  Milwaukee Member Username: Milwaukee Post Number: 1 Registered: 08-2006 Posted From: 69.95.237.8 |
Could anybody tell me anything about Pontiac? I know it's not really Detroit, but I saw that Pontiac State Hospital tour and it got me interested | ||
Ndavies Member Username: Ndavies Post Number: 2098 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 129.9.163.105 |
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/P ontiac%2C_MI | ||
Milwaukee Member Username: Milwaukee Post Number: 2 Registered: 08-2006 Posted From: 69.95.237.132 |
Thanks for the site. Is Pontiac in as poor a state as Detroit? Is Pontiac a wealthy city or is it like a poor pocket in a rich area? | ||
Ndavies Member Username: Ndavies Post Number: 2099 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 129.9.163.105 |
Not quite as bad as Detroit. It's a very poor city in a very rich county. | ||
56packman Member Username: 56packman Post Number: 536 Registered: 12-2005 Posted From: 129.9.163.105 |
Grosse Pointe has the E.Jeff ghettohood next door, Bloomfield Hills has Pontiac. Proof positive that it ain't a perfect world. | ||
Milwaukee Member Username: Milwaukee Post Number: 3 Registered: 08-2006 Posted From: 69.95.235.15 |
Is Pontiac a good city for nice architecture or is it a relatively bland city? Does it have that same abandonment problem that Detroit has? | ||
Treelock Member Username: Treelock Post Number: 149 Registered: 03-2005 Posted From: 24.192.27.161 |
Pontiac is every bit in the same dire straits as Detroit and may be even worse, since there is probably less momentum for rebirth. The city is struggling with a budget deficit of between $50 million and $60 million, which doesn't sound as bad as Detroit's until you consider it doesn't have 10% of the population and is burdened by the fact that a much greater share of its budget is eaten up by police and firefighters. Many of the city's core neighborhoods are quite rough — Unity Park and the Baldwin corridor being perhaps the best examples. You see lots of boarded-up homes here and, yes, abandonment. Unemployment is sky high, the schools are physically delapidating and are a mess and the downtown struggles constantly to attract tenants and foot traffic. Proportionately, the downtown, which still has potential, suffered to a far greater degree than Detroit's from numerous ill-conceived decisions, many made during the fabled "urban renewal" movement. Photo records indicate that literally a third (if not more) of the historic downtown was demolished years ago in favor of a massive parking garage — the Phoenix Plaza, which today barricades the downtown from motorists approaching up Woodward — and a pair of modern high-rises built for GM that are currently empty. Much of what was lost was gorgeous architecturally, especially the old Oakland County courthouse that sat at the corner of Huron and Saginaw streets that is today a surface parking lot. Urban planners will also tell you the state made a huge mistake looping Woodward around the downtown, diverting traffic away and exposing the less sightly backs of buildings and alleys to drivers. There are still some fine examples of architecture, however. Check out the Indian Village neighborhood south of Huron (M-59) and east of Telegraph for its fine housing stock or downtown buildings like the tall gothic high-rise that I believe is referred to as the Pontiac State Bank building or the Masonic Temple on Lafayette. There has been some new housing construction in the city and the bars and clubs fill up on weekend (and some week) nights, and those are undoubtedly positive things. But the downtown is pretty small and is comprised half of vast parking lots, and the demand for loft housing, office space or trendy bars and eateries that is transforming many a structure in the D appears tepid in the Oakland County seat — a surprise, given the fact the city is surrounded by relative affluence. | ||
Milwaukee Member Username: Milwaukee Post Number: 13 Registered: 08-2006 Posted From: 69.95.237.179 |
Thanks for the details about Pontiac. I didn't really know anything about it, so that really helps. | ||
Itsjeff Member Username: Itsjeff Post Number: 6644 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 208.27.111.125 |
https://www.atdetroit.net/forum/mes sages/18968/19998.html | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 2020 Registered: 02-2005 Posted From: 68.248.5.45 |
But 56packman, having the D next door gives GPers a lot more streetcred than Oaklanders could ever have haha. | ||
Tkshreve Member Username: Tkshreve Post Number: 6 Registered: 07-2006 Posted From: 12.32.128.68 |
Yes, GPers do tolerate a rougher neighbor thaN Oaklanders do. Contrary, GP police patrol that border like a war front in early 20th century europe. edited for typo (Message edited by Tkshreve on August 17, 2006) | ||
Morena Member Username: Morena Post Number: 480 Registered: 08-2004 Posted From: 216.45.2.138 |
Don't they teach you Michigan geography at your middle school? | ||
The_rock Member Username: The_rock Post Number: 1361 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 68.42.251.225 |
Pontiac was a wonderful city during the '40-'60's, Great movie houses ( The Strand, The Oakland, Orpheum, State etc), hugh Kresge's at the SE corner of Saginaw and Huron, Tasker's Hobby store down the street we could see Lionel trains go round and round and watch hampsters at the same time, neat old train station where you boarded the Grand Trunk for Detroit, the old court house downtown where my Grandfather was on the bench as both a probate and then a circuit court judge,and the grandparents home on Franklin Blvd. Several Victorian homes, 2 reliable hospitals, sporting events at Wisner stadium ( still in operation as far as I know), wonderful open-air market where Pontiac Osteopathic Hospital now sits. The list goes on and on. | ||
Irish_mafia Member Username: Irish_mafia Post Number: 594 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 70.227.219.108 |
QUOTE: "Yes, GPers do tolerate a rougher neighbor that Oaklanders do. Contrary, GP police patrol that border like a war front in early 20th century europe." ______________________________ ___________________ As well they should! Irish (from the edge of the DMZ) | ||
Darwinism Member Username: Darwinism Post Number: 548 Registered: 06-2005 Posted From: 69.209.147.170 |
https://www.atdetroit.net/forum/mes sages/36206/48738.html There are some great pictures from itsjeff and krawlspace. | ||
Hysteria Member Username: Hysteria Post Number: 1147 Registered: 02-2006 Posted From: 152.163.100.8 |
That was a great thread ^ ^ ^. Pontiac has a lot of potential and I hope the rejuvenation of the greater downtown area continues to be successful. I am glad Milwaukee started this thread because I wanted to learn more too. (Message edited by HYSTERIA on August 17, 2006) | ||
Miketoronto Member Username: Miketoronto Post Number: 259 Registered: 07-2004 Posted From: 207.61.38.86 |
When I went through Pontiac the downtown did not look that bad at all. Looked kidna trendy actually. Not as bad as people are making it out to be. | ||
Hysteria Member Username: Hysteria Post Number: 1160 Registered: 02-2006 Posted From: 216.223.168.132 |
I'm looking forward to seeing it too next time I'm around. | ||
30th_street Member Username: 30th_street Post Number: 40 Registered: 04-2006 Posted From: 152.163.100.8 |
Pontiac is the most horrible place I have had the displeasure of spending time in. Country folk trying to live the city life. A city that is rife with corruption. One big cesspool pool of shady lazy seedy folks. It is a shame that the Arts, Beats, and Eats festival is held there. I would take any of the worse neighborhoods in Detroit over Ponticrack. And I grew up in Detroit, in a bad neighborhood. When I was in Pontiac I used to just laugh at all the wannabe bad asses I would encounter. Those country ghetto bumpkins couldn't last an hour on any street in Southwest Detroit. Now there are some great old homes and building in the downtown area. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4175 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.177.81.18 |
I hear all these doom and glood stories on Pontiac, but Pontiac has something that Detroit would kill for, a large enough influx in Hispanic population to plug the population loss. It's the same thing that saved Chicago from its outward population loss over the 90's, and revitalized many of its neighborhoods. | ||
Yaktown Member Username: Yaktown Post Number: 12 Registered: 02-2006 Posted From: 69.216.97.108 |
Hey 30th_street...when you're done with that broad brush of yours, I need some things painted at home. Home being Pontiac. | ||
Yaktown Member Username: Yaktown Post Number: 13 Registered: 02-2006 Posted From: 69.216.97.108 |
Itsjeff, nice pics of the city. Sometimes I take it for granted. I drive right by the Pontiac Paint store every morning on my way to work. I have seen a lot of the old architecture and I love the Seminole Hills neighborhood. I wish I could afford it! And as much as I love cemeteries, I've never been in Oak Hill. Next time my g-f comes over, we'll go explore for the day. | ||
The_rock Member Username: The_rock Post Number: 1367 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 68.42.251.225 |
Yaktown--OakHill cemetery is worth a visit. We have about 5 generations of family members buried there on both sides of University Drive. The cemetery dates back to about 1820. ItsJeff and krawlspace are avid Pontiac supporters. The old town could use more like them. So hang in there for dear old Pontiac! | ||
Hysteria Member Username: Hysteria Post Number: 1162 Registered: 02-2006 Posted From: 64.12.116.204 |
What is a country ghetto bumpkin? Just curious. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4181 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.177.81.18 |
Those that live in ghettos of smaller cities. There often is a difference. | ||
Hysteria Member Username: Hysteria Post Number: 1175 Registered: 02-2006 Posted From: 64.12.116.204 |
Is this a knock at poor Southern and/or Appalachian whites living in these 'smaller' cities? I mean the words ghetto and country bumpkin just don't seem to fit, IMO. | ||
Erikto Member Username: Erikto Post Number: 418 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 64.228.108.98 |
I saw P-Funk in Pontiac a few years ago at the afore mentioned festival, and had a really good time. That downtown strip seemed to be all there was of the city centre. I walked around for a while outside downtown and it didn't look as bad as some Detroit neighbourhoods I've been in. In fact, we were oblivious to Pontiac's negative image; maybe I didn't venture far enough from the centre of town. I saw some burnt out houses, but it didn't seem as grim as some have portrayed it here. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4189 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.177.81.18 |
No, Hysteria. No, any if he was, why would it be any worse them him maligning blacks in smaller urban areas? Let's just drop it, already. | ||
Missnmich Member Username: Missnmich Post Number: 540 Registered: 11-2004 Posted From: 24.32.180.75 |
Like Lansing? | ||
Itsjeff Member Username: Itsjeff Post Number: 6658 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 69.136.149.133 |
Towards the end of the thread that Darwinism linked, https://www.atdetroit.net/forum/messages/36206/48738.html , I wrote why downtown Pontiac is cut in half, with the original buildings on the north end and Phoenix Plaza to the south. (It was actually an academic exercise by the U of D Architecture School that somehow got adopted by the City.) I found this pic on Virtual Motor City showing an early design of the plan.  It looks like the original scheme didn't include any of the original downtown buildings - the proposal was to raze everything, including the 30 North building and Oakland Town Center. (I couldn't find any sites of it on the net, but Dfunk has some great closeups here. Detroitpix also has some nice downtown shots here. The idea of razing an entire downtown in favor of new buildings speaks volumes about where architecture was in the 1960s. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4190 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.177.81.18 |
Yes, Missnmich, like Lansing, Flint, Grand Rapids, Battle Creek...these cities are on scales lower than Detroit in terms of the development of street/inner-city culture. | ||
Milwaukee Member Username: Milwaukee Post Number: 23 Registered: 08-2006 Posted From: 69.95.232.196 |
What is Lansing like? | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4191 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.177.81.18 |
Man, you sure are inquisitive: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L ansing,_MI At risk of hijacking more threads, I suggest you just start using wikipedia or simply using a general internet search for these general, open-ended questions. (Message edited by lmichigan on August 20, 2006) | ||
Jerome81 Member Username: Jerome81 Post Number: 1071 Registered: 11-2003 Posted From: 64.142.86.133 |
Never been to Pontiac in all the times I visited and lived in the area. That is until my GF started working at the hospital on Huron just west of downtown. Haven't spent much time, but just on looks, it doesn't seem much to talk about. But the GF goes out and has fun. I won't bad mouth it. I suppose I feel for it more than Detroit. Detroit will always be the center, the focus. It has the chance for rebirth. Pontiac, it just isn't gonna get that. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4197 Registered: 10-2003 Posted From: 67.177.81.18 |
What Pontiac does have going for it, however, is that it's population loss has slowed down to almost a trickle (if not even reversed), and it's still the county seat of one of the wealthiest counties in America. I think it's already hit rock bottom. |
