  Eboyer Member Username: Eboyer Post Number: 102 Registered: 01-2007 |
Decide for yourself... http://www.detnews.com/apps/pb cs.dll/article?AID=/20080428/B IZ/804280422/1361 | ||
Mbr Member Username: Mbr Post Number: 387 Registered: 03-2005 |
This kind of sums it up: "In losing Cullen to Gilbert, GM essentially is gaining another advocate for downtown. And Detroit is retaining a talented, if sometimes controversial, figure that has made a quantifiable difference in the city's halting redevelopment." | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 4705 Registered: 02-2005 |
Well the common interests between Cullen and Gilbert probably aren't the only reason he's going to Quicken, but I think it confirms that Quicken is definitely going forward with their downtown plan. I don't honestly know why the mayoral situation could/should change QL's plans. Nobody is changing their bet on Detroit because one politican was caught, especially if you assume that most politicians are corrupt, and Kilpatrick was one that happened to be caught. | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 6736 Registered: 08-2004 |
This is definitely good news!! Also, Matt Cullen's wife Karen works for the Ilitch's. And with the Cullen pair, and the fact that the Ilitch's are friends with the Gilberts... I think this bodes well for the Statler/Tuller site. | ||
401don Member Username: 401don Post Number: 396 Registered: 11-2007 |
I can see Gilbert using Cullen's ties/contacts to help spearhead light rail which will be more important to Quicken with their employee demographics than to GM, Compuware, etc. | ||
Ericsprague Member Username: Ericsprague Post Number: 50 Registered: 02-2006 |
Some details not in the detnews arrticle, such as mention of the privately-funded light rail effort... http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs .dll/article?AID=/20080428/COL 06/80428076 | ||
Pmardo Member Username: Pmardo Post Number: 75 Registered: 03-2006 |
Matt Cullen was a powerful leader at GM - I wish him well and hope his shoes are filled with someone similar. | ||
Sean_of_detroit Member Username: Sean_of_detroit Post Number: 179 Registered: 03-2008 |
Didn't a rep already say they chose the Hudson Block? Cullen has it. 1x1! We all need to be making sure existing projects are strongly supported. This is good news. | ||
Detroitrise Member Username: Detroitrise Post Number: 2022 Registered: 09-2007 |
It would be a depressing blow if they chose the Hudson block, but the fact that they're still re-locating downtown makes up for it.  | ||
Kpm Member Username: Kpm Post Number: 89 Registered: 08-2005 |
Twelve years ago, Matt Cullen orchestrated General Motors Corp.’s $500 million acquisition and move of its headquarters into downtown Detroit’s Renaissance Center and subsequent renovation of the building and riverfront. Now he’s been tapped by billionaire Dan Gilbert to shepherd Quicken Loans Inc.’s venture from Livonia to Detroit and operate as what amounts to being Gilbert’s right-hand business development man. http://www.crainsdetroit.com/a pps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/2008 0428/REG/732139839/-1 | ||
Chuckjav Member Username: Chuckjav Post Number: 515 Registered: 09-2007 |
I'm not understanding why so many people are fired-up about Detroit's relationship with Quicken Loans Inc. The mortgage loan industry is going to hell-in-a hand basket; the recent acquisition of Countrywide (by Bank of America) is indicative of the industry's extreme volatility. How much longer to you suppose Quicken will remain on the face of our tiny blue planet? The only thing Detroit will have to show for its Quicken love affair - another frikkin' empty building. | ||
Professorscott Member Username: Professorscott Post Number: 1240 Registered: 12-2006 |
Quicken doesn't make loans, it just brokers them. A much less risky position right now, I think. | ||
Mdoyle Member Username: Mdoyle Post Number: 380 Registered: 10-2006 |
Yeah they aren't a bank. Also 5,500 jobs moving to Detroit is not a bad thing. | ||
Chuckjav Member Username: Chuckjav Post Number: 516 Registered: 09-2007 |
Professorscott....I don't think so; Quicken may no longer generate second mortgages & HELOCs - but they're still a straight-up mortgage loan company | ||
Spacemonkey Member Username: Spacemonkey Post Number: 480 Registered: 03-2006 |
I agree with Chuckjav. Quicken is largely to blame for the present mortgage industry fallout and real estate downturn. Why be so eager to sell Detroit's soul and get in bed with the devil? Detroit may as well legalize prostitution and drugs while it's at it. | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 4707 Registered: 02-2005 |
Unbelievable. In the end, people are responsible for the loans they sign on to. Nobody's been able to prove false advertising or questionable practices on QL. Caveat emptor. I'd say 5000 jobs, a top-ranked employer and their diversified group of spinoffs, and a big-name financial services company are things we want downtown. With all those spinoffs being put downtown, it leaves some margin for error...they can't all fail, and downtown will net a lot of new workers over the next five years. It also goes so far to change the mindset. More people will talk about the advantages of working downtown, more people will be interested in moving downtown, and the very fact that a big name like QL chose downtown Detroit (in addition to Compuware and GM etc) will give the City credibility when other companies consider where they will locate in Michigan. (Message edited by mackinaw on April 29, 2008) | ||
Spacemonkey Member Username: Spacemonkey Post Number: 482 Registered: 03-2006 |
Nothing like passing off bad loans to investors... | ||
Spacemonkey Member Username: Spacemonkey Post Number: 485 Registered: 03-2006 |
Quicken / Rock preyed upon the public's general ignorance of the mortgage biz about how loans work. They purposely sold high-risk, sub-prime loans to people with poor credit. Slick brokers talked people into these loans. People trusted their broker's advice. Why wouldn't they? We trust our doctors and other professional's advice too. Now many families are foreclosing due to the junk loans Quicken sold. There was no way those loans were going to work to the customer's benefit. I'm not being sarcastic. The company operated fraudulently. I'd like to see them go out of business as Countrywide et. al. call upon them to buy back their junk loans. Was I burned by Rock? No. I didn't take a risky loan. But I feel for those who did. | ||
Kid_dynamite Member Username: Kid_dynamite Post Number: 518 Registered: 06-2007 |
Spacemonkey, you are becoming one of my least favorite users of this forum. Your perpetual idiotic blurbs contain little more than immature one-liners and feeble attempts at humor. I am not mainly referring to this thread. Cracking a joke hear or there is OK, but that's pretty much all you have to offer. Why don't to try to contribute to one of these conversations with something that others would actually have an interest in reading? | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 4708 Registered: 02-2005 |
So because they weren't very nice to people, they should go out of business, and the region should lose another 3,000 jobs. Where does this moral police draw the line? Should we banish the Big Three because they have helped created global warming? Should they cease to exist because their salespeople convince people to buy cars that will need untold dollars in repairs over time, and depreciate rapidly? No. That's the rule of sales, and in the end, the buyers are responsible. This is no place to bring your bleeding heart. | ||
Johnlodge Member Username: Johnlodge Post Number: 6393 Registered: 10-2003 |
quote: When making the biggest financial decision of your life, perhaps one should do something about their "general ignorance" before taking the next step. Do you always trust salesmen? I don't. Nor do I expect them to educated me properly. I expect them to try to sell me something. | ||
Rugbyman Member Username: Rugbyman Post Number: 320 Registered: 06-2005 |
Honestly, man- is that really what you think about the mortgage industry as a whole? Were there fraudulent or predatory lenders out there? Most definitely. Is Quicken one of those? Nope. Along your line of thinking it's not the drug addict's fault, it's those pesky dealers that offered him the drugs, taking advantage of his ignorance. Though I'm a liberal, I still recognize that people ought to be held accountable for their own fuckups. Are credit card solicitations predatory, or should people be expected to know that taking out and maxing five credit cards probably isn't a good idea? Let's not shit ourselves here- people often ARE pretty ignorant about how markets work and what to do with their money. But no one held a gun to subprime owners heads and said sign on the line. Their ignorance is on them- not going through due diligence is your fault, not the guy on the other end. In fact, I'd be willing to wager that in 90% of the subprime loans that people are getting screwed on, their own lack of common sense (i.e. don't buy what you can't pay for) was the reason they got into the mess they are in. How are you going to put that on the guy selling them the loan? Sometimes the ignorance of some people on this board just astounds me. | ||
Buzzman0077 Member Username: Buzzman0077 Post Number: 171 Registered: 11-2006 |
On top of all that, the responsibility lies on the person who signed the mortgage. It's not the loan companies fault that these people didn't take the time to properly read and research their loans before they took them. It was greed on behalf of both parties that led to the downfall. The greed of the mortgage companies in brokering loans to sub-prime people, and the greed of those same people taking out loans to buy things they deep down should have known they couldn't afford. | ||
Kid_dynamite Member Username: Kid_dynamite Post Number: 519 Registered: 06-2007 |
"They purposely sold high-risk, sub-prime loans to people with poor credit." QL barely ever dabbled into the subprime market. You have no idea what you are talking about. Nice try. | ||
Rugbyman Member Username: Rugbyman Post Number: 321 Registered: 06-2005 |
BTW, Johnlodge, that's not a bleeding heart he's showing, that's just flat out stupidity. Us liberals aren't all complete morons. Most of us have even passed an economics class. | ||
Belleislerunner Member Username: Belleislerunner Post Number: 406 Registered: 12-2003 |
Much of what goes on relative to Quicken is speculative unless someone works there as Quicken is no longer a public company. Which means they don't file quarterly SEC filings depicting their financial information. The info they do release is PR spun to make the Company look good - just as any other Company does. Countrywide, while a loan originator, is also a bank and thus required to retain a certain percentage of loans it sold. Meaning if the loan defaults - Countrywide - as opposed to the investors (e.g. ML, Bear, Morgan) which are constantly writing down the value of their investments backed by subprime loans. Thus it's not a fair comparison to compare Quicken to Countrywide. A more accurate representation would be to look at the actual loans made by Quicken, sold to investors via securitizations and now in default. But that info isn't easily disclosed in prospectus etc of securitizations. If Quicken was one of the largest loan originators in Metro Detroit, which is now in the top 10 in forceclosure, there's a good chance many of those loans were Quicken originated. Companies heavily advertising zero interest loans, jumbo arms etc tended to make the loans to less than perfect buyers because if the loans defaulted - that Company wasn't on the hook. Is there a place to see stats on the loans Quicken originated to see conforming vs non conforming etc? prime vs subprime? Or the vintage/location of loans? I would probably argue Quicken may have breached an "ethical obligation" to tell their customers what they were getting into - as many there had a large portion of salary derived from commission. However, they may not have had the legal "fiduciary responsibility". I remember when i was looking to get pre-approved for a mortgage in brush park around 2004 - I called them and the lady wanted some $500 fee for preacceptance/approval or whatever the process was. That raised my red flags and I backed down. No one should ever feel rushed to get into a mortgage. | ||
Detroitmaybe Member Username: Detroitmaybe Post Number: 101 Registered: 03-2008 |
Thanks Belleislerunner...I do agree!! Quicken has definitely directly or indirectly attributed to the crisis that we are dealing with right now. They had a very specific marketing strategy...remember those zero interest commercials during Pistons games? They specifically targeted unsuspecting victims, reeled them in, and caught them! I have a cousin that worked for them for several years, and has told me many stories of their unethical business practices...not just towards their customers, but employees too. (check out ripoffreport.com) It is naive to believe that a company that is still (supposedly)thriving in an industry that has destroyed the real estate market as we know it, would not be involved in some unethical practices. BTW, David Hall (remember him) was fired for mortgage fraud!•• hummmm???? I do hope that they are able to survive and move Downtown, though! We need all the help we can get!! | ||
Higgs1634 Member Username: Higgs1634 Post Number: 394 Registered: 10-2005 |
Setting aside for the moment the ethical debate about Quicken's conduct and rapid growth, the simple fact is that the industry Quicken is involved in is going through a heretofore unheard of upheaval. Quicken can originate all it wants, but as noted, it's not a bank. It needs someone to take the paper. The money backing the loans has dried up for all but those with pristine credit. The era of 'liar loans' and 110% mortgages is over. I would bet that a year or so into its "due diligence"...or whatever Quicken is calling its site selection process, it pulls out. No doubt citing industry wide uncertainty and (by that time) an economy in recession. I'd love to see some empty real estate downtown taken up and 5000 extra folks milling about, but one would doubt that any major move would be undertaken in time of such uncertainty and outright collapse of the mortgage sector simply for the sake of some good local p.r. | ||
Johnlodge Member Username: Johnlodge Post Number: 6399 Registered: 10-2003 |
Since we're speculating with no evidence whatsoever, I disagree. I think they will move downtown, and will push ahead the light rail plans as well. | ||
Chuckjav Member Username: Chuckjav Post Number: 518 Registered: 09-2007 |
Higgs1634....Well-Said & Spot-On. Relying upon Quicken Loans Inc. to come through for Detroit is akin to betting $1000 that 555 will be this evening's winning three-digit Michigan Lottery pick. Ain't going to happen. Nothing to get mad about - it just isn't in the cards. |
