  Emu_steve Member Username: Emu_steve Post Number: 383 Registered: 11-2006 |
Agree with Dbest that sometimes the speculation for a project can get old after a while and it is nice to get it done. However to quote the article: "The final choice -- should the only alternatives be Hudson's or Statler -- likely would be made after the financial package is complete and a public commitment is made, experts tell me." I read this as meaning the commitment would be made public (presumably later this month) BUT the naming of the site would not be immediate. So the initial announcement will not answer the question this thread is about: Statler vs. Hudsons The final vote, Gilberts', might not be cast for weeks or months???? | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1447 Registered: 02-2007 |
(Most Likely Sites) 29 Statler 3 Hudson (other) 1 Monroe Block | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1448 Registered: 02-2007 |
We can't force him. I'm sure at the same time, he's getting tired of us bugging him every second about his decision. They say impatience gets you nowhere. However, patience can help to reach heights unheard of. On the other hand, We know the the economic status needs this deal to be done. So what can we do? | ||
Quinn Member Username: Quinn Post Number: 1401 Registered: 01-2005 |
I'm way less concerned with where it's going to be as I am about it actually happening anywhere in Detroit. 1st priority, get it downtown. Now it looks like that will happen. Everyone breath a half-sigh of relief! I can make arguments for an against both the Statler and Hudsons, and in the end I'll be happy with either. I'd really be happy with the Monroe block though. | ||
Detroit_stylin Member Username: Detroit_stylin Post Number: 4390 Registered: 10-2003 |
30 Statler 3 Hudson 1 Monroe Block 2 Madison Lenox We need to expand the CBD further northward. It's basic common sense to me... (Message edited by Detroit_stylin on July 06, 2007) | ||
Mind_field Member Username: Mind_field Post Number: 736 Registered: 10-2003 |
Ok, a few things. If I'm not mistaken, the $200 million amount quoted from the article, is not the cost to construct the new corporate hq, but the value of the incentives and tax breaks that is being worked on to get them to move and stay in Michigan. $200 million seems VERY low for a 5,000 person hq. I hope they make the new building green, a platinum LEED certified building. That is the rage in many other parts of the country, but not so much here yet. Dan Gilbert could be an innovator in that department. I hope affiliated companies like Fathead and ePrize, if they do choose to move downtown, move into existing office space, like Comerica Tower, One Kennedy Square, or some of the historic towers in the CBD. The millenium parking garage is woefully undersized to serve a new Quicken hq, not to mention any associated retail development. And finally my vote. i vote for the Statler site. This will create maximum spinoff potential and lift so many depressed and under-utilized areas of downtown. I think if the hq was put on the Hudson's block, it might be a double-edged sword. A nice critical mass would be built on Woodward, but choking traffic could be a major negative. | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1452 Registered: 02-2007 |
Detroit_stylin, Who the hell voted for the Madison-Lenox? WE already established that it will be completely vacous to consider it as a possible spot. (Message edited by Urbanize on July 06, 2007) | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1453 Registered: 02-2007 |
(Most Likely Sites) 31 Statler 3 Hudson (other) 1 Monroe Block | ||
Harmonie Member Username: Harmonie Post Number: 712 Registered: 08-2004 |
I get chills thinking about the possibilities a HQ on the Statler Site would bring to Washington Blvd and GCP! I think it's pretty likely it's going to be Statler too. That would explain Kwame's big rush to demolish the Statler...I mean I know they say they wanted it gone for Super Bowl but really...it makes some sense if it would also work to show Gilbert they were serious about getting him down here. Also, highly doubt they would go too high. The movement in office buildings (especially hip young places) is towards open floor plans and more transparency (like Compuware). I can see having the building extend above streets rather than closing any off. This in combo with the DTE Park right down the street! I need to go take a cold shower  | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1455 Registered: 02-2007 |
I'm guessing that's a vote for the Statler Harmonie? (Most Likely Sites) 32 Statler 3 Hudson (other) 1 Monroe Block (Message edited by Urbanize on July 06, 2007) | ||
Downtown_remix Member Username: Downtown_remix Post Number: 393 Registered: 03-2007 |
as much as i want the Hudsons site built on finally, i gotta vote to expant the CBD north. A combined district of theater goers, sports fans, business types and lunch goers will create a district non existant in downtown as of yet. add on the possibility tthe UNITED Artist building being apart of this project make the Statler site the overwelming winner. I can see the two tycoons housing their empires in the same neighborhood and with MGM and Motor City hotel resorts. | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1461 Registered: 02-2007 |
Maybe if it plans out right, we could finally see some retail along Grand River, or is that thinking too far out? | ||
Sharmaal Member Username: Sharmaal Post Number: 1170 Registered: 09-2004 |
Do you have me down for .5 votes for each site? It doesn't seem like it. Of course, if you've got alot of stuff to carry from one meeting to the other, you could take the PM. From the Broadway stop to the Grand Circus stop. Granted, you wouldn't be able to stop into Madison's on Broadway for a nooner on the way! But maybe Baja Fresh could open up in the GCP Station? | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1463 Registered: 02-2007 |
Ok, but only for one place (read my post after the one about your College campus) (Most Likely Sites) 33 Statler 4 Hudson (other) 1 Monroe Block | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1464 Registered: 02-2007 |
Sharmaal, Of course they'll be a People Mover Station for the Quicken building (an attachment like Compuware's. Plus, they'll likely open one there. (Message edited by Urbanize on July 06, 2007) | ||
French777 Member Username: French777 Post Number: 189 Registered: 10-2006 |
Statler | ||
Sharmaal Member Username: Sharmaal Post Number: 1171 Registered: 09-2004 |
Urbanize, I just read your post. "(I'm sure they don't want to be running back and forth to 2 headquarters)." Why is that? I love getting some fresh air during the day. Can't stand being cooped up in an office! | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1465 Registered: 02-2007 |
(Most Likely Sites) 34 Statler 4 Hudson (other) 1 Monroe Block | ||
Mind_field Member Username: Mind_field Post Number: 738 Registered: 10-2003 |
i think retail will largely remain in the actual hq building, like at compuware. And let's fill up Woodward and Washington Blvd with retail first! What we really need for sustaining retail is residents. Residents spend a lot more than office workers, if i had to make an educated guess. | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1466 Registered: 02-2007 |
That's you though. This is the Motor City. See ing as these are wealthy business people, they're not going to walking back and forth to the Hudson block. The way gas prices is, they're not going to be wasting it traveling back and forth to 2 campuses or waste an hour and $3 on the People Mover either. You can go for a stroll all you want on your lunch Breaks. However, having two different headquarters just for the stroll (through other properties not a campus style project) not even next to each other is just bizarro. | ||
Nyct Member Username: Nyct Post Number: 59 Registered: 01-2007 |
Come on people! Hudsons! For 2 reasons ... 1. Woodward is and always was the heart of downtown Detroit ... it is the city's most famous street and would make it an attractive location for other businesses and a PRIME address ... Woodward needs to be built up FIRST and foremost, PERIOD! All of the storefronts that are ALREADY IN PLACE would be snatched up and more would be built on the new grounds. Reason # 2. Who in the HELL will fill that empty hudson's space if Quicken doesn't??? I think the Statler site should be developed in the future, once Detroit has a bustling corridor. To build there now would just create another little pocket of activity without anything in between connecting all the other little pockets. | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1467 Registered: 02-2007 |
MindField, You have Trolley Plaza, The B-C on Washington, and on Woodward, Lofts all along the route. All we need to do is give these business owners the latest demographics, instead of the ones from 10 years ago. | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1468 Registered: 02-2007 |
The Hudson's block is much more valuable than the Statler block. It will never get built on if Quicken doesn't take it. They could build an arcade with a high rise residential unit on the hudson block. Besides, we need to rejuvenate our High-End Boulevard for the B-C, The Book Building and Trolley Plaza residents and only a headquarters will do it. What would Louis Kapimier or that Italian developer think if he heard you right now Nyct? (Most Likely Sites) 34 Statler 5 Hudson (other) 1 Monroe Block (Message edited by Urbanize on July 06, 2007) | ||
Planner_727 Member Username: Planner_727 Post Number: 122 Registered: 07-2006 |
I agree with Urbanize. Supporting my previous vote for Statler, it really helps create an improving atmosphoere for GCP and everything in between CM and GCP. To say that workers at the Statler site would not be willing to walk 3 blocks to get to the Hudson's site (if a Macy's/retail mall went in there) is just silly. The odds of someone developing those other 5 acres on GCP with somthing when two HQ's are at CM (and the rest of the office district)are low... even if the new JLA went in there. Spread the wealth... let the pros of the Hudson's site sell it to someone else who needs more persuading/help than an HQ. | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 3175 Registered: 02-2005 |
The Statler site is a weird one. First off, the People mover tracks block the facade facing the park. It makes me kind of resent the People Mover. Any design will have to work around the People Mover. But the main entrance, and the main, longer facade of the building that hopefully gets built here will probably be on Washington Blvd, with a less-dramatic facade along Bagley. Are we all assuming that the empty lot wedged next to the UA between Adams and Bagley (this is the Tuller site, right) will be a parking garage? Retail along Grand River does indeed becomes the next frontier if this happens. Surely things will happen on Washington Blvd., but there are a bunch of empty lots along GR between the Statler site and the AT&T offices on Cass, where a ton of people work. You'd have a captive lunch crowd there to be sure, plus further nightlife possibilities considering a new hockey arena nearby. On the other hand, the empty lots here might just fill in with parking garages. | ||
Scottr Member Username: Scottr Post Number: 568 Registered: 07-2006 |
quote: i'm not assuming that, i certainly hope it doesn't go there. the only way i would accept that is if residential was fronting the park, with the garage behind it, and of course ground-floor retail all around. | ||
Fury13 Member Username: Fury13 Post Number: 1836 Registered: 10-2003 |
This pointless exercise in speculation amazes me. Let's face it, folks, if Dan Gilbert wanted to build a 50-story building in the middle of Woodward Avenue, the city would let him do so and would then re-route the street around it. None of your "votes" count. | ||
Johnlodge Member Username: Johnlodge Post Number: 969 Registered: 10-2003 |
Oops, the fun police is here. Who Narced? | ||
Rocket_city Member Username: Rocket_city Post Number: 318 Registered: 04-2006 |
Well, my vote counts. I'm emailing it to diggity Dan right now. I'm betting the choice will be Statler because it offers more opportunities for future expansion both up and out if needed later on. Compuware will own Campus Martius and Quicken/Rock will own GCP. | ||
Emu_steve Member Username: Emu_steve Post Number: 385 Registered: 11-2006 |
" but there are a bunch of empty lots along GR between the Statler site and the AT&T offices on Cass, where a ton of people work. You'd have a captive lunch crowd there to be sure, plus further nightlife possibilities considering a new hockey arena nearby." This would be incredible. We've had debates about what effect an arena (say 60 - 75 events / year) would have on the area. But combined with 5K headquarter employees then the area gets a boost of incredible proportions. Wonder if Gilbert and Ilitch will do a one two punch announcement? One announce one week (Gilbert) and the other the next week (Ilitch). | ||
Tkelly1986 Member Username: Tkelly1986 Post Number: 325 Registered: 01-2004 |
Statler....no question, but just curious, say they put 10 stories on parking on the Statler site and build atop that...how much room will they need? How many stories can we expect, parking included? | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 4744 Registered: 08-2004 |
My vote (obviously) is the Statler site. I'm not worried about the People Mover marring the site view. It's not really hurting the Whitney, Broderick or Madison views. Why not the Hudson's site? Because they can't go taller than 15 story Compuware Building next door. The parking structure will NOT hold anything taller. And if it's located on the Hudson's site, it will not have the "premier" location that Compuware does on Campus Martius... it will just have a block of Woodward frontage. I think Dan Gilbert wants a little bit more splash than that. And as to the $400 million figure that someone mentioned for the Compuware Building, I think that is the final figure if they build the addition for more office space (which would be in the back of the block, and would be taller). The existing Compuware Building cost nowhere near $400 million. Now getting back to the Statler block. If they build there they can go taller than the 15 story Hudson block limit. Quinn (who oddly voted for the Hudson site) did a nice Photoshop of a fantasy Quicken HQ on the Statler site. I saved it, and I don't think he will mind me reposting his excellent work:  Wouldn't something like this building be nice? Having the tower away from GCP kind of keeps it from overpowering GCP, and yet (as one of the posters mentioned), it gives Washington Blvd. that real tall Book Tower that was never built due to the depression. Granted, a Quicken HQ will not be this large, but we can dream, can't we? I am starting to see what Mike Ilitch is doing with the United Artists Building... he's sprucing things up so as to 'dangle a carrot' in front of Dan Quicken. Mike is saying to Dan Gilbert: "Lookie what I have here that you can include in your HQ neighborhood... an 18 story building that can be filled with some of the other companies that you want to bring downtown, or maybe residential or other commercial uses. And I also have a 2,070 seat movie palace just waiting to be restored as a "Quicken Center For The Performing Arts", that can be used by your company in the day time for meetings, etc., and used for cultural events at night to keep the area vibrant in the evening. And look at all the 1st floor commercial spaces in my building that can complement the retail and restaurants that will be going in on the ground floor of your HQ, to keep the area hopping at night. And you need space for a parking structure? I have lots of space on the back part of the Tuller block. Make it as big as your needs are!"  Quicken Center for the Performing Arts? | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 4745 Registered: 08-2004 |
Some folks on this forum mock us as being "clueless", and likely won't post on this thread. But if cluelessness is bliss, then we're the happiest folks on the forum! (Message edited by Gistok on July 06, 2007) | ||
Fury13 Member Username: Fury13 Post Number: 1838 Registered: 10-2003 |
Great, Rocket_city, I'm sure that Mr. Gilbert will act immediately upon your suggestion. Fun police? Nawww. What I'm saying is: Dan Gilbert will make his decision in due time, based on what his advisors tell him and on what he thinks will be best for his business. But it will be his decision, not yours. You have no say in the matter. None of us do. (Message edited by Fury13 on July 06, 2007) | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 4746 Registered: 08-2004 |
Fury13, we needn't be reminded by the fact that we on this forum have absolutely NO SAY on any development activity going on in Detroit... that goes without saying... Last I checked with Lowell... being a dreamer is not illegal on this forum. | ||
Johnlodge Member Username: Johnlodge Post Number: 971 Registered: 10-2003 |
Well obviously, but it's fun to speculate. Quinn's photoshopped Quicken HQ, for example, is great fun. (Don't forget Qwiggen at the ground floor retail!) | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 4747 Registered: 08-2004 |
Yeah Johnlodge... sometimes we treat this forum like the SimCity development fantasy game... great fun! I guess you can say we do this as a service to those in city government and the business community that are creatively less fortunate than many of us on this forum! After all there are folks "higher up" that do read the forum. And if we can inspire even a single idea over these many years, then all the dreaming is worth it. After all every great thing that has ever happened in this world of ours, started with a single idea... (good lord, I'm starting to sound like Yanni!  ) | ||
Cgunn Member Username: Cgunn Post Number: 60 Registered: 01-2004 |
I vote for Stratler! Having the woodward block filled in would be great, however I would rather see (crossing my fingers) a department store or such on that block. Having Quicken on the woodward block is almost like having all three casinos on the riverfront. Sounds great, the riverfront would be booming, however the west-side of downtown would still be dead (MGM Grand and DTE Campus Development); the Wagner & Co. building would be another city eye-sore (MotorCity); Trappers Alley would be another dead mall and an entire block would not be added to Monroe (Greektown). | ||
Johnlodge Member Username: Johnlodge Post Number: 973 Registered: 10-2003 |
Not only that, Gistok, but I just think it's nice there's a place I can go to discuss this kind of thing with people who really care and get excited about it. I don't care if there is speculation. That just shows the level of excitement. If I try to talk to this stuff with my friends, I'm lucky if they even know Quicken has any plans to move anywhere. And they certainly don't share my enthusiasm about them probably moving to Detroit. It's a niche crowd. This is one of the few places you can go and find a ton of other people excited about a business moving. Of course they're going to try to guess, of course they are going to weigh the possible options and outcomes. And that's why I'm here! If I just wanted the news, I'd be at freep.com. No, I want discussion and opinions, and FRIGGIN SPECULATION! | ||
Sknutson Member Username: Sknutson Post Number: 897 Registered: 03-2004 |
My "non-counting" vote would be for the Statler, in order to (1)resurect that section of office graveyard, and (2) anchor the end of Washington Blvd. The B-C at one end and a new HQ at the other could really help Washington Blvd. With 1001 Woodward, the lofts, and possible/probable residential at the Whitney and the Broderick, I'd prefer hotel/residential/retail at the Hudson's site to make that whole stretch a real downtown residential community. | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 3182 Registered: 02-2005 |
You're right, JLodge. My friends in real life don't want to hear me speculate about Detroit all day, anyway. | ||
Apbest Member Username: Apbest Post Number: 575 Registered: 03-2006 |
I agree Johnlodge, very much so. Up to the last sentence, I enjoy a good inside source now and again | ||
Kid_dynamite Member Username: Kid_dynamite Post Number: 90 Registered: 06-2007 |
A few months back, Dan met with a group of us in a leadership class where it was basically a open forum to discuss anything with the boss. He asked "by a show of hands, how many people would not be opposed to working in downtown Detroit?" When about 80% of the group enthusiastically but their hands up, he said "wow, thats very good to see." I felt better about all this speculation after that day. | ||
Billk Member Username: Billk Post Number: 29 Registered: 09-2005 |
I'm still voting for the United Artist Building. Just because Daniel Howes said the most likely sitea are Statler and Hudsons, doesnt mean he's not just speculating like everyone else. The UA is the only property that has actual construction crews in unmarked cars and trucks working on it every day. | ||
Upinottawa Member Username: Upinottawa Post Number: 882 Registered: 09-2005 |
I still like the idea of UA as primarily residential rather than primarily office space (of course, either is better than exclusively empty). | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1481 Registered: 02-2007 |
I lost count on the score. I ran out to get some KFC. Sorry for the inconvience | ||
Warrenite84 Member Username: Warrenite84 Post Number: 130 Registered: 01-2007 |
Statler. Smaller footprint site + Associated companies + other interested parties = Smartly designed, Landmark Hi-Rise w/ U.A. entertainment venue , People Mover stop, and shared parking for Quicken / new hocky Arena. | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 4749 Registered: 08-2004 |
The United Artists Building is no where near large enough to house the number of Quicken employees that Dan Gilbert wants to bring downtown. Like most downtown buildings with attached theatres, the office block is usually pretty shallow. If the 10 story Fox Building can hold 450 Little Caesar's employees, then the 18 story United Artists Building can probably hold no more than 1,000 Quicken employees. As can be seen in this pic, the building is lacking in "girth".  | ||
3rdworldcity Member Username: 3rdworldcity Post Number: 766 Registered: 01-2005 |
I say, neither. The GCP site would be by far the most practical as it's only 4 minutes tops to I-75, and not too much longer to the Lodge. That equates to countless avoided commuting hours for the employees over the time it would take to navigate to those routes from the heart of downtown. Let's remember that Gilbert is a savvy business guy who may be looking at the practicalities the impact of a potential move on his bottom line. I say there's a good chance that the UA will be the new HQ if the building can be renovated (which I believe is a long shot, and if it could the cost would probably be prohibitive.) However, Ilitch (or Gilbert) is spending a ton of money there. There are swingstages on the outside of the building and they're there for the purpose of determining what work has to be done i/c/w a renovation, and at what cost. The only conceivable basis for failure to pull permits is that mere evaluation work is being done. If Ilitch intends to tear it down, he would not be spending the time and money to do what he's doing because none of the work would be necessary in a tear-down situation. And, he wouldn't be doing the work on spec. He's got a user and the user is Quicken if the building is sound enough to be renovated at an acceptable price. If it's not able to be renovated, then my guess is that Gilbert will not move anywhere, or if he does it will be to Cleveland. He'll say that he's paying to evaluate the UA (and maybe he is) and that although he really wanted to move downtown, it's not economically feasible at this time for the company to commit the kind of money necessary to build new. Everyone's off the hook for a long while. Finally, don't underestimate the ability of the City to tell him where to build a new HQ if that's what he really wants. He that has the gold makes the rules and Kwame has got apparently $200 million to beat him over the head with if the City wants him to go to one site or the other even though the chosen site may not be first on his list. | ||
Detroit_stylin Member Username: Detroit_stylin Post Number: 4391 Registered: 10-2003 |
I got inside news today that Downtown is the spot where Quicken is moving... Where is being held a tightly guarded secret... | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1483 Registered: 02-2007 |
How about we kidnap Gilbert and force the location out of him? Or someone that has more inside info can tell us the location. | ||
Supersport Member Username: Supersport Post Number: 11626 Registered: 10-2003 |
I'd like to state a few things. First off, somebody above laughed at the notion of them building on both the Statler AND Hudson's site. The fact is, the last I heard from people working closely to this deal, was that they were in fact most interested in BOTH sites. They stated that they would like to get into the residential market in Detroit, and both sites would be approximately 50/50 office/residential. Now, this information is probably a good 6 months old, but it WAS a very possible development plan. Secondly, some idiot above mentioned the serious lack of parking. Considering that the majority of the 40,000+ Tigers fans park in that general area, I'm sure they could find spots for some 5,000 employees. Lastly, another thought crossed my mind. The United Artist building is likely to come down if the Statler site was chosen. Yet what about building a twin tower HQ that occupies both the Statler and UA site, with a multilevel walking bridge connecting the two buildings? Parking could be implemented into each building, perhaps in the rear portions, or maybe a few levels of underground parking for each building. A twin tower HQ would help fill in Grand Circus Park, which has been slowly disappearing with the loss of the Statler and Tuller, and if add one more if the UA is torn down simply for a parking garage. It's been awhile ago, but I had mentioned at renovated Grand Circus Park as one distinct advantage to them moving to the Statler site. I believe it was RSA whom pointed out that GCP actually underwent a renovation just a few years back, including the fountain. I think they even won some sort of award for the park. I'm sorry, but we walked through the park just a few days ago, and that fountain is one of the most pathetic fountains I have ever seen. The water barely spits out of the fountain. In addition, the blue paint in each fountain is seriously faded and peeling. The park in general needs some serious work, work that would most likely be done with a new HQ shadowing over it. So if I had a choice, I'd say the Statler site. | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1484 Registered: 02-2007 |
Okay, let me tally up these votes: (Most Likely Sites) 40 Statler 5 Hudson (other) 1 Monroe Block 1 United Artist | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 4750 Registered: 08-2004 |
Sport I agree with the Statler site plus the UA Building. The problem with the UA/Tuller block is that Mike Ilitch only owns about 80% of it, with the other 20% (2 parcels) owned by the estate of a man whose descendants cannot all be found to try to sell the property (at least not yet). So there's that wrinkle in the twin building idea (which I too like). One of the non-Ilitch owned parcels is a very small parcel directly to the right of the UA Building. This small parcel was a parking lot between the UA and Tuller for decades.  In this old 1920's picture it shows the UA and Tuller both flush up against the sidewalk. The gap between them is the small parking lot (probably only big enough for about 30 cars) that Ilitch doesn't own (along with another larger parcel he doesn't own at the NW corner of the Tuller/UA block). Someone mentioned that the city has been trying to get ownership of this land for some time now. And by a strange twist of fate, the fact that the entire block is not Ilitch owned, may indeed be saving the United Artists Building from a fate with the wreckers ball. | ||
Kid_dynamite Member Username: Kid_dynamite Post Number: 91 Registered: 06-2007 |
quote : "Secondly, some idiot above mentioned the serious lack of parking. Considering that the majority of the 40,000+ Tigers fans park in that general area, I'm sure they could find spots for some 5,000 employees." hey supersport, I guess I'm that idiot, huh? First of all, did you even read my post? I am telling you parking will be an issue. Drive your genius self out to our locations Livonia, Troy, Laurel Park, & Farmington Hills and look at the giant lots that are filled up. Just the fact that there will be Tigers games going on while we are working, (most of us usually work until 8 PM) presents an issue. I speculate that a few structures would be built close to the CBD with shuttle service as is currently done. Why is that hard for you to understand? | ||
Izzadore Member Username: Izzadore Post Number: 44 Registered: 11-2006 |
Everyone has posted some interesting comments but... What if 3rdworldcity is correct and neither site is selected? What other locations downtown can give Quicken a high profile? What if Quicken wants to clear some space behind the Fox, create green space (like Campus Martius) and build their new location overlooking that? Would that be a more positive development than an existing site? | ||
Focusonthed Member Username: Focusonthed Post Number: 1125 Registered: 02-2006 |
Haha suckers, working till 8:00. Anyway, I'm guessing your "giant lots" in Livonia, Troy, etc, etc, are ridiculous surface lots. Surface lots will not be built in either of those locations, both of which are either literally on top of or nearly on top of fucking parking garages, for Christ's sake. For all the many things downtown Detroit lacks, parking is SURELY not one of them. | ||
Focusonthed Member Username: Focusonthed Post Number: 1126 Registered: 02-2006 |
How about more wild speculation: They buy out the State and move into the former GM HQ. lol. Seriously though, that would be interesting, though I did just pull the idea out of my ass. | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 1100 Registered: 04-2006 |
For some reason I see Gilbert in negotiations about a transit system. All these rehabs deciding to go condo instead of apartment... Property values would skyrocket around there with an announcement of a plan to build a rail system. | ||
Charlottepaul Member Username: Charlottepaul Post Number: 1263 Registered: 10-2006 |
Let's allow Mr. Gilbert to tackle one issue at at time please. No one can deal with regional transit when they are trying to move their corp. HQ, LOL. | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1489 Registered: 02-2007 |
Wow fotd, I didn't really notice that. | ||
Supersport Member Username: Supersport Post Number: 11627 Registered: 10-2003 |
Here is another option that hasn't been considered. At one time, Compuware had proposed building another tower next to the RenCen. Obviously, the plans haven't taken effect, and any first phase expansion to Compuware would first be built behind their current building, as was also already planned out. So, while I don't think a riverfront HQ would be the best option for the city nor in terms of spurring spinoff development, considering the closeness between Gilbert and Karmanos, this could be an option. Anybody remember the details of the Compuware tower along the river? Do they own the land, or the rights to this spot? Or was it to be built on GM's property, which is now being developed into condos. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 5760 Registered: 10-2003 |
Sport, I believe the Compuware RiverEast building, was proposed for the spot that is now Beaubien Place (parking garage/AsianTown). I'm pretty sure GM has always had complete control of all the parcels directly east of its HQ, and that Compuware would have been a development partner, much like Hines is their current development partner. | ||
Hans57 Member Username: Hans57 Post Number: 184 Registered: 05-2006 |
I think we can all agree that Compuware is located at a much better spot. The Renaissance Center is just cut off from the rest of town, and east of it would've flat out blown. | ||
Kid_dynamite Member Username: Kid_dynamite Post Number: 92 Registered: 06-2007 |
Hey Focusonthed, you can call me a sucker all you want for working those hours. I dont mind. Trust me, if you work for it, you are compensated generously. | ||
E_hemingway Member Username: E_hemingway Post Number: 1243 Registered: 11-2004 |
A couple of points... quote: Actually, a Woodward mass transit line is probably a major issue in the decision. A Free Press column by Tom Walsh a few weeks ago has a lot clues in it, including this quote: quote: http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs .dll/article?AID=/20070617/COL 06/706170696/1087 This quote from the story also makes me think that a move to Cleveland is not a real possibility. It has also been written in other stories that moving the whole company that far away would cost the business too much in terms of talent. quote: The two-site plan also seems like a real possibility. Walsh's column quotes Gilbert as saying the announcement will "We'll blow your mind" and these next few graphs seem to support that. quote: This decision has a lot of potential to make a big impact. But all of this hype also has big potential for creating a huge letdown to the point that people would be disappointed if only Quicken moved down here. All of this hype scares me a little because if the deal falls apart it can be seen as just one more blow to Metro Detroit and Michigan's economy. | ||
Mind_field Member Username: Mind_field Post Number: 741 Registered: 10-2003 |
I think one location that would be highly visible and desirable for a corporate hq would be the northwest corner of Woodward and I-75, site of the demolished motown building. Give midtown some hq love! | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1491 Registered: 02-2007 |
However, it's still being looked at for a Possible Hockey Arena. Most of all, it's outside the CBD. Midtown will get it's share as the New Center area and WSU develops (Maybe a Med. Equip HQ or a smaller Pfizer-Type Company?) (Message edited by Urbanize on July 06, 2007) | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 4751 Registered: 08-2004 |
Well 3WC's comments about the Ilitch's not spending money on the UA Building unless they had Quicken "in the bag" sounds logical to me. And unlike most of us here, he's a downtown businessman. That plus the fact that the UA Building is too small to be the entire Quicken HQ, gives me an even warmer fuzzier feeling. I think that if this is the case then the Statler will also be part of the Quicken HQ. I cannot see Quicken split between the UA and Hudson blocks, with an empty Statler block still sitting there. That just doesn't sound right. | ||
3rdworldcity Member Username: 3rdworldcity Post Number: 767 Registered: 01-2005 |
Gistok: Here's an update. The 2 parking lot parcels owned by the heirs of Harold Shapiro are now under contract. The deal was made about 2 weeks ago. There are a couple of title problems being worked out but that's a done deal. The contract is w/ an "unnamed principal" but my educated guess based on a couple of the players involved is that it's Olympia Development. That's what the heirs believe. Take it to the bank. | ||
Southen Member Username: Southen Post Number: 230 Registered: 08-2006 |
I wouldnt mind seeing Quicken at Statler and all of Gilbert's other businesses located at Hudsons. I would rather see one spectacular development rather then two decent ones. Id like to see the money poured in GCP between the Statler and UA/Tuller sites personally. Hudson block will be developed soon with all that is happening down there. I cant say the same for Statler though if Quicken doesnt choose it. | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1492 Registered: 02-2007 |
In addition to Quicken's companies, I can actually see 5th/3rd looking into the City for Corporate development (maybe not a HQ, but like a Major Hub or something). They're the major Financer for ePrize and if he did get the other investors to come downtown with him, I'm sure 5th/3rd would want to get in the mix as well, to both keep up with their Market and Bank expansions. What I do see as possible is The Quicken Company by itself on the Statler site, then a Mult-Use Office Building on the Hudson site, including portions for Fathead, ePrize, and 5th/3rd. They already have a BallPark named after them, so they should have some corporate presence here. In addition, if Fatheads were to come with him, that could spur the development of more Sports bar and possibly an EPSN SportsZone that y'all have been wanting. (Message edited by Urbanize on July 06, 2007) (Message edited by Urbanize on July 06, 2007) (Message edited by Urbanize on July 06, 2007) (Message edited by Urbanize on July 06, 2007) | ||
Emu_steve Member Username: Emu_steve Post Number: 386 Registered: 11-2006 |
Thanks, 3rdWC. Sounds like Ilitch is up to something GOOD, despite the prevailing bad opinion many on this board have of him. | ||
Detroit313 Member Username: Detroit313 Post Number: 391 Registered: 02-2006 |
My vote is Statler, In my dreams Gilbert would finish the Fisher Building ( The Fisher-Gilbert Center) Dan can finish the 60 story tower and 29 story west tower planned before the depression <313> Statler vote/New Center vote | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1500 Registered: 02-2007 |
(Most Likely Sites) 41 Statler 5 Hudson (other) 1 Monroe Block 1 United Artist 1 Fisher Building (Hmmm at Detroit313) (Message edited by Urbanize on July 06, 2007) | ||
Ramcharger Member Username: Ramcharger Post Number: 350 Registered: 05-2006 |
How about the Ford Auditorium site? They could build an arcade lined with shops under Jefferson Ave. to better connect it to the rest of the CBD. This was the plan CAY hawked to Comerica in the early nineties. A citywide referendum preventing the sale of civic center land and the demolition of Ford Auditorium thwarted the plan. On a different note, when the announcement is made, will the design work have already been completed or will Gilbert still be shopping for an architect? I think it would be great if he hired a famous architect to design his new headquarters building. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 5761 Registered: 10-2003 |
Well, he's already paid for some preliminary conceptualizations (i.e. Kraemer, I believe, and Rossetti), so I imagine he may be pretty far down the road with this one. BTW, Gilbert must be getting a kick out of all of this speculation. I can't imagine that he (or some other higher-ups at Quicken) aren't reading these speculations and dreams. (Message edited by lmichigan on July 06, 2007) | ||
Tkelly1986 Member Username: Tkelly1986 Post Number: 327 Registered: 01-2004 |
Best case scenario with all his business ventures, what is the total number of employers we could see coming downtown? And is it feasible to build the Quicken HQ on the statler site and then a 15 story building on the Tuller site for his other ventures? Are we looking at closer to 6,000 people? | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1535 Registered: 02-2007 |
This may be speculation sure, but this is very big news for the city of Detroit. Quicken is a World-Class Financial Corporation that deals with Financial issues for many corporations and upscale residential units in Chicago, NYC, LA, and even overseas. So I don't mind speculation. It just mean we're one step closer to snagging a major corporation and possibly a major change. Not to mention is made Fortune's top 100 list for desirable employer, Forbe's Favorite, Crain's Best To Work, and ComputerWorld's #1 out of 100 top jobs to work at. (Message edited by Urbanize on July 07, 2007) (Message edited by Urbanize on July 07, 2007) (Message edited by Urbanize on July 07, 2007) | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1536 Registered: 02-2007 |
The Statler Site (despite major positives) still looks shaky. They're mortgage lenders for Compuware and EDS (which has a major Corporate here and in the headquarters in Texas) (which is a plus for us when it comes to a DD location period) when it comes to Home Loans and they may only want to be a Skywalk away from one of them. (Message edited by Urbanize on July 07, 2007) (Message edited by Urbanize on July 07, 2007) (Message edited by Urbanize on July 07, 2007) | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1539 Registered: 02-2007 |
In addition, Quicken also delas with the Mortgage issues for Penske, which is also headquartered in Metro Detroit (another plus). Hopefully, we could look forward to them moving as well. | ||
Urbanize Member Username: Urbanize Post Number: 1540 Registered: 02-2007 |
Also, they handle the affairs for Google, which also has a nice percentage of it's Corporate presence in SE Michigan (third plus). Let's not forget AT&T either. | ||
Kid_dynamite Member Username: Kid_dynamite Post Number: 97 Registered: 06-2007 |
Urbanize, the loans we do per month for Compuware, EDS (and Penske) could be counted on two hands. Thats a fact. Proximity to them means nothing. | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 4752 Registered: 08-2004 |
Ramcharger, you can forget about the Ford Auditorium site. About 15 years ago when Comerica was still HQ'ed at 211 W. Fort St., they were seriously interested in the Ford Auditorium site for a new HQ. They even had world famous architect Caesar Pelli design a 30 story office tower for that site. Pelli is probably most famous for his design of Malaysia's twin Petronas Towers (worlds tallest buildings for a few years), as well as London's mammoth Canary Wharf complex (located in the Dockland's area east of the heart of London). There was a big bruhaha about further blocking the view of the river around Hart Plaza, and eventually the idea was dropped. | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 4753 Registered: 08-2004 |
3WC, thanks for the updates on the Harold Shapiro sites. That makes the Statler-UA-Tuller site all the more likely (IMHO) for Quicken. | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 4754 Registered: 08-2004 |
That would leave the AAA Building, the one that was damaged in the Statler demolition, as the only other parcel left on the Statler/UA-Tuller blocks that is not either city or Ilitch owned. Earlier this year Michigan Building owner Tony Pieroni (who owns the AAA Building) said on this forum that although he had a lawsuit against the folks who demo'ed the Statler (possibly others) for his AAA Building damage.... he also stated that he was NOT going to stand in the way of a large development for the Statler block, and even mentioned that he would like to participate in such a development. After all any Statler/UA-Tuller mega-development would only further enhance the value of his Michigan Building. After decades of being the only occupied building on that stretch of Bagley, it would be nice if the Michigan Building became surrounded by big development projects, with a new arena being the other possible development to the north of the Michigan Building. |
