  Leannam1989 Member Username: Leannam1989 Post Number: 152 Registered: 06-2008 |
I couldn't find anything on this forum about Detroit's Official Plan. There was a conference of Mayor's recently, and they provided Obama with their wishlists. Here's a Yahoo article about it, with links to Forbes 10 biggest stimulus cities. http://finance.yahoo.com/famil y-home/article/106315/The-Obam a-Boomtowns I live fairly near St. Louis, and I approve of their stimulus package pretty much. Really schools should be a big priority. Hard to draw middle-class families back to the city when schools suck. I made this simple chart to reflect jobs vs. cost for 9 of those cities. Phoenix asked for $1.4 billion, but I omitted it because it did not provide job data. http://i233.photobucket.com/al bums/ee136/LeannaW1989/Stimulu sJobsCost.png Most of the inquiries appear to b for schools, infrastructure, and transportation. How much has Detroit asked for, and what are the plans? If this has been posted before I apologize. I couldn't find anything when I searched the forum. Searching Google for "Detroit Stimulus Plan (or Package)", all I could find was Kwame's plan earlier in 2008. So, if someone can link me to where the plan is posted, I would appreciate it. I realize Cockrel has only been Mayor since September. Has he proposed anything yet? Thanks. | ||
Rbdetsport Member Username: Rbdetsport Post Number: 498 Registered: 11-2005 |
Can our city be any dumber? Why would they not make a huge request, one of the largest on that list? We need it the most and it looks like they are failing again. Ask for 5-10 billion! Put a large sum toward starting mass transit on the spoke lines and put the rest into community programs, keeping the streetlights on, marketing, revitalizing neighborhoods and parks, and to help erase and balance the deficit. There are so many things that this city could use that money for. That list shows already healthy cities asking for money. What about the old and slaughtered cities? | ||
Rbdetsport Member Username: Rbdetsport Post Number: 499 Registered: 11-2005 |
We need to email our "leaders".... | ||
Detrola Member Username: Detrola Post Number: 88 Registered: 02-2006 |
You do realize that any money that comes from the FED actually comes from taxpayers. Once again my Federal tax dollars will join my State tax dollars to help detroit because they can not seem to manage their own tax dollars. I would oppose any monetary help for the city until they get a handle on the actual state and amount of their financial mess. | ||
Gene Member Username: Gene Post Number: 147 Registered: 10-2006 |
Where are Levin, Dingell and Jenny?? Time to bring home the bacon. | ||
Lilpup Member Username: Lilpup Post Number: 5070 Registered: 06-2004 |
"Once again my Federal tax dollars will join my State tax dollars to help detroit" Not necessarily true. A lot of your Federal tax dollars leave the state and don't come back. Of what does come back it would be difficult to determine how much actually goes to Detroit. (Message edited by lilpup on December 21, 2008) | ||
Daddeeo Member Username: Daddeeo Post Number: 361 Registered: 09-2008 |
They should get most of the "leaders" from the area put them on an ice floe and have them float down the Detroit River. Addition through subtraction. Turn a negative into a positive. That floe would have to be pretty big too. | ||
Fishtoes2000 Member Username: Fishtoes2000 Post Number: 699 Registered: 06-2005 |
Detroit has $832 million of projects listed so far. Not all of the city departments have their projects in the list yet. The final version will be larger. http://www.usmayors.org/mainst reeteconomicrecovery/stimuluss urveyparticipantsdata.asp?City =Detroit&State=MI | ||
Warriorfan Member Username: Warriorfan Post Number: 795 Registered: 08-2005 |
quote: Has the city even completed its audit from 2006 yet? | ||
Detroit313 Member Username: Detroit313 Post Number: 765 Registered: 02-2006 |
First off, Detroit should be a lot more. There are an awful lot of projects missing from the list that should be included. I don't know how serious the Obama administration will determine if any what city gets what, But I glanced over a couple of city's "wish list" items, and saw that Vegas wanted $25,000,000 for neon signs!!! Detroit will need to prioritize it's items and make a strong pitch to Washington this spring. Minus the corporate jets. <313> | ||
Oladub Member Username: Oladub Post Number: 987 Registered: 08-2006 |
It used to be that Detroit made things. Start ups swarmed into the area out innovating each other. The game plan has changed. Innovation has been redefined to mean how best to panhandle the bankrupt government in Washington, DC. "Obama, buddy, have you got a trillion?" A good argument could be made that if a drunken sailor, be it Bush or Obama, is buying a round for everyone, one might as well accept. Why not hold out a begging pan if the money would otherwise go to Cleveland or New Orleans? I agree. But all participants should understand that it is no more than a temporary fix and that the payment for these cumulative bailouts will be made by devaluing our money so it only buys half as much. | ||
Digitalvision Member Username: Digitalvision Post Number: 1283 Registered: 11-2003 |
Although we should get our share, we should also re-install that "innovation software" we seemed to lose with the death of Henry Ford. Ol' Henry wasn't perfect by any stretch and had foibles (some disgusting); and so did many of the titans; but Detroit used to not only be a center of production but the reason it was the center was because this is where the innovation occurs. In a knowledge/information economy (which is what we're transitioning into, like it or not, with or without a bailout), innovation is even MORE important. And Detroit's practical attitudes would stand it in good stead in creating the software, services, and processes that will be the employment of the future. | ||
Sean_of_detroit Member Username: Sean_of_detroit Post Number: 2138 Registered: 03-2008 |
Do you really blame the City of Detroit for the lack of innovation by residents and businesses? I think it has more to do with all the companies that promised lifetime employment. No? | ||
French777 Member Username: French777 Post Number: 627 Registered: 10-2006 |
The roads could use some work! -Transit -Parks -SCHOOLS - Neighborhoods - Renewable Energy | ||
Crumbled_pavement Member Username: Crumbled_pavement Post Number: 624 Registered: 08-2007 |
quote: I agree with you. That's why I believe it would be better if Detroit requested tax-free zones instead of a bailout. In other words, Detroit would have zones where new residents and businesses paid no taxes for 5 years. Let the federal government cover those costs. That would bring businesses, innovators, and residents. In the long run it would increase the tax base and if the local government crafted it right they could lower the overall taxes of residents and businesses. Sure this plan still requires help from the government. But instead of requesting the government do it all, we would be requesting that they the help the city, and the city (residents and businesses) does the rest. It's not a perfect plan but with tweaking I think it is better than just plain begging for money with no plan to use the money wisely. | ||
Mopardan Member Username: Mopardan Post Number: 58 Registered: 11-2008 |
To get an edge in grabbing these dollars the city needs a cohesive if not at least a coherent plan. The mayor, council, city manager & dept heads need to be on the same page. It also requires the politicos representing the city & metro area to play a better game of palm greasing than the next guy. Oh yeah, don't forget to include the business community & unions. It's not a "silver bullet" solution to cure a city of its ills. Sorry Sean, but innovation & creative thinking are always needed to give your city an edge; whether it's from the political, business or residential side is immaterial. This is true in any situation. Times are changing & requires a heavy dose of diversification. French is on the right track with his list; include public safety & services as well. From an outsider's perspective, the city desperately needs a major PR makeover. This doesn't just mean making commercials promoting itself; it requires a serious commitment about how it conducts its business & places priorities. I hate to say it but to a casual observer the environment is in utter chaos & not just because of the automakers' situation. A lot of people outside Detroit & Michigan would be glad to see a major turnaround & success story. Moaning & whining ain't gonna do it. I bet the majority of the people on these forums have good & PRACTICAL ideas for the betterment of the city & quality of life. Attend council meetings, make your voice heard, insist on accountability, volunteer for a mayoral candidate's campaign, etc. It means breaking out some elbow grease & getting to work. Your city is on life support at the moment; either do the necessary surgery or let it die a horrible death. Ball's in your court. | ||
Huggybear Member Username: Huggybear Post Number: 269 Registered: 08-2005 |
Crumbled_Pavement, that's a good start. It's really three things. One, a federal tax-free zone encompassing the entire city. And for 10 years. You need a length of time that encourages the investment of capital. Five years is too short - you can hardly build something in that period of time. Two, open immigration - conditioned on residency in Detroit. We need this if for nothing else to keep the housing stock from further deteriorating and to keep the market supported. It also adds more paying customers to the underused water and sewer system. And it costs just as much to police an occupied block as an urban prairie. If we get some entrepreneurial action out of it, so much the better. Three, a foreign-trade zone (like what they have at DTW or an Alabama auto plant) that encompasses the city. This allows the importation of components and assemblies for integration without customs. This is important particularly for manufacturing by an unskilled work force. I think that a plan like that should be all but unassailable by Republicans in Washington - since it involves tax cuts and free trade. They might grouse about the immigration, but whatever. We can take their "extra" immigrants in the deal. | ||
Mopardan Member Username: Mopardan Post Number: 59 Registered: 11-2008 |
Huggy & Crumbled: good posts & very workable ideas. Y'all know your city much better than I would, so keep thinking. | ||
Registeredguest Member Username: Registeredguest Post Number: 134 Registered: 10-2003 |
Y'all got it wrong - Detroit is way ahead of the others in this game - in fact, it's requesting $10 Billion! http://www.freep.com/article/2 0081112/NEWS01/81112065. Who needs to submit a proposal when you can pass a simple resolution demanding money? | ||
Detroitplanner Member Username: Detroitplanner Post Number: 2210 Registered: 04-2006 |
I've been following this relatively close since October. The only thing known right now is that the amount of money keeps changing based upon who you talk to, the list of projects change depending upon who you talk to, there is no legislation in place to either fund or authorize funding for these projects, and project need to be underway within 90-120 days (shovel in the ground). This means projects with difficult engineering or need complex multi-governmental agreements will face a hard battle unless they are already far enough in the pipeline to get through the final stages for bidding/obligation. The federal government is going to be quite shy about anymore 'bailout' type programs regardless if they put people to work. Many of these projects (if not already approved) will need to go through certain processes including public involvement, air quality conformity, environmental justice, and approval by local, state, and federal governing bodies. If a match is required most governments are not in a position to match the projects. | ||
Ongowwah Member Username: Ongowwah Post Number: 150 Registered: 03-2008 |
Hello, Levin, knock-knock, you home? When will we start getting at least an equal buck for buck return on our tax dollars? This federal money game is just that a game. It should be approached like selling your car. If you realistically want to get a grand for your car then the asking price should be 2 grand. If you have to settle for a grand then fine, if the sap, er, I mean buyer gives the 2 grand, that;'s all the better. Always bargain down, don't throw out your low ball price as the asking price. Yeesh! | ||
Crumbled_pavement Member Username: Crumbled_pavement Post Number: 625 Registered: 08-2007 |
Thanks Mopardan. Huggy, that's an ambitious plan. I like ideas 2 and 3. However, with the tax-free zone, I think 10 years is too long to give new residents a tax break. I think the natives would be a little peeved by that. Unless, everyone was given a tax break. That would require crunching the numbers to see if that is even feasible. As for businesses, sure, give them 10 years of no taxes. The benefits of that would be jobs (of which the employees could be taxed -- adding to the tax base), amenities, less blight, and a more vibrant city. I'm seriously considering emailing a mock-up of this plan to all the mayoral candidates and the city council. (Message edited by Crumbled_pavement on December 22, 2008) | ||
Leannam1989 Member Username: Leannam1989 Post Number: 156 Registered: 06-2008 |
I realize Detroit needs a lot done, but $10 billion seems like a lot. That's 3 times what Miami wants and 4 times what St. Louis wants. But I guess it's better to ask for too much than not enough. | ||
Jasoncw Member Username: Jasoncw Post Number: 508 Registered: 07-2005 |
It'll get us better mass transit, convention center, can be used to subsidize services that we couldn't otherwise afford, pay back loans and stuff. Detroit could easily use 10 billion dollars. | ||
Dcmorrison12 Member Username: Dcmorrison12 Post Number: 6 Registered: 02-2009 |
I do remember reading a while back in the FREE PRESS that Mayor Kenneth Cockrel took a plan worth 10 billion to the capital and lobbyed for it, but I do not know what was on the plan. But alas, our mayor is fighting the good fight for us! | ||
Jimaz Member Username: Jimaz Post Number: 6511 Registered: 12-2005 |
Stimulus won't dent Michigan's wish list from today's Detroit News has some extremely detailed figures in the sidebar: PDF: Michigan Municipal League's list of project requests. The hardcopy had this interesting graphic:  Communities' wish list for stimulus money | ||
Retroit Member Username: Retroit Post Number: 942 Registered: 04-2008 |
$1 trillion stimulus package divided by 300 million Americans ------------------------------ -- = $3333.33 per person $3333.33 * 4 million Metro Detroiters ----------------------------- = $13.33 billion Let's see: $3333.33 given to every single metro Detroiter would pump $13.33 billion into our local economy. That would stimulate the hell out of me! | ||
Fishtoes2000 Member Username: Fishtoes2000 Post Number: 703 Registered: 06-2005 |
I don't think the Mayor's list or the MML are Detroit's final list. | ||
Randy_mckay Member Username: Randy_mckay Post Number: 2 Registered: 12-2008 |
I am against the stimulus package as it is, but I think if this amount is true, it represents another slap in the face to Michigan...Michigan has been the hardest hit for the longest amount of time in this down cycle, and get 0.2% of the stimulus despite being the @10 th biggest state in the Union. Good thing we have Democrats Levin and Stabenow looking out for us...(not). | ||
Shorthook Member Username: Shorthook Post Number: 12 Registered: 10-2008 |
No Flint? I would imagine if this train is leaving the station.. get on board!! Something is better than nothing. Correct me if I am wrong, but won't this money be borrowed from China or some other outside country? | ||
Novine Member Username: Novine Post Number: 1089 Registered: 07-2007 |
"Michigan has been the hardest hit for the longest amount of time in this down cycle, and get 0.2% of the stimulus despite being the @10 th biggest state in the Union. " What are you basing this claim on? | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 3735 Registered: 04-2006 |
Michigan is the 8th largest state. | ||
Randy_mckay Member Username: Randy_mckay Post Number: 3 Registered: 12-2008 |
Novine, I wasn't making any claim. I am basing my comments on the Detroit News article amount shown of ~$2 Billion divided by $825 Billion. Today's paper showed it was $5.7 Billion but expected to be lower now...either way, the percentage is well below what Michigan would get if it received a straight 1/50th share (@$16.5 Billion) or much higher level if it went on population. Thanks to lheartehed for confirming that Michigan is the 8th largest state. I wonder if the Feds will also allow us to pay less back of this expensive spending, er, stimulus bill when the bills come due... | ||
Novine Member Username: Novine Post Number: 1091 Registered: 07-2007 |
The problem with your math is that your assumption is that every dollar is in spending. That's incorrect. A significant chunk of the $825 billion is for tax cuts which will go to individuals and businesses. That means that Michigan should get a proportionally higher percentage of benefit from those cuts because of our larger population. | ||
Novine Member Username: Novine Post Number: 1092 Registered: 07-2007 |
The compromise bill agreed to on Friday is $780 billion. The Free Press has details on how that affects Michigan. "The compromise included at least one blow to U.S. carmakers: a 50 percent cut in a $600 million program to replaced federally owned vehicles with new, more fuel-efficient models. Republicans had derided the measure as wasteful, but President Barack Obama strongly defended it in a speech Thursday. The original measure included about $5.7 billion in aid for Michigan, including expanded jobless benefits for the state's half-million unemployed workers. That number was certain to be lower in the compromise bill, which includes cuts to money states will receive to help stabilize their own troubled budgets. The compromise preserved provisions pushed by Stabenow and Sen. Carl Levin, D-Detroit, such as $2 billion in grants to encourage advanced auto battery development and manufacturing tax credits for production of alternative energy equipment." http://detnews.com/apps/pbcs.d ll/article?AID=/20090207/POLIT ICS/902070367 | ||
Randy_mckay Member Username: Randy_mckay Post Number: 4 Registered: 12-2008 |
Thanks for your insights Novine... Can you quantify what the amount of the tax benefit would be? | ||
Novine Member Username: Novine Post Number: 1093 Registered: 07-2007 |
"Can you quantify what the amount of the tax benefit would be?" I haven't seen any statements on how the tax breaks will benefit individual states. | ||
Mbr Member Username: Mbr Post Number: 433 Registered: 03-2005 |
This is the same list from the from the US Mayors conference, but in wiki form so you can vote on the individual projects and add comments about the pros and cons of each. http://www.stimuluswatch.org/p roject/by_city/Detroit/MI | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 3782 Registered: 04-2006 |
This doesn't mention Detroit specifically, but it will greatly impact the city. Especially if that high-speed commuter rail between Chicago and Detroit gets off the ground soon. Obama plots huge railroad expansion | ||
Danindc Member Username: Danindc Post Number: 4388 Registered: 10-2003 |
Does the stimulus have any money for paying Monica Conyers to go away? | ||
Danny Member Username: Danny Post Number: 4485 Registered: 02-2004 |
Way to go President Obama! A black man who would save the our American economy. Let's distrubute that money. | ||
Fishtoes2000 Member Username: Fishtoes2000 Post Number: 711 Registered: 06-2005 |
From the Michigan Messenger "Detroit Mayor Kenneth Cockrel Jr.’s press secretary Dan Cherrin told Michigan Messenger that the list of stimulus “ready to go” projects submitted to the U.S. Mayor’s Conference this month did not reflect the mayor’s “priorities” and said that they were merely suggested projects that still needed to be reviewed and are subject to change." | ||
Fishtoes2000 Member Username: Fishtoes2000 Post Number: 713 Registered: 06-2005 |
I've recently posted information on the economic stimulus funding and how it likely fund some greenway/trail/bike related projects in Detroit and the surrounding area. | ||
Themax Member Username: Themax Post Number: 840 Registered: 09-2005 |
Yes, that high speed train will certainly come in handy for all the people who find jobs in Chicago but prefer to live in Detroit. And all those Chicagoans who have been dying to explore Detroit's night life. | ||
Glowblue Member Username: Glowblue Post Number: 172 Registered: 09-2008 |
^Living in SE Michigan is cheaper than living in Chicago, so if HSR (and I mean genuine, 200-mph bullet trains; 110 mph Amtrak stock just won't cut the mustard) is successful and affordable, I can see some people living in SE MI and commuting to Chicago. Not to mention all the medium-sized cities along the route (Ann Arbor, Jackson, Kalamazoo, South Bend) that would benefit greatly from increased connectivity with the Midwest's two largest metro areas. Outside of the NEC, the Det-Chi corridor is possibly the most promising for HSR in the country. (Message edited by glowblue on February 22, 2009) | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4162 Registered: 10-2003 |
Actually, the Milwaukee-Chicago is far more promising considering how many people go between the metro, already, and the corridor most ready to go is the St. Louis-Chicago. Seriously, this isn't going to be so much about commuting given the distance as it will be about tourism. | ||
Danindc Member Username: Danindc Post Number: 4424 Registered: 10-2003 |
quote: I actually see high speed rail as more of a boon toward business than leisure travel. | ||
Glowblue Member Username: Glowblue Post Number: 174 Registered: 09-2008 |
quote: Chi-Mil is only ~70 miles, though. That's too short for HSR to be worthwhile. Also, St. Louis is far smaller than Detroit, and since new grades would need to be built for HSR anyway, it doesn't matter which Amtrak corridor is in the best shape. | ||
Danindc Member Username: Danindc Post Number: 4425 Registered: 10-2003 |
quote: In the context of an entire corridor that continues onward to Madison and Minneapolis / St. Paul, though, this comment seems a bit short-sighted. One could also say that Washington and Baltimore are only 40 miles apart.... quote: Lmichigan's comment was pointed toward the work that the State of Illinois has been putting into upgrading the Chicago-St. Louis corridor. I'm not sure what the population of St. Louis has to do with anything. |
