 
20043_stotter
Member
Username: 20043_stotter
Post Number: 437
Registered: 03-2007
| | Posted on Thursday, July 31, 2008 - 9:34 pm: |    |
Still hanging on by the skin of their teeth in a piss-poor division. Anything can happen yet. |
Rjk
Member
Username: Rjk
Post Number: 1157
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, July 31, 2008 - 9:46 pm: | |
That was a bad loss with Verlander pitching poorly for the second straight game.
He's given up 13 runs over his last two games and prior to that he gave up 13 runs over his previous 7 games.
(Message edited by rjk on July 31, 2008) |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 5223
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Friday, August 01, 2008 - 12:12 am: | |
Verlander has disappointed in major clutch starts. I guess he already peaked for the season. |
401don
Member
Username: 401don
Post Number: 696
Registered: 11-2007
| | Posted on Friday, August 01, 2008 - 10:05 pm: | |
Verlander is not throwing strikes. After all the walks in the 1st inning Scott Kazmir just pounded the strike zone the next five tonight. Verlander seems to have a remarkably high number of foul balls hit off him as well. His pitch counts have been incredibly high all yr. |
Flanders_field
Member
Username: Flanders_field
Post Number: 806
Registered: 01-2008
| | Posted on Friday, August 01, 2008 - 11:17 pm: | |
LOB-sters tonight.
Tigers failed miserably to capitalize on Kazmir's location problems early in tonight's game.
Last 10 games for Thames: 19 Ks in 38 ABs. |
Ggores
Member
Username: Ggores
Post Number: 244
Registered: 10-2007
| | Posted on Sunday, August 03, 2008 - 11:22 am: | |
Pretty scathing essays in the newspapers now, I suppose an indication of a season "written off". Mathematically, of course, we're still in and funny things can happen. For the Tigers to make any kind of progress at this point, we'll need a barrel of laughs! |
Emu_steve
Member
Username: Emu_steve
Post Number: 687
Registered: 11-2006
| | Posted on Sunday, August 03, 2008 - 11:31 am: | |
Big, big questions next year, like this year, isn't the position players, even without Pudge, is pitching.
Verlander, Bonderman, Galarraga, Robertson, Willis (hopefully), and late in the year Rick Porcello for a cup of coffee.
Rogers? Gone?
Jones? Gone? or should I say 'Gone!'
Sheff? Gone?
Please keep Renteria. He was fine when healthy. Tigs have his successor in the farm system for say '10 or later.
Ilitch saves some BIG bucks if Sheff, Rogers are gone as well as Pudge's big salary.
Ilitch should go after the best available reliefer during free agency. |
401don
Member
Username: 401don
Post Number: 698
Registered: 11-2007
| | Posted on Sunday, August 03, 2008 - 4:21 pm: | |
Farnsworth fits right in this bullpen. |
Zitro
Member
Username: Zitro
Post Number: 1428
Registered: 04-2008
| | Posted on Sunday, August 03, 2008 - 4:32 pm: | |
Indeed, he's already bought into the Chuck Hernandez doctrine. Quick leaner |
Smogboy
Member
Username: Smogboy
Post Number: 8494
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, August 03, 2008 - 5:30 pm: | |
Fernando Rodney needs a serious trip to the back of the woodshed for his PITIFUL performance today. He needs to be sent out of town NOW. He lost the game for us worse than Todd Jones ever could.
UGH. I'm disgusted. |
Emu_steve
Member
Username: Emu_steve
Post Number: 688
Registered: 11-2006
| | Posted on Sunday, August 03, 2008 - 5:34 pm: | |
I still don't believe that managers like Leyland would replace Seay with Rodney solely for matchup purposes. |
Flanders_field
Member
Username: Flanders_field
Post Number: 811
Registered: 01-2008
| | Posted on Sunday, August 03, 2008 - 5:52 pm: | |
Godawful "pitching" performances by Farnsworth and Rodney, The Rays sweep the Tigers, they obviously are a genuine WS contender in the AL, along with the Angels. Tigers have ONE dependable arm each in the rotation and the BP, and the team is now very deservedly below .500 once again. |
Ray1936
Member
Username: Ray1936
Post Number: 3489
Registered: 01-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, August 03, 2008 - 6:19 pm: | |
I guess the Tigers can take those stupid necklace thingies off their necks now. They obviously are not helping anything.
Of course, I thought they were dumb to start with. But dumb things go with dumb players.
How the hell do you walk in the winning run? Dah. |
401don
Member
Username: 401don
Post Number: 699
Registered: 11-2007
| | Posted on Sunday, August 03, 2008 - 7:03 pm: | |
Obviously Zumaya and Rodney are not the answers. They both just throw the ball and good hitters wait until they are up in the count and sit on their pitch.
There's a lot of rebuilding needed for next yr. You need at least 3 bullpen pitchers and at least one starter (assuming Bonderman or Willis come back). You need a shortstop, probably two catchers, a left fielder and a left-handed bat, possibly to DH, in the middle of the order. It looks like Joyce, like most power-hitting rookies, is going to see nothing but breaking pitches from now on and will end up back in the minors until he learns to hit them. The team also could use some speed but that's unlikely. Happy shopping Dave! |
20043_stotter
Member
Username: 20043_stotter
Post Number: 439
Registered: 03-2007
| | Posted on Sunday, August 03, 2008 - 7:52 pm: | |
Mags is the only trade value they have in order to rebuild and do the things 401don is suggesting. I agree with you 401.
(Message edited by 20043 stotter on August 03, 2008) |
Mallory
Member
Username: Mallory
Post Number: 278
Registered: 05-2006
| | Posted on Monday, August 04, 2008 - 9:02 am: | |
I was at the game Saturday night. Many of the Tiger contingent want Sheff gone (batting .228 and he's the DH?), and yes, the relief pitching is pathetic. Rogers looked horrible, nothing seemed to click. In the meantime, I'm living down here with a very loyal group of Rays fans, and the Rays have NO stars, but somehow seem to get the job done.
And for the record, Tropicana Field is a joke. |
401don
Member
Username: 401don
Post Number: 702
Registered: 11-2007
| | Posted on Monday, August 04, 2008 - 9:32 am: | |
Gotta agree about Tropicana. Nothing says minor league more than ringing cowbells the whole game.
I thought I was watching a senior B hockey game in Saskatchewan. Any word on approval of the new Rays stadium? |
Blksoul_x
Member
Username: Blksoul_x
Post Number: 288
Registered: 06-2007
| | Posted on Monday, August 04, 2008 - 9:58 am: | |
It amazes me, why so many people are talking about breaking up this team, particular their main source of talent, which is power and hitting.
I believe, this year, the Tigs are dealing with a situation of 'EVERYTHING HAS GONE WRONG', from timely hitting, to un-timely pitching, etc ...call it metaphysical reasons, abstract forces, or something of the supernatural, or more to the reality of simple team 'chemistry'...whatever the reasons...Tiger Fans should to give this team a chance to develop, in a psychological sense.(remember, the core of this team has only been together for 4 months)
To be more positive, in a speculative sense, a the Tigs are perhaps 20 pitches or so away from being 15 games above 500 and sitting in 1st place.
I think the Tigers have the base of a great team...it is hard to tell with some of the unexplainable 'BAD LUCK' that they are dealing with this year...perhaps what they need is a course or two of the school of Tony Dungy or Vince Lombardi.
I certainly don't want to see a fire sale from this team...perhaps a pitcher or two and a winter of team cook-outs to build team character and chemistry!
blksoul_atcha!
Obama 08' |
Focusonthed
Member
Username: Focusonthed
Post Number: 1964
Registered: 02-2006
| | Posted on Monday, August 04, 2008 - 1:23 pm: | |
The Tigers would be winning the division if it weren't for the god-awful start. They don't need to be broken up, but they do need a few pieces. |
Smogboy
Member
Username: Smogboy
Post Number: 8504
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Monday, August 04, 2008 - 3:06 pm: | |
Let's simply break things down by position and you guys tell me if we need to overhaul that position or not...
Starting pitching: We still have Verlander, Rogers, Robertson, Galarraga and Miner. More than likely Rogers will be gone but then guys like Bonderman, Willis and maybe even Porcello can step up. Not much we can do this year except hope that the remaining guys can step up their game.
Relief pitching: Rodney- I say toss him to the wolves until he can prove he's earned the role of closer. Zumaya is still young and electric but inconsistent; probably more mental than physical now. Farnsworth is an incomplete for this team. Out of the rest of the relievers, Fossom, Seay, Dolsi and Lopez- the only one who's been stellar has been Seay. Jones is probably done and we're really left without a lights out closer. This is a glaring hole the Tigers will need to address- along with most other major league ball clubs.
First base: Cabrera who's stepping into his own at the position. He hits solidly, with some power and I'm fine with him there. Guillen and Thames can rest him if need be. No sweating this position.
2B: Polanco- probably the most consistent Tiger for the last few years. Again, no problems offensively nor defensively from this position.
SS: Renteria- who has probably played himself out of the line-up. So let Santiago step up and let him give a rip at it. he's hit well the last few games and I'd leave him be there the rest of the year. If an upgrade is available in the offseason free agent market, I say we get someone. If not, we've got some youngsters in Toledo who can platoon this spot.
3B: Guillen has held up okay here amazingly so. Ideally I'd still like to have Inge and his better defensive skills man the hot corner. Guillen should replace Sheffield as DH too. His ability to hit from both sides of the plate still make him very desirable to have in the line-up.
C: Inge for now with Sardinha backing him up. Neither one of these prospects thrills me and we do need to get an upgrade here immediately. I don't see Vance Wilson coming back and helping out anytime soon and we still need a reliable smart player who can help the pitchers along.
RF: Ordonez is still the scariest bat we have in the line-up. He just very well might be the glue that holds this bunch together now. He's much better defensively than people give him credit for and he's been relatively healthy for a guy people said was injury prone. Let guys like Clete Thomas & Bret Clevlen come in and give him an occasional rest.
CF: Curtis Granderson still patrols the Comerica Park centerfield like he owns it. He's improved his hitting against lefties the last year and has truly become an everyday player now. No upgrade needed here at all for a long while.
RF: Marcus Thames? Is he the answer? Maybe, but he's yet to hit consistently. I say platoon this spot with him and Matt Joyce. Let the youngster get his feet wet out there.
So outside of the catcher, shortstop and reliever positions that need immediate addressing, I don't see why some of you guys here insist on blowing up this team to rebuild. We've got some solid young core guys with some very desirable skills to build around and if Mr. Ilitch feels the need to spend what he spent this year on the team, they've got a lot coming off the books in the off season to acquire some solid talent.
What the Tigers are experiencing isn't that uncommon for other teams in the major leagues as well. What team out there wouldn't love to have a shut down closer, a gold glove catcher, a vacuum at shortstop, a .350 hitter, etc.. Yes, we have needs but they can be addressed without selling off the whole team and playing the Mudhens in their place.
And not that this is an excuse but also look at how injuries have decimated this team too. The bad health bug has really tapped us hard this year. Great teams overcome injuries for sure but we haven't proven we're great... YET.
I'm a frustrated fan as well but I know it's not time to sell off or trade every commodity we have now in order to rebuild just yet. |
401don
Member
Username: 401don
Post Number: 704
Registered: 11-2007
| | Posted on Monday, August 04, 2008 - 3:31 pm: | |
Smogboy, I don't think your summary is that much different from mine. I would love to see Santiago play every day the rest of the way to see if he can be the everyday guy next yr until Iorg is ready but I just don't see Leyland making the switch. Robertson has not warranted keeping his rotation spot, another bad long-term contract. Zumaya, more mental than physical? He's day-to-day once again with muscle tightness.
It's hard to say how bad the rest of the guys in the pen are. All the short outings by the starters really exaggerate a bullpen's weaknesses. |
D_mcc
Member
Username: D_mcc
Post Number: 1103
Registered: 12-2007
| | Posted on Monday, August 04, 2008 - 3:57 pm: | |
I was at both games on Saturday night and Sunday...
To sum it up...
Pathetic...
Guillen stopping between third and home on saturday night was the icing on the cake for me... |
Emu_steve
Member
Username: Emu_steve
Post Number: 689
Registered: 11-2006
| | Posted on Monday, August 04, 2008 - 6:13 pm: | |
I like Smogboy's analysis but I'd say in one sentence:
"I like ALL of the Tigs' position players but needs one or two starters and a shut down reliever (closer)."
The problem on this team isn't Renteria or Thames or Inge or...
I hope Dombrowski goes big in free agency for one or two pitchers. |
D_mcc
Member
Username: D_mcc
Post Number: 1107
Registered: 12-2007
| | Posted on Monday, August 04, 2008 - 9:07 pm: | |
Mallory...where were you sitting???
I was in section 121 on the 3rd base side...probably the only section in the stadium that had more tigers fans than rays fans |
Mallory
Member
Username: Mallory
Post Number: 279
Registered: 05-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 05, 2008 - 9:02 am: | |
Section 119, Row U, seats 1 and 2. It was great to see the huge Tiger contingent there, but that was the highlight of the game. I knew the Trop would be a joke when I approached the building, noticing the queer bats and balls that adorn the outside. Trust me, folks, really cheesy looking. Inside, though, I kind of liked it. At least the concession area. Then when you walk into the stadium, well, not an attractive place, and lots of design miscues. When they flashed the "more cowbell" on the screen, I wanted to puke. Oh but they love their little cowbells. I think the new stadium is approved, there are signs everywhere downtown lauding the "new stadium," but I'm not sure where the progress on it is.
I agree with D_mcc, pathetic. All these great big bats (that are sometimes productive) and squat for arms. Rogers looked like he was phoning it in, and, as for Dolci, where did they find this guy? He couldn't throw a strike if his life depended on it. As for stupid plays, yes, Guillen's miscue between third and home was embarassing. And like I said before, for a team with few names to speak of, the Rays are getting it done and looked pretty good. |
D_mcc
Member
Username: D_mcc
Post Number: 1108
Registered: 12-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 05, 2008 - 9:36 am: | |
You were like...8 feet away from me...I was in section 121, row p seat 10
I was sitting near the guy wearing the Tueber jersey |
Flanders_field
Member
Username: Flanders_field
Post Number: 819
Registered: 01-2008
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 06, 2008 - 1:33 am: | |
LMAO!
@ Rentdiarrhea, Farnsworthless, and BOOMaya!! |
Mallory
Member
Username: Mallory
Post Number: 280
Registered: 05-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 06, 2008 - 9:05 am: | |
D_mcc, I remember the Teuber jersey. Am I wrong or is Trop Field just butt ugly? Almost as ugly as our great bullpen that let us down AGAIN last night. <insert> |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 5231
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 06, 2008 - 11:47 am: | |
Hmm, right when we have one last chance to get back in the race, we become one of the worst teams in the league. Not terrible all around, all at once, but something always seems to be failing miserably. Now that the hitting is fairly decent, the bullpen absolutely could not be worse. Generally only one guy steps up per night, while all the other guys find a way to erase their efforts. Last week it was Fossum saving us in that late game in Cleveland, last night, Rodney stepped up, but the previous game he could not have been worse. Don't even mention Farnsworth.
I'm just gonna throw it out there: could Pudge have helped minimize these bullpen disasters by making good calls and saying the right things to the pitchers?
Most of the team has acted like they still want it, but it's gotta be hard for them to believe in much at this point. |
Johnlodge
Member
Username: Johnlodge
Post Number: 7993
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 06, 2008 - 11:57 am: | |
Why pull Seay out with 2 outs and nobody on base to stick Farnsworth "Detroit is a prison" in? Keep seeing these decisions by Leyland that leave me scratching my head. Has the coaching staff given up? Same thing awhile back when they pulled Verlander out in the same situation, and we nearly lost that game. |