Discuss Detroit Archives - Beginning January 2006 Should Pistons resign Ben Wallace? Previous Next
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Paulmcall
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Post Number: 679
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Posted From: 68.40.119.216
Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 9:19 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Win or lose tonight, do you think the Pistons should pay big bucks to retain Ben Wallace?
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Chitaku
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Post Number: 389
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Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 9:22 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

YES unless Joe is going to take the team in a different direction Ben will have at least 3 more dominating seasons. I just can't see him being as good on other teams.
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Wilus1mj
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Post Number: 69
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Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 9:22 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Nothing more than 3 years, 30 million.
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Chitaku
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Post Number: 390
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Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 9:23 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Right
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E_hemingway
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Posted From: 68.42.176.123
Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 9:29 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Joe D pulled the trigger on shipping off Jerry Stackhouse when he was on top of his game. I wouldn't be surprised if he did something similar with Ben. It absolutely broke my heart when they traded Stack. Here was an NBA star (at the time) who wanted to not only play in Detroit but lead Detroit. That meant a lot because no one wanted to play in Detroit in the late 90s/early 00s. However, trading Stack for Rip proved to be the right move. Joe D didn't want to pay the big bucks to resign Stack. A move that would secure a player who's best days were behind him and leave little room under the salary cap. The more I think about it, the more I see the same scenario unraveling with Ben. And I hate that thought because I love seeing him play ball for our team.
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Lowell
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Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 9:32 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

If the money could be spent for Kevin Garnett instead, I would say 'Thanks Ben, but buh-bye'. Wiley Pat Riley has defined the very narrow difference between Miami and Detroit -- hack a Ben.
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Rjk
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Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 9:56 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Both Prince and Rip have contracts that average out to around 10 million. Rasheed's contract gives him an average of around 12 mil over the next 3 years. Ben will want at least a 4 yr. contract and he'll be the highest paid Piston if they sign him. He's probably looking for 4 years and 15 mil a year.

Personally I'd liked to the Pistons do a sign and trade with Wallace. From backstabbing his coach over the last week to not re-entering the game in Orlando he's just worn very thin with me. If Wallace comes back they'll have to fire Flip. I don't see anyway that they could coexist next year.
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Blessyouboys
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Post Number: 429
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Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 10:06 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Strike when the iron is hot...

Joe D is well aware of this, tonight may be Ben's last game at the Palace.
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Kilgore_south
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Post Number: 73
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Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 10:11 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yeah, Ben Wallace should definitely resign from the team. :-)
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Vas
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Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 10:15 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

No,

but Ben is walking down the court to get on offense. He has no energy what so ever, he looks like he doesn't even want to be there.
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Ltrain
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Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 11:03 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

No.

Ask yourself this. If a player was all offense and no defense how long would he last on this team in this town? Two words....not long. Ben is obviously one dimensional and of late that one dimension seems uninterested. I don't know what Joe's options are but I'd be concentrating on what I could get back for him real quick.

Oh and make a damn free throw.
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Deandub11
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Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 11:40 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ben Wallace is great. He deserves the money....but this is business and I have no interest in signing a thirty something defender/rebounder who is a complete liability on offense and is going downhill for 70 million dollars. Joe will not pay him that much, so unless he is willing to take much less than he might get from another team, then he should be done here. I hope for his sake someone like chicago, toronto or atlanta is willing to give him the max and he takes it.
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Super_d
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Post Number: 894
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Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 11:45 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

"Ben is obviously one dimensional and of late that one dimension seems uninterested."




I can't believe I'm reading this stuff!

perhaps most of these post are from non- basketball players?

__offensive rebounds(or tap outs)= points on the offensive end!

__weak side help on defensive(creating fast breaks) = points on the offensive end!

__ down low presents on offensive end = makes players like Rasheed Wallace and Tayshawn very affective.

I would call the above tactical actions 'valuble intangibles', skillz which only the 'great ones' possess!

Maybe! one of the annointed 'Math statisticianers' on this forum can equate that into points...I believe you would be very suprised how worthy Big Ben is to the Pistons offense.

fear tha' fro-atcha!

super d(motordetroit)
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Focusonthed
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Post Number: 195
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Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 12:06 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

^^^ He USED to provide that stuff regularly. Now, it's whenever he feels like it. Granted, in this series he's busy with Shaq, but he wasn't stellar against Cleveland either, with the exception of late game 6 and game 7.

I agree there's going to be a Flip/Ben choice in front of Dumars this off-season.
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Rusty
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Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 12:39 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The Piston's need to interject some life into this club next year......(Wallace in 04). Back then, they had something to prove and it showed on the court. They often took it to the rim for easy buckets and layups. This year (especially in the playoffs) Chauncy, Rip and Ben have primarily limited themselves to jump shots. Just think about the number of Big Ben dunks this year compared to previous years. Its definitely not the same team.

The biggest reason for this years regular season success was familiarity. Most other teams went through major changes in the offseason so they were not as cohesive as the Pistons. I'm not saying they're not a good team but the regular season dominance was vastly overrated. Unless this team starts regaining its old form and taking it to the rim they are doomed.

As for Ben, I would offer him 8-9 mil a year and not a penny more. If he doesn't sign, look toward the FA pool and/or draft for a slashing forward that can score (ala Corliss Williamson). Let McDyse fill his spot on the first team and bring in Maxiell to give the team some grit. Then watch Rasheed closely and look to deal him to a young team in need of a veteran.
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Detroiternthemist
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Post Number: 49
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Posted From: 68.73.206.25
Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 12:57 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

How soon we forget.....this post is short term memory at its best. Without Ben Wallace our Detroit Pistons are middle of the road barely making the playoffs...sometimes its not always about stats...Being honest the Pistons are a bunch of mediocre players that were assembled into a great team. As you can tell by their play. Other the playing against Shaq.......Ben Wallace nearly has a triple/double the hard way...blocks, steals and rebounds.....If Joe doesnt sign Ben thats the end of our playoff run.....trust that.
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Wilus1mj
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Post Number: 70
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Posted From: 216.111.89.3
Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 1:02 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Go after Garnett...Imagine 20 pts, 10 boards every night. What team could guard Garnett and Rasheed on the blocks? With Ben, you have teams playing off him and doubling.
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Super_d
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Post Number: 896
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Posted From: 70.88.106.173
Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 1:20 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Two offensive schemes that, in the past 2 years, have bothered the Pistons....

__ Big Post presents(Tim Ducan) and slashing guards(Ginobli and Parker)combined with peremiter players.

__Now this year they are struggling with a similiar Big post presents(O'Neil) and a slashing guard (Wade) with perimeter players, Walker and etc...

If anything, Dumas should address that problem....or either 'do as they do in Rome'?

My solution is to mirror the Spurs and Heat....

keep...

Ben Wallace (rebounder and defense)

Rasheed Wallace(perimeter player and defense and match up problem.)

Tayshawn(small foward and scorer and match up problem.)

now, the unpopular trade....

Chancey Billups, Mcdyess, Maxiell, draft pick and who ever else they want on the Pistons bench
for....
Allen Iverson and Chris Webber.


Now here's your starting five!:-)

Rasheed Wallace
Ben Wallace
Richard Hamiltion
Tayshawn Prince
Allen Iverson

Chris Webber comming off the bench.

problem solve and new NBA Champs!:-)

super d(motordetroit)
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Swingline
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Username: Swingline

Post Number: 501
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Posted From: 4.229.60.21
Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 1:20 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Super_d opines:

quote:

I can't believe I'm reading this stuff!

perhaps most of these post are from non- basketball players?


Give me a break super_d. Just because you might have seen a little court action during high school doesn't make you a basketball genius and everybody else a moron. The game isn't as complicated as nuclear physics.

As for Ben Wallace, even with all the intangibles, nobody as offensively challenged as the 'fro has ever become the highest paid player on a championship caliber team. He has plenty of weaknesses that are not overcome by hustle. For a supposed team leader, he sure is doing a lot of whining to the ref's, standing around on offense, forgetting to block out and simply giving up on all pretense of effort to make free throws.

Joe Dumars would be foolish to offer the league max to Ben Wallace
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Swingline
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Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 1:23 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Super_d opines:

quote:

I can't believe I'm reading this stuff!

perhaps most of these post are from non- basketball players?


Give me a break super_d. Just because you might have seen a little court action during high school doesn't make you a basketball genius and everybody else a moron. The game isn't as complicated as nuclear physics.

As for Ben Wallace, even with all the intangibles, nobody as offensively challenged as the 'fro has ever become the highest paid player on a championship caliber team. He has plenty of weaknesses that are not overcome by hustle. For a supposed team leader, he sure is doing a lot of whining to the ref's, standing around on offense, forgetting to block out and simply giving up on all pretense of effort to make free throws.

Joe Dumars would be foolish to offer the league max to Ben Wallace
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Focusonthed
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Post Number: 197
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Posted From: 209.220.229.254
Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 1:35 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Oh my god, Iverson and Webber, you can't be serious.
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Tayshaun22
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Post Number: 196
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Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 3:19 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Super_d, can you tweek that trade so we just get Iverson? I'm not a fan of Webber anymore.
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Paulmcall
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Post Number: 680
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Posted From: 68.40.119.216
Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 4:29 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Iverson is a coach killer and not a team player. He hasn't won anything and never will.
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Super_d
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Post Number: 897
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Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 4:36 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

'C. Webb' is just a throw in!__ then too, a healthy C. Webb is better than Davis, Cato, Delfino, and Evans put together!

I'll call Joe D and bill later today and work on the possibilities:-)

A win tonight, will squash all of this madness... and then a steal in Miami, and bring it back to the 'D' to finish Miami off!

and Then life will be back to___ Deeeeetroit Basketbaaaaall!

How soon we forget!

super d(motordetroit)
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Rjk
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Post Number: 318
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Posted From: 68.41.145.5
Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 5:11 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Dumars obviously likes AI as he was all but traded to Detroit years ago until Matt Gieger of all people nixed the trade by not waving his no-trade clause. How the hell did Gieger get a no-trade clause?

I think AI (minus Webber) would work out very well here.
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Ravine
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Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 5:51 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I'm not very knowledgeable about basketball, so I'm not going to be presumptuous enough to comment about it. What I think is disgusting is the behavior of the local media. Very recently, the Pistons were Media Darlings. Now, they get themselves into a bad fix, with doom much closer than ever before, and the media has attempted to suddenly back away from their previous bandwagon-riding, printing and saying as much negative, pessimistic bullshit as they can. Look at the picture of Ben Wallace that the Free Press (a paper which ain't shit anymore anyway) chose to print on the front page of Wednesday's sports section. Granted, it's easy to find photos of NBA players looking like Whiny Little Bitches, but only two short weeks ago, the Free Press would not have printed that picture on that page of that section. Also, all of the alleged dissension and griping which the media is attempting to play up, that stuff goes on all the time, and it's not a big f'ing deal. It happens among myself and my co-workers; can't most of us say the same? The ONLY difference is that we don't have the media shoving microphones and cameras up our collective asses on a daily, even hourly basis. I AM a big baseball fan, and speaking as one, this is the same horseshit the media will pull on the Tigers. Currently, the media is (mostly,) as Ren & Stimpy would sing, all HappyHappyJoyJoy about my Tigers, but they will turn on the Tigers like a scorned woman as soon as bad circumstances arrive. I'm thinking that what has really happened here is that the Tigers' stock went up at the same time as the Pistons' stock went down, and what we are seeing is nothing more meaningful than the resultant shameless ship-jumping... "Tigers: IN; Pistons: OUT." Well, whatever; I always figured that guys like Drew Dull were pompous, self-inflated dopes anyway.
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Naturalsister
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Post Number: 683
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Posted From: 70.8.40.160
Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 7:50 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

There is no other player like Ben Wallace in the entire NBA. No better low-post defender by far.

You all who want to act like Ben Wallace is the Pistons problem are clueless. Take it from me, he won't be going anywhere.

later - naturalsister
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Erobtheone
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Post Number: 26
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Posted From: 68.21.7.135
Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 8:57 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Have the coach work with him on his free throws in the off season to build some confidence at the stripe. I do not like all of the whining lately. It seems that after every foul there is complaining to the refs like it is the first fould in their careers. Man-up and let's kick some Miami butt!!! I like the team as is. Keep them in tact. Piston fans - let's rally around our boys!!!!!

Erob
Chicago by way of Detroit
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Naturalsister
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Post Number: 684
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Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 9:21 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yeah Erob,

They should let the calls go and not let them take them out of their game. I think it helps them to lose focus when they spend a tenth of a second arguing a call.

later - naturalsister

(Message edited by naturalsister on May 31, 2006)
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Focusonthed
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Post Number: 204
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Posted From: 24.192.25.47
Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 11:06 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

If he plays like he played tonight, YES, re-sign him.
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Naturalsister
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Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 11:12 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Big Ben has more nights like this than not. Be serious. Trade Ben? Joe Dumars isn't crazy.

We won with Rasheed, Rip, and Chauncey struggling a bit, but they get it done with the DEFENSE! Ben's hallmark. Tayshaun 29, playoff MVP for the 'Stons!

Great game on Friday night!

later - naturalsister
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Knocturnal
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Post Number: 120
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Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 11:14 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I think that Garnett and the Detroit area would be a perfect match. Not only would he be the go-to player on a great team, he would be close to Ann Arbor, his destination had he been smart enough to get into college.
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Tayshaun22
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Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 11:30 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Garnett would have went to Maryland, not Michigan.
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Knocturnal
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Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 11:35 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Tayshaun - Take this one on for size.

http://www.detnews.com/apps/pb cs.dll/article?AID=/20051129/S PORTS0102/511290423/1127
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Jerome81
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Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 11:37 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Trade Ben? Hell no. The guy is one of the only people in the NBA who can defend ANYBODY. He rebounds, he defends, he scores when the opportunity is there, he loves the game and the team.

Trading Ben would be foolish. Except in the instance that he asks for too much money, I just don't see how Detroit can be as good of a team as it is today without Ben Wallace. As much as Chaucey sets the offense and Rip keeps the defenders on their toes, Ben Wallace is THE star of the Detroit Pistons. He is a hard working, quiet voiced beast, who is adored by fans for his work ethic and attitude and controls the game without anyone else really even noticing it.

The Pistons front office would be damn fools to get rid of this guy.
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Naturalsister
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Post Number: 687
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Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 11:43 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Nice comeback Knocturnal!

Just the facts, man.

naturalsister
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Super_d
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Username: Super_d

Post Number: 898
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Posted From: 69.212.230.204
Posted on Wednesday, May 31, 2006 - 11:47 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)


quote:

"...had he been smart enough to get into college"




eerr????

super d(motordetroit)
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Tayshaun22
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Post Number: 199
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Posted on Thursday, June 01, 2006 - 12:29 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

http://ssbasketball.rivals.com /content.asp?SID=1132&CID=3561 92

The Scoop: Garnett was the consensus national player of the year and almost everybody believed he was going to attend Michigan. His test scores were low, but he later found out he qualified on his last attempt, but the ball was already rolling as he wowed NBA scouts with his athleticism and enormous wingspan. Garnett is in the middle of an all-pro NBA career and in retrospect should have been the No. 1 pick over Joe Smith. (Rasheed Wallace also should have gone higher than Smith). "The Big Ticket" may one day be the No. 1 forward on the StudentSportsBasketball.com All-Time All-American list if he can win an NBA title. As for college, was Garnett going to Michigan? He told Student Sports Magazine in the fall of 1995 that, "Everybody had me going to Michigan for a long time. I led people on that I was going to UM. If I would have gone to college it was going to be Maryland. I was going to shock'em all."
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Chitaku
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Posted on Thursday, June 01, 2006 - 9:04 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

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Chitaku
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Post Number: 392
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Posted on Thursday, June 01, 2006 - 9:05 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Shaq called it a foul!I say sit down fat boy!
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Paulmcall
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Post Number: 681
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Posted on Thursday, June 01, 2006 - 11:27 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I didn't say anything about trading Ben. Will Joe D resign him?
I doubt Miami will roll over like the Cavs did so the Pistons will have to look in the mirror and ask what went wrong.
Ben may have been underpaid before but do we overpay to keep him?

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