  Darwinism Member Username: Darwinism Post Number: 566 Registered: 06-2005 |
http://www.detnews.com/apps/pb cs.dll/article?AID=/20061030/O PINION01/610300333/1008 I have wondered about the claims in certain municipalities about budget shortages and needing to cut back on the squad. Well, seems like we sure don't see any less incognito officers nailing folks for a 'rolling stop'. What a joke ! | ||
Itsjeff Member Username: Itsjeff Post Number: 7066 Registered: 10-2003 |
This conundrum was solved beautifully in Detroit by not addressing either issue. | ||
Gannon Member Username: Gannon Post Number: 6975 Registered: 12-2003 |
I'm going to search the archives for the FIRST time I warned everyone that since EVERY level of government had revenue issues that we should all start obeying the speed limit to the digit or else suffer this 'driving tax'. No brainer, amazing that it took them so long to initiate programs like this. Even LESS brainy was getting caught in the Dearborn Heights speed trap that I knew existed on the service drive of southbound Southfield Fwy at the westbound I-94 interchange...about three months after I first posted my warning. | ||
Lilpup Member Username: Lilpup Post Number: 1446 Registered: 06-2004 |
on the other hand a recent traffic stop in one suburb yielded an arrest on an outstanding drug dealing warrant... | ||
Yvette248 Member Username: Yvette248 Post Number: 50 Registered: 10-2006 |
Or how about the $20 ticket issued 30 seconds after the parking meter expired. Multiply that by 1,000 times per day and that should pay for a couple of people at least. | ||
Lilpup Member Username: Lilpup Post Number: 1447 Registered: 06-2004 |
only if it gets collected | ||
The_nerd Member Username: The_nerd Post Number: 316 Registered: 12-2003 |
Just be happy that Michigan doesn't use speed and red light cameras. One of those things in Cleveland issued more tickets in a month, than the entire police force did last year. The city is making millions at $200 per speeding violation and $100 for running a red light. | ||
Aarne_frobom Member Username: Aarne_frobom Post Number: 39 Registered: 10-2005 |
Drivers victimized by suburban speed traps after this Thursday should be aware that Michigan speed-limit law changes on Nov. 9, 2006. After Thursday, all "prima facie" speed limits (which applies on most city streets) can only be set at less than 55 mph in one of three ways: 1) Most "prima facie" limits will have to be changed to comply with a table of the frequency of driveways and intersections. This table requires realistic speed limits, or in other words, at least 10 mph faster than what is usually posted. This will be a wrenching experience for some suburban police departments. Most collector streets and mile roads will be affected by this law. Tickets written for violating the old limits under Sec. 627 of the Vehicle Code won't be valid after Nov. 9th. 2) The current 25-mph limit in "business districts" remains, but the definition of "business district" is tightened to cover only places where occupied business frontage lines half of both sides of the street for at least 600 feet. Strip commercial areas probably won't qualify, and vacant stores don't count. 3) In a subdivision platted after 1967, an unposted speed limit of 25 applies. The old "residence district" speed limit, which applied on any road with houses, is repealed. In a residential area platted before 1968, the new law is silent as to what the speed limit can be if the streets aren't posted under another part of the law. Your guess is as good as anyone's what the speed limit will be on unposted streets in Detroit, or any old residential area. Read the new law at www.MichiganLegislature.org Just enter 257.627 where it says "basic MCL search." But don't try explaining this to an Ecorse or Eastpointe or Dearborn Heights officer on Thursday evening; save it for the magistrate or judge. | ||
Johnnny5 Member Username: Johnnny5 Post Number: 387 Registered: 06-2005 |
^^^ The law change above just increased the speed limit on my narrow suburban street from 25 to 55 mph!!! Considering that there are portions where it is not even a full 2 lanes, I am pissed! IMO the increase in pedestrian related accidents that this change may cause is not worth the convenience of the faster commute. | ||
Gannon Member Username: Gannon Post Number: 6986 Registered: 12-2003 |
Aarne, Wow. That is simply stunning, and from what you posted seems a huge setback for safety in less-densely populated areas. It is just legalese for the rich to tap into with their well-paid attorneys, so they can get out of tickets the rest of us will have to live with. Where is the Zoltan Ferency of our day...his defense against early radar tickets was made PUBLIC, so the everyman could use it for their personal defense in court...sans any expensive legal representation. Some of us are allergic to lawyers... | ||
Aarne_frobom Member Username: Aarne_frobom Post Number: 40 Registered: 10-2005 |
It should actually be fairly easy for an average person to beat a ticket under this law without representation, if the courts are honest. It will be interesting to see how this plays out. On old residential streets, the situation is not so lawless as it appears. The "basic speed law," is still in effect, requiring drivers to drive at "careful and prudent" and "reasonable and proper" speeds. If police rediscover the basic law after years of disuse, it is easy to imagine the courts insisting on low speeds in dense residential areas. And citations are rare on residential streets, anyway. As was pointed out above, the police just aren't there. Common sense, physics and self-preservation provide the effective speed limit when no one's watching. For your "narrow suburban street," Sec. 627(11) empowers cities to conduct speed studies, and post absolute limits on any street, as called for. Cities need not rely on the prima facie part of the law, but cannot pull numbers out of thin air anymore, either. Although it has a few odd gaps, this law is probably the nation's most advanced speed-limit law. | ||
Fjw718 Member Username: Fjw718 Post Number: 86 Registered: 11-2005 |
Did Aarne_frobom say "drivers victimized by speed traps"??? LOL since when is someone who breaks traffic law a "victim" i dont get that logic. Kind of like "I only double parked for a second"......well, thats against the law, isnt it? so you deserve a ticket. | ||
Darwinism Member Username: Darwinism Post Number: 572 Registered: 06-2005 |
What ever happen to common civility ? Against the law ..... as in the law put forth by the people ? Come on. The law is supposed to be fair, it is supposed to be just ..... filling a quota, sounds rotten to me. Absolutely despicable. Here's another write-up of the same issue: http://www.detnews.com/apps/pb cs.dll/article?AID=/20061025/M ETRO05/610250387/1016 | ||
Citylover Member Username: Citylover Post Number: 1868 Registered: 07-2004 |
I would love to see someone try and use this to get out of a ticket.I base my observations on peronal experience.Courts used to give advisement; not so much these days.I have never seen anyone make a legal argument to a court and have the court agree. I have seen cute girls have tickets dismissed but my guess is that they had no prior traffic tickets. Whether or not a speeding ticket is fair is not the point imo.The point is to just go the posted limit and not have to try and defend your actions_ believe me it is much easier, simpler and costs less. | ||
Eastside Member Username: Eastside Post Number: 964 Registered: 01-2005 |
"I have never seen anyone make a legal argument to a court and have the court agree." That means it never happens. | ||
Citylover Member Username: Citylover Post Number: 1869 Registered: 07-2004 |
Am I supposed to respond to such an idiotic statement? | ||
Eastsidedog Member Username: Eastsidedog Post Number: 803 Registered: 03-2006 |
Well said Itsjeff. None of this stuff really affects city residents. | ||
Itsjeff Member Username: Itsjeff Post Number: 7114 Registered: 10-2003 |
Huh? Whadisay? | ||
Belleislerunner Member Username: Belleislerunner Post Number: 283 Registered: 12-2003 |
As probably mentioned before, a great book that touches on this topic is "Tipping Point". | ||
Eastsidedog Member Username: Eastsidedog Post Number: 804 Registered: 03-2006 |
Itsjeff, last I checked, speed limits aren't enforced in the city. Nor are red lights enforced, nor stop signs. But you better not yap on that cell phone. | ||
Eastsidedog Member Username: Eastsidedog Post Number: 805 Registered: 03-2006 |
My neighbor and I were talking about this a while back. His suggestion was that the city probably wouldn't let us add speed bumps to our street but we could add some well-placed large deep potholes. I'm gonna have to get back to him on that. | ||
Itsjeff Member Username: Itsjeff Post Number: 7116 Registered: 10-2003 |
The home invasion, murder and anti-drug ordinances don't seem to be all that much enforced, either. | ||
Eastsidedog Member Username: Eastsidedog Post Number: 806 Registered: 03-2006 |
Deterrence and being a harder target than the next guy seems to be the only thing that keeps crime in check. That and neighborhoods full of good people. What was this thread about? | ||
Darwinism Member Username: Darwinism Post Number: 573 Registered: 06-2005 |
Citylover: "Whether or not a speeding ticket is fair is not the point imo.The point is to just go the posted limit and not have to try and defend your actions_ believe me it is much easier, simpler and costs less." The part that should be of prime concern among fellow citizens is how far police officers are going to stretch in order to fulfill their 'performance review' a.k.a. 'quota'. Folks might very well be abiding by the law, driving the speed limit, paying attention to traffic signs and etc. but still get 'victimized' because police officers need their jobs and paychecks too. Just a lil' food for thought from reading both the Detroit News articles. | ||
Bob_cosgrove Member Username: Bob_cosgrove Post Number: 412 Registered: 03-2005 |
A previous post said, "since when is someone who breaks traffic law a "victim." Well how about selective enfourcement such as practiced in Grosse Pointe Park along Mack Avenue where the major offense is "DWB." That stands for "Driving While Black." The Park Police and their Municipal Judge Jarboe enforce the law to the hilt along Mack Avenue between Alter Road and Cadieux where blacks frequently drive, but not along East Jefferson. Beyond Cadieux enforcement by the City of Grosse Pointe and Grosse Pointe Woods isn't dedicated to municipal fund raising, although I don't advise speeding there either. I say this only from observation, since I haven't received a speeding ticket ever, but I have seen Judge Jarboe in action in his courtroom. Bob Cosgrove | ||
Ray1936 Member Username: Ray1936 Post Number: 918 Registered: 01-2005 |
For what it's worth, Detroit City Ordinance states the speed limit is 25 MPH unless otherwise posted. Simple as that. | ||
Eastsidedog Member Username: Eastsidedog Post Number: 808 Registered: 03-2006 |
^^^ yeah... tell that to the white camaro the flies down my street. |
