 
Rhymeswithrawk
Member
Username: Rhymeswithrawk
Post Number: 625
Registered: 11-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 04, 2007 - 5:33 pm: |    |
How about that guy, eh? Always makes it interesting. The usual T.Jones inning is as follows:
Out (never on a strikeout)
Walk
Single
Out (never on a strikeout)
Out (never on a strikeout)
However, he sometimes mixes it up. Today, for example, it went:
Out (not on a K)
Single
Walk
Out (not on a K)
Out (not on a K)
Gotta love the variety the ol' Roller Coaster brings to the table. |
Jrvass
Member
Username: Jrvass
Post Number: 65
Registered: 01-2007
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 04, 2007 - 6:00 pm: | |
Grilli and Rodney with ERA's near or at 27.00?
It was 9-2 Det. when I left work, and 10-9 when I turned it back on. Pathetic!
James |
Smogboy
Member
Username: Smogboy
Post Number: 4924
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 04, 2007 - 6:43 pm: | |
I thought it was going to be a shallacking too and then I saw the final score! YOW! I'm sure ol' Leyland about aged another decade watching the lead fade like that. |
Yupislyr
Member
Username: Yupislyr
Post Number: 204
Registered: 07-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, April 05, 2007 - 1:25 am: | |
I was at this game and watching that lead slip away in person while enduring those harsh winds made it all the worse. Thankfully they pulled it out |
Smogboy
Member
Username: Smogboy
Post Number: 4929
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, April 05, 2007 - 1:42 am: | |
If they would've lost this one, I was going to make the suggestion no more "ceremony" days for the ball club. We lose the Opening Day game when we hoisted the banner and we nearly lost it on the day they hand out the rings.
The only ceremony I want now is the hoisting of the World Series banner, but we're going to have to live up to expectations and earn it. |
Southofeight
Member
Username: Southofeight
Post Number: 81
Registered: 07-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, April 05, 2007 - 8:28 am: | |
Damn straight. A ceremony for choking in the World Series? I'm on the fence on that one. Yeah, they busted ass and had a great season, but all of this reverie for second place is kind of weak.
Trust me, they won't be able to hold off comebacks against teams like Chicago and Minnesota with the same kind of nonsense they had yesterday.
I, for one, believe they're just working some kinks out. It's a long season. |
Smogboy
Member
Username: Smogboy
Post Number: 4935
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, April 05, 2007 - 9:08 am: | |
Southofeight, I agree. Don't get me wrong, beating Oakland and the Yankees was no small feat and to reach the World Series as American League champs was fine, but it still fell short of the ultimate goal. Fly the American League championship banner, but when did they start doling out rings for it? And even worse, when did they start having ceremonies for it?
It kind of reminded me of when the Red Wings would fly the Campbell Conference Playoff Championship banners... but they would do it with very little circumstance and now they're not even in the rafters of the JLA anymore.
Yes, I am very proud of the accomplishments last year; they far exceeded my expectations and they deserved the pennant raising ceremony, but let's not lose focus on what the real goal is- and that's to go back to the World Series and win it all. |
Focusonthed
Member
Username: Focusonthed
Post Number: 907
Registered: 02-2006
| | Posted on Friday, April 06, 2007 - 7:21 pm: | |
Sheesh. 162 games, there will be ugly ones. We will lose leads. We will lose games in worse fashion than we almost lost that one. It's a long season. |
Dds
Member
Username: Dds
Post Number: 199
Registered: 10-2006
| | Posted on Monday, April 09, 2007 - 8:07 pm: | |
quote:A ceremony for choking in the World Series? I'm on the fence on that one. Yeah, they busted ass and had a great season, but all of this reverie for second place is kind of weak.
Before 1969, raising a pennant was almost as important as winning the World Series. They've had ceremonies for it forever, we just haven't had one since 1985.
As for the rings, it may be overkill, but Ilitch can do what he wants with his money. I know my friend who works in the ticket office enjoys his ring. |
Schulzte1
Member
Username: Schulzte1
Post Number: 79
Registered: 01-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, April 10, 2007 - 8:59 am: | |
I agree, the pennant is a big deal and always has been, but no World Series = No Rings |
Lowell
Board Administrator
Username: Lowell
Post Number: 3779
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 11, 2007 - 10:48 am: | |
Tigers = 4-3. Jonesy = 4 saves.
Gotta love that guy. I liked how he got all teary-eyed when the won the AL pennant. |
Bobj
Member
Username: Bobj
Post Number: 1969
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Monday, April 16, 2007 - 6:12 am: | |
Todd is a good one to have around not only to pitch, but he seems like someone who would be a good mentor to all the young guys we have in the bullpen. |
Smogboy
Member
Username: Smogboy
Post Number: 5017
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Monday, April 16, 2007 - 5:37 pm: | |
Jonesy seems to be tearing it up as of late. Six straight saves in six opportunies? None too shabby. |
Gumby
Member
Username: Gumby
Post Number: 1558
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Monday, April 16, 2007 - 8:44 pm: | |
As much as Jones gives me a heart attack, at least he isn't Jose Mesa. |
Smogboy
Member
Username: Smogboy
Post Number: 5020
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Monday, April 16, 2007 - 10:40 pm: | |
I's still like to think that maybe Jonesy can pass on some of his knowledge to the likes of Ledezma, Rodney & Zumaya- the future of the Tigers bullpen. |
Smogboy
Member
Username: Smogboy
Post Number: 5021
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Monday, April 16, 2007 - 10:50 pm: | |
I just got to re-reading the original post here about Todd Jones and thought to myself...
so what if Todd Jones doesn't strike out the batters he faces?
As long as Jones is effective in getting the outs, that's all that matters right? It's not like we get bonus points for the K. Just give us the three outs for that inning we need and I'm happy. |
Bobj
Member
Username: Bobj
Post Number: 1992
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 18, 2007 - 10:53 am: | |
Another good night last night!!! |
Smogboy
Member
Username: Smogboy
Post Number: 5035
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, April 18, 2007 - 9:36 pm: | |
Oops, we jinxed 'em. Jonesy blew the save and Rodney gave it up in the tenth to the Kansas Shitty Royals today. Ouch. |
Gumby
Member
Username: Gumby
Post Number: 1560
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, April 19, 2007 - 9:12 am: | |
It was hust a matter of time before ol' roller coaster showed his ugly face again. |
Defendbrooklyn
Member
Username: Defendbrooklyn
Post Number: 297
Registered: 11-2005
| | Posted on Friday, June 29, 2007 - 9:58 am: | |
get jones out of the D |
Zephyrprocess
Member
Username: Zephyrprocess
Post Number: 430
Registered: 08-2006
| | Posted on Friday, June 29, 2007 - 12:14 pm: | |
And who closes yesterday's game, then? |
Smogboy
Member
Username: Smogboy
Post Number: 5564
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Monday, July 02, 2007 - 1:35 am: | |
The Roller Coaster came in and did his job again earning him his 20th save, preserving Jeremy Bonderman's stellar performance.
I'm not about to let Jonesy off the hook by any stretch but he is fifth in the AL in saves. It's not a bad number but I still think (I'm usre he thinks the same) he can do better. He needs to come at it like nobody can touch him. Let's see some fire before we hit that mound out there! |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 3129
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Monday, July 02, 2007 - 7:49 am: | |
Six blown saves, plus the blow-up against Texas last week, is the difference between 1.5 games back and a comfortable lead in first place.
Six more blown saves in the second half would probably cost us a playoff spot with the way the Twins play. |
Dds
Member
Username: Dds
Post Number: 261
Registered: 10-2006
| | Posted on Monday, July 02, 2007 - 8:55 am: | |
quote:get jones out of the D
quote:Six blown saves
Todd Jones does NOT have 6 blown saves. He has 4. If you check the stats, most of the top closers in the majors have at least 2. Four is not awful.
If you want to criticize anything, try his ERA. However, if you back up you criticism with incorrect stats, it makes you sound like you can't check a box score.
If you look at the way he pitched last night, you can see the adjustments that he made to have only a 7 pitch outing. Outstanding.
He's pretty much pitching the exact same way he did last year. His ERA last year in the beginning of July was around 6. His stats were worse last year in June (other than his ERA) and people were calling for his head. He ended up with 37 saves. 4 saves in the post-season with a 0.00 ERA. I trust the people in charge. |
Defendbrooklyn
Member
Username: Defendbrooklyn
Post Number: 308
Registered: 11-2005
| | Posted on Monday, July 02, 2007 - 9:53 am: | |
jones looked good last night...He has made some changes wich is a sign of a pro. I also trust the people in charge...they know best. |
Smogboy
Member
Username: Smogboy
Post Number: 5566
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Monday, July 02, 2007 - 4:12 pm: | |
Like Jones or not, he seems like a consumate professional. He works hard and isn't afraid of criticism. He stands there after games and takes all sorts of questions from the media and doesn't shy away from explaining himself. I think when he flubs it for the team, he really takes it personally- not that it's an excuse, but it at least shows some character to the youngsters on the team.
Maybe his performance has dropped at times but I think he also serves other roles on this team- and leadership is one of those things that just doesn't show up in the stats.
He's our closer- or at least until Leyland changes it, he is ours now. Until that changes, I guess I'll have to support the guy. That being said, he's still not above criticism and he's not below praise either. |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 3136
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Monday, July 02, 2007 - 5:49 pm: | |
My mistake. He is 20/24. It hurts though, when he comes into a tied game and loses it, like against Texas, or into a 3-run or greater lead situation and gives up runs (perhaps enough enough to lose like that one night in Cleveland). And even four more blown saves could cost us a playoff trip just the same. He's blown saves against Tampa Bay (5/28) and Kansas City (4/18). Yeah I want him in the 2007 playoffs.
Want some stats, how about opponents batting average? You really want your save-man to be as untouchable as possible, so let's consider this:
Putz .127 (0 blown saves)
Isringhausen .144 (2 blown saves)
Gagne .145 (0 blown saves)
Street .148 (2 blown saves)
Papelbon .150 (1 blown save)
Hoffman .171 (2 blown saves)
F. Cordero .194 (3 blown saves)
F. Rodriguez .211 (2 blown saves)
Lidge .217 (3 blown saves)
Jenks .219 (2 blown saves)
Rivera .246 (2 blown saves)
Nathan .261 (2 blown saves)
Dempster .263 (2 blown saves)
JONES .288 (4 blown saves, 4 total losses)
Borowski .318 (2 blown saves)
Most save guys average 5-10 strikeouts per 9 innings. Jones is between 4 and 5.
...all this at over $4 million a year.
We're an upper-echalante team which hopes to win the championship, so we need to have one of these top-tier closers, not one who ranks towards the bottom in the league.
Smogboy: consummate professional truck driver or fish-bait salesman, you mean? |
Smogboy
Member
Username: Smogboy
Post Number: 5567
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Monday, July 02, 2007 - 6:46 pm: | |
Of course everyone would want a Mariano Rivera in his prime in their bullpen. Who wouldn't? But those guys just aren't given up by anyone out there. Those really reliable closers are guarded tighter than geese that lay golden eggs. If there's a killer closer out there that's available, I'm sure Dave Dombrowski's already inquired AND the price is way too high. |
Ravine
Member
Username: Ravine
Post Number: 1067
Registered: 01-2006
| | Posted on Monday, July 02, 2007 - 7:19 pm: | |
Well, Your Smogociousness, I agree with you, but then, I usually do. The truth is that, if you want a guy like Rivera was in his prime, you had better hope that he is already in your organization, waiting to blossom, or has filed for free agency, because nobody is going to just give up a guy like that. I love it when radio callers say stuff like (and I actually heard this,) "we gotta go out and get a guy like Trevor Hoffman." For one thing, it's not like "going out and getting" a new car. For another thing, when the HELL did the Padres-- who are in 1st Place, and looking like they're in serious contention for a post-season berth-- say that they had ANY interest in shopping Hoffman, the ALL-TIME Saves leader, around? Sheesh!! |
Dds
Member
Username: Dds
Post Number: 264
Registered: 10-2006
| | Posted on Monday, July 02, 2007 - 8:20 pm: | |
quote:We're an upper-echalante team which hopes to win the championship, so we need to have one of these top-tier closers, not one who ranks towards the bottom in the league.
OK. And who do we give up to get a better closer? Any of those guys that was mentioned above Jones is never going to be traded mid-season for anything less than one of our franchise players.
As far as strikeouts are concerned, Jones is on pace to surpass last year's total of 28. Last year he had 37 saves and was tied for 4th in saves in the American League. Jones obviously does not depend on strike-outs or a low batting-average-against to get his higher-than-average save totals.
Face it. Jones is the best we are going to have until Zumaya (or whoever) has the experience to takeover, and that probably will not be this year.
(Message edited by dds on July 02, 2007) |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 3139
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Monday, July 02, 2007 - 9:20 pm: | |
Then what does Jones rely on to get all those saves? He relies on his fielders to track down warning-track fly balls and missile line-drives (like the one at Polanco yesterday). The man doesn't fool anyone, but the best he can do is mix in that nice curveball which he normally does do when he finds success (yet after finding success he goes back to throwing straight fastballs). Maroth seemed to be the guy to trade for a middle-of-the-road closer, but apparently we are fine with just giving him away for free to a good home. |
Smogboy
Member
Username: Smogboy
Post Number: 5572
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 03, 2007 - 12:44 am: | |
Admittedly I thought Mike Maroth had some decent trade value too. I was hoping that they were going to package him and possibly another player to get some immediate help but instead we'll be getting a prospect.
I'm sure we as Tiger fans would love to trade a bag of magic beans and get the golden goose but realistically you have to look at the other team's POV. What's in it for them? Prime example is the Sheffield for Humberto Sanchez deal- we gave up a very solid prospect to get an aging veteran who could step in now and contribute. The Yankees were pleased as punch as were we when we made the deal. The best deals are when both sides feel good about the transaction immediately after it gets done. What happens in the next few months to come is anyone's speculation (the Polanco for Urbina deal seems like outright theft now).
Like I said earlier, Jones is our closer at the moment. He's no Willie Hernandez, nor is he Mariano Rivera but he's ours. He obviously doesn't throw heat like a Zumaya or a Farnsworth but then how many can? We as fans can only hope that his slurves, odd combinations of fastballs and sliders can work until some of the otyher guys can get their acts together and maybe give Leyland some more flexibility in the bullpen. Ideally I think Jones is more of a situational pitcher, kind of like Jaime Walker last year where he's brought in to face one or two hitters, but in the absence of a true slam-the-door sort of reliever, he's it. |
Dds
Member
Username: Dds
Post Number: 265
Registered: 10-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 03, 2007 - 9:28 am: | |
quote:Maroth seemed to be the guy to trade for a middle-of-the-road closer, but apparently we are fine with just giving him away for free to a good home.
I think what I've been trying to explain is that we already have a "middle-of-the-road" closer. Maybe even a step above middle. Here and in the other thread, you've had reason upon reason why Maroth would not have gotten much of anything in a straight up trade. It would have to be a package. Maroth and a prospect (or two) for someone like, say, Percival, who in the long run (as we found out) will not be much better than Jones. (not a great analogy using Percival, sorry) I think Smogboy explained our current situation best. No team will trade their golden goose for magic beans, and I wish not to repeat 1987 over again. |
Smogboy
Member
Username: Smogboy
Post Number: 5575
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 03, 2007 - 11:12 pm: | |
Okay... duirng the first Cleveland game, didn't Capellan looks like the second coming of Willie Hernandez for a split second? I was thinking "Hey, maybe this kid can anchor the bullpen and Jonesy will be reduced to spot duty as opposed to being the stopper!"- but like all things in close baseball games, all it took was one mighty swing of the bat and we were doomed.
Such is the life of a reliever. |
Jrvass
Member
Username: Jrvass
Post Number: 135
Registered: 01-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 03, 2007 - 11:22 pm: | |
Where was Jones? I must've missed seeing him.
Or he pitched too much last night. (joke)
James |
Focusonthed
Member
Username: Focusonthed
Post Number: 1108
Registered: 02-2006
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 04, 2007 - 1:02 am: | |
Looked good to me. I hope he doesn't let that one blast get in his head. He looked great out there. Those will happen, as Rod said, when you throw that many sliders, you're bound to hang one sometime. And he hung that one, bad. |
Smogboy
Member
Username: Smogboy
Post Number: 5578
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, July 05, 2007 - 12:27 am: | |
Okay I'll admit it. Jonesy's mix of curves and a few fastballs looked solid tonight. He had them out of there and fast in the ninth. |
Mackinaw
Member
Username: Mackinaw
Post Number: 3157
Registered: 02-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, July 05, 2007 - 8:04 am: | |
It is imperative that he uses that curveball well. |
Ravine
Member
Username: Ravine
Post Number: 1094
Registered: 01-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 10, 2007 - 4:02 am: | |
I'm still tired of trying to defend Jones, but I have to say that his 22-4 Saves-Blown Saves ratio is rather good. Hell, even if you add his 1-4 Wins-Losses ratio (which you shouldn't, truly,) that brings him to 23-8, and if we had a starter with a record that looked like that, we would be pretty damned pleased with him. Not a 100% Valid comparison, but y'know, like, I'm just sayin'. |