Discuss Detroit » Archives - January 2008 » Sounds like NY's 'wilding' « Previous Next »
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Lilpup
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Username: Lilpup

Post Number: 4431
Registered: 06-2004
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 5:03 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

definitely a problem and hopefully not a growing one

interestingly, there's no indication of who the perps might be

http://www.clickondetroit.com/ news/16461498/detail.html
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Detroitnerd
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Username: Detroitnerd

Post Number: 2394
Registered: 07-2004
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 5:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Interestingly, if memory serves, the reporter who originally wrote up that sensationalist story in Central Park misquoted the kids. There was no such thing as "wilding." The kids only mentioned people doing the "wild thing." The reporter basically invented the story. This is a common occurrence in media when white reporters "interview" minorities about crime.
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Lilpup
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Username: Lilpup

Post Number: 4432
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Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 5:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It was the NY Chief of Detectives who stated those brought in for questioning used the term when questioned by investigators. Some journalists claim the police misunderstood what was described to them.

Either way, the origin of the term doesn't change the behavior now associated with it.
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Rocknrollscientist
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Username: Rocknrollscientist

Post Number: 141
Registered: 05-2005
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 5:22 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

This all sounds vaguely familiar...wasn't it a storyline on an episode of "CSI"?
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Detroitnerd
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Username: Detroitnerd

Post Number: 2396
Registered: 07-2004
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 5:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Um, the term sold papers, but we may choose to not use it, as it's racially charged. Notice how when white kids go on a tear, it's not called wilding.
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Lilpup
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Username: Lilpup

Post Number: 4433
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Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 5:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I don't see how it's considered racially charged.
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Detroitnerd
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Username: Detroitnerd

Post Number: 2397
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Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 5:34 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Because it's only used to describe the black people.

In my view, journalists have an undue love for these kinds of stories of marauding blacks senselessly attacking white people. They may not happen very frequently (most of the time, when you're attacked you know your attacker), but they grab headlines.

You can even trace "wilding" type stories back to tales of "Thursday Night Bumping" back in the 1940s, when black shoppers would allegedly engage in campaigns to bump into and intimidate whites. It proved baseless, based on misunderstandings, much like the "wilding" phenomenon.
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Chuckjav
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Username: Chuckjav

Post Number: 578
Registered: 09-2007
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 5:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

This is ABSOLUTELY nothing new to Detroit, Metropolitan Detroit...or any large city, nationwide.

Never get too comfortable with your surroundings.

If folks try to block the path of your vehicle - run them over.
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Lilpup
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Username: Lilpup

Post Number: 4434
Registered: 06-2004
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 5:48 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"In my view, journalists have an undue love for these kinds of stories of marauding blacks senselessly attacking white people."

So you're assuming it was a black crowd?

(Message edited by lilpup on June 02, 2008)
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Detroitnerd
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Username: Detroitnerd

Post Number: 2398
Registered: 07-2004
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 5:51 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Journalists are discouraged from mentioning race unless it's pertinent to the story. When they do mention race, an effort to mention the races of all subjects in the story is made. But they still get to sneak in some clues, in this case:

"two dozen men wearing ball caps and baggy shorts spread out across the street and blocked traffic."

Hmmmm. Let me turn that over in my head for a nanosecond...
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Lilpup
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Username: Lilpup

Post Number: 4435
Registered: 06-2004
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 5:54 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

on North River Road - turn that over, too
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Detroitnerd
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Username: Detroitnerd

Post Number: 2399
Registered: 07-2004
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 5:56 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Are you assuming it was a white crowd? :-)
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Mackinaw
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Username: Mackinaw

Post Number: 4849
Registered: 02-2005
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 6:01 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I don't agree that that is a clue. Baggy shorts? C'mon, you can see baggy shorts at a country club. And don't we all have baseball caps?

I don't think there's anything wrong with printing/reporting on the actual race of the perps, if it accompanies a detailed description (i.e. height/weight etc.) in an attempt to find people on the loose.

I don't know anything about N. River Rd. but when I think about Warren I think white people first. What kind of street is so devoid of traffic, pedestrians, and residents such that two dozen men can so conspicuously rob someone? How does that happen at anytime other than the early AM hours?

As to the crime itself, it's so stupid and senseless. Seems like their could be more efficient ways to rob someone, too. Like I said, two dozen men is awfully conspicuous (though invincible).
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Chuckjav
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Username: Chuckjav

Post Number: 579
Registered: 09-2007
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 6:02 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Detroitnerd....having been a victim of racially motivated physical attacks, I would not call these episodes baseless. What empirical evidence do you have to suggest otherwise?
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Detroitrise
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Username: Detroitrise

Post Number: 2266
Registered: 09-2007
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 6:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Who cares what color these "semi-humans" are, it's all an idiotic situation.
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Detroitnerd
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Username: Detroitnerd

Post Number: 2400
Registered: 07-2004
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 6:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mack: That's part of the problem. They don't want to mention race, so they drop details that invite assumptions.

As for North River Road, that's gotta be wrong. Doesn't even run through Warren, does it?

Chuck: Didn't say "baseless"; I said "senseless."
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Mackinaw
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Username: Mackinaw

Post Number: 4850
Registered: 02-2005
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 6:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yeah, baggy shorts and baseball caps had nothing to do with the event, and are irrelevant. If I was that writers' editor I would have deleted that as soon as I saw it. But it is Channel 4 and what would you except from local tv news other than that stupidity.
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Lilpup
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Username: Lilpup

Post Number: 4436
Registered: 06-2004
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 6:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

couldn't tell - that's what struck me about the article - there's no indicator of who the perps where - younger? older? gang related? black mob? white mob? mixed?
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East_detroit
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Username: East_detroit

Post Number: 1775
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 6:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"Kauffman tried to drive past them and someone threw a brick in his window. Kauffman stopped his car and got out to see what happened."

He didn't deserve it, but then again he didn't show common sense.
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Lilpup
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Username: Lilpup

Post Number: 4437
Registered: 06-2004
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 6:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"As for North River Road, that's gotta be wrong. Doesn't even run through Warren, does it?"

As far as I know there is no North River Road in Warren. My assumption was that "Warren" was the error, not "North River Road".
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Mackinaw
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Username: Mackinaw

Post Number: 4851
Registered: 02-2005
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 6:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

There's a N. River Road in Mt. Clemens, from near downtown to Selfridge. From the looks of the map I'm looking at, parts of it are quite devoid of homes and businesses.
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Detroitnerd
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Username: Detroitnerd

Post Number: 2401
Registered: 07-2004
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 6:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yeah, mentioning race is a red-flag in the business, and it's a indicative of lots of problems we have in the United States with race. Is it something it's impolitic to mention, even in a description that could lead to an arrest? Or is there some way to actually talk race without freighting the conversation with latent prejudices?

But, personally, when cops use these descriptors (baggy shorts, baseball caps), I'd say there's a heavy implication that the suspects were black.
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Lilpup
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Username: Lilpup

Post Number: 4438
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Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 6:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Correct, Mackinaw. It runs east from Gratiot along the southern boundary of Selfridge, not quite all the way to Jefferson.

There's no way I associate ball caps and baggy shorts with blacks only. There are a lot of white, suburban punks who dress that way.

(Message edited by lilpup on June 02, 2008)
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Chuckjav
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Username: Chuckjav

Post Number: 580
Registered: 09-2007
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 6:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Detroitnerd...I am referring to the comment you made about "bump clubs"; noted author Thomas Segrue noted their 1940s existence as well.

Unfortunately, what goes around comes around; white-on-black violence all-too-often followed by episodes of black-on-white violence.

At some point, ALL of us need to agree that enough-is-enough....take a stand and crush those who take pleasure in the misfortune of others.

That's all.
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Detroitnerd
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Username: Detroitnerd

Post Number: 2402
Registered: 07-2004
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 6:19 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

White kids in Royal Oak notwithstanding, if it's somebody in aviators talking, I'm gonna go with black.

I guess we're out of luck: All fired up to debate, but not enough information. :-)

Anybody want to give Hackel a call? That's his number. :P
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Detroitnerd
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Username: Detroitnerd

Post Number: 2403
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Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 6:23 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Chuck: That's funny. Because John Gunther said that by the 1950s the "bumping" phenomenon had already been debunked as a white myth.
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Chuckjav
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Username: Chuckjav

Post Number: 581
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Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 6:28 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Detroitnerd....We'll have to put Gunther and Segrue on stage (if both are still alive)...let them debate the issue.

It would certainly be more entertaining than what Clinton and Obama spewed forth.
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Detroitnerd
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Username: Detroitnerd

Post Number: 2405
Registered: 07-2004
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 6:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Haha. Gunther's long dead, and I think Sugrue's a better scholar anyway. Too bad, sometimes the findings make you sad. That's the way it goes. :-(
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Jimaz
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Username: Jimaz

Post Number: 5481
Registered: 12-2005
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 6:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Suspects sought in 'savage' beating of motorist in Mount Clemens
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Detroitnerd
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Username: Detroitnerd

Post Number: 2406
Registered: 07-2004
Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 6:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Why do they mention the race of the victims and not the suspects? Isn't that odd? You'd qualify both or neither, not just one. Seems like crappy editing to me.
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Iheartthed
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Username: Iheartthed

Post Number: 3170
Registered: 04-2006
Posted on Tuesday, June 03, 2008 - 11:17 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

quote:

I guess we're out of luck: All fired up to debate, but not enough information.



Zing! Good one...

I'll take the discussion one step further: when descriptors are mentioned at all, it's usually to identify a member of some sub-category -- and not the dominant sub-category.
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Lilpup
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Username: Lilpup

Post Number: 4443
Registered: 06-2004
Posted on Tuesday, June 03, 2008 - 12:19 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

http://macombdaily.com/stories /060308/loc_local02.shtml

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