Discuss Detroit Archives - Beginning January 2006 Violent day leaves 2 dead, 5 injured Previous Next
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Detroitman
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Username: Detroitman

Post Number: 893
Registered: 06-2004
Posted From: 216.78.45.59
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 9:06 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Violent day leaves 2 dead, 5 injured
3 Detroit shootings involve males 21 years old or younger

January 21, 2006

BY MARISOL BELLO

FREE PRESS STAFF WRITER
http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs .dll/article?AID=/20060121/NEW S01/601210352/1003/NEWS
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Royce
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Username: Royce

Post Number: 1414
Registered: 07-2004
Posted From: 69.213.204.173
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 9:16 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Warm January weather sometimes has its drawbacks.
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Mcpd1300
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Username: Mcpd1300

Post Number: 18
Registered: 01-2006
Posted From: 68.42.174.123
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 9:30 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

good god... the last shooting in that article is less than a block from my house... very very scary stuff...
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Broken_main
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Username: Broken_main

Post Number: 688
Registered: 06-2005
Posted From: 69.222.11.226
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 9:56 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It's just senseless!!! What is happening to the mindset of these younger generations. It always makes me wonder what are we doing wrong with our youth.

No one seems to consider the value of life anymore. What a shame.
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Mcpd1300
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Username: Mcpd1300

Post Number: 19
Registered: 01-2006
Posted From: 68.42.174.123
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 10:00 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

broken you're right on that... as a young person my self, it's extremely disheartening to see the senseless violence among youth... granted, I grew up out in the country and moved into the city, but i don't understand what could cause someone to feel the need to shoot another person... unless it was in self-defense... but this clearly wasn't a case of that... and to think, this happened LITERALLY less than a block from my home... i used to think my neighborhood was safer than that... The other thing is that a LOT of this is carry over crime... people from other neighborhoods, bringing their crap into mine...
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Llyn
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Username: Llyn

Post Number: 1368
Registered: 06-2004
Posted From: 68.61.197.206
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 12:51 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Everything that happens in my neighborhood is carry over crime.

About a year and a half ago we had a rape and fatal shooting from someone outside the neighborhood. Last summer just two doors down from me there were shots at 1:30 in the morning. I looked out to see my neighbor firing his gun into the air. He'd been at the casino and had just been mugged by two guys who followed him home. They eventually caught the two guys when they tried the same thing in the Rosedale Park area.
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Broken_main
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Username: Broken_main

Post Number: 701
Registered: 06-2005
Posted From: 69.222.11.226
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 1:29 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

So Mcpd1300...

What do you think about the connection between video games(with violence) and children playing them??? Plus we have all of this violence being played out on TV. Our kids may not know that these are actors at young age...then it becomes a part of there psyche that it is okay to shoot people.

Back in my day children could get a good beating for just sticking up finger guns. i think we need to implement sensitivity training in our schools from grades 4-8.
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Citylover
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Username: Citylover

Post Number: 1560
Registered: 07-2004
Posted From: 4.229.126.162
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 1:33 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

This kind of violence has been going on in Detroit much longer than the video game, x-box play station era....
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Broken_main
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Username: Broken_main

Post Number: 708
Registered: 06-2005
Posted From: 69.222.11.226
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 2:27 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Of course it has, but can we say that it has escalated slightly due to the games??
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Royce
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Username: Royce

Post Number: 1415
Registered: 07-2004
Posted From: 69.212.39.234
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 2:41 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Broken_main, I'm not sure if TV violence today is the cause of so much violence among our youth. In the past you had violence on TV: westerns and superhero shows like Gunsmoke, The Guns of Will Sonnet, Superman and Batman. You also had cop shows like Starsky and Hutch, Kojak, A-Team, Hunter, and T.J. Hooker. These shows, I think, were more violent than the cop shows that you have on today. Today's cop shows are mainly about solving the crime using science or logic ( CSI, Law & Order, Bones, Criminal Minds, Without A Trace, and Cold Case). There's not a lot of shoot 'em up, bang bang going on on network TV. Now maybe there's a lot on cable TV( I don't have cable).

My point here is that our kids are not getting their daily dose of violence from TV. Much of the violence seems to be coming from the video games, movies, and music. These things, however, are not the only contributors to violence. Our proliferation of guns and the disintergration of respect for others on the part of society in general (e.g. road rage, and parents behavior at little league)is also fueling the violence.

Those of us over 35 watched violent TV shows. Did that make us more prone to commit violence? I don't know. Are prisoners in jail who are over 35 and have committed violent crimes, in jail because of the violence they grew up watching on TV? What kept the rest of us from becoming violent, eventhough we were also exposed to the same TV violence?

Are the crimes today being committed simply out of selfishness and being spoiled. Is the attitude that these young assailants exhibit one of, "I want my way and everybody else be damned, and if you get in my way I will do what is necessary to get you out of my way so that I can get what I want?" Is this the result of our "me, me, me" society?

I know that I am raising a lot of questions, but that's because there are no definitive answers to the causes of violence. I personally believe that the lack of respect that we have towards each other is definitely a major cause for a lot of the violence we see today.

If I respect you, then I'm not going to do any thing to harm you. You are a human being like myself and you deserve respect simply because you exist. I should not have less respect for someone just because I don't like the way that they look or because of their position in life. You have my respect until you do something to me that causes me to lose some of that respect. However, I should never totally lose respect for someone because they are still a human being.

And another thing, NO ONE should ever have to earn one's respect. Often times I have heard our youth say this and it ticks me off. It says I have to show you that I am worthy of your respect. I shouldn't have to show anyone that I am worthy of respect. Again, the respect should be given because I am a human being and I exist. Only when I disrespect you should I ever lose some of your respect.

We as a society have to come up with solutions that will reduce these senseless acts of violence. The problem is we can never come to a consensus on how to go about solving these problems. Maybe we need an alien like the one in "The Day the Earth Stood Still" to get us to change our violent tendencies or face destruction as a planet from other planets with non-violent aliens(see the irony here). I just don't know what can be done.
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Cmubryan
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Username: Cmubryan

Post Number: 209
Registered: 11-2003
Posted From: 68.79.94.3
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 2:51 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Gangster lifestyle is glorified everywhere! Watch BET, MTV, movies and hip/hop videos and you can see how young people get carried away in this crap.
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Broken_main
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Username: Broken_main

Post Number: 709
Registered: 06-2005
Posted From: 69.222.11.226
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 3:07 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Royce, You have really summed this up good. I respect your response. Just like so many topics on the forum, some of the questions have definitely been answered. I guess in my youth I didn't watch Gunsmoke. Most of my TV shows were for kids.

In comparison to today's shows, many of which I watch(CSI & Law and Order to name a few), I must admit that they really aren't that violent with the shows of yesteryear.

I agree that society has to come up with an answer to all of the problems that we are facing as it relates to the "senseless acts of violence" that are taking place in our streets.

This topic is one that our mayor, council and citizens should bring to light in a Townhall environment.

Very well put Royce!!!
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Ghetto_butterfly
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Username: Ghetto_butterfly

Post Number: 590
Registered: 09-2004
Posted From: 68.60.139.186
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 3:33 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Gun laws need to be changed drastically. Guns need to be OUTLAWED and then we have to work to gradually get all guns off the streets and away from people. Obviously Americans don't have the necessary responsibility and conscience needed to handle the power that comes with owning a gun.

I'm off to Germany now, where strict gun laws have already been in place forever (as in the other European countries as well).
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Corktownmark
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Username: Corktownmark

Post Number: 151
Registered: 12-2004
Posted From: 68.61.194.191
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 4:13 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Enjoy your trip GB. See you when you return... you will return?
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Detroit_stylin
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Username: Detroit_stylin

Post Number: 2319
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 66.202.227.12
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 4:25 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Royce I agree with you whole heartedly. It is easy to place the blame on how kids act on such things as video games, and tv, and movies. That's the cowardly way out of it. We as adults have to take more of a responsibility in raising kids to know right from wrong, how to act in one situation or another, and just general respect.

What ever happened to the days of "It takes a village to raise a child"? I remember growing up how everyone in the neighborhood I was raised in looked out for the welfare of the neighborhood children whether they were theirs or not. But they'd be quick to let your momz or your popz know if you were doing something wrong, when you were outside of your parents prescence.
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Supersport
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Username: Supersport

Post Number: 9778
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 69.246.37.236
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 4:27 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

Gun laws need to be changed drastically. Guns need to be OUTLAWED and then we have to work to gradually get all guns off the streets and away from people.




LMAO at that mentality. Yeah, because once they go and take away the guns from all the registered gun owners, the criminals will then just step forward and surrender theirs.
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Danny
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Username: Danny

Post Number: 3651
Registered: 02-2004
Posted From: 207.74.111.85
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 4:28 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Crazy folks in the ghetto always make its days.
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Detroit_stylin
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Username: Detroit_stylin

Post Number: 2320
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 66.202.227.12
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 4:29 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

So how do you explain the much smaller prescence of guns in the hands of criminals in European streets then Sport?
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Supersport
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Username: Supersport

Post Number: 9779
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 69.246.37.236
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 4:34 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Well, in France during great battles they simply lie down their weapons and run. So I'm guessing thats how they got their guns off the streets. I can't speak for other Eurpean countries. Seriously though, do you honestly believe that by making guns illegal all of the sudden criminals will have less guns or have a harder time getting them? Drugs are illegal, how's that working out?
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Detroit_stylin
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Username: Detroit_stylin

Post Number: 2322
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 66.202.227.12
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 4:41 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

No what I am saying is if the US puts stricter regulations on the gun manufactures, and those that bring supplies in AND out of the country then they can curtail to a great degree the amount of guns that wind up on the street...
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Ilovedetroit
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Username: Ilovedetroit

Post Number: 1995
Registered: 02-2005
Posted From: 69.246.4.29
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 4:43 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I am for a ban on ALL guns other than basic hunting rifles. For hunting rifles there needs to an extensive government regulated (one database) background check and waiting period (at least 30-60 days). Heavy fines and or jail time (or maybe community service in lieu of jail time for first time offenders) should be levied for those who break the law.
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Supersport
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Username: Supersport

Post Number: 9780
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 69.246.37.236
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 4:57 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I say give EVERYBODY who has a clean record guns. How many crimes do you think would be commited if criminals KNEW that their victim had a gun? As it is, they roll the dice and plan on them not having a way of protecting themselves.
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Ilovedetroit
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Username: Ilovedetroit

Post Number: 1997
Registered: 02-2005
Posted From: 69.246.4.29
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 5:26 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Such a Republican you are Supersport! But I will still buy you a beer - one made in American of course!
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Ltorivia485
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Username: Ltorivia485

Post Number: 2286
Registered: 08-2004
Posted From: 199.74.87.131
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 5:40 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The people in these impoverished neighborhoods (you know, the role models) all left for greener pastures in the suburbs or out-of-state.
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Warriorfan
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Username: Warriorfan

Post Number: 228
Registered: 08-2005
Posted From: 68.43.81.191
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 8:50 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Virtually every academic and government study done on gun control have shown that they have no measuarble effect on crime rates. In fact, since Michigan allowed citizens to obtain CCWs, crime in our fair state has gone down. Vermont has "Right to Carry" laws, anyone who can legally own a firearm in Vermont can carry it in public, no permit or license or training is required. Vermont is the SECOND safest state in America. The only state that has less violent crime than Vermont is North Dakota, another state with extremely lax gun control.

Now lets look at Washington DC. It is ILLEGAL for anyone to own or posess a handgun in DC. Now let's look at their murder rates by handgun, it's gotta be the worst in the nation or at least in the Top 3.

There are currently 125,000 Michigan residents who are licensed to carry guns in public, so where are all the murders and shootings committed by CCW holders?


If you want to reduce gun crime, then start handing out tougher punishments. Make any felony committed with a firearm a minimum of 10 years in prison, and stop letting people out early. Ask any cop, they'll tell you that it's the justice system that is broken, not our gun laws. Ask them if they enjoy arresting the SAME person over and over again, because these criminals keep getting slaps on the wrist and are back on the streets in no time.
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Royce
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Username: Royce

Post Number: 1416
Registered: 07-2004
Posted From: 70.236.176.104
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 9:16 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Warriorfan, Vermont and North Dakota have very small populations relative to other U.S. states. These states also have a smaller percentage of minorities. Minorities tend to live in poverty more often than whites. Crime is more prevalent in poor communities.

Now, on the other hand, whites make up an extremely large percentage of the population in Vermont and North Dakota. Whites earn more than minorities on average. So, maybe the gun laws are the reason for such low crime, but then again maybe they're not the reason. Something to think about.
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Jimaz
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Username: Jimaz

Post Number: 72
Registered: 12-2005
Posted From: 68.2.191.57
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 9:41 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

In Phoenix it's not unusual to spot people carrying sidearms in public. Saw one on a guy with his family waiting in line at Boston Market. It's a bit surreal but nobody freaks about it. Not sure why he thought it necessary.

I guess I'd object if everyone were openly armed simply because it would provide more opportunities for a perp to snatch a weapon. Maybe mandatory RFID rings would solve that problem. CCW should help that too.

Granted though, Detroit is a completely different culture. I'm not passionate about the issue but respect opinions on both sides.
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Johnnny5
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Username: Johnnny5

Post Number: 136
Registered: 06-2005
Posted From: 71.227.95.4
Posted on Saturday, January 21, 2006 - 10:18 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"I'm off to Germany now, where strict gun laws have already been in place forever (as in the other European countries as well)."

Ghetto_Butterfly,

You are 100% correct Germany has had strict gun control laws for some time; here are some dating from the 1930's. As far as I know these laws were very effective.

Regulations Against Jews' Possession of Weapons
11 November 1938

With a basis in 31 of the Weapons Law of 18 March 1928 (Reichsgesetzblatt I, p. 265), Article III of the Law on the Reunification of Austria with Germany of 13 March 1938 (Reichsgesetzblatt I, p. 237), and 9 of the Fuhrer and Chancellor's decree on the administration of the Sudeten-German districts of 1 October 1928 (Reichsgesetzblatt 1, p. 1331 ) are the following ordered:


1
Jews ( 5 of the First Regulations of the German Citizenship Law of 14 November 1935, Reichsgesetzblatt 1, p. 1332) are prohibited from acquiring. Possessing, and carrying firearms and ammunition, as well as truncheons or stabbing weapons. Those now possessing weapons and ammunition are at once to turn them over to the local police authority.


2
Firearms and ammunition found in a Jew's possession will be forfeited to the government without compensation.
3
The Minister of the Interior may make exceptions to the Prohibition in 1 for Jews who are foreign nationals. He can entrust other authorities with this power.


4
Whoever willfully or negligently violates the provisions of 1 will be punished with imprisonment and a fine. In especially severe cases of deliberate violations, the punishment is imprisonment in a penitentiary for up to five years.


5
For the implementation if this regulation, the Minister of the Interior waives the necessary legal and administrative provisions.


6
This regulation is valid in the state of Austria and in the Sudeten-German districts.


Berlin, 11 November 1938
Minister of the Interior

Source http://www.jpfo.org/NaziLawEng lish.htm
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Alexei289
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Username: Alexei289

Post Number: 999
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 68.61.183.223
Posted on Sunday, January 22, 2006 - 2:32 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

... wait..

Arent these people poping other people with guns completely ignoring the most severe law in this country?.. What makes you think baning guns will do anything...

If there is a demand, there is a supply... period. In Germany, there is no demand, therefore, there is no supply. In America, where it is difficult just to provide for your basic needs for many people, life becomes much more devalued, since really... for about 1/4th of this country, existance sux... while 3/4th of it are doing pretty well and constantly rubbing it in your face and blaming you for all of their problems. Its not hard to lose your respect for laws after that.... and your respect for life...

BTW, why are people in Japan, Canada, and Europe playing and watching the same violent movies and video games and not translating them into real violence???
wow... no correlation

What about the fact that we spend almost 150 BILLION dollars on fighting the supply of drugs everyyear.. and any and all drugs are very readily and ampally available... why would gun laws get rid of guns from people that own them illegally as it is. Most of them got them illegally in the first place, so they already have an ILLEGAL supply, which can evade any ban on guns...

wow... no correlation..


start using some logic people...

Until we start changing society so that people live together instead of segregating by class... we will NEVER solve violent crime.
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Ilovedetroit
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Username: Ilovedetroit

Post Number: 1999
Registered: 02-2005
Posted From: 69.246.4.29
Posted on Sunday, January 22, 2006 - 2:34 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Vermont and South Dakota .... hmmm low crime rates? Cus they have no F**king people!
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Warriorfan
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Username: Warriorfan

Post Number: 230
Registered: 08-2005
Posted From: 68.43.81.191
Posted on Sunday, January 22, 2006 - 12:35 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Exactly, it's ridiculous to make a statement that all guns need to be banned everywhere just because Detroit has a problem with firearm homicides. Just because there is gun violence in Detroit does that mean we need to ban guns in the Upper Penninsula, or Traverse City, or Grand Rapids, etc?

There are MANY places in this country where firearm ownership is common, like the Dakotas and Vermont, and yet gun homicides are not. To deny 300 million people a constitutional right because of the irresponsibility of a few would be tantamount to fascism.


And when we live in a country in which tens of millions of people use drugs that are illegally smuggled in, what makes you think that guns won't be smuggled in the same way? As long as there is a market for guns in America, there will be people to smuggle them in. Supply and demand, drugs are illegal but easy to obtain if you are willing to break the law, and so will guns if you ban them.
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Goat
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Username: Goat

Post Number: 8079
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 64.228.211.85
Posted on Sunday, January 22, 2006 - 3:09 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

If guns reduced crime, the USA would be the safest country in the world...So why isn't it?

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