Discuss Detroit Archives - January 2008 Why cant Detroit get these lofts. Previous Next
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Umbound
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Username: Umbound

Post Number: 114
Registered: 02-2008
Posted on Monday, April 28, 2008 - 5:08 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I was in Birmingham today and i noticed those Eton Street lofts that were really nice. It was like a whole little neighborhood. Why cant Detroit get something like this but in a bigger scale. i think it would be pretty amazing.
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Drankin21
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Username: Drankin21

Post Number: 242
Registered: 12-2003
Posted on Monday, April 28, 2008 - 5:14 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Those lofts are not selling and many people have lost money now that they need to move for family size/job issues. The concept is great when grown from need.
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Mbr
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Username: Mbr

Post Number: 386
Registered: 03-2005
Posted on Monday, April 28, 2008 - 5:19 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

They would be a lot cooler if you could actually pick up a commuter train there.
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Umbound
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Username: Umbound

Post Number: 115
Registered: 02-2008
Posted on Monday, April 28, 2008 - 5:24 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yeah thats true it would seem great for empty nester's and such. i would like to live there it seems nice but a little empty with almost no tenants.
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Soulhawk
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Username: Soulhawk

Post Number: 347
Registered: 04-2004
Posted on Monday, April 28, 2008 - 11:13 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I live in Detroit to avoid Birmingham. If you love Birmingham elitist snobs so much, then go over to B-Ham yes and leave us alone. "Indie Cool Meets Birmingham Luxe." Barf vomit puke
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Soulhawk
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Username: Soulhawk

Post Number: 348
Registered: 04-2004
Posted on Monday, April 28, 2008 - 11:13 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I live in Detroit to avoid Birmingham. If you love Birmingham elitist snobs so much, then go over to B-Ham yes and leave us alone. "Indie Cool Meets Birmingham Luxe." Barf vomit puke
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Fareastsider
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Username: Fareastsider

Post Number: 873
Registered: 08-2006
Posted on Monday, April 28, 2008 - 11:33 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I wish I were as socially aware as that! Why does Detroit and its neighbors not get along again? By the way I have not been to a neighborhood built since 1970 in 8 months and counting. Unless you know good urban design I just dont associate with those types of suburban dwellers. . . .
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Sparty06
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Username: Sparty06

Post Number: 101
Registered: 03-2007
Posted on Monday, April 28, 2008 - 11:44 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Fareastsider, that's really sad that you haven't ventured outside your little box in that long. To me, while I try and promote the CoD at every chance I truly enjoy "everything" that this region has to offer. Detroit isn't NYC and all the great activities, restaurants, etc. aren't located downtown with nothing in the suburbs. I think you should try and open your mind and enjoy some of the advantages that come with living in the metro area. This is the sort of regionalism that hinders growth rather than encouraging it. Outsiders don't see us as the city/suburbs they see as the SE Michigan region and we should promote all the great aspects of this region.
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Detroitstar
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Username: Detroitstar

Post Number: 1078
Registered: 01-2006
Posted on Monday, April 28, 2008 - 11:51 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

That guy is an idiot.

I live in Detroit, but I find that Birmingham has plenty to offer our region. It is okay to support both the city and the suburbs. As soon as people get that through their thick heads the better off we will all be.
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Dougw
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Username: Dougw

Post Number: 2092
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Monday, April 28, 2008 - 11:55 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Detroit does have some new loft developments such as the Ellington, which are somewhat upscale, so there are some options in Detroit. I haven't seen the Eton Street lofts up close in person to compare, though.
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Atwater
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Username: Atwater

Post Number: 187
Registered: 09-2007
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 12:09 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Quote Soulhawk:

quote:

I live in Detroit to avoid Birmingham. If you love Birmingham elitist snobs so much, then go over to B-Ham yes and leave us alone. "Indie Cool Meets Birmingham Luxe." Barf vomit puke



And if living in Detroit means living amongst immature, discriminatory, narrow-minded anti-Birmingham types like you, than count me the hell out. I love Detroit, and I love Birmingham as well. The fact that you call residents of Birmingham "elitist snobs" (and then give a "Barf vomit puke") speaks volumes about you.. and nothing positive.
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Mind_field
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Username: Mind_field

Post Number: 881
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 12:33 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Municipality boundaries shouldn't mean much in the modern world. What should matter, and what WILL matter, is how places are developed. Birmingham, Ferndale, Royal Oak and Pontiac are great assets to our region because they offer somewhat urban alternatives to the city. The chance to possibly live a carless lifestyle, and maybe in the future utilize mass transit on Woodward. These Woodward suburbs will become increasingly interconnected with each other and the city of Detroit, especially as a new light rail line is built from Pontiac to downtown Detroit.
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Atwater
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Username: Atwater

Post Number: 189
Registered: 09-2007
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 12:39 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I agree 100% with all that Mind_field just wrote.
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Fareastsider
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Username: Fareastsider

Post Number: 875
Registered: 08-2006
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 12:45 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Um. . . .uh. . Sparty I thought it was quite clear I was being sarcastic. Just trying to bring the "Im so aware of good design and level living standards" crowd down a bit from their soap box. Come on have not been in a new sub in 8 months is that even believable!
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Sparty06
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Username: Sparty06

Post Number: 102
Registered: 03-2007
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 12:52 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Maybe, you never know with DetroitYes! Sometimes I think this place has more threads on hating the 'burbs than it does about the city. Maybe they should start another forum called SuburbsNo!
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Danny
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Username: Danny

Post Number: 7315
Registered: 02-2004
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 12:55 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Soulhawk,

Great post! Your efforts for keeping Detroit black forever is paying off.
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Fareastsider
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Username: Fareastsider

Post Number: 877
Registered: 08-2006
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 1:21 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Sparty when your right you are right!
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Wolverine
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Username: Wolverine

Post Number: 451
Registered: 04-2004
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 1:29 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

No more lofts for now! They are empty everywhere! Rode my bike past the Ellington the other day and noticed the sun shining into an incredible amount of vacant units. The picture is the same across the metro.
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Deteamster
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Username: Deteamster

Post Number: 112
Registered: 07-2007
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 1:32 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'm going to play the devil's advocate(sort of) here.
Firstly, it is obvious that suburbs like Ferndale, Birmingham, Dearborn, Pontiac, and Royal Oak are integral and invaluable to our region's future. They are adept to a dense, unified urban layout much more than say, Macomb Township.
However, Detroit still is, and needs to be our urban center. On that note, for a plethora of reasons, Detroit needs peoples' business- and most importantly, residents- than a place like Birmingham ever will. There is money and power and people there already, and Detroit is hanging on by a thread, despite its importance and potential.
While calling the residents of Birmingham "elitist snobs" is certainly provocative and derogatory, it should not be dismissed. We live in the most segregated region in the country. As most of you who actually live around here have experienced, individuals who live in the suburbs will spend years- now generations- without setting foot in the city. We live in a region of the obscenely rich and the Third-World poor, and the most extreme textbook example of white flight.
Downplaying the elitism and even open racism that thrives in places like Birmingham doesn't make it go away. Racism and close-mindedness thrives in the black community of Detroit, as well. Admitting there is a problem is the first step towards finding a solution.
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Kpm
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Username: Kpm

Post Number: 88
Registered: 08-2005
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 7:59 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

FYI -- here's a link:
http://www.crosswindsus.com/mi chigan/birmingham_eton_street/ eton.htm

I, for one, really like this development and love the neighborhood that it is a part of.
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Danny
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Username: Danny

Post Number: 7319
Registered: 02-2004
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 9:11 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Deteamster,

That 's " MICH-ississippi" for you!
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Rustic
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Username: Rustic

Post Number: 3233
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 9:39 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"Why cant Detroit get these lofts."

ummm ... lets see ... urban scale loft developments (that aren't selling) atop empty street level storefronts beside dusty sidewalks and along streets devoid of cars ...

... and your point is? ...
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Melocoton
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Username: Melocoton

Post Number: 24
Registered: 01-2008
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 9:47 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"Indie cool meets Birmingam luxe" IS the most nauseating slogan ever, though.
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Sciencefair
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Username: Sciencefair

Post Number: 86
Registered: 10-2007
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 9:52 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I live in a loft in Detroit. It's great. I love it. I also enjoy visiting Ferndale, Birmingham, etc. What's the big deal with all of this?
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Umbound
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Username: Umbound

Post Number: 117
Registered: 02-2008
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 10:19 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I like everything about the WHOLE area of Detroit(thats including suburbs) but it sounds like soulhawk is just trying to instigate something when i asked a simple question. But its ok by me his mind can still live in 1967 while everybody else is living in 2008.
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Danindc
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Username: Danindc

Post Number: 4183
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 10:23 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I think the title of the thread is misleading. It suggests that all developments are prizes to be "won" by different municipalities, as if the developer is hellbent on constructing a new edifice without consideration for location. This smacks highly of the municipal poaching that has plagued and weakened Southeast Michigan for decades.

New construction goes where conditions dictate. In other words, Birmingham has a walkable, semi-urban environment, with a potential customer base of highly educated, high income people. If you compare to the demographics of Detroit, you easily see that's it's not a matter of finding "any" site, but the "right" site.

Detroit would see a lot more development like this if it focused on creating conditions that attracted the same demographic. I don't mean to imply that current residents should be given the heave-ho, but that Detroit desperately needs to diversify its population base if it wants anything other than liquor stores and coney islands.
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Ndavies
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Username: Ndavies

Post Number: 2979
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 10:33 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The title of this thread is even more misleading since Crosswinds is building very similar projects in the city. These are no different than the townhouses in Brush park and or the lofts they built on Woodward in New center.

The ones in Birmingham are just more expensive versions of the same thing.
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Illwill
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Username: Illwill

Post Number: 113
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 10:57 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I can't believe what i'm reading. Detroit has tons of lofts-some upscale and others are the "true" meaning of a loft. I can assure you that Detroit has more upscale lofts than all of Birmingham. Second, Detroit is just fine with all the liquor stores and coney islands. Chicago has no problem what so ever with liquor stores, bars that open at 9 a.m and hot dog stands on every corner and it's getting along just fine. Variety is what makes a great city. What Detroit needs are jobs and better city services.
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Danindc
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Username: Danindc

Post Number: 4185
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 11:09 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

quote:

Detroit is just fine with all the liquor stores and coney islands. Chicago has no problem what so ever with liquor stores, bars that open at 9 a.m and hot dog stands on every corner and it's getting along just fine. Variety is what makes a great city.



Reread what you wrote.
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Gogo
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Username: Gogo

Post Number: 1414
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 11:49 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I think what makes Eton street different from lots in Detroit is the live/work aspect. I don't know of any new live/work lofts that have been built with this template in mind for Detroit (maybe Willys Overland?).

I think what makes them unsuccessful at Eton Street is that they are somewhat isolated from downtown Birmingham and the storefronts do not benefit from any street activity from surrounding businesses or developments.

What might make these a good model for Detroit (particularly areas like Midtown) is that there is a noticeable lake of businesses and there are many people who want to open a business in Detroit, but cannot afford rent or whatever. However, many may be able to afford a mortgage for a home, which just so happens to have a storefront that they can operate their business out of.

I don't think we should be writing off the concept of a live/work loft just because it is unsuccessful in Birmingham. This is a model that could have great potential in some areas of Detroit where we have the residential density but lack store front retail. Such developments might be a good way to fill in the retail gap in many of Detroit's streets.
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Umbound
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Username: Umbound

Post Number: 118
Registered: 02-2008
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 12:59 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I think this would be perfect for Midtown actually. if i went to Wayne State or CCS and those lofts off a side street would make me want to move there on the campus.
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Chris_rohn
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Username: Chris_rohn

Post Number: 428
Registered: 04-2005
Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 1:14 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The site plan alone makes me hate it. This development is an isolated island.
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Vivadetroit
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Username: Vivadetroit

Post Number: 9
Registered: 04-2008
Posted on Thursday, May 01, 2008 - 8:54 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

umbound, there are some pretty "luxe lofts" in Detroit -- not to rehash what everyone else said, but one weekend go visit some of the nicer lofts in the D. If I had the money I'd like one of the Willys Overland top floor duplex lofts. Research Lofts over near WSU has duplex lofts w/ great balconies at decent prices.

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