  Upinottawa Member Username: Upinottawa Post Number: 832 Registered: 09-2005 |
The naysayers will claim that the program will be too expensive for a declining, deficit-laden city, but tell that to the people of Kalamazoo. I suspect that people around the world with connections to Detroit will be willing to donate to "Detroit Promise". http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs .dll/article?AID=/20070514/NEW S05/705140367 | ||
Andylinn Member Username: Andylinn Post Number: 407 Registered: 04-2006 |
well, when Sharon McPhail announced something like this as part of her platform a year or two ago, people laughed. in many ways, rightfully so. i really don't see the money coming from anywhere. i think something more practical would be a full scholarship for anyone who goes to school in detroit and commits to STAY in detroit. it would be a much smaller budget and would have a greater direct benefit. | ||
Ndavies Member Username: Ndavies Post Number: 2610 Registered: 10-2003 |
That's all fine and dandy. It is a great program. However, Kzoo was given a bucket load of money by a private entity to do this. In Detroit we don't even have enough money to get the kids though to graduation. If you can't afford to even pay for the kids going through the public school system, where in the hell are you going to get the money to put them through college. | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1177 Registered: 06-2006 |
yeah, I thought I remember reading something about some anonymous donor that gave the city a HUGE chunk of change for this program...that is the ONLY way this can be done... because otherwise, it makes no sense to tax the city's residents just to give the money right back to them for college education...why wouldn't you just let them keep their money to pay for college with in the first place? | ||
Gmich99 Member Username: Gmich99 Post Number: 188 Registered: 11-2005 |
I agree with Ndavies; Kzoo didn't make the decision to fund its citizens' education, a donor decided. Further, there are too many young people in this city not fit for college. Whether it be the schools, the parents, the community, or a combination of things, too many DPS graduates that I attended college with were not prepared for a college education. (Message edited by gmich99 on May 14, 2007) | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 753 Registered: 04-2006 |
"Whether it be the schools, the parents, the community, or a combination of things, many DPS graduates that I attended college with were not prepared for a college education." What makes you the expert to make such a statement? | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1178 Registered: 06-2006 |
Also, such a program wouldn't produce any better results for minorities than Affirmative Action produced, which not only provides a virtual guarantee of access to college for minorities who complete high school, but also results in tons of scholarship and financial aid opportunities...but even with all of that, very few have been motivated enough to put in the effort to take advantage of these opportunities... it kind of goes back to the Bill Cosby rant...individuals that place higher priorities on sports, fashion, music and "acting hard" than on education, self-respect, and self-improvement simply won't succeed... | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 755 Registered: 04-2006 |
"Also, such a program wouldn't produce any better results for minorities than Affirmative Action produced, which not only provides a virtual guarantee of access to college for minorities who complete high school, but also results in tons of scholarship and financial aid opportunities...but even with all of that, very few have been motivated enough to put in the effort to take advantage of these opportunities..." Better yet, what makes YOU the expert to make such a statement? | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1179 Registered: 06-2006 |
lheartthed: I have to agree with Gmich99 from my own experience... I've only had classes with three DPS students in my undergrad and LS career, and out of those, one failed out academically, the other left school because they hadn't been prepared enough in HS for the strenuous coursework and it just became too much to handle, and the third was always "lost" in class discussions, had to retake at least two courses that I know of and ended up finishing at the bottom of the class... I'm not claiming to be an expert...just making observations based on my experiences | ||
Gotdetroit Member Username: Gotdetroit Post Number: 42 Registered: 12-2005 |
I think an overall point is being missed here. That the Kalamazoo housing market is growing, more middle class families with kids are moving into the city, which will increase tax revenue, city funds, quality of life, etc., etc. It's not the be-all end-all, but, as the article suggests, the decision for some families of whether to move to the city was tipped by the existence of the Promise. This has more than just an impact on edumacation. P.S. My kids live in Kalamazoo. Started in Kindergarten. No college tuition out of my pocket. We're already brainwashing the kids to love Schools containing the words "Michigan". | ||
Gmich99 Member Username: Gmich99 Post Number: 189 Registered: 11-2005 |
Ihearthed- It is a simple observation. The sun rises in the East, and it sets in the West. There is no point to be made by searching the web data to show that Detroiters have low graduation rates at both the high school, and college level. Grammar alone is barrier to many inner-city young people. I am not asserting this is not a problem, but college isn't the place to sort out the fundamentals. | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1180 Registered: 06-2006 |
"Better yet, what makes YOU the expert to make such a statement?" Again, I never said I was...I'm stating my opinion... the article suggests that such a program has the power to motivate people to work harder if they think there are opportunities waiting for them...my argument is that AA serves (or SERVED if your talking about public MI universities) largely the same purpose... (Message edited by thejesus on May 14, 2007) | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 756 Registered: 04-2006 |
"Grammar alone is barrier to many inner-city young people." What a racist statement. I'm gonna stop the discussion here and drop a couple links for ya that might help to clarify some misconceptions. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S tandard_english http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A frican_American_English http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dialect (Message edited by iheartthed on May 14, 2007) | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1185 Registered: 06-2006 |
lheartthed: I take it you think textbooks and class discussions should be done in every English dialect, yes? btw, how many foreign languages have you learned to speak fluently so that you don't have to offend immigrants by forcing them to speak YOUR language? | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 759 Registered: 04-2006 |
"I take it you think textbooks and class discussions should be done in every English dialect, yes? " Nope. "btw, how many foreign languages have you learned to speak fluently so that you don't have to offend immigrants by forcing them to speak YOUR language?" Hablo español, ¿y tu? | ||
6nois Member Username: 6nois Post Number: 231 Registered: 11-2006 |
I think you're putting words in peoples mouths. I think the point of the links was that there are disconnects in the English language like there are in any language. As for a promise to Detroit residents, if there was a funder and you had to achieve benchmarks to get it, it may help. And you know if something was set up and it doesn't help massive amounts of people but I did help some change their existence, that's a good thing. | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1186 Registered: 06-2006 |
"Nope. " Then how can you, with a straight face, label Gmich "the racist" for suggesting that the grammar learned by inner-city young people is a hindrance to their potential to succeed in college? "Hablo español, ¿y tu?" Just one? and do you even speak it fluently? | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 760 Registered: 04-2006 |
"Then how can you, with a straight face, label Gmich "the racist" for suggesting that the grammar learned by inner-city young people is a hindrance to their potential to succeed in college? " First of all, your attempt at an analogy was way off base as languages and dialects are two different things. Maybe you should take a gander at the links as well. Second, I didn't say he was racist, I said his statement was racist. But if the shoe fits... Tercero, no importa. | ||
6nois Member Username: 6nois Post Number: 232 Registered: 11-2006 |
si hablo espanol. and no I don't speak it fluently because its hard to do with out emersion, but I can get by. I never called anyone a racist. I just made a statement about the English language, and made no judgements one way or the other. I think you just want to fight. | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1188 Registered: 06-2006 |
same question, slight variation Then how can you, with a straight face, label Gmich's statement "racist" for suggesting that the dialect learned by inner-city young people is a hindrance to their potential to succeed in college, when you don't think classes should be tought in their dialect? Explain yourself... | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1189 Registered: 06-2006 |
6nois: I wasn't addressing you...I didn't even notice your post...I'll read them after lunch | ||
Charlottepaul Member Username: Charlottepaul Post Number: 995 Registered: 10-2006 |
https://www.atdetroit.net/forum/mes sages/91697/96495.html | ||
Charlottepaul Member Username: Charlottepaul Post Number: 996 Registered: 10-2006 |
"Yeah, this definitely might be worth a shot. Test it in some Detroit neighborhood, and see how it works. If more people move into the neighborhood and more taxes are collected, it could possible fund itself along with perhaps a few neighborhood organizations or businesses helping. Why not try it? There is basically little to lose at this point." | ||
6nois Member Username: 6nois Post Number: 233 Registered: 11-2006 |
sorry Thejesus about the miscommunication. Please address who you are speaking to in the future. | ||
Upinottawa Member Username: Upinottawa Post Number: 834 Registered: 09-2005 |
Paul, exactly. Especially if the Promise Fund consists of privately funded donations. | ||
Gmich99 Member Username: Gmich99 Post Number: 190 Registered: 11-2005 |
Observing poor grammar in the inner-cities is not a racist statement. The reasons grammar in the inner-city compares so poorly to standards in the English language may be related to racism. Verb confusion and other errors do not amount to a dialect. A proper understanding of the English language is a necessary collegiate skill set. It is more important that inner-city youths are prepared with the necessary skill sets, or at least one that compares favorably to their suburban peers than it is to offer a get-into-college-for-free pass. The same applies to rural communities, which compare closely to the problems faced within inner-cities. But this is of course racist nonsense. (Message edited by gmich99 on May 14, 2007) | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 761 Registered: 04-2006 |
"same question, slight variation Then how can you, with a straight face, label Gmich's statement "racist" for suggesting that the dialect learned by inner-city young people is a hindrance to their potential to succeed in college, when you don't think classes should be tought in their dialect? Explain yourself..." That's not what you asked before. I had many college instructors who could barely speak English in any dialect, so that's really beside the point. There are two angles to look at this. One point is that too often black and latin kids dialect is directly linked to perceptions about their intelligence, which in turn causes their peers to (consciously or unconsciously) marginalize them when they go into the mainstream. Second, these standardized tests are ALWAYS written with a bias towards the "standard english dialect" (i.e. the dialect you most likely pick up being raised/educated in a suburban predominantly white environment). There have been studies to show that when the language bias is accounted for there is less variation of testing scores. | ||
Gmich99 Member Username: Gmich99 Post Number: 191 Registered: 11-2005 |
In sum, language matters and going off on racism rants doesn't effectuate your points. | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 763 Registered: 04-2006 |
"In sum, language matters and going off on racism rants doesn't effectuate your points." No, your statement was still racist. I just explained to you why. | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1197 Registered: 06-2006 |
so you think it's a problem for inner-city young people that standardized test scores are written in the "standard English dialect", yet you don't think it's reasonable for them to learn this dialect nor do you think such tests should be written in other dialects... so what's your solution? (other than to call people racists) | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 767 Registered: 04-2006 |
"nor do you think such tests should be written in other dialects..." I did not say that. As for everything else, take it or leave it. I'm just trying to help you understand a little more than you already knew. | ||
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1 Post Number: 9140 Registered: 10-2003 |
quote: You can't do that for someone that knows everything. Now Iheart if I am understanding you correctly you are saying that the language barrier is a problem that causes many intelligent children's ability to be marginalized. While we need to address grammar and language deficiencies in poor areas (counting rural) we should not dismiss the intelligence of children due to this language barrier. Am I understanding properly? | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 769 Registered: 04-2006 |
"Am I understanding properly?" Close. "While we need to address grammar and language deficiencies in poor areas (counting rural) we should not dismiss the intelligence of children due to this language barrier. " I'm saying that these aren't deficiencies at all. It's a dialect and to say that it's wrong is like saying someone with an English accent has a speech impediment. | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1200 Registered: 06-2006 |
"I did not say that" I asked you above if you think classes, test books should be taught in every dialect and you answered, "Nope" are we discriminating now? do you think they should just be taught in select dialect? what's your solution? please fill us in... | ||
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1 Post Number: 9142 Registered: 10-2003 |
quote: I agree with part of what you say but can't agree with this. We live in a society that has a standard language. There may be deviations to some extent but in order to succeed in our society it is imperative that people can communicate on the same level. Some nuances are fine but a different dialect will always be an impediment to success and is something that can and should be addressed IMO. | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1201 Registered: 06-2006 |
JT1: try to keep up, ok? lheart's position is already out on the table...I'm asking him what he thinks the solution is, and thus far he's avoided the question... | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 770 Registered: 04-2006 |
Well, strictly speaking in this instance, it's not the way it is taught that is the problem. It's the way that it is tested. | ||
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1 Post Number: 9144 Registered: 10-2003 |
thejesus - I am trying to get a clarification of people's position on this topic. It is a much better way to address it than just throw out the same rhetoric. I certainly hope that you don't plan to do any arbitration work. | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1203 Registered: 06-2006 |
not quite...you were tying to imply that I was failing to understand L's position and that you did understand it...go back and read your post if you forgot already...the funniest part is, it pretty much backfired since YOU turned out to be the one who didn't understand it... P.S. You don't need to worry about the line of work I'm going into as people like you are unable to afford such services anyhow...trust me on this one (Message edited by thejesus on May 14, 2007) | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 771 Registered: 04-2006 |
"I agree with part of what you say but can't agree with this. We live in a society that has a standard language. There may be deviations to some extent but in order to succeed in our society it is imperative that people can communicate on the same level. Some nuances are fine but a different dialect will always be an impediment to success and is something that can and should be addressed IMO." But whose nuances* get excused? Society seems a lot more forgiving to the speech patterns of the Korean with an H-1B work visa than to the cleaning lady who grew up on Linwood and Davison. *I added the asterisk because there are recognizable linguistic patterns for both groups. Thus, I personally wouldn't categorize it as a nuance. | ||
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1 Post Number: 9146 Registered: 10-2003 |
I wasn't implying that you were failing to understand. I blatantly stated that you know everything and the rest was to see if I could get clarification of Iheart's point to help move the conversation along. I did concede that you know everything so you should be pretty happy with that. Beyond that I made no implications about what you did or did not understand. The funniest part is that you completely inferred something in my post that did not exist. Not too good for a budding attorney. | ||
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1 Post Number: 9147 Registered: 10-2003 |
quote: True but the Korean with an H-1B work visa probably (just my assumption) is coming in with an education that is sought after in their specific field. In many or most cases they received their degrees in their country of origin so the languange nuances were not at play since the education trumps the language barrier in this situation. I see them as different situations. I am not saying it is fair but it is reality. Coming in with a needed skill will get latitude on language barriers, language barriers however will be a problem in attaining the initial education for the person on Linwood and Davidson. | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1204 Registered: 06-2006 |
"But whose nuances* get excused? Society seems a lot more forgiving to the speech patterns of the Korean with an H-1B work visa than to the cleaning lady who grew up on Linwood and Davison." so what solution do you propose to what you stated above? calling people racists only get you so far, which isn't far at all | ||
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1 Post Number: 9148 Registered: 10-2003 |
quote: A laughable and ignorant assumption. Nothing less than I would expect from you. If you want to compare finances feel free to e-mail at jt1_detroit@yahoo.com. I will happily compare salary, current investments, equity in your home or any other barometer of wealth that you would like. | ||
Gmich99 Member Username: Gmich99 Post Number: 192 Registered: 11-2005 |
Iheartthed- Observations of real and consequential issues identified predominately with specific races are not racist. Stamping observations of real issues of great consequence as racist prevents the acceptance of those issues and the commitment towards resolving the issues. I fear that even addressing those who scream racism only gives their false color of racism legitimacy, or at least gives rise to enough doubt about legitimate issues as to mitigate their possible value. This gives rise to the question of whether you seek to impose racism, or seek to resolve the issues created by racism. The language spoken in the inner city is a real and consequential issue that is a detriment in standardized testing, collegiate success, and employment opportunities. Regardless of the reasons, many of which I attribute to racism, the impact is overwhelmingly negative. Undergraduate institutions expect a comprehensive understanding of Standard English regardless of the subject. The emphasis is greater in most post-graduate subjects. Employers expect employees that can communicate to clients and customers in the Standard English. It is my personal experience in undergraduate, and in law school, inter alia, language skills is a tremendous disadvantage. I’ve read papers of DPS students in undergraduate as a classmate, as a tutor, and listened to debates in student government. The oral language barriers distinguish themselves further when put to paper. While you suggest that when the language differences are accounted for, which would be near impossible to measure accurately, it does not change that there still remains a recognizable variation. Further, English is core collegiate subjects where there is no room for variation. The disadvantage of inner-city education is not limited to language, as this debate has been framed. The objective standardized test results, which are the best and only indicator of educational success among large population groups, show significant variations in all subjects tested between suburban and urban students. Most agree (I hope) that education should be equal across all races, sexes, and ethnicities within this country, but we should not advocate a system that creates the illusion of education. Should there be money available to send Detroiters to college, yes. The US would benefit further by a universal education system. But this system should begin with the fundamental building blocks to prepare students for later more advanced education. It should also be based on merit, not geography, or race. Getting hung up on finding racism around every corner leaves a person where they started. Racism is a real issue, that has created different standards of education for different people, but failing to identify the problems that gap in education has created and committing to resolving it is a detriment to everyone who repeats that failure. At the end of the day it doesn’t matter whether or not it is created by racism; it only matters if it can be overcome. I have nothing more to say on this matter. You can take your racist pointing finger to the mirror and enlighten your dim day. | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1206 Registered: 06-2006 |
"If you want to compare finances feel free to e-mail at jt1_detroit@yahoo.com. I will happily compare salary, current investments, equity in your home or any other barometer of wealth that you would like." JT: while I could care less (and have serious doubts) as to how your personal wealth measures up against a typical Walmart store clerk let alone my own, I can tell you with virtual certainty that my statement above is accurate, and therefore you need not worry what field I'm going into... cheers, mate (Message edited by thejesus on May 14, 2007) | ||
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1 Post Number: 9152 Registered: 10-2003 |
As typical you make incorrect assumptions then claim that you don't care about the truth. A wonderful tactic to ignore the fact that you often speak about topics that you have no idea about. For a budding attorney (talking up the 'whopping' $18K tuition he pays) you certainly have little or no regard for facts. | ||
Charlottepaul Member Username: Charlottepaul Post Number: 999 Registered: 10-2006 |
"The disadvantage of inner-city education is not limited to language, as this debate has been framed. The objective standardized test results, which are the best and only indicator of educational success among large population groups, show significant variations in all subjects tested between suburban and urban students." It has always seemed to me that the Kalamazoo Promise was less about trying to improve the public schools than actually simply trying to get people to move back into the community. Would not the purpose of doing a Kalamazoo Promise in part or all of Detroit be to encourage people to move back into the city? Seems that these issues of race/language that you all are debating has little to do with this thread. Am I really missing something here? | ||
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1 Post Number: 9153 Registered: 10-2003 |
I see it as a two pronged benefit: You increase population specifically families which will help the tax base and the sustainability of the the city. By having this option there is hope for every child to do well in school. Hope if a huge deterrent in many cities. While having this option won't help every kid it certainly offers the opportunity for anyone willing to do work. A major disadvantage in many poor/urban areas is the lack of hope for a future. This fund makes it possible for every child, regardless of socio-economic situation to have hope and a goal to strive for. It is an amazing program and any city whether it be Detroit, Warren, Dearborn, Inkster, or rural poor areas through the state any city would greatly benefit from it. | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1207 Registered: 06-2006 |
"talking up the 'whopping' $18K tuition he pays" I don't recall ever "talking it up"...I simply used the figure to counter you (again) incorrect assumption that I had no vested interest in the city...but since we're on the topic, and since you brought it up and are acting like $18k is a small amount to pay for tuition, how does that figure compare to what you paid in tuition (assuming you did)? Keep in mind that's one year's expense and it's JUST tution...no books, supplies or living expenses...while WSU has low ls tuition due to state subsidies, I doubt your expenses even approach that amount (Message edited by thejesus on May 14, 2007) | ||
Susanarosa Member Username: Susanarosa Post Number: 1484 Registered: 11-2003 |
I think we now have proof that thejesus has an incredibly teeny penis. | ||
Quozl Member Username: Quozl Post Number: 606 Registered: 07-2005 |
quote: Yea, I remember back in the olden days, my peoples migrated from Alabama and Mississippi to Detroit where work and jobs were located, now they just stay in the same god-forsaken city generation after generation living on the public dole complainin' and bitchin'. No reason to move back south where the jobs are now, cuz they will be back in Michigan in a few decades or so. | ||
Goat Member Username: Goat Post Number: 9425 Registered: 10-2003 |
But does he drive a "beemer" or whatever the fuck that guy in here bragged about driving? | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1208 Registered: 06-2006 |
"I think we now have proof that thejesus has an incredibly teeny penis." I think you confused me with the guy whose trying to compare the size of his bank account against everyone else's | ||
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1 Post Number: 9154 Registered: 10-2003 |
quote: Just yours since you made the claim that you will be so important and demand such a rate that I could not afford it in my wildest dreams. Beyond countering that silly argument I don't really care what anyone else makes or what anyone else has. | ||
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1 Post Number: 9155 Registered: 10-2003 |
quote: I wish I could be that optimistic. | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1210 Registered: 06-2006 |
"Just yours since you made the claim that you will be so important and demand such a rate that I could not afford it in my wildest dreams. " all things are relative, JT... compared to you, yes I will... compared to most people, probably not so much... | ||
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1 Post Number: 9156 Registered: 10-2003 |
Does it feel like your penis is getting larger as you type? | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1211 Registered: 06-2006 |
"Does it feel like your penis is getting larger as you type?" JT: I think you're confusing this board with those other sites you like to visit again... | ||
Charlottepaul Member Username: Charlottepaul Post Number: 1002 Registered: 10-2006 |
Sure is difficult to have a somewhat serious discussion... | ||
Detroitplanner Member Username: Detroitplanner Post Number: 1247 Registered: 04-2006 |
I've always thought that the K-zoo promise was a stroke of genius and good for the families that donated the money for it. Something has to be done to make older cities more competitive. What I hear here is a lot of cart before horse arguements. The fact is, bright kids will shine in what ever environment you put them in. One of the bad things about the City of Detroit is that it is a sink, and everything settles at the lowest common denomonator. the K-zoo promise helps to make the City attractive to families. It will take some time for the school district to balance things out; but in the end, it does stabilize property values and help to curb sprawl. | ||
Detroit_stylin Member Username: Detroit_stylin Post Number: 4081 Registered: 10-2003 |
Just noticed the name spelled kalazazoo.... lol | ||
Mayor_sekou Member Username: Mayor_sekou Post Number: 846 Registered: 09-2006 |
How did this thread from a good question about Detroit following the Kzoo plan to penis size of thejesus? Good Lord. lol Detroit schools, at least when I was a student, had the compact program that pays for tuition for any student with a 3.0 overall GPA, no disciplinary issues, over a 21 on the ACT, and good MEAP scores. Which worked fine for me, except that not all DPS schools are compact. If anything we should make this and programs like this more visible as to attract more families to DPS and the city. "I've only had classes with three DPS students in my undergrad and LS career, and out of those, one failed out academically, the other left school because they hadn't been prepared enough in HS for the strenuous coursework and it just became too much to handle, and the third was always "lost" in class discussions, had to retake at least two courses that I know of and ended up finishing at the bottom of the class... " What school did/do you go to? | ||
Michigansheik Member Username: Michigansheik Post Number: 194 Registered: 09-2005 |
i don't think anyone would be against a private fund coming forward and making a Detroit Promise. Come on private fund, where are you? Does anyone know if KPS students have increased their graduation rate? Are residents moving back to kzoo? I lived on the west side of kzoo for 5 years, nice place, and lately the east side has been getting cleaned up. | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 1219 Registered: 06-2006 |
"How did this thread from a good question about Detroit following the Kzoo plan to penis size of thejesus? Good Lord. lol " yeah, it's pretty ridiculous, I agree... basically, JT1 didn't like what I was saying so he decided to attack me personally by injecting my graduate area of study into the conversation, as he often does... then he tried to compare the size of his bank account to mine, which, according to a thread I was just reading over at Hot Fudge, he's done before on this forum (big F-ing surprise there) | ||
Mikem Member Username: Mikem Post Number: 3289 Registered: 10-2003 |
Well, he is in the 36% (35?) tax bracket. | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 773 Registered: 04-2006 |
"Mayor_sekou" What compact school did you go to? | ||
Jt1 Member Username: Jt1 Post Number: 9159 Registered: 10-2003 |
The difference is that I admit that I enjoy being a jerk here to relieve stress at the office. | ||
Mayor_sekou Member Username: Mayor_sekou Post Number: 848 Registered: 09-2006 |
I went to Murray Wright |
