  Hardhat Member Username: Hardhat Post Number: 151 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.73.4.227 |
From the Freep: Once home to Lindell AC sports bar, vacant building to be razed for Rosa Parks Transit Center June 27, 2006 By JOHN GALLAGHER By JOHN GALLAGHER The city’s Economic Development Corp., a quasi-public authority, approved a contract worth $193,400 with Homrich Inc., a Carleton, Mich.-based contractor, to handle the demolition work. Both the Lindell AC building at 1300-1320 Cass Ave. and a structure at 350 Michigan Ave. will be razed. In their place, the city will soon begin construction its new downtown bus terminal, named for the famed civil rights pioneer who died last year. One of Detroit’s best-known sports bars, the Lindell AC opened in 1949 under owner John Butsicaris, who claimed for it the title of America’s first sports bar. But age and declining business closed the Lindell AC in late 2002. A few months later, Butsicaris’s son, Mel, announced plans to reopen in a larger space in the 1001 Woodward building. But those plans went nowhere and the bar remains just a memory at this point. | ||
Rbdetsport Member Username: Rbdetsport Post Number: 124 Registered: 11-2005 Posted From: 68.61.11.146 |
Do u have a link? | ||
Hardhat Member Username: Hardhat Post Number: 152 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.73.4.227 |
http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs .dll/article?AID=/20060627/NEW S11/60627003/1013 | ||
Rjlj Member Username: Rjlj Post Number: 83 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 63.171.81.130 |
This is great news that will help to get things moving in Capitol Park. | ||
Itsjeff Member Username: Itsjeff Post Number: 6181 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 208.27.111.125 |
Yes, although you cite the Freep and credit John Gallagher, I can't begin to comprehend where this article may have come from. | ||
Hardhat Member Username: Hardhat Post Number: 153 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.73.4.227 |
Where did this article come from? Uhhh... the Detroit Free Press website, which employs staff writer John Gallagher? | ||
Designut Member Username: Designut Post Number: 17 Registered: 05-2006 Posted From: 65.123.68.93 |
My thoughts exactly Rjlj...I think Capitol park will benefit greatly from the move (given some time of course) | ||
Ndavies Member Username: Ndavies Post Number: 1962 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 129.9.163.234 |
It'sjeff, It was in the 10:46 web update. It will appear in the print version tomorrow. (Unless they can figure out how to update the print version before then.  ) | ||
Detourdetroit Member Username: Detourdetroit Post Number: 221 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 205.188.116.137 |
I am a transit advocate to the core, and I am largely supportive of the RP Transit Center, minus the siting, temporary nature of the structure and further erosion of the urban streetwall architecture along Michigan Avenue. It saddens me whenever anything viable gets lost to the upstanding non-citizen demolishers at Homrich...I'm interested to know what 19th Century facade and bones is behind the mural at 350 Michigan. Isn't the DEGC pissed off at them for their bang up job at the Statler in the days leading up to SBXL? | ||
Supersport Member Username: Supersport Post Number: 10233 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 64.118.137.226 |
What is this "print" version you speak of? Is it free too? | ||
Ray1936 Member Username: Ray1936 Post Number: 658 Registered: 01-2005 Posted From: 207.200.116.139 |
Interesting responses so far in this thread. Several "hoorah for transportation", but no tears for the Lindell. I miss that place dearly. The best meal in all the world was a cheeseboiger, fries, and a Bud from the Lindell. And no telling who you were going to run in to. I agree, hooray for transportation advances, but I still shed a big crocodile tear for Jimmy and Johnny's place.  | ||
Corktownmark Member Username: Corktownmark Post Number: 195 Registered: 12-2004 Posted From: 141.217.12.135 |
Can't say anything new on the value of the building (it is ugly now). but this IS a great location for transit anyway. It is across the street from people mover station. This corner and also further up and down Michigan are always busy bus stops. Here is hoping some folks can transfer or catch a bus and stay out of the weather too. | ||
Jjaba Member Username: Jjaba Post Number: 3998 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 67.171.136.201 |
Rosa Parks deserves a bus station. Detroit is only about 50 yrs. behind so many cities in the creation of centralized, coordinated, transit malls, and terminals. Finally, a transit station in Detroit. jjaba. | ||
Mccarch Member Username: Mccarch Post Number: 72 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 70.227.206.90 |
You people live in a virtual dream-world. There is no need for a centralized bus terminal, outside the minds of transit pimps with Master degrees. This is just an example of how it's easier to fund and build a building (after, of course, finding the only site in downtown Detroit that still has existing buildings on it) rather than improve the operations of the bus system. The latter is HARD. (BTW, this is similar to the new Greyhound terminal at Fort & Eighth Streets. They tore down the existing warehouse building quick enough; now the site sits empty). Just as a point of discussion, when was the last time any posters on this thread A) took a City of Detroit bus, and/or B) took a SEMTA bus? | ||
Spacemonkey Member Username: Spacemonkey Post Number: 59 Registered: 03-2006 Posted From: 63.102.87.27 |
I will miss the Lindell A.C. I used to live across the street at the Ramada/Leland hotel and would go to the Lindell for drinks and to talk to the bartender about the old days and stuff. Great sports history. Good hamburgers too. | ||
Kova Member Username: Kova Post Number: 28 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 63.77.247.130 |
Lindell AC was over rated, kinda of like Miller's is in West Dearborn | ||
Jams Member Username: Jams Post Number: 3470 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 70.227.220.104 |
Mccarch, As is my daily routine, in about an hour I'll walk to my corner, board the #48 Lafayette-VanDyke bus to Capital Park where I will transfer to the #19 Fort Street line. Get off at Green and walk 3 blocks to my job. At the end of my shift, I'll walk across the street to catch the 9:05 #30 Livernois to Fort Street and transfer to the #19 Fort Street line or I'll wait for the 9:24 #125 SMART bus straight through to Downtown. AND yes, as a daily rider we need a more efficient transit center than Capital Park. While you're looking for the closest parking space for your vehicle, take a look around at all the people that depend on and use the transit system daily, despite all its failings. | ||
Designut Member Username: Designut Post Number: 23 Registered: 05-2006 Posted From: 65.123.68.93 |
Kova - sidenote: millers is not over rated it is and always will be literally the best burger in SE MI and maybe even the world carry on... | ||
Jams Member Username: Jams Post Number: 3471 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 70.227.220.104 |
BTW it costs me only $3.50 a day to my destination and back. OK, $5.00 + cost of beers if I decide to meet up with friends Downtown instead of going straight home. | ||
Mccarch Member Username: Mccarch Post Number: 73 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 70.227.206.90 |
Jams, As a DOT user, you have the right of way here to opine what is needed and not needed. But I would think that the money proposed for this terminal would be better spent on bus operations. Just to get the buses to run on schedule would seem a better goal. | ||
Hamtramck_steve Member Username: Hamtramck_steve Post Number: 3043 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 136.181.195.17 |
We've known this was coming down since it closed. There was a raging debate on here about how the Lindell would NOT be razed for the transit center. IIRC our then-resident insider led that charge. The story was that a nightclub would open in the Lindell building. | ||
Jjaba Member Username: Jjaba Post Number: 4004 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 67.171.136.201 |
As you know, in future tense, this Forum is full of mis-information. That's why we invoke Skipper's Rules. Believe it when you see for your own damn self. jjaba. ps. Jams, spell it CAPITOL PARK. | ||
Jsmyers Member Username: Jsmyers Post Number: 1782 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 209.131.7.68 |
As a "transit pimp with a Master degree" (and engineering degree), a occassional DDOT and SMART user, and someome who was transit dependant living in another city, I can tell you that building a better transfer system can help get the buses to run on schedule. BTW - The fact that education is looked at as a bad thing is a big part of this state's problems. (Message edited by jsmyers on June 27, 2006) | ||
Toledolaw05 Member Username: Toledolaw05 Post Number: 19 Registered: 04-2006 Posted From: 72.240.58.198 |
any links or pictures as to what it will look like | ||
E_hemingway Member Username: E_hemingway Post Number: 795 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 69.242.215.8 |
http://modeldmedia.com/feature s/transform50.aspx | ||
Dang Member Username: Dang Post Number: 43 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 69.212.54.179 |
If a bus terminal can help the "public urination" epidemic downtown, I welcome it with open arms. With thousands of people passing through one neighborhood with NO bathrooms... the alleys are just REEKING with the stench of urine. It even smells worse when it RAINS. I'm sick of holding my breath (both literally and figuratively.) Bring on the pottys! | ||
Mccarch Member Username: Mccarch Post Number: 74 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 70.227.206.90 |
Is something wrong with the present transfer system? Do we need to build a suburban-style barn where buses pull into "slots" to be boarded by automaton riders? What's wrong with catching a bus on the street? Yes, I know it rains and it snows; but on the other hand, if you're in the skylighted, heated and air-conditioned bliss of Somerset Mall, you wouldn't be bothered by any yucky nature stuff. What's wrong with pretending Detroit is a city with real "street life"? I actually think Capitol Park functions quite well as a spot to wait for the bus. On the other hand, I've had to go the the Greyhound Terminal a couple of times in the past months to pick up a relative, and it was a dreadful experience. | ||
E_hemingway Member Username: E_hemingway Post Number: 796 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 69.242.215.8 |
What world are you living in? | ||
Dang Member Username: Dang Post Number: 44 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 69.212.54.179 |
I lived above Capitol Park for two years. It smells like urine and there are frequent occurances where the cops have to be brought in for one reason or another. It's total bullshi+. | ||
Mccarch Member Username: Mccarch Post Number: 75 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 70.227.206.90 |
I said: "Capitol Park functions quite well as a spot to wait for the bus." You're complaining about the actions of the people in Capitol Park, some who are waiting for the bus and some who aren't. What are these people going to do if a new "Transit Center" is built? Will they relocate? Will their behavior improve with a new fabric roof? Will their behavior improve because the Transit Center has 24 hour, supervised rest rooms (I'm not holding my breath)? We can use some common sense here. I repeat: functionally, Capital Park works well as a spot to wait for the bus. | ||
E_hemingway Member Username: E_hemingway Post Number: 797 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 69.242.215.8 |
No, no it doesn't. It was designed to be a park, a small urban park at that, not a bus depot. It was built as a temporary bus stop. It's too small and too cramped. Not enough places to sit. Not enough shelter during inclement weather. No bathrooms, drinking fountains, or a place to wash up. It's also confusing. Do I wait for my bus at one of the places in the park or on Shelby Street near Michigan? Capitol Park wasn't designed for the type of bus traffic it handles and suffers because of it. | ||
Danindc Member Username: Danindc Post Number: 1583 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.100.158.10 |
Actually, jjaba, until about 4 years ago, Cadillac Square served this function. Then the City of Detroit decided such a location was too centralized, and that people relegated to riding the bus might be offensive to the people the City hoped to attract downtown. Hence, the temporary move to nice, out-of-the-way Capitol Park. | ||
Mccarch Member Username: Mccarch Post Number: 76 Registered: 12-2003 Posted From: 70.227.206.90 |
Capitol Park is not a "temporary" bus stop. It's been a bus stop for at least 75 years. I think it used to be the west-side bus stop, more or less, just as Cadillac Square was the east side bus stop, more or less. Were any of the Cadillac Square termini moved to Capitol Park, or were they just farmed out to various downtown streets? | ||
Detourdetroit Member Username: Detourdetroit Post Number: 222 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 205.188.116.137 |
#16 Dexter and #53 Woodward are my good friends. The bus and I (and my wife) do round trips 3-5 times per week. go figure. the worst part about Campus Martius was that they didn't build it in anticipation of a subway. they'll just have to tear it up again in a few years ;) | ||
Rbdetsport Member Username: Rbdetsport Post Number: 126 Registered: 11-2005 Posted From: 68.61.11.146 |
I wish that a subway could be put in just in Downtown. When the subways reach less dense areas or just areas outside of downtown, they come up onto the street surface as light rail. Kind of like Boston's system, except Boston has a more extensive system. The main terminal should be under Campus Martius. | ||
Focusonthed Member Username: Focusonthed Post Number: 309 Registered: 02-2006 Posted From: 209.220.229.254 |
The cost to build a subway today would be astronomical. I wish, but there's no way. | ||
Jams Member Username: Jams Post Number: 3472 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 68.73.6.244 |
Obviously, you're not a frequent bus rider. I agree with E_hemingway's assessment. No signs so the novice can find where the bus needed may be boarded, so you run from bus to bus as they pull up to find the bus you need until you learn where the various routes start and that is not guaranteed, the Fort Street for two days this week loaded a block away from the usual spot. No system maps available to determine the route you need. A limited number of schedules at the store across the street, since the kiosk was closed. Generally, no Ddot employees available to ask to get answers from. The Royal Oak Transit Center, while not anywhere near perfect, is light-years ahead of Capital Park as a transfer point. Mccarch, I really do not understand your opposition to an efficient transit center. A place to be able to get a monthly pass, a schedule, information about routes, a restroom or a drinking fountain, a place of shelter during inclement weather while waiting to transfer to another line unless ......you think bus riders are subhumans who deserve nothing better than gruel and rainwater when they can find it. | ||
Lilpup Member Username: Lilpup Post Number: 1129 Registered: 06-2004 Posted From: 69.130.18.100 |
transit centers also get the busses out of the way of other street traffic Ann Arbor has one that accomodates most of the routes leaving typically only two or three busses at in-street curbside stops during the busiest times | ||
Gumby Member Username: Gumby Post Number: 1299 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 68.60.143.186 |
Flint has a pretty good downtown transit center, so it is not just a suburban thing. It is currently closed due to 6 million in renovations but it helps to keep Flints bus system running rather smoothly. I just wish the bus came to Swartz Creek where I live so I wouldn't have to drive everywhere I go. |
