  Lowell Board Administrator Username: Lowell Post Number: 3801 Registered: 10-2003 |
Grand Prix Apron  Downriver Point Walkway  Downriver Point Walkway 2  | ||
Rb336 Member Username: Rb336 Post Number: 19 Registered: 02-2007 |
Now show some of the true car-eating manholes on the east end of the island! | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 628 Registered: 04-2006 |
Hope you got a shot of all those syringes and everything that makes it not worth a $0.25 toll! | ||
Hans57 Member Username: Hans57 Post Number: 91 Registered: 05-2006 |
So, they've been making walkways on the island? I've seen them tearing up the open grass right at the entrance for a few months, it seems that all the commotion doesn't add up to the project they've completed. | ||
Charlottepaul Member Username: Charlottepaul Post Number: 800 Registered: 10-2006 |
Who is angry at any efforts to improve the island? Just as the City of Detroit started downtown and now is working on improving the neighborhoods, you can't redo the whole island at once. | ||
Hans57 Member Username: Hans57 Post Number: 92 Registered: 05-2006 |
Does anybody have an overview of the project at hand? | ||
Ndavies Member Username: Ndavies Post Number: 2552 Registered: 10-2003 |
http://www.detroitgp.com/map.a sp | ||
Gravitymachine Member Username: Gravitymachine Post Number: 1599 Registered: 05-2005 |
wow, looks like they took out part of the long straight just past the pits and over that little bridge from the previous configuration of the track. The idea of all that pavement near the scott founntain for the paddock doesn't thrill me either, I realize the previously dirt paddock area was one of the biggest gripes of CART teams, just wish there was a better solution than paving the entire thing permanently | ||
Hans57 Member Username: Hans57 Post Number: 94 Registered: 05-2006 |
Well, with the completion of the permanent paddocks, Belle Isle should attract more races in the future. If that's a good thing, I don't know. It should be an attractive track though, maybe well get another CART race. It would be really cool if the Trans Am series was revived considering all the American car companies will have pony cars again. (Message edited by hans57 on April 17, 2007) | ||
Irish_mafia Member Username: Irish_mafia Post Number: 875 Registered: 10-2003 |
Thanks for the link NDavies. I for one was not aware that the American LeMans Series was going to be here as well as the Indy Series. Very Cool! All those interested in brushing up can catch both series over the coming weeks on SPEED... that's what my son and I have been doing. Penske's team has been dominating the first place positions in Indy with Andretti's team holding the most overall points. I believe that Penske dominated last week in Long Beach with Porshe for the P2 in the American LeMans as well. | ||
The_rock Member Username: The_rock Post Number: 1714 Registered: 11-2003 |
Is the actual race-area of the track going to be WIDENED at all so cars can actually pass each other rather than another practically single-file, somewhat boring, race? | ||
Skulker Member Username: Skulker Post Number: 3781 Registered: 10-2003 |
The course is returning to its original configuration, the longer straight with the temporary road has been eliminated. The track will not be widened to accomodate Nascar fans who cannot appreciate true racing. Belle Isle has plenty of passing opportunities for the talented and bold. Turn 1 has always been a hot corner. To pass at turn 8, one has to begin their set up in turn 3 to stay right on the tail of fthe carahead and draft along the Strand. The sneaky can squeeze a pass by diving under at 13 or running tight inside on the slight bend after 14 to set up for turn 1. Part of the fun of a race like Belle Isle is watching the gaps between cars, watching who is faster outside of traffic and how long till they get reeled in or get completely schooled. Christian Fittipaldi's epic battle with Michael Andretti in 1996 is a perfect example. Christian went wide into turn four on caution restart, where Michael pounced decisively. Christain lost of lot of time in the marbles and then let it all hang out, setting some absolutely blistering laps in an all out effort to reel in Michael closing the gap by nearly a second a lap. Damn near worked but pushed a little too hard and bobbled again. For about a dozen brilliant laps, he was channeling his uncle. Too bad no-one in IRL can drift an open wheeler like Paul Tracey used to do in turn three. | ||
The_rock Member Username: The_rock Post Number: 1716 Registered: 11-2003 |
Skulker, I look foreward to a ride with you on the track. Answer me this (please). Is there room on the straight-aways to pass or just in the curves? | ||
Irish_mafia Member Username: Irish_mafia Post Number: 877 Registered: 10-2003 |
Thanks for the great analysis Skulker. We could use a lot more of that in the local media. | ||
Detourdetroit Member Username: Detourdetroit Post Number: 287 Registered: 10-2003 |
olmstead is turning in his grave. but he wrote off his detroit plan anyway. i actually think it's kind of cool to have the race back on belle isle. maybe the next round of construction can include streetcar track, which would add another challenge to the course - euro style... | ||
Skulker Member Username: Skulker Post Number: 3787 Registered: 10-2003 |
quote: The track is wide enough to have cars run two abreast comfortably at all points, A large portion of the track can accomodate three to four abreast. See the first video below. Think about it for a moment. If there were no places to pass, how do cars get lapped? Typically at Detroit, 1/2 of the field is NOT on the lead lap, meaning that half the other cars have already passed them somehow somewhere. Watch this video, there is plenty of room to pass, the track is just unforgiving. If you slide you crash, there is no safe run-off on to grass. Not a track for the less than talented. Separates the men from the boys etc etc. I have bad feeling some of the GT classes in ALMS are going to turn the track into a giant pinball machine. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =v_6G5j5Z_r8 Beep beep http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =O72PmQdhX-c Oh how the mighty have fallen http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =05vLC_zjPpY RIP, my good man, RIP http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =8urxj94ral0&mode=related&sear ch= Oh, the good old days... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =_ruh7H5OH8w | ||
Susanarosa Member Username: Susanarosa Post Number: 1445 Registered: 11-2003 |
Ahh, watching those just made me feel 18 all over again. I was listening to Blundell's radio at that time, Billy was not a happy boy. | ||
El_jimbo Member Username: El_jimbo Post Number: 93 Registered: 12-2006 |
Skulker, While I'm not much of a racing fan and therefore really have no interest in what is and isn't "true racing", wouldn't it be a good thing for the Belle Isle track to accomodate NASCAR regardless? NASCAR currently only runs on two road courses (Watkins Glen in NY and Infineon in CA). NASCAR would do well to further diversify itself from being an almost strictly oval circuit by adding another road course. It would also be wise for NASCAR to bring an event to Detroit because its three biggest sponsors are the Big 3 if I'm not mistaken. What better way to please your sponsors than by adding a race that is MUCH closer to their HQ than what MIS is? It would be a BIG boost for Detroit to have a NASCAR event within city limits. NASCAR has a HUGE fan base and a NASCAR event at Belle Isle would bring in big crowds and revenue to the local area. Plus, it would bring in a group of tourists that at this point, are less likely to come to Detroit without an event such as NASCAR to bring them in. No matter what you think of the quality or style of racing comparing one league to another, if you want to look at it from the city's perspective, wouldn't it be better to accomodate all the racing leagues instead of just one? How much additional revenue would be generated from 100,000 people coming to the metro area for a weekend of NASCAR racing on Belle Isle? | ||
93typhoon Member Username: 93typhoon Post Number: 15 Registered: 04-2006 |
once the track / paddock is complete - it would be nice to get another couple races a year - maybe an scca weekend etc. NASCAR is not my type of racing but would be great for the city | ||
93typhoon Member Username: 93typhoon Post Number: 16 Registered: 04-2006 |
Or how about a track day car show type event - the Sunday after the dream cruise? | ||
Susanarosa Member Username: Susanarosa Post Number: 1446 Registered: 11-2003 |
It's my understanding (although Skulker is much more of an expert) that NASCAR would need much, much more paddock and pit room than Belle Isle can currently afford to "give up." Have you ever been in the pits or paddock of a NASCAR race? Aside from having many more teams to accomodate, the cars and teams and mechanics and work areas take up much more space than the open wheel or ALMS cars do. That, and adding another road course probably isn't really high on the list of NASCAR's list right now. Especially since most of the drivers use "fill-ins" for road courses. (Is Belle Isle is still technically a street course?) | ||
Hans57 Member Username: Hans57 Post Number: 95 Registered: 05-2006 |
I don't know how many people will come to Belle Isle for IRL, but it seems that the 100,000 people for NASCAR would destroy it. The mass amounts of grandstands alone would call for much compromise. Plus, NASCAR blows. | ||
El_jimbo Member Username: El_jimbo Post Number: 94 Registered: 12-2006 |
93typhoon, I agree about NASCAR. Hey, even if they are rednecks, their money is still green, right? Personally, I think they should try and talk NASCAR into a mid-may race in Detroit that would happen the same weekend as the Downtown Hoedown. That way you can cross promote these two big "country" events together and it will give the NASCAR fans a reason to stay and spend money downtown when the racing isn't going on. Just a thought. | ||
Susanarosa Member Username: Susanarosa Post Number: 1447 Registered: 11-2003 |
Giving Michigan three NASCAR races in three months? Why don't ya'll learn a bit about the sport before you start throwing out these grandly unfeasible ideas. | ||
Hans57 Member Username: Hans57 Post Number: 96 Registered: 05-2006 |
El_jimbo, Excellent idea, get some of the "Strangers" downtown. (Message edited by hans57 on April 19, 2007) | ||
Gumby Member Username: Gumby Post Number: 1564 Registered: 11-2003 |
NASCAR and sport do not belong in the same post, Susanarosa. | ||
El_jimbo Member Username: El_jimbo Post Number: 95 Registered: 12-2006 |
Susanarossa, Was that "y'all" in your post intentional? | ||
Skulker Member Username: Skulker Post Number: 3789 Registered: 10-2003 |
While I fully agree there should be more races on the Island for economic benefit, visitor attraction and selfish race fan reasons, I don't see it happening for a number of practical reasons. I don't see NASCAR ever doing a street track. I think the bump and run style of racing in NASCAR would be a complete disaster on a street course. At least on road courses there is plenty of run off space. There are all sorts of other opportunities including vintage racing, any number of SCCA pro classes like SPEED GT, a resurrected Trans Am, Grand Am(24 hrs Daytona sanctioning body), Champ Car. Good luck getting Champ Car on the Island now that IRL is there. I am sure neither faction would be interested in that and I would be surprised if IRL does not have some sort of non-compete clause in their contract with the City. Ditto ALMS and Grand AM. The track is eminently unsuitable for motorcycle racing. For the remaining opportunities of vintage and SCCA pro classes, the biggest challenge to hosting more races on BI is the cost and time to set up and tear down the bridges, the stands and not least, the jersey barriers. Unless there was some other weekend combined event, I don't see there being more than one race a year on BI. The only way to make it cheaper and easier for club and other racing is to have semi or fully permanent features like grandstands, bridges and long stretches of walls / armco installed. Don't see that happening any times soon....scratch that, ever. I don't think anyone would be keen to see permanent fixtures of that scale and scope on the Island for 3 uses a year. | ||
Susanarosa Member Username: Susanarosa Post Number: 1450 Registered: 11-2003 |
quote: Auto Racing is a sport. quote: No. | ||
Quozl Member Username: Quozl Post Number: 457 Registered: 07-2005 |
Looks like that non-union labor is doing a bang up job. Keep up the good work fellas! | ||
Dds Member Username: Dds Post Number: 214 Registered: 10-2006 |
quote: Way to bring your petty little arguments over from another thread. | ||
Quozl Member Username: Quozl Post Number: 460 Registered: 07-2005 |
Dds wrote: quote: No way brother, simply an observation. | ||
Gumby Member Username: Gumby Post Number: 1566 Registered: 11-2003 |
Auto racing is not a sport. Does it take skill? Yes, a lot of it but still not a sport. I would describe it as a competition much like cheerleading and golf. | ||
The_rock Member Username: The_rock Post Number: 1717 Registered: 11-2003 |
Skulker---A picture ( video) speaks a thousand words! Many thanks for the clarification. I will order my ticket. | ||
Detourdetroit Member Username: Detourdetroit Post Number: 288 Registered: 10-2003 |
I have a modest proposal: What about ALL of the professional racing classes going green? I may be missing something obvious, but wouldn't it be pretty straightforward to convert racing engines to alternate fuel sources? Closed tracks and fairly limited locales facilitate the ability for vehicles to utilize some other source... It would be such a powerful statement and would give the NASCAR crowd something to think about... | ||
Awfavre Member Username: Awfavre Post Number: 112 Registered: 08-2005 |
Auto racing is not a sport? Please. The physical exertion involved in driving one of these vehicles is tremendous, & anyone who’s ever been in a speeding car on a challenging road (let alone a true race car on a racing course) knows this. It’s not for the faint of heart, either physically or mentally. | ||
Jimaz Member Username: Jimaz Post Number: 1943 Registered: 12-2005 |
quote:I have, in a sportscar.  Isn't it just semantics though? | ||
Ndavies Member Username: Ndavies Post Number: 2556 Registered: 10-2003 |
IRL cars use ethanol as their fuel. Ethanol is a renewable fuel source. | ||
El_jimbo Member Username: El_jimbo Post Number: 97 Registered: 12-2006 |
NASCAR doesn't even use unleaded fuel. | ||
Burnsie Member Username: Burnsie Post Number: 949 Registered: 11-2003 |
Gumby wrote, "...still not a sport. I would describe it as a competition much like cheerleading and golf." Here we go again. We had this discussion some months back, and once again I've dragged over to the computer my copy of the 4th ed. of the American Heritage Dictionary. The first definition given for "sport" is: "Physical activity that is governed by a set of rules or customs and often engaged in competitively." By definition, golf, autoracing and cheerleading fit that description. And I'd bet that every other dictionary has essentially the same definition. | ||
Kenp Member Username: Kenp Post Number: 430 Registered: 03-2006 |
I would wager, Susanarosa, that the Nascar driver is every bit as good at road racing then the IRL driver. Your statement that most Nascar drivers use "fill-ins" for road tracks is uninformed. IRL is average at road racing. It began as oval track racing trying to cash in on the Nascar success. However I look forward to race weekend. All car racing is good, open wheel or not. Calling Nascar a hillbilly sport is stupid, we are every bit NASCAR here as they are in North Carolina. Damn we made the cars remember. Try going to the many 1/2 mile or 3/8 mile tracks in our state, thats definitely "racing". You want real open wheel cars, get the Formula One series back. Paul Tracy couldnt hang. | ||
Irish_mafia Member Username: Irish_mafia Post Number: 880 Registered: 10-2003 |
"IRL cars use ethanol as their fuel. Ethanol is a renewable fuel source." Now From Our Right Wing Sponsor: Made from food, thus removing a low-cost food source from the world market, thus causing mal-nourished children and starvation across the world. ahhh... if we had only allowed drilling in Anwar where no human would dare reside, additional drilling off the coast of California where so many of those evil foreign cars consume the fuel, more refineries in the US for the very abundant oil available in the world, a common grade of gasoline and common fuel laws across the country.... we could have reduced the cost of gas, our dependence on terrorist nations as suppliers and avoided the feel-good PC solutions that are now starving the global community. Thank you. Back to the races. | ||
Sister Member Username: Sister Post Number: 21 Registered: 01-2005 |
The second set of pictures is at Sunset Point and is being done by the Belle Isle Women's Committee. The brick bathroom is going to be replaced with one in keeping with the historic buildings on Belle Isle. That area is slated for plantings, picnic tables, benches, etc. | ||
Rocket_city Member Username: Rocket_city Post Number: 228 Registered: 04-2006 |
Cool! I'm going out picture taking on Saturday on my bike, so I'm glad I saw these so I can go see for myself. | ||
Themapman Member Username: Themapman Post Number: 238 Registered: 10-2003 |
This thing is going to be a complete disaster. You think no one went before when CART raced there? The IRL are like locusts...they kill everything. CART raced in St. Petersburg in 2003, and drew 70,000 on raceday. In three years the IRL hasn't drawn more than 35,000. The race at MIS? The IRL's drawing 15,000 where CART drew 100,000. Loudon, NH doesn't have a OW race, nor does Gateway, Phoenix, Fontana...all went from CART to IRL to done. Pikes Peak and Nazareth got closed and plowed under after going from CART to the IRL. Champ Car (CART's new name) just drew 90,000 on raceday and 180,000 for the weekend in Long Beach after drawing 150,000 in Vegas the week before. The IRL drew 30,000 at Homestead, FL and 35,000 at St. Pete the next week. The capper is that Champ Car has those customers that pay, while Homestead only SOLD 800 tickets for its race, the rest were freebees, at St. Pete they didn't even check for tickets on the way in. And it's on Labor Day when everyone's up north. Sorry, but this is going to suck, big time. | ||
Susanarosa Member Username: Susanarosa Post Number: 1459 Registered: 11-2003 |
First of all Kenp, I never called NASCAR a hillbilly sport, so you're out of line. Secondly, why does Boris Said run so many of the road courses for NASCAR if they don't use fill-ins? But my point was that NASCAR is not (and I think that any real NASCAR fan would agree to this) a street or road course sport. And that three races in three months in Michigan is a silly idea. I love watching Watkins Glen, if only because it truly separates the men from the boys. But even you have to admit that most of the oval track guys phone the road courses in for the points. (Message edited by susanarosa on April 20, 2007) | ||
Royce Member Username: Royce Post Number: 2192 Registered: 07-2004 |
I've never understood why the Grand Prix race goes in the opposite direction than the way cars normally drive on Belle Isle. Is it because the race was originally a formula one race and it originated in europe? | ||
Miss_cleo Member Username: Miss_cleo Post Number: 525 Registered: 05-2005 |
I hate Auto racing, just like watching traffic to me.....but if it brings people and money downtown, so be it. But you'd never find me anywhere near it. | ||
Spider3455 Member Username: Spider3455 Post Number: 1 Registered: 08-2005 |
NASCAR actually finally switched to unleaded fuel this year. (Message edited by spider3455 on April 20, 2007) | ||
Kenp Member Username: Kenp Post Number: 434 Registered: 03-2006 |
Chill Susanarosa, the only thing I said about you was your comment and I quote, "Especially since most of the drivers (Nascar) use "fill-ins" for road courses. Were did you get this info. Boris Said is trying to run all Nascar events. But he isnt going to replace any driver for a road race. There are 40 some teams that qualify in Nascar, anyone is welcome. Some teams add a car for these races and get a ringer to come in. But for Nascar driver to be replaced for a road track is not going to happen unless he is near the bottom of the points. Now everything else you said I agree with. I for one hate seeing Stock cars on a road track, and I hate seeing IRL cars at a oval like Richmond Intl. Sorry if I offended. | ||
Susanarosa Member Username: Susanarosa Post Number: 1460 Registered: 11-2003 |
quote: Bingo. And that happens all the time. http://sports.yahoo.com/nascar /news?slug=db-statssonoma06220 6&prov=yhoo&type=lgns And I apologize that I didn't know Said was trying to run all the races this year. After Trans-Am went out to pasture I have only seen him as a "fill-in." You must follow NASCAR closely. But I think we've been saying the same thing, only differently. | ||
Kenp Member Username: Kenp Post Number: 436 Registered: 03-2006 |
Jazz fest is on the same weekend as the race. I think thats a good thing for the race. It should be a fun weekend. Susanarosa, I dont follow NASCAR that close. My brother used to work with Ford on PR in NASCAR and now he does the same thing with Formula One. Thats basically how I became a racing fan. | ||
Rhymeswithrawk Member Username: Rhymeswithrawk Post Number: 733 Registered: 11-2005 |
Sweet! A parking lot in Detroit. Finally! I was wondering when we were going to get one of those. You'd think Ilitch woulda made one by now. Still, having to park on Belle Isle and walk downtown is going to be inconvenient. | ||
Peachlaser Member Username: Peachlaser Post Number: 86 Registered: 08-2006 |
As for the 'sport' in racing, I've heard it put this way. In football, teams run a play at full speed for 15-30 seconds and then walk back to the huddle and rest, in baseball, you have a few minutes during a game where you are running and the rest of the time you are standing around. In racing, you are 'on' 100% of the time, because if you are not, you can get hurt very badly or even kill yourself or someone else. And this goes on for hours without let up. As for relevancy, I think the ALMS prototype endurance racers are the most relevant of the bunch. These cars can drive day or night, rain or shine and when wrecked, many times they can be put back together to race again. In most series, 500 miles is the limit. In the 24 hours of Le Mans, these cars go over 3,000 miles in a race that goes on whether rain or shine, day or night. NASCAB, while the most popular, is the least relevant. These cars are no longer built in Detroit and modified as they are all built in the shops of the teams to a strict specification so that they are all the same. They are not using 'modern' engines but are still using 1950's technology with carbureted push-rod V-8s. The ALMS by contrast, is running modern prototype engines with different fuels. There are diesels, cars running with E85, a biodiesel engine, and there was even a gas-electric hybrid that ran at one time. So, I think having the ALMS coming to Detroit is 100 times more relevant to the future of Detroit and the automobile industry than having NASCAR there. | ||
Flybydon Member Username: Flybydon Post Number: 123 Registered: 01-2005 |
That’s a big hunk of cement.  | ||
Ltdave Member Username: Ltdave Post Number: 57 Registered: 09-2006 |
Jeez! what a waste of grass... i took my new wife to the 1996 Grand Prix. we got some of the WRIF Bleacher seats (bleacher E i believe)... other than the good day downtown, we were both kind of bored. im not into roundy-round and the drags take way too long between runs... the day was beautifully sunny and warm, and there were lots of people enjoying the atmosphere. i was just a bit uninspired by the race... david | ||
Emu_steve Member Username: Emu_steve Post Number: 307 Registered: 11-2006 |
I'm a real newbie on this, but how much is it costing and who is paying? How much change is being made to the Isle? | ||
Susanarosa Member Username: Susanarosa Post Number: 1493 Registered: 11-2003 |
Actually David, the 1996 race began in the rain. The track was so damp they even started single file. But by the time Andretti snuck past Christian Fittipaldi for the win, it was sunny. Emu_steve, the changes are being done by the Downtown Detroit Partnership Here is a list of the changes: http://www.detroitgp.com/event _facts.asp | ||
Gistok Member Username: Gistok Post Number: 4344 Registered: 08-2004 |
Holy Crap! That is a lot of cement... 450,000 sq. feet of paddock area! Maybe they can use it for a giant skating rink in the winter! | ||
Mdoyle Member Username: Mdoyle Post Number: 83 Registered: 10-2006 |
A skating rink would be great. They could actually do two rinks and have hockey on one. Campus Martius is just too small to do anything fun on. | ||
3alarm Member Username: 3alarm Post Number: 6 Registered: 09-2006 |
i have some friends that ride those road motorcycles. i think they should have that type of racing there too. | ||
Gplimpton Member Username: Gplimpton Post Number: 23 Registered: 05-2007 |
that's a lot of cement. | ||
Bulletmagnet Member Username: Bulletmagnet Post Number: 665 Registered: 01-2007 |
I think this re-paving scheme is going to be a boon to the weekend bikers. They really will be able to tear it up from a launch pad like that one. | ||
Peachlaser Member Username: Peachlaser Post Number: 88 Registered: 08-2006 |
Detroitdetuor, you ask, "I have a modest proposal: What about ALL of the professional racing classes going green? I may be missing something obvious, but wouldn't it be pretty straightforward to convert racing engines to alternate fuel sources?" I agree with you. I am a big fan of endurance prototype racing (like the ALMS that is coming to Belle Isle) and they have experimented with alternative fuels and are using a blend this year. Back in 1999 they had a Panoz gas/electric hybrid nicknamed 'Sparky' that was a big fan favorite. The series has been dominated of late by Audi who switched last year to a Twin-turbo Diesel V-12. They just won Le Mans again this weekend in a battle with the new Puegot Diesel V-12. Some predict that this race will be a dud and a failure. I think it is already a success in that it is bringing a lot of the world's latest automotive technology to Detroit's doorstep. This race is for the thinkers, designers and decision-makers in Detroit that are looking for answers to problems that now face us. So, if all the fans do head north or don't come out, maybe it will leave more room for the key people in the industry to look, observe and ask questions. The ALMS is known for its open paddocks, friendly teams and letting people get close to the cars, of which many are technical works of art. In supporting this form of racing, I have out-spokenly proposed that it must prove its relevance to real-world challenges. These cars must be fast and efficient at the same time. They must be safe and must last day and night, rain or shine. To me, they are one of the most-relevant series racing. I have also been a fan of solar-prototype racing. These cars must get 100% of their energy from the sun and convert it into electrical power. Today, these cars can reach 70+ mph. I think this series and the ALMS would make great partners. Road Atlanta has a locally enforced quiet time on Sunday morning and racing engines can not be started. The solar cars are quiet and this would make an excellent time to display the technology. Several years ago when the solar cars finished a cross-country endurance race just about the time there was an ALMS race at Laguna Seca, I tried to arrange an exhibition and found the contact person at the Dept. of Energy and the track and ALMS. It did not come through. I bet if Penske had been involved, it would of happened! All of this stuff is dangerous and, as always, I hope and pray for a safe event for all. My hope is that the Detroit automotive geniuses turn out to observe, get inspired and create new designs that will lead the automotive world. |
