Discuss Detroit Archives - Beginning January 2006 Kwame and George Jackson: Historic Preservationists Previous Next
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Harpernottingham
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Username: Harpernottingham

Post Number: 36
Registered: 04-2006
Posted From: 68.62.21.54
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 1:36 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hardly!

Check out Neal Rubin's column in today's Detroit News:

http://tinyurl.com/jgabz

I don't understand what George Jackson's big hurry is to tear down Tiger Stadium. Harry Glanz has the funding, but the city seems to be turning a deaf ear to him.

The new movie about Tiger Stadium examines the racial angle on it, if indeed there is one.

Gary Glaser is the director/producer of the Tiger Stadium movie. It's called "Stranded at the Corner." You can buy the DVD at Thomas Video in Clawson or online at www.strandedatthecorner.com.

The movie might be playing on the big screen soon at the Royal Oak Main Art Theatre. But by then, the stadium might not be standing anymore.
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Jt1
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Username: Jt1

Post Number: 7327
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 198.208.159.19
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 1:41 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

I don't understand what George Jackson's big hurry is to tear down Tiger Stadium. Harry Glanz has the funding, but the city seems to be turning a deaf ear to him.




No, he does not have the funding that is why he is just blowing smoke.
http://detroitnews.com/apps/pb cs.dll/article?AID=/20060505/O PINION03/605050368&SearchID=73 243645397636


quote:

Glanz says he's been busy rounding up supporters who will pay for upkeep on the stadium while they stitch together a plan. The problem, he says, is that there's no way to know what's doable until he goes through the place with a structural engineer and a magnifying glass.




I'm more than skeptical that he expects others to pay for the upkeep while he comes up with a 'plan'

I still have not seen Mr. Rubin in his 3 articles about this even acknowledge the community or community groups that are effected by TS.

It is easier to dream big when you don't live near the reality.
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Jt1
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Username: Jt1

Post Number: 7328
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 198.208.159.19
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 1:42 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

And this was a great quote that so many people forget to consider with Glanz's last minute 'heroics'


quote:

"I think people like him should be held just as accountable as people who work for the city are," Jackson says, "the same way people who wait for 6 years and did nothing should be held accountable."


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Darwinism
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Username: Darwinism

Post Number: 492
Registered: 06-2005
Posted From: 69.215.30.34
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 1:50 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

This debate will continue to no end.

Rhetoric duel and so on .....

Harpernottingham: Perhaps you have been lurking for a while, but just in case you're not aware, many on here are in favor of Corktown's very own plans. Histeric may be able to say more regarding that. If G. Jackson is already saying that Tiger Stadium comes down, then I guess even Corktown's plans have been shoved.
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Harpernottingham
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Username: Harpernottingham

Post Number: 39
Registered: 04-2006
Posted From: 68.62.21.54
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 1:54 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

George Jackson and Kwame Kilpatrick:

True visionaries.
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Gotdetroit
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Username: Gotdetroit

Post Number: 12
Registered: 12-2005
Posted From: 66.208.225.165
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 2:14 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Tear the thing down already. It's getting boring talking about this. It's a freaking pile of steel and concrete. Sure, some great stuff happened there. In the past. Other than that, the thing is useless. Let it go already.
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E_hemingway
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Username: E_hemingway

Post Number: 613
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 68.42.176.123
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 2:27 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I wouldn't dismiss the Corktown plan as dead in the water quite yet. Look at what Rubin wrote at the end of his story.

"Jackson ... has another project in mind that he suggests will be an easy sell.

"You'll know Tiger Stadium was there," Jackson says. "It won't be, 'We're just going to tear it down.'"

He says an announcement could come within a week. Pending mayoral approval, he can't say what it is, but it's clear what it won't be -- not when he and Glanz aren't even in the same ballpark."

Those graphs make me optimistic about Corktown's plan, since it calls for demolishing most of the stadium but preserves the field and a few seats.

Plus, if Corktown's plans were being snubbed or something they didn't like were going to happen, I think they would be making quite the ruckus right now. Silence can speak loudly.
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Histeric
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Username: Histeric

Post Number: 693
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.61.194.66
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 2:37 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Very perceptive...while Glanz gets some more free advertising for his mortgage company.
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Harpernottingham
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Username: Harpernottingham

Post Number: 40
Registered: 04-2006
Posted From: 68.62.21.54
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 2:39 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I wouldn't be surprised if Glanz was working with the Corktown development group. They've got the plan. He's got the money. Hmm ...

I certainly hope so.
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Histeric
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Username: Histeric

Post Number: 694
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.61.194.66
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 2:42 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

uhhhhh....not. Glanz is so good at doing his due diligence that he has never even approached the "Corktown development group". I think he just likes seeing his company name in the paper over and over and over.
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Histeric
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Username: Histeric

Post Number: 695
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.61.194.66
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 2:44 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

BTW - I am sick and tired of seeing George Jackson take the heat. He is the best thing to happen to the leadership of Detroit development in many moons. He doesn't deserve the constant barrage of negativity.
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Harpernottingham
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Username: Harpernottingham

Post Number: 41
Registered: 04-2006
Posted From: 68.62.21.54
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 2:50 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

How so, Histeric?

Honest ... Tell us what's so great about George Jackson. I'm assuming he's a step up from Walter Watkins. I sure hope so.
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Unclefrank
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Username: Unclefrank

Post Number: 41
Registered: 03-2006
Posted From: 192.85.50.1
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 2:54 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I know Kwami can't wait to tar down Ft. Wayne.
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E_hemingway
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Username: E_hemingway

Post Number: 614
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 68.42.176.123
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 2:55 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Gotta agree. George Jackson and the Mayor do take a lot of heat. A little of it they deserve. However, they have stayed focused on a lot projects that have immensely helped or will have a great impact on downtown and the city overall. They have been major players in the riverfront development, Book Caddilac restoration, One Kennedy Square building, streetscape improvements and a lot more. The bottom line is the city is moving forward and looks better than it has in a long time. These two guys deserve a lot more credit than they have received.
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E_hemingway
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Username: E_hemingway

Post Number: 615
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 68.42.176.123
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 3:13 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Histeric: BTW, I didn't believe what you said about TS in January at LJ's would actually happen. I now have much more faith in that. I'll be more than happy to buy you a drink or three the next time I see you.
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Histeric
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Username: Histeric

Post Number: 697
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.61.194.66
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 3:24 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

There are still no guarantees my friend, although I have great respect for Mr. Jackson. The current administration is miles ahead of the last in terms of its understanding of urbanity as a positive thing and its vision for our future. Time will tell whether they live up to their potential but I remain very very hopeful. And regardless, if you are not prepared to be patient and persistent (I still have a hard time with the former) then you probably don't belong here or any other big city in America.

And if all the naysayers will allow me just a moment of hope....imagine with me the impact of saving just the field and developing mixed use surrounding it. It would be the first time in the history of our entire country that such a plan was considered and executed. Wow!!!!!
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Matt_the_deuce
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Username: Matt_the_deuce

Post Number: 631
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 69.14.248.252
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 3:31 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hear Hear!
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Rrl
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Username: Rrl

Post Number: 473
Registered: 12-2003
Posted From: 71.213.228.212
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 3:44 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

What would be the big deal for the city to wait two more months and give Glanz one more walkthrough with his group? How does the City lose anything by doing that?
If after two months no real proposal w/ financial backing is in place, then fire up the bulldozers.
What is the harm in waiting and giving this guy an opportunity? The City could potentially get the property back on the tax role and save the several millions in demo costs. Why the hard-on to demo immediately?
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Jt1
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Username: Jt1

Post Number: 7334
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 198.208.159.19
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 3:55 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Then 2 months later someone else comes up with a 'plan' and only needs a little time for due diligence and etc, etc.

With the nostalgia for TS there will always be someone that wants just a little more time. That cycle can't continue for ever.
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Sharmaal
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Username: Sharmaal

Post Number: 797
Registered: 09-2004
Posted From: 136.1.1.101
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 3:57 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Well at some time you have to call a spade a spade. Sure, he gets two more months, and his plan falls through. Then some other yahoo comes up, and we have to give him two more months, and another and another. Most of which are half-baked ideas (if even defrosted).

Besides, the hope is that the Demo costs will be recouped by a fire sale.

Who wants a trough!
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Leob
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Username: Leob

Post Number: 43
Registered: 10-2005
Posted From: 69.14.9.224
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 4:10 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Not to get too off topic, but, does anyone know if this money man Harry Glanz is any relation to Steve Glanz who operated the Michigan Theater in the 70's and Gabe Glanz who owned the Grande Ballroom ?

Leo B
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Detroitplanner
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Username: Detroitplanner

Post Number: 77
Registered: 04-2006
Posted From: 63.85.13.248
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 4:43 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hey doesnt that side of town need a Staples? ; )
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Rrl
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Username: Rrl

Post Number: 475
Registered: 12-2003
Posted From: 71.213.228.212
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 5:02 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yep, let's just make sure it's not too close to the sidewalk. Old people and the physically challenged prefer to have their parking up front...
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Naturalsister
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Username: Naturalsister

Post Number: 609
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 69.213.80.165
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 6:03 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I hate George Jackson.
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Harpernottingham
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Username: Harpernottingham

Post Number: 42
Registered: 04-2006
Posted From: 68.62.21.54
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 6:14 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

While we're debating here, one last public debate is shaping up. One involving the key players. Stay tuned.
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E_hemingway
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Username: E_hemingway

Post Number: 616
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 68.42.176.123
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 7:30 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Cryptic statement. Elaborate...
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Histeric
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Username: Histeric

Post Number: 699
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.61.194.66
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 7:39 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I am waiting with bated breath. Care to reveal who these "key players" are and what is being debated? Based on your name, I am guessing your initials are PCR. The Corktown CDC and Greater Corktown Development Corporation have been united in their position since 99 so I am curious as to what public debate is shaping up and who are these "key players". You DO know that a handful of parking lot owners alone do not constitute "key players".

You are sounding alot like someone over on HFD who insinuated that the community is "selling out". I wonder who has the real "conflict of interest" in this scenario? You do realize that the Tigers are not coming back to the corner and that right or wrong, minor league will never happen while the Illitch family owns the team.

All I know is I haven't spent a dime buying tickets to Comerica or any other Illitch owned venue since 99. I made a promise to myself not to until the situation on The Corner had been resolved to Corktown's satisfaction. I really want my kids to have the opportunity to see more games than the occasional free tickets. Please let go and let Corktown grow.
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Supersport
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Username: Supersport

Post Number: 10041
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 69.246.37.236
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 9:21 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

I really want my kids to have the opportunity to see more games than the occasional free tickets.




DO IT FOR THE CHILDREN PEOPLE! :-)

(key up "We are the world")
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Histeric
Member
Username: Histeric

Post Number: 700
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.61.194.66
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 9:23 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Shouldn't u b out drinking or something? After all, it IS Friday.
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Motorcitymayor2026
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Username: Motorcitymayor2026

Post Number: 782
Registered: 10-2005
Posted From: 24.231.189.137
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 9:27 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

supersport has to go to work in the morning :-)
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Harpernottingham
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Username: Harpernottingham

Post Number: 45
Registered: 04-2006
Posted From: 68.62.21.54
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 9:31 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

No, I'm not Peter Comstock Riley. My name is Dave. (Catchy, huh?) I lived for more than 20 years at Harper and Nottingham (thus the screen name).

If this public debate takes place, you'll hear about it here ahead of time so you can tune in.

I assure you this debate will not include any parking lot owners.
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Histeric
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Username: Histeric

Post Number: 701
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.61.194.66
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 9:53 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Tune in? Are u saying that this debate will be broadcast?
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Harpernottingham
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Username: Harpernottingham

Post Number: 46
Registered: 04-2006
Posted From: 68.62.21.54
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 10:04 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

That's the plan, Histeric.
That's the plan.

Ideally, it would include more participants.
But space only allows for four.

Two-on-two.

That's all I'll say now.
It'll be about four days till I know more.
I'll post then.

Have a good weekend.
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Histeric
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Username: Histeric

Post Number: 702
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.61.194.66
Posted on Friday, May 05, 2006 - 10:23 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Are you going to include neighborhood representatives in this planned debate or will we once again, "tune in" as others argue our fate.
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Harpernottingham
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Username: Harpernottingham

Post Number: 47
Registered: 04-2006
Posted From: 68.62.21.54
Posted on Saturday, May 06, 2006 - 3:52 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It's not up to me, Histeric. I've only made suggestions.

I assume you live in Corktown. Although I don't live there myself, I think it's safe to say that the decision affects many stadium lovers throughout the state.

By the way, I'm perfectly willing to work with you. Most of us are on your side. I like Corktown, and I visit frequently. I lived in the city for 25 years, if it matters at all.

If you'd like to talk outside this forum, feel free to drop me a line. I don't necessarily need to remain so cryptic. Write to KidFidrych@yahoo.com.
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Ndavies
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Username: Ndavies

Post Number: 1795
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 129.9.163.105
Posted on Saturday, May 06, 2006 - 11:36 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

LMAO @ Harpernottinham's ignorance. If you haven't invited Hysteric to your debate, you may as well cancel it. You'll just be wasting your time. The most likely voice involved in the sites reuse will be missing.
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Drm
Member
Username: Drm

Post Number: 945
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 69.212.59.92
Posted on Sunday, May 07, 2006 - 1:04 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Neil Rubin, the former(?) gossip columnist, has proven time and again that he doesn't know anything about the city. Can we please stop giving him free advertising on this forum?

As far as the supposed TS debate, I can only assume that these so-called "key players" are suffering from delusions of grandeur.
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Fnemecek
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Username: Fnemecek

Post Number: 1622
Registered: 12-2004
Posted From: 69.215.16.86
Posted on Sunday, May 07, 2006 - 2:55 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

BTW - I am sick and tired of seeing George Jackson take the heat.



Relax. If George Jackson can't handle having his name raked through the mud on a daily basis then he has no business working in the public sector. Period.

I used to work for Coleman Young and on the campaign staff of a Congressmen and a few state legislators. All of them got their names trashed far worse than anything Mr. Jackson has had to deal with.

If he's upset, I'd encourage him to post his resume on Monster.com today. Someone in the public sector who can't handle being insulted in the press on a daily basis is about as useful as a life guard who refuses to get wet.
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Fnemecek
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Username: Fnemecek

Post Number: 1623
Registered: 12-2004
Posted From: 69.215.16.86
Posted on Sunday, May 07, 2006 - 2:58 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

LMAO @ Harpernottinham's ignorance. If you haven't invited Hysteric to your debate, you may as well cancel it. You'll just be wasting your time. The most likely voice involved in the sites reuse will be missing.



Amen.
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Harpernottingham
Member
Username: Harpernottingham

Post Number: 50
Registered: 04-2006
Posted From: 66.178.227.202
Posted on Sunday, May 07, 2006 - 8:21 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Now, why the trash talking?
That's not necessary, is it?

It's tempting, I know, but really unnecessary.

I know some of what's up regarding the ballpark, and if you guys play nice, I'll let you in on it.

I'm not trashing anybody here (except perhaps George Jackson).

Anyhow, it's not my debate, fellas.
I don't have my own talk show.

But I'll tell you whose it is in short order.
Well ... that is if you'll just play nice.

Thanks.
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Hamtramck_steve
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Username: Hamtramck_steve

Post Number: 2932
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.255.162.105
Posted on Sunday, May 07, 2006 - 9:56 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"I know some of what's up regarding the ballpark, and if you guys play nice, I'll let you in on it. "

Consider this post my official "I'm playing nice" pitch to hear what you have to say. Feel free to send me whatever you have at haagsr AT yahoo dot com, too, if that's more comfortable.
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Jt1
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Username: Jt1

Post Number: 7343
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 205.158.96.140
Posted on Sunday, May 07, 2006 - 11:24 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

me too

jt1_detroit@yahoo.com
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Harpernottingham
Member
Username: Harpernottingham

Post Number: 51
Registered: 04-2006
Posted From: 68.62.21.54
Posted on Monday, May 08, 2006 - 1:52 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks, guys.

What I have isn't earth-shattering news, but you guys'll likely find it very interesting. I'm excited about it anyhow. ...

--Dave
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Lurker
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Username: Lurker

Post Number: 1623
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 65.196.220.198
Posted on Monday, May 08, 2006 - 9:29 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Are the Expos moving to the stadium?
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Harpernottingham
Member
Username: Harpernottingham

Post Number: 53
Registered: 04-2006
Posted From: 68.62.21.54
Posted on Monday, May 08, 2006 - 9:47 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hey, maybe we can lure the Dodgers outta Brooklyn.

: )
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Fnemecek
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Username: Fnemecek

Post Number: 1625
Registered: 12-2004
Posted From: 69.213.205.84
Posted on Monday, May 08, 2006 - 3:09 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

Now, why the trash talking?
That's not necessary, is it?

It's tempting, I know, but really unnecessary.



No one here is talking trash. We're just stating the obvious for the benefit of the oblivious.

(Message edited by fnemecek on May 08, 2006)
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Harpernottingham
Member
Username: Harpernottingham

Post Number: 54
Registered: 04-2006
Posted From: 66.178.227.202
Posted on Monday, May 08, 2006 - 5:05 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

E-mail me, Frank.

kidfidrych@yahoo.com

I'd be glad to share with you what I know.
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Kbkav
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Username: Kbkav

Post Number: 236
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 69.246.31.248
Posted on Monday, May 08, 2006 - 5:30 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

harpernottingham, i'm having a hard time seeing the distinction between emailing information to strangers you have interacted with on a public forum and posting said information on a public forum.
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Dialh4hipster
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Username: Dialh4hipster

Post Number: 1597
Registered: 11-2004
Posted From: 68.250.205.35
Posted on Monday, May 08, 2006 - 6:08 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Well, for starters, it's a power position to have information you think others want.

I'm just so bored with the "something up my sleeve"-ness of it all. OK, someone's going to have a debate. Wahoo.
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Drm
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Username: Drm

Post Number: 947
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 68.255.242.142
Posted on Thursday, May 11, 2006 - 7:45 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

So, are you going to reveal the big secret or what?
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Hamtramck_steve
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Username: Hamtramck_steve

Post Number: 2942
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 71.148.29.71
Posted on Thursday, May 11, 2006 - 7:51 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Drm, he might email you the answer if you ask. Then you can see the flashpoint and understand what the hullabaloo is about.

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