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The Griswold rendering officially released - 1Admin128 02-10-07  1:07 am
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Charlottepaul
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Post Number: 425
Registered: 10-2006
Posted on Tuesday, February 06, 2007 - 8:19 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"first new-construction condominiums ever built in Detroit’s central business district"

I found it very interesting that they used that phrase. You would have thought that at some point in the CBDs entire history that a new condo building would have been built. I guess they didn't call them 'condos' back in the 20s and before.
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Gambling_man
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Posted on Tuesday, February 06, 2007 - 9:59 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

For the above posters.........truly, not all parking garages have slanted floors....some of them have a "helix" roundabout in the middle (or ends) to get you up the garage, leaving most of the garage (90% or so) with flat floors.
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Dialh4hipster
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Posted on Tuesday, February 06, 2007 - 10:47 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

quote:

"first new-construction condominiums ever built in Detroit’s central business district"

I found it very interesting that they used that phrase. You would have thought that at some point in the CBDs entire history that a new condo building would have been built. I guess they didn't call them 'condos' back in the 20s and before



They didn't call them that because they didn't exist. The CBD was not residential, and what residential was there was always apartments for rent, not condos for sale.
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Mplsryan
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Posted on Tuesday, February 06, 2007 - 4:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Those units are cheap! Trying buying a penthouse in Minneapolis and you're talking 2 mil.
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Detroitstar
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Posted on Tuesday, February 06, 2007 - 5:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

But we're not in Minneapolis. This is Detroit, and we're just damn happy to be taking a step in the right direction.
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Lmichigan
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Post Number: 5098
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Posted on Tuesday, February 06, 2007 - 9:50 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hardhat, what is the link to that press release?
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Hardhat
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Post Number: 191
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Posted on Wednesday, February 07, 2007 - 1:46 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Lmich - There's no web link. The press release was sent to me via e-mail.
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Scottr
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Username: Scottr

Post Number: 236
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Posted on Wednesday, February 07, 2007 - 3:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

from a question from a while back...

quote:

would anyone have a list of the parking garages that have been built to hold buildings on top and how many stories that would be? I heard the Opera house, but have no idea how many stories or if this is even true.



Sadly, neither the Opera House garage nor 1001 Woodward garage were built to allow development on top of them. From a Free Press article today about air rights:

http://freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll /article?AID=/20070207/BUSINES S04/702070304/1002
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Gumby
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Posted on Wednesday, February 07, 2007 - 3:56 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I think they are awrong on the fact that 1001 garage was not built for possible expansion up. I am pretty sure they said that it was a possibility for the future.
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Lmichigan
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Username: Lmichigan

Post Number: 5104
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Posted on Wednesday, February 07, 2007 - 4:01 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It was said well before the structure began construction by the architects that they were designing it to hold additional floors on top, but I don't ever once remember doing construction or after completion hearing that it had actually been constructed to hold additional floors. Plans could have easily changed from paper to actual construction, and the media just never followed up.

I guess at this point it's just as likely as unlikely that it was actually constructed to hold additional floors. I'll try to find out from one of the architects that designed the garage.

What I must say is, though, is that the line in the News article that was just posted is strangely written, IMO, concerning 1001 and Opera House.

(Message edited by lmichigan on February 07, 2007)
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Scottr
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Post Number: 238
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Posted on Wednesday, February 07, 2007 - 4:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I certainly hope they are wrong. Especially the 1001 garage, that seems like a poor use for land right in the heart of downtown, if there is no possibility of expansion.
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Lmichigan
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Post Number: 5106
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Posted on Wednesday, February 07, 2007 - 4:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I've always said that even with additional floors on top, there should have never been any above-grade parking garages on Woodward. It's bad enough there have to be so many downtown in the first place, let alone on the main street. It's an extremely poor land use any way you turn it, additional floors or not. It would be nice, though, to have additional floors.
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Chris_rohn
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Post Number: 272
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Posted on Wednesday, February 07, 2007 - 4:25 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The 1001 garage was built with poured-in-place concrete, so i dont see why building on top wouldnt be possible as long as the structure added above it was light enough.

On the other hand, the Opera House garage was built with pre-cast concrete panels. There is no way that structure would be able to support construction above it.
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Lmichigan
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Username: Lmichigan

Post Number: 5107
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Posted on Wednesday, February 07, 2007 - 4:50 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Just got a email back from my contact at Rich & Associates. He says that to his knowledge (since they were only consultant/associate architects), the garage is not designed to hold additional floors.

Yeah, the Opera House garage most definitely isn't designed to hold additional floors.
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Quinn
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Username: Quinn

Post Number: 1109
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Posted on Friday, February 09, 2007 - 10:34 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I just spoke to a friend at Walbridge. They are to move into Kennedy Square, from 613 Abbott, on floors 2 and 3 by the end of June. They are being told they will have assigned parking space at the Griswold Garage AT THAT TIME...THIS YEAR...BY JUNE.

Is this possible? Can they put up the garage part in 4 months?
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Dan
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Post Number: 1350
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Posted on Friday, February 09, 2007 - 12:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Or by Griswold do they really mean the Kennedy sq. garage under the building? Why would the tenants of a building with plenty of underground parking, have to park in a different building’s garage?

Not only that but The Griswold is for BC, The Griswold, and Lafayette parking only I believe.

I am pretty sure they mean the Kennedy parking, with entrance on the Griswold side.
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Archy
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Post Number: 33
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Posted on Friday, February 09, 2007 - 12:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Dan,

The Lafayette developers are looking a another garage...this garage will be for future capitol park condo/apartment projects.
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Lmichigan
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Username: Lmichigan

Post Number: 5114
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Posted on Friday, February 09, 2007 - 1:33 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Actually, I heard 2nd ear (from someone that knows someone that works at Roxbury), that this new garage is being built to also house parking for any potential Lafayette Building renovation, too. At 528-spaces it's going to be a tight squeeze, but I've calculated, if you want to use one parking space per resident, that you have 67 units for the B-C, 80 units for the Griswold Capitol Park, and 125 units for the Lafayette. That gets you 272 spaces if you're calculating one car for every unit. The remaining 256 spots can be split between the 455-room hotel (knowing that you don't need one spot for every room of the hotel), and any small office space.

It still seems like a tight fit with the expectation in the city for a parking spot for everyone and their dog, so I wouldn't be surprised if someone screams they need another garage in the area. It would look ridiculous, though. It's very possible the Lafayette could be boxed in on three sides by a parking garage.
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Rjlj
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Username: Rjlj

Post Number: 257
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Friday, February 09, 2007 - 1:46 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Archy,
Do you have details on this garage? Can you post them here? If not, please send them to me. Thanks.
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Quinn
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Username: Quinn

Post Number: 1110
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Posted on Friday, February 09, 2007 - 2:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The garage under Kennedy square isn't very large...certainly not enough for the ~200 who work at Walbridge.

Walbridge owned the commerce building and lot next to it for years. I'm not sure if they are developing (meaning putting the money behind it) the parking garage at griswold or not, but they are definitely planning to use it for employee parking when they move into Kennedy Square...IN JUNE!

That's why I asked...is this really possible to have people parking there by June? Any builders out there?

Second source at Walbridge now... this is the public plan they've annouced to employees. Expect to be in Kennedy late June and parking at Griswold.

Ahhhhh...love this stuff.
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Beantown
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Username: Beantown

Post Number: 30
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Posted on Friday, February 09, 2007 - 2:54 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Lmichigan (and Quinn),
In your calculation of The Griswold ~ Capitol Park parking garage allocation, keep in mind that the residences/condos at the Book Cadillac were alloted 100 spaces, not 67. The future residents had the opportunity to buy a second parking space for $25k + additional association dues for maintenance & security. Good thing too, since ~91 have been purchased and assigned, and four condos are left for sale (with a guaranteed spot for each), meaning there are only 5 of the "extra" 33 spaces left available.

It would be interesting to know what Roxbury plans for the parking allocation for the 80 condos at The Griswold. Meaning, will it be one space per condo, or a few extras like the B-C for an optional second space.

It seems increasingly evident that there is more demand for this garage than 528 spaces. Leads me to really question whether both the Lafayette and the Kennedy Square plan to use some of those 528...
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Lmichigan
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Username: Lmichigan

Post Number: 5115
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Posted on Friday, February 09, 2007 - 2:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

That really throws a wrench into my calculations, then.

I find it odd that One Kennedy Square is needing much parking in this deck, unless the Kennedy Square Garage beneath the building is already filled. That garage holds 450 spaces.

And, it seems highly unlikely they could get that garage up and running by June.

(Message edited by lmichigan on February 09, 2007)
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Quinn
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Username: Quinn

Post Number: 1112
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Posted on Friday, February 09, 2007 - 3:59 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

That size of garage (450 spaces) under Kennedy Square is larger than I thought. I know that Walbridge is planning to take two floors of that building, and would need about 200 spaces. So some people might need to be pushed out to other lots.

When I started at Walbridge in 1998, we had parking passes for various lots throughout the 613 abbot area. We had to walk. When they built the garage for MGM, we got space there so we could all park at one place.

It wouldn't surprise me if Walbridge moved into Kennedy before Griswold is completed...and make employees park elsewhere and walk. I just found it strange that they are telling people the garage at Griswold will be completed in time for their headquarters move and wondered, "is that physically possible to construct and finish-out that garage in 4 months?"

Isn't the commerce building still partially standing?
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Hans57
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Username: Hans57

Post Number: 17
Registered: 05-2006
Posted on Friday, February 09, 2007 - 4:25 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Does anybody know which companies, if any, currently have offices in One Kennedy Square?
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Lmichigan
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Username: Lmichigan

Post Number: 5116
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Posted on Friday, February 09, 2007 - 5:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Quinn, there is no way they could get it done in four months. Take what you heard with a grain of salt.
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Gambling_man
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Username: Gambling_man

Post Number: 958
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Posted on Friday, February 09, 2007 - 7:20 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Greektown finished it's 600 car garage in 11 months. From teardown to parkers.......this one is slightly smaller, but I highly doubt they would start parking people in there until the condos were at least roughed-in....nor could they possibly have a C of O in that amount of time.....maybe 10 months or so if they wanted to pay extra.
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Charlottepaul
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Post Number: 445
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Posted on Friday, February 09, 2007 - 9:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Here in Charlotte, in the center city, the zoning ordinance calls for .5 spaces per 1,000 sq ft. of office space. Maybe that can give a little insight on this issue.
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Gistok
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Username: Gistok

Post Number: 3742
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Monday, March 05, 2007 - 11:53 am:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Bump....

(Didn't want to let it get aged off)
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Planner_727
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Username: Planner_727

Post Number: 93
Registered: 07-2006
Posted on Monday, March 05, 2007 - 12:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I know one of the realty agents that worked with 1001 on the garage and rehab. He confirmed that the garage is designed to hold additional condos in future... although they will not likely be built in the near-term as they are not selling the 1001 rennovated units at a good pace.
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Lmichigan
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Username: Lmichigan

Post Number: 5181
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Posted on Monday, March 05, 2007 - 6:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

That's so weird. The associate architects told me that it wasn't built to hold additional floors.

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