Discuss Detroit » Archives - July 2008 » McNichols and Livernois in the old days « Previous Next »
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Marshall
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Username: Marshall

Post Number: 1
Registered: 09-2008
Posted on Friday, September 26, 2008 - 8:12 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hi everyone! I am new to the forum, and a native Detroiter who loves Detroit. I thought I would share a couple memories of my old neighborhood. I lived on Prairie, between Santa Clara and Santa Rosa.

Unlike many of the suburbs now, we knew just about every neighbor on the block.

Remember the U of D stadium? - the place to go for great football, police and fire field days!

The Varsity theater. W3 used to walk up there on Saturday mornings to see the matinee's for a quarter.

Sanders on Pennington and 6 mile had the best fountain cokes. We got our prescriptions from Burk's pharmacy or Barbas drugs, and hardware from Frommes.

My dad opened Debonair cleaners in the old Kroger building on 6 and Pennington just down from Larcos.

Occasional lunch at Lou's deli (Roselawn special-corned beef, coleslaw and russian dressing). My dad went shopping on Sundays at the San Juan market for butter and eggs.

I went to Bagley Elementary. Anyone remember Joe the Gyp who sold candy and ice cream from a pushcart on Pickford and Roselawn near the school.

Some of the neighborhood kids went to Jesu.

It was one of the most beautiful areas in Northwest Detroit. The streets were treelined, and the trees on each side of many streets touched making a kind of arbor.

I would love to hear from anyone growing up in the same area. I lived there from early childhood (1950) until about 1964.
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Danny
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Username: Danny

Post Number: 7779
Registered: 02-2004
Posted on Friday, September 26, 2008 - 8:29 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I grew on Lawton St. between McNichols and Puritan in the Martin Park sub-division near University District, Pilgrim Village and Palmer Park area from 1977 to 1985. My sister went to Gen. George Custer Elementary. I went to a progressive school in the suburbs. My Detroit ghettohood was well kept up. Everyone knows everyone, good businesses and white black and Jews lived together in racial harmony. There was a synagogue called Temple Israel at 17400 Manderson St. just north of Pontchartrain and McNichols. It was last synagogue in the Northwest Detroit area. The congregation moved to Bloomfield TWP in 1980 until the moved to their new building on the corner of Orchard Lake and Walnut Lake Rd. in west Bloomfield TWP. in 2005. When I came back to my old ghettohood my house which is a 3 family flat is still intact ever since my family moved out. Other houses south of Puritan St. turned to DEAD (C)KRAK HEAD terraces. Those DEAD (C)KRAK HEADS came mostly from Highland Park and now making our ghettohood more ghetto. The U of D Mercy one was barless is now gated to keep out the vagrants and the my old ghettohood is not the same any more.
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Olddetroiter
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Username: Olddetroiter

Post Number: 1447
Registered: 04-2008
Posted on Friday, September 26, 2008 - 9:10 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I lived on the east side, but my grandfather lived on Santa Rosa between Outer Drive and 7 Mile in the '50s and early '60s. It was a very nice neighborhood. My mother's youngest brother went to Mumford.

I read in the News the other day that Christine Beatty's house on Santa Rosa is in foreclosure. Anyone have any idea where it is?
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Chuckjav
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Username: Chuckjav

Post Number: 846
Registered: 09-2007
Posted on Friday, September 26, 2008 - 9:36 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Marshall....Welcome.

Yes, I remember the neighborhood you've described; would ride through it onboard DSR coach - from lower east side to the Jewish Center at Meyers & Curtis, circa 1965-67.

Walking through your neighborhood, back in early 1967, saw an Oldsmobile Toronado for the first time...awesome!
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Urbanoutdoors
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Username: Urbanoutdoors

Post Number: 1078
Registered: 11-2005
Posted on Friday, September 26, 2008 - 9:49 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Welcome to the forum marshall. I grew up in the 80's and 90s in the university district and must say it is crazy to see how much it has changed in just the past 10 years. I have witnessed 3 or 4 homes be torn down in the university district in the past year or 2. I went to gesu from k-3. I went to mayflower on curtis before that for pre-K. Livernois has changed drastically over the years no more Dino's coney, gregs pizza moved to a new location, although I am not fond of the new boulavardization of livernois it does seem to be making it more marketable for retail and much more pedestrian friendly. Lou's is still there and going strong but it is crazy to see how much things change.
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Dianeinaustin
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Username: Dianeinaustin

Post Number: 114
Registered: 02-2008
Posted on Friday, September 26, 2008 - 1:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hi Marshall,

My mother who is now 85 lived 16190 (?) Prarie in a house her father built. I think the family stayed there until the mid 50's. The googlemap does not have all of Prarie street on their streetview so her house and your house can't be seen.
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Ditman
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Username: Ditman

Post Number: 61
Registered: 05-2007
Posted on Friday, September 26, 2008 - 1:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hi Marshall, welcome to the forum. I also grew up on the NW side(Fenkell btwn Schaefer & Meyers) on Ward Ave. Danny brought up Temple Israel. That's where my folks belonged & I was bar mitzvahed there. I also attended Temple Sunday School at Bagley. I remember the very big homes on Ponchatrain. Met wife#1 at a singles mixer at the JCC on Curtis. My sister took an address of a cousin who lived on Prairie so she could transfer frm Cooley to Mumford. Anyone remember adeli called Billy"s? I think it was on Livernois&7 Mi. Any one have any Darby"s memories. Again-welcome.
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Ditman
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Username: Ditman

Post Number: 62
Registered: 05-2007
Posted on Friday, September 26, 2008 - 1:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hi Marshall, welcome to the forum. I also grew up on the NW side(Fenkell btwn Schaefer & Meyers) on Ward Ave. Danny brought up Temple Israel. That's where my folks belonged & I was bar mitzvahed there. I also attended Temple Sunday School at Bagley. I remember the very big homes on Ponchatrain. Met wife#1 at a singles mixer at the JCC on Curtis. My sister took an address of a cousin who lived on Prairie so she could transfer frm Cooley to Mumford. Anyone remember adeli called Billy"s? I think it was on Livernois&7 Mi. Any one have any Darby"s memories. Again-welcome.
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Chuckjav
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Username: Chuckjav

Post Number: 848
Registered: 09-2007
Posted on Friday, September 26, 2008 - 1:54 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ditman...hey, I didn't realize we grew up on the same street - I lived on the c/o Ward & Foley (two blocks south of Grand River).

My memories of Darby's: I never ate there, but I enjoyed listening to the fond recollections of cabin mates at JCC Fresh-Air Society's Camp Tamarack (Brighton). Sadly, I do remember the day Darby's burned to the ground.
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7051
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Username: 7051

Post Number: 165
Registered: 02-2006
Posted on Friday, September 26, 2008 - 2:37 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

UrbanOutdoors,

I have lived and raised a family in the Univ. District the last 10 years(gasps heard from the land of streets paved with gold in the exurbs..."the thought of raising a family in Detroit"). Things were great here until the forclosure crisis. Things are still pretty good here.

2 Houses have been torn down in the last 10 years - both of them in the last 5 months. One was inhabited by a middle age woman for many years who did NOTHING to upkeep the home during the 20-30 years she was there. It, unfortunately, should have been torn down 15 years ago or longer. The other house had a "legitimate" (NOT vacant house fire arson as 70% of the fires are in the city)fire 2 years prior. Between insurance squabbles, DTE right of way squabbles, etc. it took some time for it to be torn down.

One suburban lady who I spoke to on the recent Toure DeTroit bike ride, commented that in her opinion, she noticed that there were less foreclosures and sale homes in Boston Edison, Rosedale Park, Univ. District, Palmer Woods, Sherwood Forest, Bagley Neighborhood than in here midnorthern macomb county area. Interesting to hear from a suburbanite.
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Detroit_stylin
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Username: Detroit_stylin

Post Number: 5920
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Friday, September 26, 2008 - 2:46 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ironic I was born on Prairie and lived there for the first 11 years of my life between 7 mile and 8 mile...
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Urbanoutdoors
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Username: Urbanoutdoors

Post Number: 1080
Registered: 11-2005
Posted on Friday, September 26, 2008 - 3:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

7501,

My dad lives on the corner of santa maria and parkside. The third I was referring too was the house linwood just south of the university district in the martin sub. I felt both houses could still have been rehabbed but not in this housing market. The University District is still in pretty good shape when looking at other areas but the home values everywhere are horrid. I almost considered buying a house on Muirland that sold for 230,000 just 3 years ago and recently sold for 44,000. what street are you on?
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Ditman
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Username: Ditman

Post Number: 63
Registered: 05-2007
Posted on Friday, September 26, 2008 - 3:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hey Chuckjav: I also went to Fresh Air Camp thru the JCC. I was 12 so it must been about 1955. A big deal--sleep away camp for 3wks! When did you go? Are you the person that sent me the Elmwood links? If so, can you put them back on the forum.
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Chuckjav
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Username: Chuckjav

Post Number: 849
Registered: 09-2007
Posted on Friday, September 26, 2008 - 4:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ditman....sorry, wasn't me that sent the Elmwood links - are you referring to Elmwood Cemetery?

I went to Camp Tamarack, 1966-68; welcome relief from the lower east side.

Didn't you go to Cooley with Milt Pappas?
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Steves
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Username: Steves

Post Number: 14
Registered: 07-2006
Posted on Friday, September 26, 2008 - 5:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I grew up on Greenlawn just a block from Bagley in the 50's/60's. Curtis seemed seemed like a busy street to a little kid, and so did Greenlawn until they closed the entrance to the Lodge after a nasty accident. Stevie Wonder lived just down the street. Great memories of the time and place.
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Maxdetroit
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Username: Maxdetroit

Post Number: 83
Registered: 08-2007
Posted on Friday, September 26, 2008 - 6:50 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

My grandparents lived on Santa Rosa just north of 6 Mile in the 50's. I remember Burkes, Larco's etc. There was also a big phone company building, the Town House hamburger place and Sinclair gas station on the north side of 6 Mile at Santa Rosa and a Chinese restaurant UT Garden on the south side. The Varsity Theater and Wilson's at 6-Livernois. My grandfather never took the car out of the garage, you could walk to ANYTHING within just a few blocks of home.
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Original63
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Username: Original63

Post Number: 61
Registered: 08-2008
Posted on Friday, September 26, 2008 - 7:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Welcome Marshall.

My Fathers office was on Puritan between Parkside and Lawton. A Dr's office. It is now a thriving lawnmower business that I patronize now.

(Message edited by original63 on September 26, 2008)
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Ditman
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Username: Ditman

Post Number: 64
Registered: 05-2007
Posted on Monday, September 29, 2008 - 10:48 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Chuckjav-I was refering to links that someone posted a few months ago in response to my thread about the Elmwood Casini in Windsor. One link was a comprehensive history of the nightclub. Another had old menus & programs. Evidently the forum now doesnt go back that far. I would be appreciative if those links could be re-posted. Thanks.
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3rdworldcity
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Username: 3rdworldcity

Post Number: 1376
Registered: 01-2005
Posted on Monday, September 29, 2008 - 11:33 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Went to U.of D. thru 1960. Great memories. Then moved to Green Acres several years later and kids went to Gesu.

Maria's on Fenkall had the 2nd best pizza I've ever had. Went to Petco's on 6 Mile (almost to Woodward) - filled up on the peppers and beets which were free if you bought something. UT Gardens was great. Mercury Fish and Chips on Schaeffer and 7 Mile (?), just north of the Mercury Theater, was a night out. Robin Hood on Livernois north of 7 Mile had the best breakfasts in town. And of course, Lou's Deli when we took out Marygrove girls. Many happy memories.
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Chuckjav
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Username: Chuckjav

Post Number: 877
Registered: 09-2007
Posted on Monday, September 29, 2008 - 11:50 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ditman...I found this link.
Information that you seek is about one-third down the page:

http://www.ctmhv.com/Links/lin ks.htm
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Marshall
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Username: Marshall

Post Number: 2
Registered: 09-2008
Posted on Monday, September 29, 2008 - 12:02 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Oh how I loved Petcos and the Robin Hood!
Speaking of Darby's, my uncle Charlie was the piano player in the bar there. AFter it burned down, he ended up at the Kingsley inn.

I spent a lot of time at the JCC on Curtis.
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Gary
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Username: Gary

Post Number: 342
Registered: 02-2004
Posted on Monday, September 29, 2008 - 5:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

This thread is a real trip down memory lane. My family lived in the neighborhood from '59 to '86. At least a couple dozen of my childhood friends still live there and have never left. I get over that way often to visit.

I remember Gregg's Pizza, the Varsity, the original Trade Winds store on Livernois (the first real "party store" I can remember), the Mercury Theatre, The Six Mile/Uptown theatre (in it's pre-"Behind The Green Door" days, Sander's on 6 mile, the White Tower hamburger stand on the corner of 6 mi. and Livernois, the Chinese laundry on Puritan where my dad always had his shirts done, U of D football stadium and U-D football games (no hot dogs served at Friday night games, only tuna sandwiches). Playing tackle football (no pads, just helmets) on that huge athletic field south of Calihan Hall on the U of D campus in the days before the campus had to be locked down from the surrounding neighborhood. Good memories.

Anybody who really claims to have known the neighborhood back in the day might remember Detroit Lion John Gordy's burger joint on Livernois a block north of 6 mile. Only lasted about a year or so as I recall, but they had great burgers, fries and shakes.
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Scooter2k7
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Username: Scooter2k7

Post Number: 143
Registered: 10-2007
Posted on Monday, September 29, 2008 - 7:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Both of my parents grew up in Detroit during the 50s and 60s. My grandparents left war-torn Poland in the 1920s and British controlled Ireland in the 1880s to settle in the Vernor-Junction area and 6 Mile/Gratiot - Hamtramck area. I hear stories all the time about what a great city Detroit used to be and how safe it used to be. When I hear stories about Detroit's heyday it is really sad to me. I do not understand why Detroit lost its potential. Sure the riots chased my family to the Northern Mile Roads, but still why wouldn't the new residents keep Detroit's glamour and pristine? It makes me sick to drive through these neighborhoods after hearing how great Detroit used to be. My great-grandfather loved Detroit, but if he seen what a rotting, cess-pool, crumbling, shit hole the city has become, he would have taken his chances with the Nazis in Poland.
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7051
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Username: 7051

Post Number: 166
Registered: 02-2006
Posted on Monday, September 29, 2008 - 10:03 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Scooter2k7,

You need to study the last 55 years of Detroit's history a bit. Start with:

http://www.amazon.com/Origins- Urban-Crisis-Thomas-Sugrue/dp/ 069101101X

It touches on the job loss, freeways, race, unions, federal policy, taxes, etc. There are many, many books available that chronicle the reasons for Detroit's 55 year downfall.
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Urbanoutdoors
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Username: Urbanoutdoors

Post Number: 1084
Registered: 11-2005
Posted on Monday, September 29, 2008 - 10:23 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

That book taught me a great deal when I read it. His new book shall be interesting, comes out in 2 months. If you know what has transpired you know what you can do to solve the problems. The potential is still there it just takes ambition good planning and a diversified economy to get the city back on track. I still see Detroit as a wonderful place and understand that there is more too it, if the fha would have favored renovation over new housing, if the auto industry wasn't decentralized, if the interstate system didn't destroy neighborhoods, if Edwards had won, not Cobo and if packard had not gone under Detroit would be a much different place. Yes the riots/rebelion happened but the forementioned had much more to do with it.
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Nellonfury
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Username: Nellonfury

Post Number: 264
Registered: 03-2005
Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2008 - 3:00 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I know that Livernois has turn into a blvd from McNichols to 8 Mile, but my friend was telling me that they expanding it all a way to Grand River. Is it true? If it is, does anyone has photos of it?
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Ladia
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Username: Ladia

Post Number: 202
Registered: 05-2008
Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2008 - 8:02 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I grew up in the area also,both on Mcnichols,and Baylis street on Linwood. :-)
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Urbanoutdoors
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Username: Urbanoutdoors

Post Number: 1089
Registered: 11-2005
Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2008 - 9:48 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Nellonfury,
I have seen work being done as far south as davison and believe that is what the ultimate goal of the semcog plan, I just want more to be done with the medians than just grass, hopefully the greening of Detroit can add some trees, dogwood cherry blossom or something of the like so it looks more like WGB in the new center.
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Marshall
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Username: Marshall

Post Number: 3
Registered: 09-2008
Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2008 - 10:01 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"John Gordy's burger joint on Livernois a block north of 6 mile."

The LIONBURGER! Yep! It was fun while it lasted.
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Gerrym
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Username: Gerrym

Post Number: 1
Registered: 09-2008
Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2008 - 10:29 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I also grew up in the 6 mile / Livernois area in the 50's and went to UofD .. recall the Varsity theater and bowling alley ..
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Ditman
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Username: Ditman

Post Number: 65
Registered: 05-2007
Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2008 - 10:44 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Chuckjav-thanks for the Elmwood Casino links-really appreciate it. Pappas was a senior when I was a freshman at Cooley & they were the defending public school baseball champs. The guy was a major league pitcher in high school-not bad.
HAPPY NEW YEAR TO ALL. This forum has brought back many fond memories this past year. L'Shana Tova.
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Chuckjav
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Username: Chuckjav

Post Number: 884
Registered: 09-2007
Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2008 - 10:55 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ditman....Toda; Happy 5769 to You and Family!
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Scooter2k7
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Username: Scooter2k7

Post Number: 144
Registered: 10-2007
Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2008 - 4:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yes thank you for the reference 7051. I actually am quite familar with Detroit's history. However, all those things you listed (freeways, taxes, federal policy, etc.) do not define the current appearance of Detroit. Can taxes spray paint graphiti on every street corner? Does federal policy forget to keep your home from looking nice? These are basics that should not know boundaries. Lets stop making stupid excuses here.

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