Discuss Detroit Archives - Beginning January 2006 Mayor Ignores Calls about Tiger Stadium Previous Next
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Merchantgander
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Username: Merchantgander

Post Number: 1682
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 68.42.172.120
Posted on Sunday, March 26, 2006 - 12:35 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

http://www.detnews.com/apps/pb cs.dll/article?AID=/20060326/O PINION03/603260337/1283

I love ideas where the city doesn't have do raise the funds.
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Naturalsister
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Username: Naturalsister

Post Number: 551
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 68.42.169.65
Posted on Sunday, March 26, 2006 - 12:43 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I just love that idea period. Preservation and having an eye for history. Great idea.

later - naturalsister
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Matt
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Username: Matt

Post Number: 1019
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 69.136.149.90
Posted on Sunday, March 26, 2006 - 12:58 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Tear that schitt down!
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321brian
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Username: 321brian

Post Number: 88
Registered: 02-2006
Posted From: 209.114.225.8
Posted on Sunday, March 26, 2006 - 1:07 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

He would have called back if it was Barden on the line. Actually, he probably would have taken it instead of calling back.

Besides why would Detroit want to sell something that is costing it so much money? It has so much!!
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56packman
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Username: 56packman

Post Number: 141
Registered: 12-2005
Posted From: 24.208.234.52
Posted on Sunday, March 26, 2006 - 1:56 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

This sort of thing is typically followed by the
"send in the bulldozers late at night to mortally wound the structure so it HAS to be torn down" ploy, which has worked successfully on many other buildings. City hall knows that no one will be called to task for that faceless command, and the building huggers will go off and cry, letting you go about your business.
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Ray1936
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Username: Ray1936

Post Number: 400
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 207.200.116.139
Posted on Sunday, March 26, 2006 - 2:04 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

That was worth clicking on that link just to see the 1934 photo that went with the article. Good one.
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Leoqueen
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Username: Leoqueen

Post Number: 1186
Registered: 07-2004
Posted From: 68.61.195.27
Posted on Sunday, March 26, 2006 - 2:40 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Good article, and the picture was wonderful. Sounds like he has a great idea. Doesnt surprise me that the city powers that be havent returned his calls. What he describes sounds much more exciting than anything going on at Comerica Park......COMPETITION!!! that Ilitch wouldnt want in such close proximity.
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Histeric
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Username: Histeric

Post Number: 661
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.61.194.66
Posted on Sunday, March 26, 2006 - 2:56 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Well he may be well intentioned but I can tell you for certain that he doesn't do his homework...or he would have called Corktown. We have been working on resolving the TS issue from the initial stakeholders meetings leading up to the Tigers moving up until the present. Maybe he thinks he's too much of a big shot to consult the community in which he wishes to do business, something the city, and especially Mayor Kilpatrick, is not guilty of. Another Illitch we can do without.
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Broken_main
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Username: Broken_main

Post Number: 1004
Registered: 06-2005
Posted From: 68.42.79.6
Posted on Sunday, March 26, 2006 - 3:09 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

COMPETITION, if Ilitch is scared of some little leaguers coming to play ball in Old Stadium, then it serves him right to produce a real competitive team(but thats a whole nother story).

I think these Matty's and Mikes really have KK by the balls and he is feeling some pressure. These guys seem to have a lot of control over our boy in CAYMC.
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Histeric
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Username: Histeric

Post Number: 662
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.61.194.66
Posted on Sunday, March 26, 2006 - 5:25 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I know that politicians are easy targets for rumour, innuendo, speculation and negative assumptions, but it seems to me that as long as that is so, we will continue to deny ourselves access to the best leadership available. I mean who would willingly subject themselves to the vile(as demonstrated so clearly and so often on this forum by the resident armchair quarterbacks and know it alls) of those they must lead when so many other choices are available in life. Or who would give up their right to be innocent until proven guilty and subject their families to what that entails. America needs to lose this National Enquirer methodology in the treatment of our leaders or we are doomed to more mediocrity.

KK has been advised since his inauguration by the Corktown Citizens District Council, the Greater Corktown Development Corporation, the Corktown Historic Society and the stakeholders meetings facilitated by Zachary and Associates during the time leading up to the closing of the stadium that we strongly oppose the recycling of The Corner as a single use site and that any plan should include a mixed use with a strong residential component, preserve the field at a minimum, and relieve the scourge of surface parking lots.

The proposal in this article, dubbed the Navin Field Plan, sounds very similar to previous versions turned down by Corktown. No residential and no parking plan sounds like no support from Corktown.

Is KK supporting Mike or Corktown? Time will tell. I have faith in our leader.
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Magic_mushroom
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Username: Magic_mushroom

Post Number: 1
Registered: 12-2005
Posted From: 24.220.197.208
Posted on Sunday, March 26, 2006 - 6:21 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Something needs to be done to save this historic venue. We're down to four remaining classic pro baseball parks now. That number will fall to three after Yankee Stadium is leveled in 2008. At least many of us can say "I've been to a game at the corner." Unfortunately, that number will also grow smaller every year.
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Danindc
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Username: Danindc

Post Number: 1364
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 67.100.158.10
Posted on Sunday, March 26, 2006 - 6:34 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

This is just a conspiracy between the Detroit News and the National Trust to make the City of Detroit look bad. Look at all the other buildings that Detroit has saved!
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Paulmcall
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Username: Paulmcall

Post Number: 608
Registered: 05-2004
Posted From: 68.40.119.216
Posted on Sunday, March 26, 2006 - 6:48 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

City of Detroit doesn't need any help in making itself look bad. Just look at the zoo fiasco and Mr. Ferguson lining his pockets at citizen expense for examples that make you shake your head.
As far as feeling sorry for our great public officials taking heat, don't make me laugh. They deserve ever bit of heat and more for not doing their jobs. They should be leading instead of looking out for No. 1 (themselves).
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Histeric
Member
Username: Histeric

Post Number: 663
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.61.194.66
Posted on Sunday, March 26, 2006 - 7:18 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Well get off their backs until you have done a thorough investigation and have hard evidence of wrongdoing, as opposed to throwing stones at every opportunity, and just maybe, they might have time to pay attention to leading instead of the constant defense/battle mode. I will always wonder what progress we sacrificed to...catch a president getting a blowjob or...allowing an unwinnable recall against our previous mayor. Why didn't Archer run again? Why did California spend all that money to replace a Governor during his term to then disapprove of the knight in shining armor who replaced him. Americans have become whiney bitches and alot of them are on this site. Try doing it yourself.
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Dialh4hipster
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Username: Dialh4hipster

Post Number: 1499
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 68.40.28.148
Posted on Sunday, March 26, 2006 - 7:28 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Look, I know there is a great deal of sentimental value attached to TS, in particular from suburbanites who only have to deal with it when they want to, but frankly it is obsolete and USELESS, and frankly it will not become useful as some little ballpark for minor leagues or little league or whatever.

Of all the structures to try and save, why not something with some real function for the future, not to mention some architectural merit.
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Histeric
Member
Username: Histeric

Post Number: 664
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.61.194.66
Posted on Sunday, March 26, 2006 - 7:30 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

BTW - Corktown is full of historic preservationists, including myself (histeric preservationist). I guess the difference between many of them and some of the building huggers respresented on this forum is that they are operating with the whole picture/the real facts instead of some twisted sense of nostalgia driven to madness by rumours. The real power of historic preservation is as an economic development tool.

I challenge Dan to show me why Detroit, with its rear position in terms of urban redevelopment, should be the only city to reuse its major league park, when far stronger markets were unable. Oh screw it. Carry on using this as another excuse to bash the city you all claim to love. I've got better things to do, like putting my money where my mouth is.

(Message edited by histeric on March 26, 2006)
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Royce
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Username: Royce

Post Number: 1563
Registered: 07-2004
Posted From: 68.255.240.236
Posted on Sunday, March 26, 2006 - 8:02 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

How about building a community recreation center on the site with the original ball field divided into two or three ball fields to be used for the rec center's little league games. At present there doesn't appear to be a playfield for children in Corktown. Come to think of it, are there any children in Corktown? If there are, where do they go to play baseball. The TS site seems perfect for a community/neighborhood ball field and rec center.
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Wcpo_intern
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Username: Wcpo_intern

Post Number: 1871
Registered: 04-2004
Posted From: 71.227.58.187
Posted on Sunday, March 26, 2006 - 8:17 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Histeric, I'm sure George Jackson and Kwame agree with you. Wait, maybe they don't. Actually, I think they disagree with you 100%. Wait, I don't remember them saying that either. What was it that the Mayor's office said on the issue? I forgot. They had nothing to say because they don't respond to anything ever. I agrre that its outrgaeous to expect George to respond to these proposals or expect anyone from the Mayor's office to let the public know their plans for fixing a long standing problem.

I'll try that one at work. When the boss asks me to investigate the feasability of a solution to a problem we're having, I'll ignore it because its time to go to lunch. . . on the company credit card. . . with my relatives. . . and a supplier that should be paying for the lunch. . . and order the most expensive items. . . at the fanciest restaurant. . . out of state, of course. . . because I'm too busy researching other alternatives to give a courtesy call back on the solution that was presented to me.
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Livernoisyard
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Username: Livernoisyard

Post Number: 347
Registered: 10-2004
Posted From: 69.242.223.42
Posted on Sunday, March 26, 2006 - 8:23 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Milwaukee County Stadium is now a ball park next to Miller Field: "Helfaer Field, a Little League ballpark, occupies part of the site where County Stadium once stood."

Milwaukee County Stadium
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Danindc
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Username: Danindc

Post Number: 1365
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 67.100.158.10
Posted on Sunday, March 26, 2006 - 8:42 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Histeric, you kindly missed the part where the City issued RFPs for redevelopment--and then promptly ignored them all. What gives? Why no follow up since?

Let's be honest, because the City certainly hasn't been. That hulk has been sitting there empty on the Corner for five years. Why the tease on the part of the City?

IMO, this is just another instance of the City of Detroit's short-sightedness in "planning". For the $75 million of city money that went into Commercialism Park, the least Detroiters could expect is a definite plan for the Tiger Stadium site. Instead, the CoD chose the usual route of ignoring the building until it's too far gone to save, and then they'll exercise the only remaining option, which is a publicly-funded demolition, in the "hopes" that someone will redevelop the site.

...and for what it's worth, League Park in Cleveland (although a bit dilapidated) has been a neighborhood park since it closed in 1946. Uncanny how Glans's new proposal for Tiger Stadium sounds A LOT like the redevelopment plan for League Park.... But, how silly of me to dare compare Detroit to another city.

http://www.ballparks.com/baseb all/american/league.htm

DIDC
professional building preserver
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Rustic
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Username: Rustic

Post Number: 2262
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 67.163.181.81
Posted on Sunday, March 26, 2006 - 9:29 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I agree with Histeric's initial point. This plan seems to lack even a veneer of realistic due diligence (if that is the right term) if it is news to the Corktown folks. Anyone who is serious about doing something at the TS site would do well to reach out to the Corktown orgs ... even if they got a cold shoulder at least it would indicate some commonsense on the part of the would-be development team.

Rustic -- armchair QB and know-it-all

(Message edited by rustic on March 26, 2006)
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Histeric
Member
Username: Histeric

Post Number: 665
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.61.194.66
Posted on Sunday, March 26, 2006 - 10:19 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

WCPO - If you can't understand that different disciplines/professions require different methodologies/strategies, I am not sure I can help you. It is obvious you don't have an intimate understanding of how incompetent our local media can be at times. George Jackson and Doug Diggs are committed professionals, with busy schedules and probably recognize the same old recycled stories and prioritize their time accordingly. I have been called for quotes on all the same slow news day stories and have not returned the calls either. When there is something NEW to report, I will be happy to assist them in getting the NEWS out. GJ's job is not to help the NEWS sell the same old crap and neither is it mine. I say quit milking the Queen of Diamonds for stories until there IS a story, and not from someone with sour grapes who didn't get picked to play.

Your second paragraph isn't worth dignifying with a retort.

Dan, you have been on this site long enough to know that I have discussed ad nauseum what you claim I "kindly missed". There are only a handful of people who know the long and complicated history of this process/struggle as well as myself and I have laid out much of it phase by phase for the forum. But nobody gets anything accomplished pissing and moaning. There has been a recent change of leadership at P&DD and I for one, am prepared to give that new leadership a little time before I will lay the blame for inaction at their feet. Instead, I will stay positive and see it as an opportunity to move forward. But forward is the key word and that requires the components I described, including a preserved field, mixed use development and parking. I believe I have seen most, if not all, of the proposals resulting from the cities two RFPs. The Saginaw group who put in the Navin Field proposal sat and argued with Corktown that Corktown had parked cars for 50k+ people for years and they didn't see why we couldn't do it for 15 or 20K. They insisted that the parking deck we were asking for would make their plan financially unfeasible, but without it, our plan to infill our neighborhood remains unfeasible, which meant for us, no support. Can you blame us? The formal garden proposal folks were downright insulting when we didn't support their lamebrain plan. I don't have time to go through them one at a time but suffice it to say that it was not encouraging. That is why Corktown put its own proposal together and found developers willing to partner on our collective vision. Time will tell where we go from here....as it will for League Park where they also have a PLAN and the Hyde Park facility which also has a PLAN. Want a plan? Gotta about twenty of em at my office. Stop by some time.
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Xd_brklyn
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Username: Xd_brklyn

Post Number: 121
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 24.199.85.70
Posted on Monday, March 27, 2006 - 1:15 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"...That number will fall to three after Yankee Stadium is leveled in 2008"

Though Yankee Stadium is still counted as an existant stadium, it was leveled in the early '70s down to the foundations and then rebuilt as it is today. The new Yankee Stadium they are proposing is planned to be built in a lot next door and is designed to actually look more like the original Yankee "House that Ruth Built" Stadium than the current one. Yet, there are strong objections to this plan as the neighborhood will lose valuable public park land. The Bronx neighborhood wants the Yankees to redo what they did in the early 70s--build the new stadium on the footprint of the old one. Another case where a neighborhood is trying to determine its own direction.
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Mbr
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Username: Mbr

Post Number: 53
Registered: 03-2005
Posted From: 69.136.139.235
Posted on Monday, March 27, 2006 - 1:57 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Has an MLS soccer venue with a Detroit team ever been considered for TS?
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Gistok
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Username: Gistok

Post Number: 1927
Registered: 08-2004
Posted From: 4.229.129.88
Posted on Monday, March 27, 2006 - 3:06 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I remember driving thru Chicago (mid 1980's?) when the New Comiskey Park was being built across the street from the old Comiskey Park. Deja Vu!
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Drm
Member
Username: Drm

Post Number: 905
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.248.43.118
Posted on Monday, March 27, 2006 - 10:36 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

What was it that the Mayor's office said on the issue? I forgot. They had nothing to say because they don't respond to anything ever.


Just because they didn't say anything to YOU doesn't mean they haven't said anything to those who MATTER... and you obviously don't matter.

This city can use a hundred more folks like Histeric and about a million less wannabes.
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Dabirch
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Username: Dabirch

Post Number: 1433
Registered: 06-2004
Posted From: 208.44.117.10
Posted on Monday, March 27, 2006 - 10:38 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

This city can use a hundred more folks like Histeric...




Think of how much better the bar business would do...
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Merchantgander
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Username: Merchantgander

Post Number: 1684
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 150.198.150.244
Posted on Monday, March 27, 2006 - 11:08 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

This city can use a hundred more folks like Histeric and about a million less wannabes.




We don't even have million people. We definitely could use a million more wannabes living in the city of Detroit as long as they are educated and have jobs. They are allot better then the uneducated, no job having, don't give a shit and just shit on the city they live in attitude which is way to prevalent in Detroit.

(Message edited by Merchantgander on March 27, 2006)
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Swingline
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Username: Swingline

Post Number: 422
Registered: 11-2003
Posted From: 172.131.189.79
Posted on Monday, March 27, 2006 - 11:57 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It is very difficult to believe that a reuse of Tiger Stadium as some sort of entertainment or recreational venue will generate enough revenue to support a multi million dollar construction program and then annual operational costs in perpetuity. There is less risk to the city and Corktown and far more benefit if a new mixed-use project is pursued. Residential ownership and retail and office tenancies provide far more potential for a stable revenue stream that will provide the community with a vital 24/7 asset.
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Focusonthed
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Username: Focusonthed

Post Number: 63
Registered: 02-2006
Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Monday, March 27, 2006 - 12:21 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I don't know if tearing half the stadium down is a better option than tearing it all down.

I don't think I want a half-demolished stadium living on as a little league ballpark. That's just insulting to everything T.S. was.
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Jt1
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Username: Jt1

Post Number: 7064
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 198.208.159.20
Posted on Monday, March 27, 2006 - 12:23 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I offered them $1 Billion and a viable plan and they shot me down.

Hey, I said it, it must be a solid plan. Alert the presses. How can people believe the local media that believes any response to an RFP is a viable plan.

We have some ignorant media around here that report on emotion and not reality. Is it really that hard to see?
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Skamour14
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Username: Skamour14

Post Number: 28
Registered: 03-2005
Posted From: 35.8.142.183
Posted on Monday, March 27, 2006 - 3:00 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

jt1... do you really have a billion dollars..... quick give it to the Barenaked ladies... they keep on going "if i had a million dollars"..... just so they shut the hell up, and then they'd have a billion dollars...... I ve been hanging around danny too much...
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Jt1
Member
Username: Jt1

Post Number: 7065
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 198.208.159.20
Posted on Monday, March 27, 2006 - 3:32 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

I ve been hanging around danny too much...




Priceless. Nope but many claim that they have finances/financial backing that is unproven or sketchy at best.
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Detroit313
Member
Username: Detroit313

Post Number: 17
Registered: 02-2006
Posted From: 72.229.136.103
Posted on Monday, March 27, 2006 - 5:00 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I honestly think the city should level tiger stadium and build a new convention center there. tear Cobo down, the river should be for the residents people. Tiger stadium is a treasure I love it too but it's time to move on. And resurface Michigan Ave DAMMIT! 313
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Ndavies
Member
Username: Ndavies

Post Number: 1695
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 129.9.163.106
Posted on Monday, March 27, 2006 - 5:54 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Detroit 313, That's a terrible idea. First there is not near enough land at the tiger stadium site for a convention center as big as COBO hall. Second it would completely destroy one of the best functioning neighborhoods in the city due to the huge amounts of parking that would be required. It would also greatly impact a barely functioning downtown. It would remove a huge source of business for all the resturaunts.

Cobo needs to stay downtown to keep downtown functioning. Tiger stadium needs to be turned into mixed use to keep corktown growing.

None of the residents of Corktown would want this.
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Magic_mushroom
Member
Username: Magic_mushroom

Post Number: 2
Registered: 12-2005
Posted From: 24.220.197.208
Posted on Monday, March 27, 2006 - 8:01 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"...The Bronx neighborhood wants the Yankees to redo what they did in the early 70s--build the new stadium on the footprint of the old one..."

Now that's an idea for Olympia Stadium! They could then relocate the armory to Joe Louis Arena. I wonder if they completely took out the basement portion when they bulldozed the Old Red Barn? If only I had friends like Ross Perot or Bill Gates.
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Skamour14
Member
Username: Skamour14

Post Number: 35
Registered: 03-2005
Posted From: 67.185.180.156
Posted on Monday, March 27, 2006 - 9:17 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

or we could be like jt1 and just give em a billion dollars... and it'd buy em a monkey!!!!!
now you know you've always wanted a monkey!!!
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Chitaku
Member
Username: Chitaku

Post Number: 4
Registered: 03-2006
Posted From: 68.43.107.72
Posted on Tuesday, March 28, 2006 - 4:22 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Anyone wanna start stripping bricks off and selling them?
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Skamour14
Member
Username: Skamour14

Post Number: 40
Registered: 03-2005
Posted From: 67.185.180.156
Posted on Tuesday, March 28, 2006 - 7:45 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

how bout we start stripping bricks off your face????? now that would just be like a rouge huh?

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