 
Danindc
Member
Username: Danindc
Post Number: 3109
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 11:08 am: |    |
I can't believe how many people are suggesting that Oleosis do whatever his girlfriend wants. Do you not have spines?
Oleosis--you need to do what is going to make YOU happy. If that's buying an industrial building in Detroit and rehabbing it, then go for it. If the woman isn't going to be supportive (or at least understanding), then she's probably not the right woman for you.
Best of luck, my friend! |
Fury13
Member
Username: Fury13
Post Number: 2078
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 11:14 am: | |
Actually, I was under the impression that Sterling Heights is one of the more diverse suburbs, with various Arabic/Muslim ethnic groups, Chaldeans, and Asians on the upswing there. |
Dougw
Member
Username: Dougw
Post Number: 1862
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 11:27 am: | |
Oleosis -- To be fair, buying and rehabbing a 46,000 (??) square foot warehouse is probably the most extreme urban experience you could put your girlfriend through. If it's that large a warehouse for only $150K, I'm guessing it's in the middle of nowhere.
Some sort of compromise might be in order, such as renting a place downtown (as E_hemingway suggested), or buying something in a more established neighborhood in the city. Or if you really want to fix up a warehouse, at least maybe try a smaller one, and in an area where some other people are doing the same thing. |
Pam
Member
Username: Pam
Post Number: 2446
Registered: 11-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 11:27 am: | |
quote:Actually, I was under the impression that Sterling Heights is one of the more diverse suburbs, with various Arabic/Muslim ethnic groups, Chaldeans, and Asians on the upswing there.
I think you are right. (Comparing my last visit there with growing up there in the 70s.) |
Ericdetfan
Member
Username: Ericdetfan
Post Number: 150
Registered: 02-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 11:28 am: | |
my fiance feels the same way about living in Detroit, and therefore; moving back will likely never be an option for me. This does not mean that I don't intend to play an active role in something that helps the city. You can still own property, volunteer, or anything else in the city without out actually living there. If you love this girl than I would def compromise with her. I'm sure that you can find something to do that you will both agree on. If not than oh well. The love of a good woman can be more important than a lot of other things. |
Frankg
Member
Username: Frankg
Post Number: 16
Registered: 08-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 11:29 am: | |
I have a passion for Detroit as well, and have it in the back of my mind to move back into the city someday (I work in Milford and rent in Waterford now). But being single, I have noticed that very few women enjoy Detroit as much as I do. I think a lot of it has to do with crime and fear. But the reality is, violent crime is a more scary proposition to women than a big guy like me. I pretty much came to the conclusion that unless I want to remain a bachelor for life or turn gay then I probably won't ever move back into the city. It is a shame, too, as our family has deep roots there (my great great grandfather was born there in 1841). |
6nois
Member
Username: 6nois
Post Number: 456
Registered: 11-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 11:30 am: | |
I am shocked by the number of people who "want to enjoy what the city has to offer" but won't live in the city, and I don't know how they think its going to change unless they take an active move to change the politics, services, and way the city is. You can't change that from Ferndale, all you can do is complain.
I think trying to get her to rent first and try out the city is the best way to go about this. Ease into it. This will also allow you to save up money for your project, also it will be alot of work, but if you succeed the rewards will be amazing. |
E_hemingway
Member
Username: E_hemingway
Post Number: 1314
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 11:45 am: | |
quote:I pretty much came to the conclusion that unless I want to remain a bachelor for life or turn gay then I probably won't ever move back into the city.
Hey, if Sporto can find a girlfriend who enjoys the city, then there is hope for just about everyone.  I wish Manrooter were still around to have some fun with the "turn gay" part of that post. |
Jt1
Member
Username: Jt1
Post Number: 9874
Registered: 10-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 11:46 am: | |
quote:I am shocked by the number of people who "want to enjoy what the city has to offer" but won't live in the city, and I don't know how they think its going to change unless they take an active move to change the politics, services, and way the city is. You can't change that from Ferndale, all you can do is complain.
Detroit has more cheerleaders than citizens which is why the city is still struggling. That said there are a lot of people that don't live in the city that contribute and help.
It is just frustrating hearing how many people want Detroit to be to a certain standard before they consider moving. Seems so many people have that attitude and we are not seeing the progress we should see.
Cheerleaders/volunteers, etc are great but for the city to improve we need citizens that will be an asset in their neighborhood.
(Message edited by jt1 on August 28, 2007) |
Detroitbill
Member
Username: Detroitbill
Post Number: 310
Registered: 09-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 11:58 am: | |
Detroit is by no means a great city to raise a family, that is fact, For people who do not fit that scenario, its a very liveable city Downtown in the right areas. It is not just restaurants, its about diversity, proximity to many cultural events, world class art institutions, sporting events, the river, closeness to business and commerce,, and many people who think the same way . You do not have to sit on a freeway half your life if you are lucky enough to work and socialize there.There is a enormous cost (both financial and emotionally) to that , one that many people never do quantify. Thats the plus. The civic government is certainly not the best, in the suburbs you have some very poor governments as well as some very good ones. One has to work with the present and future and not dwell on administrations who damaged stability in prior years. You may not succeed but you have to make an attempt to contribute if you want Detroit to be a better city. Racism still persists on both sides of the color fence , it is demonstrated in a subtle fashion often in this whole metro area yet I notice where I live it is not a major issue at all. People have learned to accept each other on quality not color, perhaps this is because, as mentioned earlier, the people think alike, minds are open to each other and they dont dwell on the past. My niece who used to live in Detroit, ( still loves it) and moved to Montreal for work visited the other day and spent the weekend. She asked when people in this metro area will realize this is Detroit 2008 not Detroit 1978. She talked to some suburbanites in a restaurant and she could not get over the lack of knowledge as well as some of the comments made about Detroit. They were afraid to park their car in a lot in greektown and were cautious because of all the various types of "people" on the street ( whatever that means) . They were surprised at how nice everything looked though. This sort of attitude is what makes it difficult for many of us. It is obvious both city and suburban dwellers need to make a better effort to know each other, as they will both be quite pleased Im sure. |
Jfried
Member
Username: Jfried
Post Number: 1054
Registered: 11-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 12:08 pm: | |
"I pretty much came to the conclusion that unless I want to remain a bachelor for life or turn gay then I probably won't ever move back into the city."
This may be the funniest, yet, saddest quote I've seen on this site.
I was in a very similar situation as Oleosis007 about a year ago. I ended up engaged to a girl who had no intention of living in the city. I owned a loft at the time, but it was in a neighborhood she was not down with, so to compromise, we were going to sell that place and rent in one of the CBD developments (above small plates, or Merchants Row)to see if she would come around.
Long story short, she completely changed her tune once she actually had the ring and completely refused to live in the city. In the end we split. Where we were going to live was not the only reason, but it was definitely a big part of it.
I've come to realize that you've got to do what's best for you. Is your desire to live in the city strong enough to risk your relationship? For a lot of people "living" in the city defines who they are, and there is absolutely no way they would live in the burbs. Do you love her enough that you making some other type of investment in the city might make up for actually living there? Either way it's a tough decision, but in the end you need to decide who/what is more important to you.
Many people have suggested trying out renting first. It's probably the safest idea because if things don't work out you can get out of a lease much easier than a mortgage. Surprise her by taking her to a nice dinner and set up a few appointments to see the nicer places downtown.
I think your idea of converting an old building is great and it actually sounds, like me, you probably watch a little too much HGTV. 46k sq ft is huge for your first project, and you could easily be looking at close to $2M to rehab something that size. You can do a lot of the work as you go, but just to prep a building that size for 1 unit is going to cost a huge chunk of money. I'm doing the same thing on a 4200 sq ft building right now and no matter how much construction background you have, how much money, how much time, it's going to take much more than you think. Don't be discouraged, and keep this as a goal, but maybe start a little smaller.
In the end you have a lot to think about. Don't be swayed by all the negative posts on this thread. There are obvious many issues to deal with here, but as swingline mentioned there are so many more good things that keep so many of us here. I think a lot of the negativity is coming from people who haven't lived in the city for a while. I find that most of my friends have never had more pride, or have seem more momentum then were seeing here right now. The changes in the city, not just downtown, the past five years are still pretty unbelievable.
(Message edited by jfried on August 28, 2007) |
Sstashmoo
Member
Username: Sstashmoo
Post Number: 326
Registered: 02-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 12:09 pm: | |
DaninDC wrote: "I can't believe how many people are suggesting that Oleosis do whatever his girlfriend wants. Do you not have spines?"
Yes most certainly and brains too.. |
Cambrian
Member
Username: Cambrian
Post Number: 1537
Registered: 08-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 12:31 pm: | |
"Quote: "It would be pretty tough to overcome the stereotypes and fears her folks instilled in her."
Or possibly the reasons she is against this is grounded in common sense and based on real numbers."
I've not taught my child that Detroit is a bad place. I must be a bad parent. |
Cinderpath
Member
Username: Cinderpath
Post Number: 158
Registered: 05-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 12:39 pm: | |
Cinderpath,
Either help this city or get out of the way. Right now you are part of the tide making its future harder.
If you've noticed, most posters here are part of the rebuilding effort. You are not. With your naysaying, you are now part of its troubles.
Well- I take issue with your assertion that I am a nay-sayer, rather, I am pointing out facts. The police are indeed corrupt, I have experienced it firsthand, (one was in a very scary personal situation) as well as have friends in the business community who know all to well about what it takes to get city contracts. For God sakes, we're taking about a city which routinely does not have manhole covers on streets sometimes. Nothing personal, but that is something, I kind of feel is a basic necessity and not luxury items. Do I want my kid to fall in a sewer? I watched a house burn to the ground in the city last year, because the fire department did not have enough water pressure to fight it. These basic safety issues can sometimes take weeks and months, if ever to fix by the DPW. I may not like it, but I am not immune to reality. So please answer the question how is someone who does not sugarcoat reality "Part of its troubles"?
The original post was about a person whose partner did not want to move into the city. I offered a personal comment, which apparently you disliked (which is fine), and I personally have struggled with the same issue. Unfortunately we live in a society where free speech is tolerated, so please respect my viewpoints, as I do yours. I didn't resort to calling you a pie-in-the-sky dreamer about Detroit?
I applaud anyone who moves to the city, and tries to change it for the better. I am busy running a business in a bad economy myself, and trying to raise a family. I don't have the energy or time to change the city. I personally have about 30 families who depend on paychecks from our company to feed their families, which I consider more important. Call me selfish, but I care about the people who work for me. It sickens me, when someone's house burns to the ground when the fire hydrants don't work, yet the Mayor goes to conventions and stays in a $1300 a night hotel suite. I find this morally questionable.
I do not think it is asking to much when citizens who pay taxes have a right to expect good city services, and a decent education, which is currently not happening in Detroit. I guess this makes me a bad person.
(Message edited by Cinderpath on August 28, 2007) |
Granmontrules
Member
Username: Granmontrules
Post Number: 146
Registered: 01-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 12:59 pm: | |
DUMP HER! There are lots of cool Detroit girls. I Know I married one! |
Iheartthed
Member
Username: Iheartthed
Post Number: 1474
Registered: 04-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 1:02 pm: | |
For God sakes, we're taking about a city which routinely does not have manhole covers on streets sometimes. Nothing personal, but that is something, I kind of feel is a basic necessity and not luxury items. Do I want my kid to fall in a sewer?
I'm gonna need you to prove this. I can't recall ever seeing one unattended manhole without a cover in Detroit. And it sounds like I spent a lot more time living there than you did... |
Miss_cleo
Member
Username: Miss_cleo
Post Number: 831
Registered: 05-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 1:04 pm: | |
^ yeah, cause you are Superman and in every location in the city at once!
OMG! How arrogant are you? Just because you personally havnet seen an open manhole means it couldnt have happened, right? |
Quozl
Member
Username: Quozl
Post Number: 1332
Registered: 07-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 1:06 pm: | |
Maybe he is referring to the 100's of missing storm sewer grates that have been replaced by old tires sticking out of the street? |
Iheartthed
Member
Username: Iheartthed
Post Number: 1475
Registered: 04-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 1:11 pm: | |
^ yeah, cause you are Superman and in every location in the city at once!
Why yes, yes I am.
Just because you personally havnet seen an open manhole means it couldnt have happened, right?
I didn't say there weren't any... He said it was routine. If it were routine then a person like me, who has probably spent more time in that city than the average poster on this forum, would have probably noticed something like that, right? |
Lo_to_d
Member
Username: Lo_to_d
Post Number: 10
Registered: 07-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 1:15 pm: | |
Oleosis007 - I got married 1 year ago and bought a condo in midtown 9 months ago. We lived in chicago for the previous 3 years. The first time I brought her to Detroit, we came in on Michigan Ave. She was actually brought to tears by the abandoned train station. I showed her all of Detroit's 'ripped back sides' as Iggy Pop would say. Long story, short. She did not want to move into the city of Detroit because of similar fears of your girlfriend. I explained to her that it was a passion. I talked her into it and guess what... She now loves it. She is such a supporter of the city and we plan on buying more real estate in the future. She now promotes and sells real estate in the city. I think a 'rent to own' option would be your best bet. You can rent for a year and at the end of the year have an option to buy with 1/2 of your years rent going toward the downpayment. She can continue living in S.H. if she wants, but she will become more comfortable each time she visits. Of course do your research, but don't listen to some of the ignorant comments in this thread. There are great, safe areas to live in the city and even raise a family. btw, i own property in the city of chicago too. My taxes there are much higher and most city services are not better. Crime is actually worse in my neighborhood in chicago than it is in midtown, detroit. Don't live your life in fear in the burbs with binoculars watching and waiting for the city to get better. Follow your passion, but make sure its your passion. If she doesn't follow, the relationship would have failed eventually anyway. Sorry for the long post. |
Exmotowner
Member
Username: Exmotowner
Post Number: 400
Registered: 06-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 1:24 pm: | |
As most of you know by my past posts, I had a very rough time when I lived there. Time (and this website) has eased my memories somewhat, but just be prepared for the roughness of the city. If you dont live there now. Seriously think about it. Do you want to have a gun in your face? do you want your car stolen, do you want your house broken into and completely emptied out (and nobody sees anything) (Don't snitch - is the norm).
I would give anything to be able to come home, but logic keeps telling me WTF are you nuts?
Listen to your girlfriend, theres a reason the burbs are afraid of the city. Most of us were ran out of there. You would think in America, you could live where you want, but you really cant (with any quality of life). I've mentioned moving back (I could now probably afford the house in the BE area that I've always wanted), but could I afford the taxes, insurance, gas bills etc? Probably not. Certainly not with having to replace everything about once a year. :-(
When I truely feel I can come home SAFELY, I will. But Im gay and I SURE dont feel welcome there. Sorry. Yea guys Im still bitter. It really hurts that I cant come home. |
Bumble
Member
Username: Bumble
Post Number: 324
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 1:33 pm: | |
quote:Iheartthed
Member
Username: Iheartthed
Post Number: 1474
Registered: 04-2006
Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 1:02 pm:
------------------------------ ------------------------------ --------------------
For God sakes, we're taking about a city which routinely does not have manhole covers on streets sometimes. Nothing personal, but that is something, I kind of feel is a basic necessity and not luxury items. Do I want my kid to fall in a sewer?
I'm gonna need you to prove this. I can't recall ever seeing one unattended manhole without a cover in Detroit. And it sounds like I spent a lot more time living there than you did...
Here's your assignment: Starting from the Blvd., walk south on Lincoln and continue on to Trumbull. Walk in the street, right next to the curb, on the west side. You probably won't see any tires sticking out of the uncovered manholes but if we're lucky you'll certainly discover something else. Bring your cell phone. . . .
Do you even live in this city??? |
Cinderpath
Member
Username: Cinderpath
Post Number: 159
Registered: 05-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 1:47 pm: | |
I'm gonna need you to prove this. I can't recall ever seeing one unattended manhole without a cover in Detroit. And it sounds like I spent a lot more time living there than you did...
I guess you don't hang around the same nice areas as I do :-) (Lighten up, you need a sense of humor around this place).
This specimen was like this for a few weeks, before fortunately the city decided to "Fix it" by placing a piece of wood in it and marking "No Cover" , which I found too humorous (in the tragic-comedy sense) not to photograph it. It was "Only" like this for a few additional weeks..................
I have seen several open manholes- I may have even photographed others.
You may live in the city, but I bet I could take you to places you have no idea exist.
(Message edited by Cinderpath on August 28, 2007) |
Detroitbill
Member
Username: Detroitbill
Post Number: 311
Registered: 09-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 2:00 pm: | |
ExMotowner, I feel very bad what happened to you in the D ,, however there are many of us who have not been " run out of town" or had guns shoved in our faces, many who are gay and straight who have not had these bad things happen at all, I , once again did some homework way back in 1989 and chose an area where the chance of these awful things is less. Found secure living/parking and lived my life accordingly. I have always tried to be sensible about where I live and always look around me when I walk and run. With the exception of 3 years in the burbs its been 16 years now living in Detroit and its been primarily a very good run. I found this was the best and most sensible way to enjoy living in Detroit. Maybe if you come back someday you might try a different area.. This goes the same in any city I know. If I moved to Chicago and bought a house on the south side I dont know if I would feel is such a wonderful town..
As for manhole covers open, geesh dont ever go to NYC... and for that matter a friend on the weekend fractured a foot on a Royal Oak sidewalk that was cracked and never repaired. soo, Royal Oak is out of the question to live in now also |
Cinderpath
Member
Username: Cinderpath
Post Number: 160
Registered: 05-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 2:12 pm: | |
I have spent a lot of time in the city, and go there all the time. There are people in the Bubs who literally go years without ever setting foot in the city. I know of places I doubt long time residents even know exist. I certainly don't "Hate it" by any means, rather I am just really disgusted with those tasked with administrating it. It is a disgrace. As for crime, ironically I have left my vehicle in places in the city that would make people in the burbs cringe, and never had a problem. I did have it broken into in Rochester though. |
Exmotowner
Member
Username: Exmotowner
Post Number: 401
Registered: 06-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 2:30 pm: | |
Detroitbill, I lived all over the city (except for the real expensive parts. I managed a 50 unit apt building behind Menjo's (Palmer court apartments) for four years. I've been through the mill with Detroit, but it still feels like home. Nashville where I've lived since 87 sure as hell doesnt feel like home and I doubt it ever will. |
Danny
Member
Username: Danny
Post Number: 6402
Registered: 02-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 3:09 pm: | |
Oleosis007,
If your girlfriend don't like the ghettos of Detroit then let her stay in the suburbs. You do have a option to dump her if she don't respect your wishes. Your choice. However keep trying to persuade her that Detroit is not just a city filled with DEAD (C)KRAK HEADS, po'folks, schizoblacks, and mutants. Take her on a tour starting from nicer communities like Downtown, Brush Park, Midtown, Woodbridge Estates, Indian Village, East English Village, Bagley, Mexicantown and Greektown. And hopefully she would change her mind. |
Vas
Member
Username: Vas
Post Number: 784
Registered: 01-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 3:35 pm: | |
Cinder,
Don't be so defensive, you don't have to talk about your committment to your workers, free speech ect...I'm not calling you a bad person. I explained a simple point.
In your second post, you did more of the same-complain and harp on Detroit, giving all sorts of reasons not to move. You are being part of the problem.
The more functioning people living in the city, the more progress that will happen.
This Website is called DetroitYes!
not DetroitNo!
You see, I would agree with you, the Politcans are corrupt, the Police corrupt, city services horrible. But we want that to change. You on a megaphone reminding everyone to stay away because the city is bad.....well that keeps it that way.
Like I said before we are on the front lines, a lot of us have the luxury of not having a family to tie us down. Lets encourage the change, not complain about it. |
Defendbrooklyn
Member
Username: Defendbrooklyn
Post Number: 467
Registered: 11-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 4:35 pm: | |
problem solved....
"Part of your plan hinges on someone wanting to live in your flats. Is the area you are looking to purchase viable for real estate? Right now, nothing is. Take your $150k, and get yourself a real nice house in Ferndale, and keep your eye on Detroit. Chances are your Ferndale property will increase in value before the price of that warehouse does. Take the girlfriend Downtown when you want to go out, see if she warms to the idea. Both the city and your girlfriend need more time. If a few years down the road, things seem more viable, sell the house and buy the warehouse. Or, keep the house and buy the warehouse, but at least you'll be only 20 minutes away while you're working on it." |
Granmontrules
Member
Username: Granmontrules
Post Number: 147
Registered: 01-2007
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 4:47 pm: | |
Wow! I have only been on the forum for a few months and most of Danny's posts are very strange but the one above is actually good and makes almost sense - however, I have no idea what a "schizoblack" is? |
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