Discuss Detroit Hall of Fame Threads DSR Streetcar memories DSR Streetcar memories - 1 Previous Next
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Busterwmu
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Username: Busterwmu

Post Number: 167
Registered: 09-2004
Posted From: 24.247.221.194
Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 8:58 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Next year will be the 50th anniversary of the end of the streetcar era in Detroit, as the last PCC DSR streetcars closed the Woodward Line in 1956. Other late ending lines included Michigan Ave., Gratiot, and E. Jefferson. I have a few photos of these classic Streetcars at work around Detroit which I took from www.davesrailpix.com, which has the largest assortment of online DSR photos. Wayne State's Virtual archive has a few as well. I'm curious to know any memories or any streetcars lines, streetcars themselves or streetcar styles, or anything relating to the DSR of the time. I missed the era entirely by not coming Around for another 30 years, but I've ridden the Toronto system and find the streetcars very interesting.

What's that you say? Do any of the old DSR streetcars still survive? Why YES!

Peter Witt #3876, painted in the later attractive Maroon and Creme DSR scheme. It is at the Ohio Railway Museum, Worthington OH.
http://www.ohiorailwaymuseum.org/museum/images/detroitcar.jpg

Peter Witt #3865, painted in the earlier DSR creme and green colors. It went to the Henry Ford Museum after retirement and underwent a partial renovation before being stored out of sight. The exterior restoration was completed when it was sold to the Illinois Rail Museum in Union, IL in 1998, where it is on display.
http://www.irm.org/pictures/600/3865dsr01.jpg

PCC #268, painted in the attractive PCC version of the Maroon and creme. This is the only surviving PCC from the Detroit fleet, which once numbered 189 President's Conference Committee cars. It went with the rest of the Detroit PCC fleet into service in Mexico City, and was returned to Michigan in the 1990s. It is at the Michigan Transit Museum at Selfridge ANG base in Mt. Clemens.
http://lyttonspccs.homestead.com/263.html

A few photos:
These are courtesy of Dave's Rail Pix:

PCC 156
PCC #156 sports the attractive PCC DSR Maroon-red and cream colors as it navigates through downtown on the Michigan Ave. line

DSR 232
PCC #232 rolls through Downtown on the Woodward line.

DSR3229
This classic Peter Witt streetcar, #3229, is on the Michigan Avenue line as it rolls under the train bridges near Clark Avenue.


PCC #272 is at the lower end of the Woodward line, on Griswald near Atwater. This view shows the small billboards used on the PCCs.

Livernois
A DSR PCC operates past the Senate Theatre on Michigan Avenue at Livernois as it accelerates east into Downtown.


So please, post your thoughts, memories and the like about the old streetcars, the types, the various routes, and things of that sort. Thanks!
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The_rock
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Username: The_rock

Post Number: 964
Registered: 11-2003
Posted From: 68.42.251.225
Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 9:13 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Great shots, busterwmu! PCC#156 was taken showing what I think was the old Majestic Building in the background. That stretches my memory though I sure do recall what PCC #232 looked like, too! I rode 'em both.
jjaba will go bananas when he sees these photos.
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Irish_mafia
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Username: Irish_mafia

Post Number: 256
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 69.218.77.243
Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 9:44 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks Busterwmu.

They were essentially gone by the time I arrived...but I can tell you that they were all heated by heaters from the the Peter Smith Heater company on Mt. Elliot...by a product designed by Peter Smith to keep his father, a trolley driver, warm.
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Broken_main
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Username: Broken_main

Post Number: 437
Registered: 06-2005
Posted From: 198.109.44.2
Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 9:57 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Seeing how i have never seen these things before in Detroit, I must say that it is very interesting to see these buses on tracks...hehehe
please bring them back!!
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Ray1936
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Username: Ray1936

Post Number: 77
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 207.200.116.134
Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 9:58 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Great photos...what a pleasure to see them. Well, this old fart remembers riding the Grand River line in the old Peter Witt streetcars. They had a motorman who "drove" it, and a conductor by the doors in the middle of the car who collected the fares. When the PCC cars came on line, the conductor was eliminated and the standard fare box put in by the motorman.

Then I remember driving my car on the streetcar tracks. Since the tracks were actually lower than the asphalt by a fraction of an inch in most places, the tracks pretty well grabbed the tires and you could take your hands off your steering wheel and go straight as an arrow.

Nice clean smooth rides with no fumes. Too bad there's no place for them any more.........
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Douglasm
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Username: Douglasm

Post Number: 416
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Posted From: 66.189.188.28
Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 10:09 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

There was an interesting article on the history of the PCC car in Trains Illustrated a couple issues ago, talking about its development. Anyone know if Toronto and/or Pittsburgh still have PCC fleets?
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Bertz
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Username: Bertz

Post Number: 452
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Posted From: 68.61.15.89
Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 10:11 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

what is the building behind PCC #232?
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Aiw
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Username: Aiw

Post Number: 5032
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Posted From: 69.156.95.2
Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 10:17 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Majestic Building. Michigan & Woodward.
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Irish_mafia
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Post Number: 259
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Posted From: 69.218.77.243
Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 10:20 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Toronto has something similar to the street cars in Detroit.

Pittsburgh has a rail line that goes from the South Hills above ground, and when it hits the downtown area in the Golden Triangle, it goes below ground as a subway.

It also has two "inclines" that run from the Mt. Washington area down to connect to the other rail (at least one ends up at the connection). Good touristy thing to do there.
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Douglasm
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Post Number: 417
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Posted From: 66.189.188.28
Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 10:22 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Correct my own error.....
....the article on the history of the PCC car is in the Spring 2005 issue of Classic Trains magazine.

Trolleys used to turn around, of course, at the State Fair Grounds (with the DSR Lunch diner). As a special treat, Mom and I would take the streetcar from New Center to the Fair Grounds, then catch a Greyhound transit bus from the stop 50 or so feet north to continue on to Woodward and Lewiston.
Anyone got any pictures of the car barn in Highland Park? Would like to see it from Third (?), across the street from what my mind says was a Kelsey Hayes plant.
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Broken_main
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Username: Broken_main

Post Number: 440
Registered: 06-2005
Posted From: 198.109.44.2
Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 10:28 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hey Ray1936...


quote:

Since the tracks were actually lower than the asphalt by a fraction of an inch in most places, the tracks pretty well grabbed the tires and you could take your hands off your steering wheel and go straight as an arrow.




Living life on the wild side huh??? LOL
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Busterwmu
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Username: Busterwmu

Post Number: 168
Registered: 09-2004
Posted From: 24.247.221.194
Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 10:32 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

This thread already seems to be quite popular, so here are some more photos. I've got even more that I've located from various places, but they will need to be resized. The great thing about these is, not only do they showcase the colorful streetcars of an era gone by, but they show a whole scene, including buildings, people, automobiles, signs and ads, etc. Here's some more.

These are courtesy of the DSR-2-DDOT Yahoo group, and dave's rail pix...

DSR3958
One of the last Peter Witts purchased, car #3958 is shown here servicing the Oakland line northbound on Hastings @ Farnsworth in 1949. Oakland was one of the DSR's shortest, most heavily traveled routes.

PCC244
PCC #244 is bound for the Rouge Plant in this early 1950s photo.

DSR3230A
PETER WITT #3230
One of the first 50 purchased in 1921 by the M.O., car #3230 is seen here during its later years in 1948 with the headlight now moved from the roof to the front dash. Peter Witts ran in Detroit until the early 50's. This Peter Witt is of an earlier design in the series, with the smaller signboard and different roof design.

Peter Witt 3462
Peter Witt #3462, built by McGuire-Cummings in 1923, is seen here servicing the Clairmount line @ Hamilton Ave in 1949.


PCC #102 looks sharp in this late 1940s photo, on the Woodward line operating toward the fairgrounds.

DSR 3616
Peter Witt #3616 was a late survivor on the DSR. The last Peter Witts survived into 1954, and made it into the attractive maroon-red and cream DSR paint scheme. Car #3616, one of 25 cars (#3600-3624) built by St. Louis Car in 1924, is seen here on the NE end of the Baker line, east-bound on Nevada at the Conrail crossing just east of Mt. Elliott in 1948.


Again on the Baker line, in another rare color photo of a late era Peter Witt in the maroon and cream scheme. The last 130 Peter Witts cars (#3851-3980) were built by the St. Louis Car Co. in 1930. This order also helped St. Louis Car from going under. A total of 781 Peter Witts were purchased by 1930, the last twelve retired in 1954 were from this group.
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Broken_main
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Post Number: 443
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Posted From: 198.109.44.2
Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 10:40 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Wow!!! these pics are awesome. You guys are great!!

I am suprised jjaba hasn't chimed in. He is probably too excited to type while reading this wonderful thread.
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Dmb
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Post Number: 168
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Posted From: 69.246.55.57
Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 10:50 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Am I the only one that feels sick just looking at these photos. I swear to god I was born in the wrong decade, because that is the Detroit I want to see. I hope whatever person/people deciced to eliminate this obviously effective mode of transportation from our city is rotting in hell. It really makes me angry to think what Detroit would be like if the DSR was still around today. Call me pessimistic, but I'm 27 and I already am resigned to knowing that I'll never see anything like this in the Detroit of my lifetime.
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Psip
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Username: Psip

Post Number: 514
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Posted From: 69.246.13.131
Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 10:57 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The last run down Woodward.
Last

Inside the DSR Streetcar School
School

WSU
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Broken_main
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Post Number: 445
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Posted From: 198.109.44.2
Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 11:00 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Dmb..i feel your pain. When i was a kid. the DSR had buses on rubber wheels. I have this lifelong love of vehicles on tracks, and I have passed this same love to my boys. Looks like I am going to have to pull out my Lionel Trains circa 1960 and have some nostalgic memories for myself.
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Hornwrecker
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Username: Hornwrecker

Post Number: 473
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Posted From: 66.2.149.57
Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 11:02 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

PCC cars headed to the State Fair grounds for retirement.

DSR last run
WSU/VMC
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Broken_main
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Post Number: 448
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Posted From: 198.109.44.2
Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 11:06 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hornwrecker...Is that Woodward avenue they are on??? It looks funny to NOT see the RENCEN in pictures LOL
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Hornwrecker
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Post Number: 474
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Posted From: 66.2.149.57
Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 11:15 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Woodward, just north of McNichols, about a mile before they turn into the fairgrounds.

I might have an aerial of the Highland Park, DSR car barns, will check.
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Psip
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Post Number: 518
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Posted From: 69.246.13.131
Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 11:18 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Picking up babes on the streetcar
Babes
Check out them gams and Al Capone with the spats


WSU
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Hornwrecker
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Post Number: 475
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Posted From: 66.2.149.57
Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 11:30 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Here is an aerial shot of the DSR carbarns in Highland Park, taken sometime in the 30s. Woodward Ave is towards the top, above that would be the Ford HP factory.

DSR yard Highland Park aerial
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Psip
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Post Number: 520
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Posted From: 69.246.13.131
Posted on Sunday, November 20, 2005 - 11:45 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Here is a picture for Jjaba. Jjaba should recognize the Dexter Davidson intersection. Notice the horse drawn milk wagon. I believe that center divider is for the streetcar stop.
WSU
Dexter Davidson
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Chris_rohn
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Username: Chris_rohn

Post Number: 127
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Posted From: 69.220.60.93
Posted on Monday, November 21, 2005 - 11:51 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

My friend Bob wanted me to let everyone know the Michigan Transit Museum has two PCC cars, one Detroit and one Toronto currently stored at Selfridge Airforce Base. If you're interested in taking a look you can contact Billie Henning, MTM Historian, at billie_h_h@yahoo.com
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Busterwmu
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Post Number: 169
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Posted From: 24.247.221.194
Posted on Monday, November 21, 2005 - 1:40 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

More photos, More photos! I've just been resizing a few more, obtained from davesrailpix, DSR-2-DDOT and WSU.

PCC279
DSR PCC #279 makes the loop at the state fair grounds, the end of the line for Woodward Ave. streetcars. That red and cream paint sure looks good!


Peter Witt #3346 takes on a healthy load of passengers at Capitol Park during the winter of 1948. They will be operating on the 85 line out Grand River and return. (WSU)


Presidents' Conference Committee #181 makes a sharp turn on an afternoon in the early 1950s. 10 points to anyone who can identify this location!


PCC colors streak through downtown as car 123 passes Crawford's Clothiers on Monroe. Today this is the site of the Compuware HQ. It is operating on the Gratiot line, inbound for city hall.

DSR3360
A nice "roster" photo of a DSR Peter Witt, this one happens to be streetcar #3360. The ad on the front panel says "follow the crowd to WALLED LAKE." It was built in 1922 by St. Louis Car, is seen here during its later years working the Clairmount line.

DSR3835
"The Detroiter" car #3835 is shown working the Mt. Elliott line @ McDougall and Mack in its later years. All Witts were repainted cream with black trim during the 1940's. The last remaining Witts were repainted cream with red trim by the early 50's. The front ad on this one is for Pfiffer's.


PCC #102 makes the loop as it services the Michigan Ave. line to the Rouge Plant. Michigan was one of the last four lines in service with streetcars in Detroit, ending streetcar service on September 7, 1955.
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Ray1936
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Post Number: 79
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Posted From: 207.200.116.134
Posted on Monday, November 21, 2005 - 2:06 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Aw, man, those are beautiful! Thanks for the nostalgia trip, Buster.....really good memories. And, yeah, those of you who never experienced the real "Detroit Street Railways" really missed something.
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Lowell
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Username: Lowell

Post Number: 1951
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Posted From: 66.167.210.171
Posted on Monday, November 21, 2005 - 2:06 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Great thread, great posts! Thanks to all for my continuing education about the D.
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Mikeydbn
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Username: Mikeydbn

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Posted From: 35.11.141.32
Posted on Monday, November 21, 2005 - 2:06 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

That location in picture #2 looks like the Wayburn Loop on Jefferson at GP.

wbl
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Bongman
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Post Number: 845
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Posted From: 198.111.56.128
Posted on Monday, November 21, 2005 - 5:05 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

My friend Bob wanted me to let everyone know the Michigan Transit Museum has two PCC cars, one Detroit and one Toronto currently stored at Selfridge Airforce Base. If you're interested in taking a look you can contact Billie Henning, MTM Historian, at billie_h_h@yahoo.com
------------------------------ ------------------

Whew...get ready for a shocker there.
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Eric_c
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Username: Eric_c

Post Number: 505
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Posted From: 68.248.42.251
Posted on Tuesday, November 22, 2005 - 1:51 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Enough! Bring 'em back and everything will return to normal!
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Mikem
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Posted From: 68.43.15.105
Posted on Tuesday, November 22, 2005 - 1:52 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The streetcars were before my time. My mother split her childhood between the Woodmere area and Redford. Going back and forth to Woodmere, she took either the Springwells or Baker Line, I can't remember which, except that it took forever and was constantly making turns as it zig-zagged across the southwest side. Eventually the line got what she called "streamlined" cars which felt like you were riding on air.

In her late teenage years and early twenties, she worked at Hudson's and Booth Newspapers in the Buhl, and lived near Grand River and 7 Mile. Getting out of work at the end of the day, she would find the Grand River cars jammed with commuters. To avoid waiting for several cars to pass by before she could find a space on one, she would walk down closer to the river to get on a car near the start of its run. Many times it would be standing room only until she got west of Grand Boulevard or Livernois or Oakman. It was hot all the time, summer and winter, and everyone had b.o. from sweating. In the summer she would get nauseous from the heat and the constant starting and stopping, so she would hop off along the way, walk a several blocks to get fresh air, then hop on the next car. The commute took at least an hour and she remembers being envious of her boss, one of the Booth brothers, who could afford to live close by; Boston-Edison or Indian Village, and would be home in ten minutes.

If you're really interested in the history of the streetcars, find the three-volume set of books called "Detroit's Street Railways" by Jack Schramm and William Henning. Each volume is packed with pictures, maps, rosters, etc. Volume 1 covers the years 1863-1922; Volume 2, 1922-1956; and Volume 3 covers the interurban system.
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Bobj
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Posted on Tuesday, November 22, 2005 - 2:10 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I don't really have any memory of seeing streetcars, but the pictures are wonderful to look at and wonder why things changed.

My Grandfather was a conductor on streetcars, he never said much about it, but must have liked it, he did it for 40years
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Mikem
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Posted on Tuesday, November 22, 2005 - 2:15 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I really slaughtered these, but they were difficult to scan. A list of routes from 1921 - try driving one:







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Psip
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Post Number: 527
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Posted on Tuesday, November 22, 2005 - 2:21 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

WOW just WOW.
It looks as if you could get almost anywhere on a streetcar.
No wonder the auto companys wanted them dead.
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Swpablo
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Posted From: 69.212.37.219
Posted on Tuesday, November 22, 2005 - 10:08 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

they have been ripping up tracks on michigan avenue lately for the reconstruction. just a couple of weeks ago i saw twisted rails they dug up and thought about how the auto industry really screwed detroiters out of public transportation. more cars! more cars!
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Busterwmu
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Posted on Wednesday, November 23, 2005 - 12:09 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

MikeyDBN gets 10 points for some strange reason :-P Yes, up there a ways PCC #181 is turning sharp on the WAYBURN LOOP at the east end of the Jefferson Line at the border with Grosse Pointe. It still serves as a DDOT turnaround for route #25, E. Jefferson, and the rails are still showing through, though not as much as in Mikey's photo since they put down more asphalt.
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Hornwrecker
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Posted on Wednesday, November 23, 2005 - 12:54 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

For you oldtimers that don't take a cotton to that new-fangled electricity, here's Old Paint on the Fort Wayne to Elmwood, oat powered, street railway.

Old DSR
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Jjaba
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Post Number: 2769
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Posted From: 24.22.82.162
Posted on Wednesday, November 23, 2005 - 4:24 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

jjaba is so impressed with this thread.

He rode the Oakman, the Grand River, Trumbull, Michigan Ave., and Woodward lines.

The Ex-cello plant was near the Manchester Yards in Highland Park. Kelsey Hayes may have been there too. Holley Carbeurator and Sanders Bakery on Oakman.

North of Six Mile Road, the Woodward cars sped up on the median. There were fewer stops out there.

The Grand River streetcars were replaced by the "feeder" buses. They were sleek electrics.

A fine collection of PCCs and others is on the Market Street line in San Francisco, running from Castro St. to Bay Street, Fisherman's Wharf. They have kept the original colors. The motormen allow no food to keep them nice. The cars have come from many cities, USA, Italy, and others.

Portland, Oregon has a new set of Czech Skoda cars
running from the Willamette River up SW 10th into NW 23rd St. area. It is very popular and Portland doens't have conductors so everybody rides for free. The line is expanding yearly.

jjaba at the Manchester Yards waiting for the Oakman.
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Hornwrecker
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Posted From: 66.2.148.45
Posted on Wednesday, November 23, 2005 - 10:56 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

This is from a DSR safety demonstration, maybe on Woodward, from sometime in the 1920s.




LOC/DPC
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Psip
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Post Number: 532
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Posted on Thursday, November 24, 2005 - 3:42 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The Car Barn at Woodward and Manchester
Highland Park

1949
1949

1952
1952


1956
1956

1961
1961

Today
Today
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Hornwrecker
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Posted From: 66.2.148.130
Posted on Thursday, December 08, 2005 - 11:41 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)



Jjaba and Rock synchronise watches so they can nip out for a quick Goebel's before the PCC trip leaves.
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Douglasm
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Posted on Thursday, December 08, 2005 - 11:57 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

jjaba is correct, and I was mistaken. It was the Ex-Cello plant across Second from the carbarns.

Homewrecker....
....you have any idea who the two gents were along with the motorman on the MRRC fantrip?
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Jjaba
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Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 2:38 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yes, Ex-Cello made the machines which produced the cardboard milk containers. This was a marvel since glass bottles were in use until then. Their same basic designs are still used today, with some obvious modification. They had a huge sign in the Manchester Yards as jjaba recalls.

jjaba, waiting for the Oakman car on a bonechilling day like today.
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Psip
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Post Number: 619
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Posted From: 69.246.13.131
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 2:47 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Like this one?
Wilson Milk
WSU

At Cass and Temple... notice the old style flat top container.

(Message edited by Psip on December 09, 2005)
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623kraw
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Posted From: 68.41.224.200
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 10:43 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Amazing thread - this is what the forum is all about. I missed the streetcars by one year - CRAP!!
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Jjaba
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Post Number: 2864
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Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 2:50 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Psip hits the target with his Wilson's Sta-Fresh milk carton. Wilsons was a fine dairy with retail outlets and soda fountains. jjaba rode his bike out to the one at W. Outer Drive and James Cousins, 1954. It was on the corner of one of Detroit's most beautiful intersections. That corner is now obliterated by the John C. Lodge Expressway.
jjaba, Proudly Westside.
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Psip
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Post Number: 620
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Posted From: 69.246.13.131
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 3:06 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Background:
In 1934 Ex-Cell-O Corporation, a Detroit-based automobile machinery manufacturing company, acquired the rights to manufacture and distribute the Pure-Pack system. Ex-Cell-O introduced the tab on the side of the gable that could be lifted for pouring out. Prior to the tab, the cartons had to be cut open with a knife to pore the milk. The modern opening and pouring spout did not appear until the 1960s. The first Ex-Cell-O Pure-PaK filling machines were installed in 1936 at Border Dairies, New York.
In 1959 Ex-Cell-O introduced a laminating process to eliminate the dip in the wax to proof the paperboards. Today most of the milk and beverage cartons are formed out of polyethylene-laminated boards. The paperboard is sandwiched with a thin inner and outer layer of polyethylene. For use with fresh products, the carton is generally made out of 89% paper and approximately 11% polyethylene.

Old Style Carton
GIS

Milk
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Jjaba
Member
Username: Jjaba

Post Number: 2866
Registered: 11-2003
Posted From: 24.22.82.162
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 3:51 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Psip scores big again with this photo and discussion. Your scholarship and photos are wonderful.
jjaba, Waiting in the Manchester Yards by the Ex-cello Plant for the Oakman car (just got a big-boy haircut at Hudsons and rode the PCC car out Woodward to Highland Park.)
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Hornwrecker
Member
Username: Hornwrecker

Post Number: 532
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 216.203.223.96
Posted on Friday, December 09, 2005 - 11:54 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I don't have a clue who those two gents are, Douglasm.

Here's the other one from that trip, somewhat younger railfans.

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Douglasm
Member
Username: Douglasm

Post Number: 431
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 66.189.188.28
Posted on Saturday, December 10, 2005 - 12:20 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Lord, it's going to be 50 years? Mom, Dad, myself and Grandmother Miller stood at the corner of Woodward and Farrend (Grandma lived at 11 Farrand...am I spelling that right?) and watched the PCC cars parade down Woodward for the last time....
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Hornwrecker
Member
Username: Hornwrecker

Post Number: 540
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 66.2.149.5
Posted on Monday, December 12, 2005 - 7:02 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Just so the Eastsiders don't feel neglected, here's the DSR carbarns at Kercheval near Conner. Although I'm too young, by a couple of years, to remember seeing the streetcars, I do remember this place standing abandoned for many years. I think Mikem's got a lot more info on these.

DSR Kercheval carbarns

Taken from an aerial photo (WSU) of the auto plants on Jefferson and Conner.