  Emu_steve Member Username: Emu_steve Post Number: 1 Registered: 11-2006 |
Any ideas? Any thoughts (yeah or nay)? and location (behind Fox Theatre or across I-75 on Woodward - don't know who owns that land)? I grew up in the Detroit area (used to run on Belle Island years ago with the Belle Island Runners) and still follow the Tigers and EMU. I love what I see happening downtown (I was out for the first WS game). | ||
Eric Member Username: Eric Post Number: 610 Registered: 11-2004 |
We just don't know. The last stories in news basically said they'd make a decision before the years end. But you always have to take those things with a grain of salt, it's very possible that they won't make an announcement until early next year. | ||
Motownman Member Username: Motownman Post Number: 46 Registered: 09-2006 |
Probably behind the Fox. Welcome  | ||
Aschar76 Member Username: Aschar76 Post Number: 6 Registered: 11-2006 |
Why do this if they intent to build new? Naming the Joe Louis Arena west entrance the "Gordie Howe Entrance," as the Red Wings did Wednesday, is only the start. They also have commissioned Chicago artist Omri Amrany to create a statue of Gordie to place inside the entrance next spring. http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs .dll/article?AID=2006611230404 | ||
Ericdfan Member Username: Ericdfan Post Number: 180 Registered: 08-2005 |
Sounds like he has made up his mind to me. | ||
Apbest Member Username: Apbest Post Number: 292 Registered: 03-2006 |
I dont think that means anything...it will take a couple years to make a new arena ready for the wings to play in. A simple statue is not a commitment to JLA for Illitch, if they do decide to build new, the wings will be playing in JLA for probably 2 more seasons. Besides, if it did, why would they release that info to the public? it would totally shatter the anticipation of their announcement plants | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 3132 Registered: 08-2004 |
What better way to negotiate with other west Foxtown property owners than to let them think that staying at the Joe is still a possible option! Why should he announce that he wants to move to the west Foxtown area before he has the property in hand? That would be dumb! Remember the east Rivertown Casino land speculation frenzy?? | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 3133 Registered: 08-2004 |
I personally don't think the new hockey arena is going to be built in west Foxttown. There's sure to be a few property owners who want $5 million an acre for their land. He's going to balk, and probably build it somewhere else, maybe next to MotorCity Casino. Then lots of downtown restaurants are going to lose a ton of pre and post game business (once folks get into their cars, they're likely to be heading home). | ||
Emu_steve Member Username: Emu_steve Post Number: 2 Registered: 11-2006 |
A decision to put a new hockey arena anywhere but in the Fox area would be a huge blow to continue building an entertainment 'zone' with Ford Field (aren't the Lions "entertaining"?), Comerica, Fox, new hockey arena and the MGM Grand. BTW, does anyone know what plans, if any, there are for the land on the NW corner of Woodward and I-75? That land seems to be prime for development. | ||
Apbest Member Username: Apbest Post Number: 295 Registered: 03-2006 |
From what I heard, I believe the city was working on getting the land in their hands and putting out an RFP | ||
Emu_steve Member Username: Emu_steve Post Number: 3 Registered: 11-2006 |
that parcel is very interesting as it is unique and I'd think very valuable. It is across from all the residential in Brush Park yet kiddie corner to Comerica and whatever development Ilitch gets west of Comerica (on Woodward - there is parking lots there now). If the 3 casinos weren't already built that would seem to be a great location for something like a casino or entertainment venue because of freeway access and all the available parking @ Comerica and behind the Fox. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4747 Registered: 10-2003 |
When Will Ilitch Decide Whether to Build a New Hockey Arena? When he decides to. Really, this has been discussed to no end. | ||
Viziondetroit Member Username: Viziondetroit Post Number: 947 Registered: 11-2003 |
Kinda like when the Tigers built that plaza on Michigan. They have money for projects like this. The money spent on a statue and naming something is drop in a bucket compared to building a new one... they can upgrade the facilities and building another one in the process. | ||
Emu_steve Member Username: Emu_steve Post Number: 4 Registered: 11-2006 |
sorry if this topic is old. I'm new to the board so I obviously wouldn't know. I did read in one of the Detroit papers last month where Ilitch supposedly indicated that he'd decide within 30 days of the end of the World Series. If there is EVER a time for him to build behind the Fox it is now. There is real synergy in the Comerica/Fox area caused by the Tigers' success. Strike while the iron is hot. | ||
Bibs Member Username: Bibs Post Number: 606 Registered: 10-2003 |
Assembling the property and getting financing for the project would the largest hurdles. We know that the Tigers generated a ton of revenue this year and will certainly generate a ton next year. Perhaps, this significant sum of revenue will allow the Illich family to assemble the land necessary to build another arena for the Red Wings. Not sure if this logic holds true since the companies managing each team might be separate. | ||
Enduro Member Username: Enduro Post Number: 5 Registered: 11-2006 |
The statue is nothing. Think of the Tiger Plaza he built at the old Stadium, knowing full well he wanted out. | ||
Lowell Board Administrator Username: Lowell Post Number: 3336 Registered: 10-2003 |
"BTW, does anyone know what plans, if any, there are for the land on the NW corner of Woodward and I-75?" My little birdies are telling me that is the spot. Parking structures [whoopee] will be built on the Donovan / Motown site to centrally serve all stadia and Fox. Building there is several million less than south of the x-way behind Fox where land acquisition is more complicated [remember that was a casino shell game site too]. Word is that they are very close to putting together all the pieces on the north site, but taxi cab guy is squeezing their cajones. And what about the revival of the Eddystone and the fate of the Palms Hotel? Buh-bye. Tweet tweet | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4752 Registered: 10-2003 |
Wait, so you're hearing the arena is going to be put even further north than the Donovan/Sanders Building? | ||
Apbest Member Username: Apbest Post Number: 297 Registered: 03-2006 |
I hope if they do build there that it is straight up to the street on Woodward w/ ground floor retail..see in Washington where the Nationals arena has a chipotle on the ground floor facing the street | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4753 Registered: 10-2003 |
Yeah, if they are going to put it on Woodward, they better build it up to the street, or at least put a plaza on Woodward to connect it to the arena if it's not right on Woodward. I don't want to see none of that "one-parking-lot-back" from Woodward crap they did with Comerica. | ||
Emu_steve Member Username: Emu_steve Post Number: 5 Registered: 11-2006 |
"BTW, does anyone know what plans, if any, there are for the land on the NW corner of Woodward and I-75?" My little birdies are telling me that is the spot. Parking structures [whoopee] will be built on the Donovan / Motown site to centrally serve all stadia and Fox. Building there is several million less than south of the x-way behind Fox where land acquisition is more complicated [remember that was a casino shell game site too]. Word is that they are very close to putting together all the pieces on the north site, but taxi cab guy is squeezing their cajones. And what about the revival of the Eddystone and the fate of the Palms Hotel? Buh-bye. Tweet tweet ********* Very interesting. How big is the Donovan/Motown site? Would a new arena or parking structure or both face Woodward? I can visualize the NW corner of Woodward & 75 - I know it is used as surface parking, but I do not know how 'deep' or how far (wide) along Woodward the site exists. | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 3146 Registered: 08-2004 |
A footnote on the Motown site... When they rebuilt the Fisher Freeway a few years back, they removed the Park Ave. bridge. And IIRC Clifford is One-Way northbound when it crosses the Fisher. So pedestrians would have to take either the Clifford bridge or the Woodward bridge to cross over to downtown. Cars would have to take either the Woodward or Cass bridges to go south. Sounds like Park Ave. could use a pedestrian bridge if they built north of there. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4755 Registered: 10-2003 |
Oh, that particular site (Donovan/Sanders + loft directly adjacent to the north) is pretty small (the whole area bound by Woodward, Fisher Freeway, Henry, and Park). It would be impossible to set an arena on it. It's not wide enough. I'm sure they must be talking about vacating some streets and building on the many vacant blocks to the north, as well, at least for the arena. They could stretch a pretty good garage out of the Donovan/Sanders lot, but the arena would be too wide big for the lot. In fact, the lots get slightly wider the further you go north up Woodward. The Donovan/Sanders + lot to the north lot from north to south (upon a quick aerial inspection) doesn't even measure a full 200 feet, though it's a good 560-580 feet or so long. In comparison, the Joe 328 feet wide, and 550 feet long. At the very least, if we're talking about the area just west of Woodward at the freeway, we're talking about a vacation of at least Henry Street and Sibley Streets if they are going northward. I'm still thinking they are going for the Behind-Park-Avenue area, where it would be much easier for them if they can aquire all of the land. (Message edited by lmichigan on November 25, 2006) (Message edited by lmichigan on November 25, 2006) | ||
Emu_steve Member Username: Emu_steve Post Number: 6 Registered: 11-2006 |
Curious which site posters would prefer? (I think either would be great). I'm fascinated by the north of freeway site and what it would do for development along Woodward going toward Wayne State. Connecting downtown and Wayne State along Woodward I think would be a long term hope for city planners. (Message edited by emu_steve on November 25, 2006) | ||
Crew Member Username: Crew Post Number: 1086 Registered: 02-2004 |
Illitch is pushing 80 years old. Do you think he'll even be around when his company finally builds a new area? | ||
Yvette248 Member Username: Yvette248 Post Number: 196 Registered: 10-2006 |
What for? To listen to years of people b!tching and moaning about how great the "old" stadium was??? | ||
Gumby Member Username: Gumby Post Number: 1474 Registered: 11-2003 |
Yvette248 no one will be bitching how great the old stadium was. | ||
Detroitduo Member Username: Detroitduo Post Number: 752 Registered: 06-2005 |
Please... please... oh please.... I hope they don't build a parking structure on Woodward. Living directly across the street from that lot... the LAST thing I want to look, see or hear is a parking structure. IF.. and I mean IF something is built on that side of the street, it had BETTER have ground floor retail or something. My neighborhood is growing and growing and we NEED walking distance retail. This COULD be good, but alas... I don't believe ANYTHING until I see a foundation and a building. Oh, great Detroit and Mr. Illitch... Please, surprise me and do something right, this time? | ||
Jasoncw Member Username: Jasoncw Post Number: 295 Registered: 07-2005 |
Off the top of my head, I think putting it between Woodward, Park, and Sporat would be good. It could make the Sproat and Park intersection really cool. The lot is too big for it, but maybe some kind of hotel, tailored for traveling fans, would be cool. I'd want it close to the sidewalk, but in order for it to be practical, there needs to be wide sidewalks so that they can handle the foot traffic when games let out. So it needs to be set back a little. | ||
Lowell Board Administrator Username: Lowell Post Number: 3337 Registered: 10-2003 |
Parking structures could easily be hybrid with ground level retail in front and an outer layer of residential on Woodward above. Possibilities are endless. What's to stop covering the sections of the 375 on both sides of Woodward to create continuous parkway? Get rid of that community flow impediment. | ||
Apbest Member Username: Apbest Post Number: 298 Registered: 03-2006 |
was that birdies talking? | ||
Lowell Board Administrator Username: Lowell Post Number: 3341 Registered: 10-2003 |
No birdies this time, just my speculation, but with the growing vibrance of that area, it makes $ense and could pay for the parking lots behind. | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 3148 Registered: 08-2004 |
Lowell, unfortunately bridging over that part of the Fisher Freeway has to contend with the exit ramps to and entrance ramps from Woodward. | ||
Lowell Board Administrator Username: Lowell Post Number: 3342 Registered: 10-2003 |
Just for fun, I 'moved' the Joe to the corner in question and dropped it on vacant available land. It surprise me how little it is.  | ||
Emu_steve Member Username: Emu_steve Post Number: 7 Registered: 11-2006 |
Interesting although it would overwhelm the houses across the street on Woodward. Maybe behind the Fox is best for a new arena with a nice housing/retail/parking structure on that NW corner of Woodward/75. | ||
Lowell Board Administrator Username: Lowell Post Number: 3343 Registered: 10-2003 |
The whole Cass/Clifford-Temple-Woodward- 375 plot is in play. I arbitrarily dropped it on a vacant plot simply to show how it could theoretically be shoehorned into such a spot ala Madison Square Gardens. With all the land available there one can be pretty sure that it would be set back to say Park if not further. The final shape would no doubt be different anyway. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4757 Registered: 10-2003 |
I'd imagine this new arena would be larger than the old Joe, if anything, if only by a little bit. Seeing the Joe dropped down there like that, I would think that if it must go north of the Fisher (not my favorite of the potential locations) that they set it back from the street with a plaza, on building some mid-to-high-rises on either side of it to frame the plaza. I'm not liking the image I get of this thing looming over Brush Park like this. | ||
321brian Member Username: 321brian Post Number: 211 Registered: 02-2006 |
I'm sure it would be at least half underground. | ||
Navin_parker Member Username: Navin_parker Post Number: 10 Registered: 11-2006 |
Lowell Just 4 fun try picking up the JLA and placing it at the Corner of Michigan and Trumbull in place of Tiger Stadium. Great freeway access along with Marian Ilitch's Casino in the background always a possible avenue until the hole is dug elsewhere. The City and State could condem Brooks Lumber CO. for a Parking Garage and knock out a 100 years of history on both sides of Trumbull Ave. I'm sure that would be hailed as real progress toward the future by KWAME and COMPANY. Eager to see your next pictures! Thanks my friend. | ||
Buddyinrichmond Member Username: Buddyinrichmond Post Number: 79 Registered: 02-2004 |
Nest thing you know someone will be talking about the legalities of "imminent" domain. Detroit Rises! | ||
Royce Member Username: Royce Post Number: 1924 Registered: 07-2004 |
Detroitduo, I'm with you on this one. Putting a stadium at that site would be a bad idea. The new Brush Park residents need some retail in that area. On the west side of Woodward would be the ideal location. A stadium takes up too much space to allow enough retail to go in that area. Also, a stadium at that site would make the development of the Eddystone and the Harbor Light Building less appealing for residents who would have to deal with constant traffic congestion more intense than what residents in Woodward Place deal with. That's because the stadium would be right next to them, acting as the focal point for all traffic congestion. I understand that it may be cheaper to put a stadium at that site, but at what cost to the synergy that is happening in the area. If I were the city, I would find a way to work with Ilitch to purchase the land behind the Fox. The land behind the Fox is the best location for a new hockey arena. (Message edited by royce on November 26, 2006) | ||
Gumby Member Username: Gumby Post Number: 1475 Registered: 11-2003 |
I personally think it would help the Eddystone and Harbor Light buildings. I would love to live that close to the action. Plus think about the pedestrian traffic that will help support the retail in the neighborhood. I am not saying it is for everyone but I do believe there is a demographic who would like this arrangement. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4762 Registered: 10-2003 |
There is as other newer stadium plans across this country are usually now part of a greater neighborhood plan. Look at the new ballpark in St. Louis and San Diego, for instance, where the plans also include residential towers for the area. Residential and sports entertainment can (and has) worked in the same neighborhood. With that said, I still second-guessing my originally thought that a new stadium would be nice right there on Woodward. The only way I can see it working, now, is if they hem it in and push it lengthwise back away from Woodward giving it a small Woodward frontage, and built directly on either side of it some mixed-use mid-rises to kind of properly frame it. If we'd have seen the likes of the Garden Lofts along Woodward instead of the townhouses, this may have made more sense. | ||
Jasoncw Member Username: Jasoncw Post Number: 296 Registered: 07-2005 |
In the long term, those townhouses on Woodward just aren't going to be around. I think once the area gets better, they'll be demolished and something bigger and more cosmopolitan will be built there. The stadium will probably be around longer, if it's well made. | ||
Apbest Member Username: Apbest Post Number: 302 Registered: 03-2006 |
no | ||
Dnvn522 Member Username: Dnvn522 Post Number: 149 Registered: 11-2004 |
 | ||
Emu_steve Member Username: Emu_steve Post Number: 9 Registered: 11-2006 |
I'm not an urban planner, but I know rivers, freeways, etc. act as natural barriers to development, etc. (good example is the SE freeway in D.C. - it split Capitol Hill off from the rest of SE D.C. - the result Capitol Hill is expensive and exclusive; the other part became industrial, etc.). It seems to be that the Lodge in Detroit is the critical divide. Anything north of it will be 'isolated' from downtown. The times I've been in Detroit (I no longer live in MI but visit several times a year and go to Tiger games, college FB at Ford Field, etc.) and basically consider the Motor City Casino in a different state. Total isolated. I have never even been NEAR it. Tiger Stadium locale does absolutely NOTHING for me. Building of the type we are talking in Detroit should be in the CBD or north of 75 along Woodward (in fill between the CBD and Wayne State). | ||
Apbest Member Username: Apbest Post Number: 307 Registered: 03-2006 |
do u mean west of the lodge? it runs north-south | ||
Emu_steve Member Username: Emu_steve Post Number: 10 Registered: 11-2006 |
My bad. I meant WEST of the Lodge. | ||
Detroitplanner Member Username: Detroitplanner Post Number: 431 Registered: 04-2006 |
hmm you can also say that freeways contribute to development, mostly ugly auto orientated development, but in many cases it does. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4770 Registered: 10-2003 |
But, only in areas built for the automobile. A freeway through an inner-city doesn't usually spur much development, at all. BTW, the Lodge hardly seems like the divide that the 375 or Fisher are to downtown. I'd say that the Fisher is REALLY what raped Corktown and North Corktown. | ||
Chow Member Username: Chow Post Number: 327 Registered: 10-2003 |
The only spot in the CBD that I think would be suitable is on the formerly proposed Greektown site on Gratiot. I'm tired of superblock developments. They do not consider future growth of the immediate area. To be honest, does anyone think that choosing an area simple by virtue of the abundance of vacant is a good idea? The former proposed Greektown site is cleared, does not require the shutting of any significant streets (just Mullet St), has frontage on a major road, and would create a cohesive stadia district (clustered in the northeastern portion of the CBD). As a plus, it is close to Greektown's permanent site.  | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4773 Registered: 10-2003 |
It's not close enough to Ilichtown, though. Whether we like it or not, this guy is trying to consolidate his empire within Foxtown. | ||
Chow Member Username: Chow Post Number: 328 Registered: 10-2003 |
Fair enough. I still feel that the site posted above works better aesthetically and functionally than any of the others. If consolidation is what he wants then I say build it on the land west of the Lodge, south of MotorCity and east of Trumbull. It has no place in the Park Ave. area nor on Woodward north of the Fox. | ||
Jasoncw Member Username: Jasoncw Post Number: 300 Registered: 07-2005 |
wow Chow, I think that's a really good spot. Unfortunately what Lmichigan says is probably true though. | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 3157 Registered: 08-2004 |
Chow's idea has merit... but I don't think that MotorCity Casino owner Marion Ilitch will like giving Greektown Casino a lot of extra business after Hockey Games. And also that superblock has some issues with getting off the freeway to get there. Too many left turns to make for a crowd of 20,000... they would end up backing up onto the freeway, and probably clogging the I-75 Interchange. | ||
Emu_steve Member Username: Emu_steve Post Number: 11 Registered: 11-2006 |
One thought that I had, namely, putting a new arena behind the Fox would be very close to the new MGM Grand. For Mrs. Ilitch's sake, I wish her casino was anywhere else but where it is. If her casino was where the new MGM will be then the CoPa, buildable parking lots, Fox, new arena, and casino 'lineup' would be as good as it gets. I'd doubt any individual or family across America would have a better 'entertainment venue' then this. It is hard for any single individual or family to get such contigious urban land. | ||
Dnvn522 Member Username: Dnvn522 Post Number: 150 Registered: 11-2004 |
 | ||
_sj_ Member Username: _sj_ Post Number: 1602 Registered: 12-2003 |
The new hockey arena should have a larger footprint than the cramped JLA. You need to compare those lots with the sizes of the larger newer rinks. | ||
Danindc Member Username: Danindc Post Number: 1943 Registered: 10-2003 |
If Ilitch builds a new arena, let's just hope he's smart enough to build it out to the sidewalk, and not surround it entirely with parking lots.
Emu_Steve, you're only partially correct in that rivers and freeways disconnect development. Your comparison to Capitol Hill, though, doesn't hold up. The freeway isn't what made the Hill expensive. Historically, Capitol Hill has been relatively affordable and blue collar compared to the rest of the District. It has only been within the past ten years (or less) that it has re-gentrified. There are many other parts of town that are far more expensive, and without freeways. On the other hand, the industrial area on the Anacostia waterfront has always been there. The Washington Navy Yard has been sited there since pre-Civil War days, and led to the industrial development of that area. Sorry for the digression. Back to the thread about Little Caesars' Hockey Barn. | ||
Dnvn522 Member Username: Dnvn522 Post Number: 151 Registered: 11-2004 |
We've used the Palace as a size reference in the past.  | ||
Scottr Member Username: Scottr Post Number: 87 Registered: 07-2006 |
according to wikipedia, bell center in montreal is the largest arena (capacity wise) in the nhl, but it still fits rather nicely on that site. i have no idea how to insert images here, but here's the link to my attempt... http://i66.photobucket.com/alb ums/h264/scottrreed/newjoe.jpg | ||
Emu_steve Member Username: Emu_steve Post Number: 12 Registered: 11-2006 |
dan, I guess I agree in large part with you but I think the SE Freeway prevented Capitol Hill from moving south toward the Anacostia. Sure that area is industrial, has/d public housing projects, etc. but the area where the new ball park is going up might have redeveloped faster if it had not been cut off from Capitol Hill by that freeway. | ||
Danindc Member Username: Danindc Post Number: 1948 Registered: 10-2003 |
Agreed. Just like new development in downtown Detroit is going to have a difficult time spreading beyond the Chrysler Freeway. | ||
Gumby Member Username: Gumby Post Number: 1480 Registered: 11-2003 |
Am I the only one who sees the irony in closing "Mullet St." for a hockey arena. I just started laughing when I saw that mentioned. | ||
Dnvn522 Member Username: Dnvn522 Post Number: 152 Registered: 11-2004 |
Wouldn't it be more ironic for a Nascar track? | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4775 Registered: 10-2003 |
Danindc, it doesn't really matter. Lafayette Park is more of a barrier than the freeway. It was a total destruction of the street grid. | ||
Scottr Member Username: Scottr Post Number: 88 Registered: 07-2006 |
no, gumby, you're not the only one that caught that. | ||
Detroitduo Member Username: Detroitduo Post Number: 762 Registered: 06-2005 |
I say not any time soon. Ilitch will renovate the Joe, because the city will not foot the bill for anymore of his big projects. And certainly the Ilitches won't use any of their OWN money! | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4778 Registered: 10-2003 |
That's your wish, Duo. lol The city is going to foot a big part of the bill, and the Ilitch's, with their newfound casino and Tiger's money, will build this thing. | ||
Scottr Member Username: Scottr Post Number: 89 Registered: 07-2006 |
the city will foot at least some, because that will get them space to expand cobo while keeping the wings in detroit. the city DOES have an interest in this, more so than comerica. and even comerica was over 60% private funding, and i would expect the same or better for a new hockey arena. | ||
Gumby Member Username: Gumby Post Number: 1482 Registered: 11-2003 |
Yeah I was going to mention that Ilitch funded a lot of Comerica why would he refuse to do the same for his hockey team? | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 3168 Registered: 08-2004 |
I was wondering what if.... Both MGM and MotorCity helped pay for the costs of a new arena on the west side of Grand River Ave. in Midtown. That way both MGM and MotorCity could have catwalks (with moving sidewalks?) connect from MGM north across the Fisher to the new arena... and connect MotorCity east across the Lodge to the new arena. I don't even know if there's enough space in Midtown west of Grand River (a sort of triange shaped piece of land) for a new Arena. Now mind you, I don't particularly care for this location, but anything is possible. | ||
Rhymeswithrawk Member Username: Rhymeswithrawk Post Number: 172 Registered: 11-2005 |
Word is that they are very close to putting together all the pieces on the north site, but taxi cab guy is squeezing their cajones. And what about the revival of the Eddystone and the fate of the Palms Hotel? Buh-bye. Tweet tweet It's hard to fathom that area being able to handle that kind of traffic, etc. But I will tell you one thing, if this is true, you might want to snatch up one of those condos now. Can you IMAGINE how your housing value would skyrocket if you were located across the street from a new Red Wings arena AND CoPa AND the Fox AND Ford Field? Not to mention the demand for redeveloping Brush Park. Yowzahs. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4790 Registered: 10-2003 |
You really think it would be that much? I don't, especially considering, as you already mentioned, there are already two stadia built in the area. | ||
Rhymeswithrawk Member Username: Rhymeswithrawk Post Number: 176 Registered: 11-2005 |
You're right. Maybe skyrocket was a bit much. | ||
Royce Member Username: Royce Post Number: 1940 Registered: 07-2004 |
Here's a crazy idea. Ilitch should talk to the Ford family and get an agreement to have Red Wings home games played at Ford Field. Sixty five thousands fans attending an NHL hockey game for 41 games could rake in a lot of profits for both Ilitch and the Ford family. The additional money could be used to build new parking structures where the new hockey arena would have gone. Now, if we could only convince Bill Davidson to move the Pistons to Ford Field. Talk about a hat trick. | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 3172 Registered: 08-2004 |
Royce, that idea lacks 2 things... intimacy and sight lines. | ||
Emu_steve Member Username: Emu_steve Post Number: 20 Registered: 11-2006 |
Actually Royce's post does bring up a tangent thought: If Ilitch builds a new arena, does he go after a lot of the concerts, etc. and try to bring them downtown? | ||
Rhymeswithrawk Member Username: Rhymeswithrawk Post Number: 185 Registered: 11-2005 |
You mean bring them downtown from the Palace? Makes sense to me. The Palace is anything but convenient unless you live in Lake Orion or something. | ||
Llyn Member Username: Llyn Post Number: 1743 Registered: 06-2004 |
Amen. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4792 Registered: 10-2003 |
I can only imagine that he'd build the new Red Wings arena as a decidedly multi-purpose venue. I can't see him wanting to just build a hockey arena, and I'm sure he wants to bring everything under one roof as he currently has to host concerts Olympia brings in in the Cobo Arena. Ilitch knows that this is his last big legacy project, and I can only imagine that he wants to go out big. | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 3177 Registered: 08-2004 |
Some folks mentioned that the new arena will be smaller than JLA. But I don't know if that would be a wise move. Granted it may be more intimate for Hockey, but if the Palace has 20,000 seats, and the new Olympia has say only 17,000 or 18,000, then that could put him at a competitive disadvantage against the Palace for entertainment bookings. And besides if Detroit fills its hockey arena better than any other hockey venue, why would he want fewer seats? | ||
Spiritofdetroit Member Username: Spiritofdetroit Post Number: 81 Registered: 11-2006 |
There wont be fewer seats. In the past couple of years they have added a few seats wherever they could. They Joe had had a capacity in the high 19,000's for years, and it has been increased to, IIRC 20,067 or so now. | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4794 Registered: 10-2003 |
Yeah, where had you heard that, Gistok? | ||
Royce Member Username: Royce Post Number: 1947 Registered: 07-2004 |
A 25000 seat arena would be a good size for a new hockey arena. | ||
Emu_steve Member Username: Emu_steve Post Number: 24 Registered: 11-2006 |
I'm not a hockey fan so I don't visit the hockey only venues, but I'd assume that any new arena would have to be a monster as they need to have all the space for the luxury suites. I've been in the Verizon Center (for basketball) a number of times - it is huge. I'd think a new arena would be much larger then JLA (because of the suites). | ||
Rjk Member Username: Rjk Post Number: 572 Registered: 11-2003 |
As far as basketball and hockey, once you start getting past 20,000 the seat are pretty bad. I've sat near the top of the Palace for a Pistons game and it took half the game for my eyes to adjust. Even as cheap as the tickets were (relatively speaking) it just wasn't worth it. Also with the salary cap the Red Wings will no longer be able to put a hall of fame team together. You won't see the demand for tickets like it use to be. Both the Tigers and Lions downsized their stadiums. My guess is that the Wings will not go much above 20,000. | ||
Detroitduo Member Username: Detroitduo Post Number: 767 Registered: 06-2005 |
Quote: "Can you IMAGINE how your housing value would skyrocket if you were located across the street from a new Red Wings arena AND CoPa AND the Fox AND Ford Field? " I know some of my neighbors are drooling at the thought of this prospect, I think it will either kill or do nothing to our property values. IF... and I repeat "I F" a new stadium is built near the old Motown building, it will only increase property values when it is built to compliment the neighborhood. That means, looking like Madison Square Gardens with stores, restaurants and bars on street level to service the community. If it is built like a stadium...with a setback and no access from ground level (read, like a fortress), then it will kill the area. Regardless, the idea about a new stadium directly across the street does not thrill me in any way. I see it as more potential trouble than anything.... But honestly, I haven't heard anything reliable that a new Arena will be built ANYWHERE, let alone in this location. I think the most likely location is behind Foxtown, somewhere.... | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 3178 Registered: 08-2004 |
I heard it from one of the Olympia Entertainment employees. But he's a honch at the Fox, and it was in a discussion this summer. So it's not gospel. Thanks for the 20,067 JLA figure Spiritofdetroit. Anyone have the exact figure for the Palace? | ||
Lmichigan Member Username: Lmichigan Post Number: 4798 Registered: 10-2003 |
The Palace holds 22,076 for basketball games, I believe making it the largest arena in the NBA, and can see another 2,000 for concerts and such. But, yes, the Red Wings arena will have to be larger than the Joe if only by a little bit. It's definitely not going to be smaller. |
