpg, how many vehicles can travel the 100 miles?
4. If you get 40 mpg, how many vehicles can travel the 100 miles?
5. If you get 50 mpg, how many vehicles can travel the 100 miles?
Answers if you needed them:
1. 1 vehicle
2. 2 vehicles
3. 3 vehicles
4. 4 vehicles
5. 5 vehicles
I guess I have been really discouraged hearing politicians talk about personal responsibility and entitlement. They talk the talk but don't walk the talk. No one can even utter the words EFFICIENCY and CONSERVATION. I thought that was part of self-responsibility... not to use any more than my share and do things as efficiently as I can.
I guess I've been most discouraged about the use of entitlement. It is usually mentioned in conjunction with welfare when in fact some of the most devastating affects occur in other ways. Many think they are entitled to drive the biggest, most in-efficient vehicle they can and then buy a SUV. And Detroit has been happy to sell it to them. "We just give them they want!", they say with a sheepish grin.
If you need to carry people, there are better, safer and more efficient ways to carry people than a SUV. SUVs are safer when they are the bigger of the vehicles in a accident. But, in general, they have such a high center of gravity that they roll over easily and end up killing people when all they were doing is making a standard evasive or corrective move.
But, more of the educated purchasers and those practicing self-responsibility (more efficient, safer, better mpg, alternative power sources) go elsewhere and buy.
But, it's more than just cars. With the cheap money and cheap Latin labor, people have been building homes in huge numbers the size of what I used to call a mansion. How are they going to heat and cool all this space and it's just for a small family or only a husband and a wife? And there are 10's of thousands of them that popped up in the past 7-8 years. These huge houses take a lot of energy and that figures into our energy requirements.
Years ago, I started a little web project but never had a chance to complete it, but I think you get the idea...
http://www.lasersol.com/air_wa ter/suv.html |
Gannon
Member
Username: Gannon
Post Number: 12642
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 07, 2008 - 10:16 am: | |
You ROCK, Peach. |
Lilpup
Member
Username: Lilpup
Post Number: 4205
Registered: 06-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 07, 2008 - 10:48 am: | |
It would be interesting to see how much oil consumption is really used for gasoline compared to other products (plastics, inks, industrial processes, heating, etc.). |
Craig
Member
Username: Craig
Post Number: 777
Registered: 02-2007
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 07, 2008 - 11:08 am: | |
Also interesting to observe the impact of 55 mph speed limit upon amount consumed.
I'm for a lower speed limit if it lowers consumption & thereby lowers the price of fuel via less demand. |
Vivadetroit
Member
Username: Vivadetroit
Post Number: 16
Registered: 04-2008
| | Posted on Wednesday, May 07, 2008 - 10:55 pm: | |
a sign of the these times... There was a Monster.com job fair in Southgate yesterday. I waited in line for n hour & 15 mins just to get in the door cause the line wrapped around the hotel. Never experienced that before at a job fair. Shows you how many people need a job. Worst part, only 1-2 of the 20 companies there were actually accepting resumes. The rest said "go online to apply" - that really pissed people off. |
Ggores
Member
Username: Ggores
Post Number: 102
Registered: 10-2007
| | Posted on Thursday, June 05, 2008 - 3:01 pm: | |
saw this guy the other day, he was standing by the side of the road, waving at passing traffic. he was wearing suspenders which held his red and white checkered pants. he was sportin' a beer belly too! he wore no hat and no make-up, but did have a heavy 5 o' clock shadow - and a Big Boy shirt. he was in front of a Big Boy. THAT'S pretty tight! |
Ronjm23
Member
Username: Ronjm23
Post Number: 5
Registered: 11-2007
| | Posted on Thursday, June 05, 2008 - 3:47 pm: | |
Gasoline as a ratio of income is still not as bad as you might think. I started driving in 1963. Gasoline was about thirty cents per gallon. I drove a 62 Pontiac Catalina convertible, got about 12 mpg. I was making $66 / wk. Gas now is about $4 / gallon but I earn substantially more than $660 per week. As a ratio of income, my income has risen greater than the cost of gasoline. Please note that I am not thrilled about paying >$60.00 to fill my tank. I'll bet that many people posting never saw gas below a dollar a gallon. Not to rub it in but how many people on this forum remember the gas wars of the early 60's when the major stations were squeezing the independent stations? I do. In 1964 I put 5 gallons of regular in my tank for $1.00. Yup, it was 19.9 cents per gallon. Those days are gone. |
Gannon
Member
Username: Gannon
Post Number: 13015
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, June 05, 2008 - 4:08 pm: | |
I don't think a lower limit should be enforced...that experiment failed miserably...just let those who WANT to drive the minimum do so, as long as they park their slow-ass but rational selves in the righthand lane. I get amazing mileage at 55 mph...goes from just under 30 to over 40!
As for then versus now scenarios...back then we wouldn't IMAGINE paying for television, had one phone in the hallway at home (never dreamed of a portable unit I could watch TV on)...and the marketeers had not determined yet what dollar amounts they could entice most to spend without thinking onto a credit card that isn't tangible money for services and goods we largely do NOT need.
NOBODY imagined gourmet coffee shops taking $3-5 for some version of burnt chocolate coffee...OR a daily expense for drinking water! Plus, blue jeans were just that.
I worked at a gas station on W.Warren just west of Wyoming when the gas prices first peaked over a buck. Had fun determining how to set the price on the pole sign...it wasn't made for three digits! |
Rid0617
Member
Username: Rid0617
Post Number: 168
Registered: 03-2008
| | Posted on Thursday, June 05, 2008 - 4:57 pm: | |
Telling on my age here, my first job at 16 years old was working at a full service gas station. Self service haden't been invented yet. Every day price was 32.9 and often we would have gas wars down in the teens.
I have found a trick for people who do not want to get rid of large safer cars or people who do not want to take on a car payment.
I have a 1989 Lincoln Town Car, 98,125 actual miles, 302 V8 Electronic fuel injection. By advancing the timing the car steadily averages 20-21 in the city, 25-26 on the highway. It does rob a little power compared to a normal 302 but not noticeable. When the temp is in the 90s the engine does run a little warmer with slight valve rattle when under a strain but middle grade takes care of that.
Thinking it was particular to Lincolns we tried it on my wifes 1989 Mercury Grand Marquis. Identical engine, 101,412 actual miles. Identical results.
So, if people do this why should we take on driving an unsafe econobox, have a car payment and be required to have full coverage insurance. Just my tip for those it may help |
Dianeinaustin
Member
Username: Dianeinaustin
Post Number: 40
Registered: 02-2008
| | Posted on Thursday, June 05, 2008 - 5:44 pm: | |
Rid617,
I have a 1987 Merc Grand Marquise with 108,000 miles. How much hotter does the engine run? I live in Texas and it is summer here. Don't want to kill my car as I just put in a new transmission last week. |
Warrenite84
Member
Username: Warrenite84
Post Number: 319
Registered: 01-2007
| | Posted on Thursday, June 05, 2008 - 9:59 pm: | |
Hey Gannon, remember when the pumps couldn't show prices over 1$, so they started charging by the half-gallon?
In all seriousness, here are some ways to lower gas AND food prices IMHO: Drill here, open new refinaries(efficient ones), quit growing and subsiding corn ethanol production, build ethanol production on non-food sources, such as switchgrass.
Since America has the technology and know-how to drill and refine in environmentally sensitive ways, why drill elsewhere with a higher risk of polluting the environment?
Where can we grow millions of acres of this switchgrass to make a lot of ethanol? How about publicly owned highway medians? Lets lease, or pay a nominal amount to, ethanol producers to grow the switchgrass in these areas & maintain the roadside area. It is near the highway infrastructure, so the switchgrass and ethanol can be moved quickly to markets.
I had heard , but do not know if it is true, that China is drilling for oil in the Gulf, in areas Congress says we can't. Is this true? What have you heard? |
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