  Lowell Board Administrator Username: Lowell Post Number: 3922 Registered: 10-2003 |
From this week's Crain's comes some impressive figures. Not a surprise those who are in touch with the downtown rise, but a message that needs to get out. quote:This report was created by Social Compact, a company tasked with pitching downtown's and other Detroit neighborhood's viability for attracting retail investment. They have been contracted by the DEGC, Detroit Economic Growth Corp. full article Detroit Rises! | ||
Cman710 Member Username: Cman710 Post Number: 320 Registered: 07-2006 |
Thanks for the post, Lowell! It must be satisfying for you and other Detroiters to witness this, given the state of downtown when you started this site in the 1990s. | ||
Jimaz Member Username: Jimaz Post Number: 2439 Registered: 12-2005 |
http://www.socialcompact.org/ | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 5709 Registered: 10-2003 |
I'm pretty sure these numbers were released months ago in the news, or is this another study? | ||
Yvette248 Member Username: Yvette248 Post Number: 680 Registered: 10-2006 |
I guess the ignoramuses who think everyone in Detroit are welfare queens and thugs should get a reality check from this. | ||
Bumble Member Username: Bumble Post Number: 188 Registered: 11-2004 |
quote: http://www.copyright.gov/fls/f l102.html | ||
Michigan Member Username: Michigan Post Number: 628 Registered: 04-2007 |
Nice info to hear! great | ||
Jimaz Member Username: Jimaz Post Number: 2440 Registered: 12-2005 |
Googling some of the unique terms in that article, I ran across this mention at University of Missouri: Social Compact's "DrillDown" results. It would be nice to find other references from beyond Detroit to track how well the information is disseminated. | ||
Professorscott Member Username: Professorscott Post Number: 489 Registered: 12-2006 |
If you have been around the D for a long time you would have got a sense of this already. I came here in 1980, when things were just about (I would guess) at their ebb. About the only new construction was the Ren Cen and that was a walled-off fortress. In the past, say, three or four years, I've been impressed by the number of cranes working on downtown buildings, people testing the retail waters (even if not all are successful), and just a more generally positive "vibe". It hasn't spread to the neighborhoods, but that will take time and we need to start somewhere. I think if downtown becomes revitalized and is a thriving urban hub again in five or ten or fifteen years, we will look back and see that it was the vision of a very few people, widely regarded as crackpots at the time, who got the ball rolling: the Ilitch family, Chuck Forbes and a few others. | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1478 Registered: 06-2006 |
"I guess the ignoramuses who think everyone in Detroit are welfare queens and thugs should get a reality check from this." see, this is the old approach that never yielded positive results...calling them ignorant and racist doesn't attract retailers to the city... DEGC is doing it the right way...they've learned from past mistakes...now the rest of you will have to as well | ||
Detroitbill Member Username: Detroitbill Post Number: 269 Registered: 09-2006 |
These stats only support the fact that there is a solid population to support retail. Market researchers constantly refute this. For those of us who live here and fall in those categories this supports the reasearchers' findings as hogwash. Add in all the people that work downtown and visit for events etc. and you have a very solid base for well planned retail. | ||
Professorscott Member Username: Professorscott Post Number: 490 Registered: 12-2006 |
Detroitbill, One of the difficulties downtown Detroit has, compared to other cities, is that with limited transit it is hard to attract shoppers unless you provide parking, and to provide parking in a CBD is an expensive undertaking. To fix this, there are two options: 1. Improve transit in the CBD 2. Provide lots of free parking in the CBD (or, if not "free", then validated) Those of you who've seen my posts know what my choice is  | ||
Broken_main Member Username: Broken_main Post Number: 1261 Registered: 06-2005 |
We need to promote downtown as a walker-friendly area. Foot traffic promotes a higher desire for retail. It also IMO helps develop a sence of security for others as well. | ||
1953 Member Username: 1953 Post Number: 1447 Registered: 12-2004 |
This is the report that was released last year. Social Compact is now moving ahead with its support of a city-wide drilldown. There is a blurb about Social Compact's involvement at the following link: http://www.cityconnectdetroit. org/Article.aspx?id=24 | ||
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1 Post Number: 9860 Registered: 10-2003 |
quote: I thought he was talking about individuals that thought this, not a blanket statement against whole groups or retailers. Some cards are played too often but assuming comments to be much more nebulous than they are is no different. The simple fact of the matter is that there are still a lot of people that Detroiters are either thugs or on welfare. Certainly nowhere near a majority but there are a lot. Should I remind you that you have made statements about forumers never being able to afford your legal services. Seems you were making some assumptions about the wealth of the forumers that live in Detroit. (Message edited by jt1 on August 22, 2007) | ||
Danny Member Username: Danny Post Number: 6377 Registered: 02-2004 |
Br Boileau, Great data but Detroit is growing in wealth NOT IN POPULATION. The data from 2005 U.S. Census says that Detroit's population now stands at 846,000 people and its decreasing. White flight to the suburbs has become a reality. Today it's slowing down and fewer hip cool white kids are moving back to downtown and midtown areas, however full white families aren't moving back to Detroit due to violent crime, poor schools, poor city management, vacant and abandon housing and more black folks living in each and every Detroit ghettohoods. White folks are slowing coming back to Detroit but it will take a long time perhaps after 50 years. Black folks in Detroit ghettohoods are getting sick and tired of BROTHERS KILLING BROTHERS in their homes, poor schools, corrupt city leaders poor city services, living next an crackhouse next door or a vacant lot, vacant and abandon buildings and going to poor Detroit Public Schools not learning anything while some Detroit teachers babysit them all day keeping them from clowning other teachers and students. So most of them started to follow the white folks to the suburbs for a better living and mingle along with the white folks in which some white folks don't want to see them next door. So far during the past 15 years over 150,000 Black Detroiters have move out from Detroit to the suburbs and other successful cities in the U.S. Detroit will rebound but it would take small steps and over 50 years away. | ||
Yelloweyes Member Username: Yelloweyes Post Number: 180 Registered: 02-2007 |
So nearly a tenth of Detroit residents live downtown. | ||
Mike Member Username: Mike Post Number: 971 Registered: 11-2003 |
the problem is not entirely mass transit and parking. the problem is too much parking and a population that doesnt walk. detroit's problem is that it is located in michigan. people here do not appreciate nor want an urban environment. | ||
Livernoisyard Member Username: Livernoisyard Post Number: 3804 Registered: 10-2004 |
The homeless living downtown are surely not figured into the average income. Their numbers are also not insignificant to the number of wealthier folk downtown, either. Furthermore, they would still have an effect in lowering any median income figure, too. The Detroit Rises crowd fails to rightfully attribute anything to the homeless--as if they do not exist whenever it suits their purposes. (Message edited by Livernoisyard on August 22, 2007) | ||
Hans57 Member Username: Hans57 Post Number: 190 Registered: 05-2006 |
Danny, I believe you're contradicting yourself as well as ignoring the facts. You claim that white people are and are not moving back to Detroit in the same post. Also, white flight became a reality about 30 years ago. No, the population of Detroit as a whole is not growing, but the downtown and midtown populations are. Yes, the hip cool skinny white kids are increasingly moving to midtown and downtown. I am one, and there are more of me since I moved here 5 years ago. It's true that full families are not moving to Detroit, there are few options for schools. The facts state that the number of projected residents for 2006 are 13.3 percent higher than previously thought. | ||
Mayor_sekou Member Username: Mayor_sekou Post Number: 1353 Registered: 09-2006 |
I wouldn't be surprised if this study shows that Detroit's overall population has either remained constant or gained a little. | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 1432 Registered: 04-2006 |
detroit's problem is that it is located in michigan. Haha, AGREED!!! | ||
Detroit313 Member Username: Detroit313 Post Number: 460 Registered: 02-2006 |
Detroit really needs to get the ball rolling on mass transit. Forget looking for companies to "move downtown". Send lobbyist to D.C. "we need a mass transit" Detroit can't be that poor if the average person can afford to buy a car, gas, and a coney dog! It looks like Downtown is has stopped it slippery-slope, now it's time to focus on other things; 1. Mass transit 2. Better schools 3. Cleaner parks. 4. Cleaner Neighborhoods 5. Crime prevention 6. Cobo and the West Riverfront 7. Boarder crossing 8. Lower taxes. not in that order. <313> | ||
Broken_main Member Username: Broken_main Post Number: 1262 Registered: 06-2005 |
Here is where the real problems exist. While we do have a multitude of working class folk in the Downtown area and its connecting neighborhoods(myself include), there are still a lot of us who won't think twice to drive 20 miles to somerset to do some shopping. I strongly believe that if we start throwing the line out to a few namebrand retailers to set up shop in downtown Detroit (Radio Shack, Chilis, Target, Macys, etc) then others will surely follow because of the tremendous success that would occur. Somebody is going to have to be the first to come and take a chance. There is a market for it, especially with 73,400 people in the area | ||
Miketoronto Member Username: Miketoronto Post Number: 630 Registered: 07-2004 |
The revival is going to start downtown and move outward. Downtowns across the country are seeing increasing pop and wealth as the remainder of the core city declines. Same going on in Pittsburgh, Philly, etc. | ||
Broken_main Member Username: Broken_main Post Number: 1263 Registered: 06-2005 |
Mike... I agree with you wholeheartedly. We are now watching the beginning of a new and changed city. | ||
Miketoronto Member Username: Miketoronto Post Number: 631 Registered: 07-2004 |
I just wish downtown would provide room for all people and not just the rich. It is sad that the centres of our cities are not representing all the great people that make up our cities. And instead are just putting focus on the money and rich. Detroit should market the neighbourhoods to downtown residents who get married and have kids. The Centre City Philly group has a whole plan to encourage downtwon residents who are having kids to look at inner city neighbourhoods next to downtown instead of fleeing to the burbs, when the kids are born. | ||
Charlottepaul Member Username: Charlottepaul Post Number: 1487 Registered: 10-2006 |
I'm pretty sure that there is section 8 housing in the new downtown residential developments. | ||
Broken_main Member Username: Broken_main Post Number: 1266 Registered: 06-2005 |
Mike, I live close to downtown(within 8 blocks) with my family. There is, of course, lots of development going on at this time in my neighborhood for all 3 income levels. | ||
Irish_mafia Member Username: Irish_mafia Post Number: 1022 Registered: 10-2003 |
Of course, the reality is that what is attractive about Detroit, the City, is downtown. A lot of work by very dedicated people have brought the core of the doughnut back to life. The doughnut is the analogy many have used for the city where all the wealth resides outside the hole that is the city. That center of the city (from whence this entire State really emanated) essentially is going through the process again: Building itself up from the center. The challenge that the expansive outer portion of Detroit has to face is that they are really in no more attractive position to that dynamic core than the inner ring suburbs. So why live there? The answer has to be an environment that is GP Light on the GP border (and similarly phased in on the other burbs). The other answer is (I believe), a tax structure and overall cost that allows a family to say "yes I can move here, but because of my reduced overall cost, I can now send my kid to a "parochial, private or other school" that makes the entire picture work. That, I believe has been one of the great failures of the many suburban attempts to boost the city. If you want to strengthen the city neighborhoods, start from the edge of the very successful inner rim and move inward (while the center city success moves out). Recent articles indicate that this is the plan for areas like Altar to Eastlawn/Kercheval to Jefferson. You have to hope it is done effectively, because it does so much to increase the value of both municipal areas (in dollars and quality of life). | ||
Danindc Member Username: Danindc Post Number: 3077 Registered: 10-2003 |
quote: I agree. And scary as this sounds, downtown Detroit is very affordable compared to most cities on the Coasts. The problem is, in order to have redevelopment, you need to be able to finance it. Construction is expensive, whether it's a new building or a renovation. You have site prep, excavation and foundation work, structure, cladding, finishes, HVAC systems, electrical, architect/engineer fees, and permitting fees. That all has to be paid somehow. In order to be able to finance these projects, rents (or sales) need to be high enough to cover the inital construction costs, cover taxes on the increased property value (if the building is rented) and still turn a profit for the owner/developer. This is exactly why Jane Jacobs argues for saving old buildings--so that people of lesser means still have a place to live. It kind of stinks if you're one of the have-nots. But frankly, Detroit on average is a poor city. I don't see a huge problem with a concentrated downtown population of people with better-than-average incomes. | ||
Royce Member Username: Royce Post Number: 2362 Registered: 07-2004 |
On Washington Blvd. you have at least three high-rise apartments for Section 8 or senior residents. Downtown has its poor residents. However, the question to ask in the near future is, "How long before these folks get kicked out for a clientele that's willing to pay more money to live in these same buildings? Will market forces entice landlords to kick out the poor for the rich? Stay tuned. | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1905 Registered: 06-2006 |
"Should I remind you that you have made statements about forumers never being able to afford your legal services. Seems you were making some assumptions about the wealth of the forumers that live in Detroit. " Oh get off it...I made that statement about YOU because YOU were being a dick and belittleing my graduate area of study, and it wasn't because you are a Detroiter... | ||
Danny Member Username: Danny Post Number: 6384 Registered: 02-2004 |
Royce, Once gentrification take over all of Washington Blvd. the po'folks will be long gone. I can't wait when the rich folks start moving in the Book Cadillac Hotel. | ||
Craig Member Username: Craig Post Number: 260 Registered: 02-2007 |
If CBD is just humming with hipsters weighted down with cash why do the businesses that are downtown today close so early? CVS and Borders are canaries in the coal mine: they close "early" because growth to date is only a drop in the bucket and because the cool people are outnumbered by the bums once the sun sets. When these guys stay open late I will be convinced that the threshold has been crossed. |
