  Wordonthestreet Member Username: Wordonthestreet Post Number: 131 Registered: 11-2003 |
The Detroit Downtown Development Authority has entered into an agreement in principle to sell the “air rights” from a parking garage being built as part of the Book Cadillac redevelopment to a firm that wants to build 80 units of condos on top of the garage. Detroit-based Roxbury Development L.L.C., an arm of The Roxbury Group P.L.L.C., is the developer for this proposed Griswold/Capitol Park project. The company’s offices are in the Stott Building on Griswold. The 528-space garage will be at 150 Michigan Ave., the site of the soon-to-be-demolished Commerce Building. The Book Cadillac is at Michigan Avenue and Washington Boulevard. The “air rights,” the ability to develop space above a property, are being sold for the incremental costs the DDA might spend to support the condominium development such as increases in construction or garage design costs. Roxbury estimated this cost to be $750,000 and the DDA will receive the funding on or before the completion of the garage. Gary Brown, design and construction consultant for Detroit Economic Growth Corp., said the Commerce Building destruction began Dec. 1 and he expects it to be finished by the end of the month. He said the designs of a parking garage supporting a condominium structure on top still aren’t finished. Construction of the garage is expected to start in February, Brown said. The DDA is a branch of the DEGC, which is a public/private partnership with the city government to attract, retain and govern over business and economic initiatives in Detroit. Though the deal is still in negotiation, here is the current framework of it: Roxbury would buy the “air rights.” Roxbury would buy or lease 120 garage parking spaces at a rate to be determined later. Both parties agree to share a percentage of the profit from the sale of the condos. The DDA has to approve the design of the condo development. The deal will be finalized when Roxbury receives more information on project construction and when the development agreement is negotiated and approved by the board. The memorandum of understanding expires next June. DEGC staff member Brian Holdwick said this memorandum of understanding was important for Roxbury because now the company can obtain third-party financing for the project using the document as proof of ownership of the “air rights.” The DDA board of directors approved the resolution to enter into an agreement with Roxbury at Wednesday’s development meeting. David DiRita, president of Roxbury Group, and Brown said this condo project might be the first in Detroit’s central business district that didn’t involve any restoration or conversion of an existing building. Holdwick said Roxbury has been working with the DDA for about six months on the project. On Aug. 25, the DDA sent a letter to Roxbury allowing them to investigate the feasibility of condo construction project. Holdwick sent a memo regarding the sale of the garage’s air rights to the DDA board of directors Nov. 28. Mimi Pledl, the DEGC’s brownfield redevelopment associate director, said a key piece of the financing Roxbury hopes to receive will come from a decision at a Dec. 19 Michigan Economic Growth Authority board meeting to grant more than $3.6 million in brownfield tax credits to the company. | ||
Spiritofdetroit Member Username: Spiritofdetroit Post Number: 89 Registered: 11-2006 |
wow, fantastic news. | ||
Tetsua Member Username: Tetsua Post Number: 948 Registered: 01-2004 |
The first brand new (non restoration) high rise condos in the CBD, in a long time. This is pretty exciting. I wonder how high they'll build, 80 units probably wont go too high. | ||
Patrick Member Username: Patrick Post Number: 3715 Registered: 10-2003 |
Air rights? Hell, I thought that was a NYC thing. | ||
Spiritofdetroit Member Username: Spiritofdetroit Post Number: 90 Registered: 11-2006 |
well, that is not a huge footprint, so that will help with the height thing. 528 spaces on that land, how high is the garage itself going to be? | ||
Jdkeepsmiling Member Username: Jdkeepsmiling Post Number: 135 Registered: 01-2006 |
That is probably ten stories of condos on top of maybe 6 stories of parking.... just a guess based on footprint. | ||
Tetsua Member Username: Tetsua Post Number: 949 Registered: 01-2004 |
I guess this should soften the blow of the Commerce building coming down a little bit. | ||
Llyn Member Username: Llyn Post Number: 1745 Registered: 06-2004 |
ooo... I like this... How many additional floors for 80 condos? 10 floors? Would the garage height go up another level or two to accommodate additional parking requirements? If the garage height is about another 10 floors, this is suddenly a fairly tall building. (Message edited by llyn on December 06, 2006) | ||
Upinottawa Member Username: Upinottawa Post Number: 655 Registered: 09-2005 |
I think this is a smart idea. When the B-C is open this area will be fairly lively, making the condos next door most desirable. People living these condos will also have quick access to the amenities and restaurants in the refurbished B-C. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4827 Registered: 10-2003 |
I think I may be almost ready to forgive them for bringing down the Commerce, now. It's always been that if they HAD to bring down the Commerce for parking that they at least add ground floor retail and a tower, on top, but I could take a few floors of condominiums. | ||
Spiritofdetroit Member Username: Spiritofdetroit Post Number: 91 Registered: 11-2006 |
now lets fix up CP, and get the rest of this area downtown rolling | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4828 Registered: 10-2003 |
I think I may be almost ready to forgive them for bringing down the Commerce, now. It's always been that if they HAD to bring down the Commerce for parking that they at least add ground floor retail and a tower, on top, but I could take a few floors of condominiums. BTW, when anyone posts an article, PLEASE post the link. Otherwise you'd really just copying it. (Message edited by lmichigan on December 06, 2006) | ||
Gambling_man Member Username: Gambling_man Post Number: 902 Registered: 11-2003 |
Ahhh yes, with a beautiful view of Capitol Park and the bums pissing on the sidewalk. | ||
Pagesix1536 Member Username: Pagesix1536 Post Number: 13 Registered: 12-2006 |
Good news. Motion creates motion...I think we'll see more of this kind of thing going on. People notice big projects like this, I think it will spin off more things to come. | ||
Dougw Member Username: Dougw Post Number: 1466 Registered: 11-2003 |
Hey, if your condo is that high up in the air (on top of a 6 story garage), they'll just look like bustling pedestrians. | ||
Gambling_man Member Username: Gambling_man Post Number: 903 Registered: 11-2003 |
Why hasn't anyone built one in a more "desireable" area of downtown......I always thought Greektown or Harmonie Park would be perfect...... | ||
Matt_the_deuce Member Username: Matt_the_deuce Post Number: 681 Registered: 10-2003 |
Broken Record Alert. I assume the garage before the proposed condo component was going to have ground floor retail, right? It's a requirement in the CBD, right? With the condo component, is there still a requirement for the retail? | ||
Rsa Member Username: Rsa Post Number: 976 Registered: 10-2003 |
c'mon G_m! you know how much it's cost to buy surface lots! buying from DDA is el-cheapo. (not being sarcastic) | ||
Eastsidedog Member Username: Eastsidedog Post Number: 861 Registered: 03-2006 |
I agree Gambling_man. The parking lots directly north of Greektown seem to be prime real estate for a Ellington-esque loft development. | ||
Stecks77 Member Username: Stecks77 Post Number: 208 Registered: 08-2006 |
WordontheStreet: What is the source of your glorious news? | ||
Charlottepaul Member Username: Charlottepaul Post Number: 91 Registered: 10-2006 |
Wait a minute; since when is everyone for tearing down the Detroit Commerce Building? Is a parking deck with condos on top where the line is drawn between approval and disapproval? | ||
Spiritofdetroit Member Username: Spiritofdetroit Post Number: 92 Registered: 11-2006 |
the building is gone | ||
Rsa Member Username: Rsa Post Number: 977 Registered: 10-2003 |
who sed everyone's for it? it's just inevitable at this point, so let's try and look at the positives. actually, this thread is kind of refreshing: there's a time to quit bitching, look at the positives, and try to be constructive. | ||
Tetsua Member Username: Tetsua Post Number: 950 Registered: 01-2004 |
The only constant in life is change, and at least this is somewhat of a positive change. They could be tearing down the Commerce building for ...nothing... after all. Look at the Madison Lennox site. | ||
Danny Member Username: Danny Post Number: 5247 Registered: 02-2004 |
Let's hope the parking garage have some retail businesses, too. | ||
Charlottepaul Member Username: Charlottepaul Post Number: 92 Registered: 10-2006 |
"this thread is kind of refreshing" Wasn't trying to be too pessimistic, I am usually not, but 'refreshing' to see people that use DetroitYES! actually being for demoing a building for a parking deck with condos on top of it? That is the only thing that I see that is refreshing... | ||
Rsa Member Username: Rsa Post Number: 979 Registered: 10-2003 |
not to harp, but nobody sed everybody here is for it. i think people have just moved on. | ||
Charlottepaul Member Username: Charlottepaul Post Number: 94 Registered: 10-2006 |
Ah gotchya! I guess you win some, loose most trying to preserve vacant buildings in Detroit, and definitely as much as you can hope for to do with a site after a building is gone, this isn't too much of a raw deal. Sure beats a vacant field! | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4831 Registered: 10-2003 |
Actually, since the demolition of the Commerce was a forgone conclusion, we're trying to look for any silver lining out of this, and this is quite a surprise. They very well could have simply torn this down for a parking structure. Or, even worst, they could have torn it down for a surface lot. When you realize a building's come down, and in this case the building is beyond saving as they are tearing it down as we speak, you have to take any good you can find out of that. This makes the demolition just a bit less senseless if even still senseless. | ||
Burnsie Member Username: Burnsie Post Number: 784 Registered: 11-2003 |
Hate to nitpick, but the correct spelling is Madison Lenox. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4834 Registered: 10-2003 |
All that just for that? lol | ||
Rbdetsport Member Username: Rbdetsport Post Number: 184 Registered: 11-2005 |
This sounds great. I think that the tower will be taller than what you all are saying. 80 condos compared to 127 Apartments in Broderick Tower is almost equal depending on the size of the units. The footprint of the Broderick Tower and the Detroit Commerce Building is about the same. I think that the Parking Garage will be 8 stories, while the tower will be at least 15. It would be awesome to have a 23 story tower right there. | ||
Andyguard73 Member Username: Andyguard73 Post Number: 171 Registered: 03-2006 |
RB, I may be wrong but I think the garage is taking up the Commerce Buildings footprint and the surface parking next to it, which would give it a pretty big footprint. Does anyone know for sure? From what I've gathered in the article, the garage is going to be 528 spaces, and that Roxbury will be using 150 of those. I know alls been quiet on the Lafayette front, but I remember people talking about a renovated Lafayette Building using space in the new garage. Does anyone know if the loss of those spots would affect a potential renovations. (And not to threadjack, but has anyone heard anything more about that recently at all?) | ||
Dan Member Username: Dan Post Number: 1326 Registered: 10-2003 |
Source please? | ||
Mplsryan Member Username: Mplsryan Post Number: 143 Registered: 11-2003 |
Just make sure you don't get one of these hideous things. Seven levels of apts. over 10 parking floors and ground retail. It's gotta be the *ugliest* infill in downtown mpls. Oh and the condos aren't great either, my buddy lives there. http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/b u/?id=streetmetroapartments-mi nneapolis-mn-usa | ||
Tetsua Member Username: Tetsua Post Number: 953 Registered: 01-2004 |
Here's the source of the article by the way, it's from Crains Detroit Business http://www.crainsdetroit.com/a pps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/2006 1206/REG/61206009/1016 | ||
Busterwmu Member Username: Busterwmu Post Number: 312 Registered: 09-2004 |
Yay ground floor retail-autopark-condo sandwich!  | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4835 Registered: 10-2003 |
Mplsryan, Considering this was originally proposed as parking garage-only, ANYTHING to expand it to more usages is an improvement. This is one of the few projects where I will not complain about much of anything considering the site was only supposed to be getting a parking garage. | ||
Royce Member Username: Royce Post Number: 1952 Registered: 07-2004 |
I'm with Andyguard when I ask, "What has happened to the Lafayette Building development?" Wasn't that development dependent on getting parking spaces in this new parking structure? Also, does the building of condos above this garage delay it's opening for the BC? In addition, don't these condos compete with the condos in the BC and the possible condos in the Lafayette Building? I'm not sure if the more the merrier is necessarily a good idea here. Let's fill up the old and renovated buildings first and see how they do before we build brand new condos. | ||
Apbest Member Username: Apbest Post Number: 320 Registered: 03-2006 |
well considering the B-C is nearly sold out already (thee is like, what, 7 unites left out of 67 or something), it seems that there would be a demand for these condos, and the garage will take nowhere near as long to construct as the BC will take to finish rennovation. Im confident that by the BC's delivery in 2008 there will be at least a functioning garage if the condos are not already built out. However, considering the demand that exists on the CBD, perhaps it may create more of a synergy that will serve to help downtown development. Peebles is supposedly in some sort of deadlock or discussion with the city regarding parking and hopefully it will be resolved soon. THe Lafayette is a different kind of appeal than the condos on top of the BC garage I presume. Like the BC they will be more of uber-luxury condos with the appeal of significant historical structure. I think the BC garage condos will be aimed at more modest residents probably in the 200,000 range and more affordable for younger professionals than wealthy business people/company residences for out of town visitors the way the BC is...I doubt there will be million dollar penthouses in this development. I don't think we're at the point yet were the developments will trade off | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4837 Registered: 10-2003 |
I shot off an email to Roxbury. I don't expect them to respond, but it wouldn't hurt to ask about this. BTW, the B-C and Lafayette condos are renovations. These would be new construction. As long as they are a niche project, they shouldn't have any problem selling. Not everyone wants a house in an historic building, and not everyone wants one in a new construction. | ||
Detroitstar Member Username: Detroitstar Post Number: 345 Registered: 01-2006 |
This goes to prove exactly what I said last week...nobody wants to restore an average building located next to the one of the most famous buildings downtown. But give the opportunity for new development in a prime location combining facilities and infrastructure, and this is the sort of quality development that we will begin to see more of. | ||
Andyguard73 Member Username: Andyguard73 Post Number: 172 Registered: 03-2006 |
With this announcement, the conversion of 1001, and the restorations of the BC and (hopefully) the Lafayette, Michigan Ave seems poised to really become a lively residential sector of downtown. | ||
Ramcharger Member Username: Ramcharger Post Number: 156 Registered: 05-2006 |
Condos to top off Capitol Park site | ||
Tetsua Member Username: Tetsua Post Number: 954 Registered: 01-2004 |
I'm interested to here where these are | ||
Michikraut Member Username: Michikraut Post Number: 199 Registered: 05-2004 |
Mplsryan, the retail/garage/condo building you used as an example, while not being the most attractive building is not that bad. It respects the street cornice lines, has a massing that fills out the street sight lines, and is not just a bland glass facade. It is a nice filler building. The picture gave little hint as to details and surface but there is much worse out there. I hope the Architects for the Detroit project create more of an "infill-building" than a "Stand alone/Object-building", some respect to surrounding buildings in color, materials, heights, and cornice lines would also be much appreciated. Anyway- this is good news and am of the opinion- the higher concentration of housing and retail will only help not hurt surrounding developement. | ||
Charlottepaul Member Username: Charlottepaul Post Number: 98 Registered: 10-2006 |
Detroit in my opinion has had good architecture in the new projects to be put into the downtown. it hard to think of a project in about the last ten years that wasn't nearly perfect. So one can presume that this project will be at least mediocre, but seeing how it is next to the BC, it will probably be as great of a development as the other newer developments. | ||
1953 Member Username: 1953 Post Number: 1194 Registered: 12-2004 |
Capital Park will perk up, once the new Times Square bus terminal is open downtown. | ||
Gambling_man Member Username: Gambling_man Post Number: 906 Registered: 11-2003 |
Yup, adding a few thousand more bums to the already bustling population will really "perk up" the area. Do you remember when they had it on Cadillac? It hasn't made Capitol Park any worse, as it was already pretty bad, but it certainly hasn't "perked it up"...... | ||
Mind_field Member Username: Mind_field Post Number: 656 Registered: 10-2003 |
The opera house garage should have condos on top of it. The views on the roof of the garage looking west are phenomenal, one of the best cityscape views that I've ever discovered downtown. | ||
Apbest Member Username: Apbest Post Number: 322 Registered: 03-2006 |
?..i think hes talking about the Rosa Parks transit center (directly next to Times Square PM stop), which would move all the bus stations in Capitol PArk to a $15 mil state of the art transit center...demolition has already begun and its federally/state funded I believe. There's no question that it will only be a positive for Capitol Park. There's no more "bums" than before (I find your assumption about bus riders sorta offensive) because the bus stands are just moving. First from Cadillac Square to Capitol Park...now to Rosa Parks transit center | ||
Burnsie Member Username: Burnsie Post Number: 786 Registered: 11-2003 |
Michikraut wrote, "I hope the Architects for the Detroit project create more of an "infill-building" than a "Stand alone/Object-building", some respect to surrounding buildings in color, materials, heights, and cornice lines" There are a lot of outstanding "stand alone" buildings out there. Some examples: the Fisher, Penobscot, Guardian. The buildings around the Commerce don't really follow each other with respect to color, materials and heights, anyway. There's no reason that a non-residential neighborhood building has to try to "blend in" with its neighbors. Good contrasts are part of what makes downtown stand out from the suburbs. | ||
Jdkeepsmiling Member Username: Jdkeepsmiling Post Number: 136 Registered: 01-2006 |
I am just excited to see wholly new construction. This is a great sign for the future of Downtown. At some point we are going to run out of cool early 20th century buildings to redo. I believe that a dynamic city should have building both new and old that appeal to a wide range of people. Plus there are some people out there who do not see progress unless it is a high-rise sheathed in glass. Great news. | ||
Southen Member Username: Southen Post Number: 36 Registered: 08-2006 |
Although im saddened to see the Commerce building go because I think it had character and history that cannot be replaced, I am excited by this new news. Im envisioning something similar to the latest greektown design. Not in scale but moreso in how this building will look and function. I imagine the tower will be next to the Book Cadillac with the rest of the site only having parking and ground floor retail. I imagine the design and building materials will be top notch too, considering its for the BC and it makes renovating the Lafayette Building that much more attractive. Im also excited about the possible spin-off for Capitol Park. I think that area has loads of potential if you can get residents into some of those buildings, plus the possibility of a renovated park after the buses are moved. | ||
Tetsua Member Username: Tetsua Post Number: 956 Registered: 01-2004 |
Who owns the surface lots in the Greektown area anyways? There's a growing desire for city living going on, and there's a hotel / casino going up down the street (not to mention a pretty bustling restaurant district down the street). Is the surface lot still looking like the most feasible plan to the lot owners? | ||
Jdkeepsmiling Member Username: Jdkeepsmiling Post Number: 137 Registered: 01-2006 |
Tetsua.... Unfortunatly, yes, because they are cash cows. The lots do not pay much in the way of taxes because they are essentially nothing. They bring in tons of money...think of an average 100 car lot on one night during the tiger season. Charging $15 = $1,500 in a single night. There expenses involve two guys (probably under the table) at 5 bucks an hour for 6 hours. Very profitable enterprise. This is even more so as Downtown has become more popular of a destination, and parking rates have risen accordingly. It is going to be a while before we see a mass turnover of parking lots into buildings, it is just simple economics. I think the city should pass a special assesment for parking lots in the CBD, along with price caps. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4839 Registered: 10-2003 |
Southen, this will be considerably different than the Greektown development. Just because it includes a parking garage and tower doesn't mean it's going to be similar. For one, from all implications, this tower will be built entirely above the garage. Greektown is building a hotel directly adjacent to (attached on all of its levels), but not on top of, their parking garage. Gambling man, can I post the renderings you sent me yet, and have you been receiving my messages? | ||
Spitty Member Username: Spitty Post Number: 507 Registered: 07-2004 |
That's news to me Lmich. I think everything I've read thus far said that it would be 12-15 floors of parking with 15-18 floors of hotel etc. above it or something like that. Sounds like you know more than the general public, or like something's changed. Keep us posted as much as you can. I'd like to see these latest renderings if it is possible. | ||
Rbdetsport Member Username: Rbdetsport Post Number: 185 Registered: 11-2005 |
The hotel will still be 30 stories. | ||
Southen Member Username: Southen Post Number: 37 Registered: 08-2006 |
Lmich I was under the impression that Greektown would rest at least on some of the floors of the parking structure. Hopefully this new condo development will at least have a tower feel to it, considering there needs to be space for a lobby etc. | ||
Rrl Member Username: Rrl Post Number: 697 Registered: 12-2003 |
Roxbury Development LLC, too funny ...picturing two greased back, swarthy guys in shiny suits, bobbing their heads to some disco dance track...  | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4843 Registered: 10-2003 |
Spitty, I'd love nothing more than to show you the renderings, but I have to get permission from Gamblingman, first. Still, you guys have already seen the more recent renderings. Southen, nope. The parking structure is attached to the hotel directly on all floors of the garage, but the tower does not sit over any part of the garage. And, if you've seen these type of towers before that DO sit over garages they literally sit atop the parking garage, and the lobby is always the first floor above the parking garage. You need look no further than Genesee Towers in Flint. For street walk ins there is usually a small lobby at ground level that takes you up to the main lobby. | ||
Southen Member Username: Southen Post Number: 38 Registered: 08-2006 |
Thanks for the info. Changes my expectations for the development. | ||
Charlottepaul Member Username: Charlottepaul Post Number: 109 Registered: 10-2006 |
So if the parking deck is taking up the whole site, they must somehow plan for future development on top of it, right? Elevators going through the parking levels, etc. All of the projects that I have worked on with a tower of sorts and a parking deck below have a portion of usually the first two levels of the deck set aside for the lobby at the ground level. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4846 Registered: 10-2003 |
The lobby can either be at street level, or the first occupiable floor above the parking structure. Paul, if they are building a parking garage and building something above it, of course they will construct it so that it can hold the tower. Did I miss something? I thought it pretty clearly lays out Roxbury is buying the air rights meaning they will have to retrofit the garage to hold additional floors. BTW, another example of a parking structure built to support more floors is the recently completed Townsend Street Parking Garage here in Lansing. It's a city-owned garage that can support and additional two levels of office or residential space. http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/b u/?id=townsendstreetparkingram p-lansing-mi-usa Examples of structures with parking built into them: Radisson Winnipeg 1. http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/bu/?id=radissonwinnipeg-winnipeg-canada Genesee Towers 2. http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/bu/sh/?id=102039&txt=Genesee%20Tower Can someone find some more postmodern examples besides the Minneapolis one? They are all over the country. (Message edited by lmichigan on December 07, 2006) | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 3213 Registered: 08-2004 |
What about Trolley Plaza on Washington Blvd? Which reminds me... they ought to change their name... no longer a trolley going down that street. (Message edited by Gistok on December 08, 2006) | ||
Mplsryan Member Username: Mplsryan Post Number: 144 Registered: 11-2003 |
I got a few more from Mpls- one to break ground this spring and one from 2001. The Dorsey-Whitney Bldg. 7 floors parking, 24 office or so above. http://www.lileks.com/mpls/dor sey/3.html (flip through to see it completed) And the Sexton II- 10 floors parking with 24 residential above. 34 total. project was redesigned recently so I believe the renderings have changed a bit. http://www.sextonlive.com/Proj ects/Two/index.html http://www.minnescraper.com/fo rum/viewtopic.php?t=374&postda ys=0&postorder=asc&start=0 | ||
Charlottepaul Member Username: Charlottepaul Post Number: 115 Registered: 10-2006 |
Well I think that almost every building now built in city centers has a parking deck on the lower levels (as well as some below grade), but it is quite different to have the deck and the tower above be built as separate projects. It will definitely be interesting to see how it turns out. http://www.emporis.com/en/il/i m/?id=498066 | ||
Mplsryan Member Username: Mplsryan Post Number: 145 Registered: 11-2003 |
http://www.minnescraper.com/co ntent/index.php?option=com_con tent&task=view&id=45&Itemid=58 | ||
Boynamedsue Member Username: Boynamedsue Post Number: 7 Registered: 03-2005 |
By the way, 'sed' is usually spelled 'said.' That was just kind of annoying me... | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4852 Registered: 10-2003 |
Paul, it will turn out just like any structure built atop a parking structure. Really, it really isn't that odd, at all, and the outcome is no different. When a parking structure is built to house space above it shouldn't be unusual to see something actually built above it whether it be built all in one phase or two. I'm just not sure I see how it will be anymore or less interesting to watch how this one turns out than a similar structure all built in one phase, and we don't even know that this isn't being built in one phase, at the moment. | ||
Charlottepaul Member Username: Charlottepaul Post Number: 116 Registered: 10-2006 |
Yeah, too true that it might just all be built at one time. I was just looking at it from a logistics volume programming standpoint and I think that it would be very interesting if it weren't bult at one time to see how it all comes together in the end, but that's just the architect in me talking. | ||
Tetsua Member Username: Tetsua Post Number: 958 Registered: 01-2004 |
The 1001 garage (CVS parking structure), and the Opera House garage were also built with the capability to have a structure on top right? | ||
Spiritofdetroit Member Username: Spiritofdetroit Post Number: 97 Registered: 11-2006 |
i know the 1001 Garage was for fact. And I believe the same is true for the Opera House Garage | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 3216 Registered: 08-2004 |
I'm going to give a cautious NO to the Opera House Garage. They built business/retail space along one side of the garage. I don't think they ever had plans for anything on top. As we can see with the BC Garage, it costs money to do that. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4855 Registered: 10-2003 |
Yeah, I'm pretty sure the Opera House garage wasn't built for a potential vertical expansion, and, I know it was originally announced that the 1001 Garage was to be built to hold additional floors, but I haven't been able to ever confirm it. Has anyone been to the roof? It would be easy to tell. | ||
Rbdetsport Member Username: Rbdetsport Post Number: 187 Registered: 11-2005 |
The 1001 Woodward Garage looks like it was designed for a building to be on top. (Message edited by Rbdetsport on December 09, 2006) | ||
Rbdetsport Member Username: Rbdetsport Post Number: 189 Registered: 11-2005 |
Can someone get a picture of the Book Cadillac all lit up at night? | ||
Nyburgher Member Username: Nyburgher Post Number: 7 Registered: 10-2006 |
It's a pretty sad state that Detroit seems to be in as far as transit goes and for now, this kind of design is the best one can do. | ||
Busterwmu Member Username: Busterwmu Post Number: 318 Registered: 09-2004 |
On a semi related topic (this is a semi-hijacking), does anyone have any photo of the progress with the Commerce Building demo? Sad to see her fall but if new good things are to come I'm sure it's for the better! Detroit Rises! | ||
Southen Member Username: Southen Post Number: 43 Registered: 08-2006 |
"It's a pretty sad state that Detroit seems to be in as far as transit goes and for now, this kind of design is the best one can do." Huh? | ||
Mind_field Member Username: Mind_field Post Number: 659 Registered: 10-2003 |
These condos are far from a sure thing, Roxbury still has to secure financing among other things. It is a long way from reality! | ||
Apbest Member Username: Apbest Post Number: 332 Registered: 03-2006 |
we all know, but it's progressing...why rain on our parade? | ||
Mcwalbucksnfitch Member Username: Mcwalbucksnfitch Post Number: 18 Registered: 10-2006 |
I'm excited about the prospect of this. It leads me to speculate, as earlier mentioned, that the Book-Cadillac project will catch national development attention to help restore perhaps the United Artists before it's too late....or the David Whitney. | ||
Rbdetsport Member Username: Rbdetsport Post Number: 191 Registered: 11-2005 |
Yes, if this is built, it could spark a lot of interest in redeveloping Capitol Park and eventually spreading to UA and DW i.e. Grand Circus Park. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4909 Registered: 10-2003 |
Hey, I wasn't expecting any reply, but I got a reply email, last night, concerning the very tentative plans for this development by the developers, Roxbury Group. I can't stress enough that this are tentative plans that could easily change, but here is what little they could give m concerning the project, thus far: 1. They are just now getting into the design and engineering phase of the project. 2. The tentative name is "The Griswold ~ Capitol Park" 3. It will consist of a 10-story parking garage, topped by 5 levels of 80 condominium units. 4. Each unit is currently designed to have a terraced balcony, and the entire structure is being designed to pay homage to the architecture of the Book-Cadillac across the street. *YAY!* 5. Construction is currently scheduled to begin this spring (Spring 2007), with a move-in time in the Fall of 2008. All I have to say is so far so good, all that was originally considered (i.e. just a parking garage). To say I was surprised to receive a response to my email would be an understatement. The company says they are excited about being part of the downtown renaissance. | ||
Detroitstar Member Username: Detroitstar Post Number: 373 Registered: 01-2006 |
There is a Book-Cadillac across the street from this site? Last I knew we only had 1, and it was right next door. sorry, couldn't resist! | ||
Tetsua Member Username: Tetsua Post Number: 987 Registered: 01-2004 |
Lmich, Did they give you any idea of what the height would be?
Guess they aint playing about getting this thing done. They no doubt waited to see the results of the presales were for the BC. | ||
Detroit_stylin Member Username: Detroit_stylin Post Number: 3383 Registered: 10-2003 |
Speaking of development in the area, who knows anything about the building that sits behind the Holiday Inn, on the southwest corner of Michigan and SHelby? WHo owns it, and are there any plans for it and if so, what are they? | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4913 Registered: 10-2003 |
Tetsua, I didn't ask because this is far to early in the design phases. Plus, it's an easy guess. Give each floor a minimum of 10 feet and you get at least 150 ft, and probably greater. I got a little bit more info concerning the architecture, and Roxbury says that though they have no official say in the look of the garage, everything they've seen shows it looking more like an actual building than a parking garage. I'm guessing we may get something at least as nice as the 1001 Garage. As for the shape, it's going to be longer than it is tall, meaning it's going to stretch the whole block with the only odd part of the development being the angle created at Michigan and Griwold Street. The main address will be on Griswold Street, btw, as they say they want to finally getting around to branding Capitol Park as a residential district. (Message edited by lmichigan on December 18, 2006) | ||
Tkelly1986 Member Username: Tkelly1986 Post Number: 197 Registered: 01-2004 |
where can I find a picture of 1001 Woodward Parking Garage? | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4923 Registered: 10-2003 |
http://flickr.com/photo_zoom.g ne?id=78554181&size=l Hope that helps. | ||
Tkelly1986 Member Username: Tkelly1986 Post Number: 198 Registered: 01-2004 |
thanks Lmichigan | ||
Detroitstar Member Username: Detroitstar Post Number: 377 Registered: 01-2006 |
That has to be the best exterior lighting on a parking ramp in existence. | ||
Milwaukee Member Username: Milwaukee Post Number: 395 Registered: 08-2006 |
I'm really happy to hear about this project, but I'm a little worried about how it will look. There are a couple of buildings in Milwaukee with parking and then offices on top, and to be honest they don't look too good. I hope Detroit has better luck with that type of building. | ||
Southen Member Username: Southen Post Number: 50 Registered: 08-2006 |
Im not sure if I like the idea of having the units spread across the entire parking structure. The massing of the entire block may end up looking a bit odd. I would have prefered concentrating the units on one end and getting some more height. A real positive though is that this will help "wall" in Michigan Ave right there and create a much more urban feel. | ||
Focusonthed Member Username: Focusonthed Post Number: 709 Registered: 02-2006 |
On the contrary, I'd rather the units cover the whole garage. Detroit has enough parking garages; the less obvious each new one is, the better. | ||
Milwaukee Member Username: Milwaukee Post Number: 401 Registered: 08-2006 |
I just looked at that 1001 garage, I really like that. If they could do something like that with Book Cadillac, then I would be really impressed. So the condo's would completely cover the garage, or only half cover? would the garage and condo's be connected to the book cadillac or would you have to park, go down to the street and then walk into the hotel? | ||
Apbest Member Username: Apbest Post Number: 351 Registered: 03-2006 |
it will def have some sort of skywalk, the buildings are back to back, they wont make you walk down to the street, it's been pretty much explicitly stated as such by Ferchill I believe (that the garage will be connected) | ||
Detroitplanner Member Username: Detroitplanner Post Number: 579 Registered: 04-2006 |
How about having the condos IN the garage? That way you can hide the parking behind the apartments and the folks would have a short walk from their car to their door? I've seen this once before, I went to Vegas with a large party, and we stayed at the Imperial Palace. One of the rooms was located at the far end of the parking garage, it was easily the oddest set up I've ever seen. | ||
Milwaukee Member Username: Milwaukee Post Number: 408 Registered: 08-2006 |
I kind of like that idea. You could make a full 15 story condominium front on Washington, then half way on the tower in back start the structure. That wasn't very clear, but here's a picture of a new building in Milwaukee that's like that. The facade on Cathedral square is all offices and condos and the structure is behind it. http://www.cathedralsquarecond os.com/gallery.html | ||
Detroitstar Member Username: Detroitstar Post Number: 378 Registered: 01-2006 |
I like that idea, but I dont think the lot is deep enough to make that work efficiently. | ||
Milwaukee Member Username: Milwaukee Post Number: 413 Registered: 08-2006 |
It really would have to be a bigger lot to work, but they could do something like that in one of downtown's other surface lots. | ||
Apbest Member Username: Apbest Post Number: 353 Registered: 03-2006 |
and one has to consider that this building has Capitol park and Campus Martius(roughly) frontage so the aesthetics of the "back" side can't be ignored necessarily. | ||
Milwaukee Member Username: Milwaukee Post Number: 415 Registered: 08-2006 |
The building in Milwaukee has a good looking back also. It's just that the front is all glass. The structure in back has been made to look like an office building and really doesn't look too much like a garage. There's retail on the first floor of the garage. | ||
Beantown Member Username: Beantown Post Number: 17 Registered: 10-2006 |
Today the office of Gov. Granholm announced that the condos did indeed receive the tax credits for which they applied: "Detroit developers 150 Michigan Ave L.L.C. and Griswold Capital Park L.L.C. will use a $3.6 million state brownfield single-business-tax credit to redevelop a site at the northwest corner of Michigan Avenue at Griswold. The $47.3 million, 13-story mixed-use project is to feature 80 condos built on top of a planned 500-space parking garage." The only thing that surprised me was "13-story". I had thought that the parking garage was 10 stories and that the condos would add another 5 stories, which makes 15 total. Lmichigan - what are your thoughts on the discrepancy? | ||
Tetsua Member Username: Tetsua Post Number: 997 Registered: 01-2004 |
I wouldn't put too much stock into how many stories this thing will be until they at least put together a rendering. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4929 Registered: 10-2003 |
Bean, I think the discrepancy may be that the DEGC has said the garage will be 8 to 10 stories, and Roxbury is saying it will be a solid 10 floors. That's where the difference is. The 5-stories atop the garage are pretty set, the difference is coming from the DEGC. It's hard to get reliable news in such early stages and especially when you're working with two developers developing different parts of the project instead of one developer developing one project. | ||
Charlottepaul Member Username: Charlottepaul Post Number: 156 Registered: 10-2006 |
Not to be a downer at this point (this is all def. good news), but might only five (give or take) floors on top of a ten story (give or take) GARAGE look a bit too minimal? How many buildings have a garage that is two-thirds of the floors in the building? I don't want it to look like that stupid building in River Place with the huge multi-level deck and little tiny units on top. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4930 Registered: 10-2003 |
Look at the link posted earlier in the thread, Charlotte. The parking garage is taller than the structure atop it: http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/b u/?id=streetmetroapartments-mi nneapolis-mn-usa |
