Discuss Detroit Archives - Beginning January 2007 Apartments on S. Woodward, just south of 8 Mile - question... Previous Next
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Lizaanne
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Username: Lizaanne

Post Number: 3
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 - 2:16 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

About once a week I drive down Woodward to RenCen to get to work from just north of Eight Mile. On the South bound side of Woodward, just south of Eight, there is a large grouping of BEAUTIFUL brick apartments with a good deal of deco style tile work and brick work. They are set at an angle to WW. Just wondering if anyone has heard anything about anyone doing something with these? Right now they look pretty crummy inside, but I can imagine them being absolutely drop dead beautiful if someone were to take them over and do something with them instead of just letting them rot.

Hope someone knows the buildings I'm talking about.

~Liza
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E_hemingway
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Username: E_hemingway

Post Number: 1205
Registered: 11-2004
Posted on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 - 2:23 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Palmer Park maybe? Which side of Woodward is it on?
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Oliverdouglas
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Username: Oliverdouglas

Post Number: 86
Registered: 02-2006
Posted on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 - 2:24 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Money ran out, but I understand that new financing is on the way. Original plans called for two more of these buildings on that site. They are well made and are not cheap
($250k+ IIRC); I never could understand why someone would plop down that kind of cash for anything on that corner. The is/was a website for the developer, but the name escapes me.
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Lizaanne
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Username: Lizaanne

Post Number: 4
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 - 2:33 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

NO no - these are OLD buildings! On the south bound side of Woodward, just south of Eight.

Not those new townhome looking things. I'll get more detail so I'm not so wishy-washy on the location. Sorry - :-(

~Liza
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Supergay
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Username: Supergay

Post Number: 55
Registered: 05-2006
Posted on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 - 2:37 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Those are the apartments of Palmer Park that you are thinking of. By "just" south of 8 Mile I assume you mean further down at McNichols (6 Mile), right?

Once a very popular area, decline started in the 80's. Used to be Detroit's gay hub.

Last week's Metro Times had some history on the area:

http://www.metrotimes.com/edit orial/story.asp?id=10562
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Oliverdouglas
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Username: Oliverdouglas

Post Number: 87
Registered: 02-2006
Posted on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 - 2:40 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Liza-

There's those townhouse things, then St. John's Orthodox, then cemeteries, then Palmer Woods which is all single family. Could you mean just north of Six Mile? That's Palmer Park - great looking old apartment buildings in a pretty shady neighborhood. See archive for numerous old PP threads.
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Lizaanne
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Username: Lizaanne

Post Number: 6
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 - 2:43 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ok - I guess it's further south than it feels - I will drive by there tomorrow and report back with better details. :D

Duh.

~Liza
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Gotdetroit
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Username: Gotdetroit

Post Number: 66
Registered: 12-2005
Posted on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 - 2:48 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

http://www.cr.nps.gov/nr/trave l/detroit/d33.htm

When I first saw them, I thought they were beautiful too. Reminded me (don't know why) of the Dakota in New York.
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Exmotowner
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Username: Exmotowner

Post Number: 292
Registered: 06-2005
Posted on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 - 3:23 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yes Lizaanne, Those used to be very nice apartments and were heavily populated by the gay community. Crime got so bad we all finally had enough and left.

Still say if I owned one (or more) of those buildings, I would be advertising in the gay magazines and begging for them to come back.
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Lizaanne
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Username: Lizaanne

Post Number: 7
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 - 3:30 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

YES YES YES!!!!

Thank you Gotdetroit - those are what I'm talking about! They are further down WW than I thought.

Ok - I'll go read this page now. Gorgeous buildings they are - could be so very grand again if someone put some money into them.

~Liza
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Jfried
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Username: Jfried

Post Number: 990
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 - 3:37 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

There actually are people investing in that area. This place is one of the best values in the city. http://www.1001covington.com
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Lizaanne
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Username: Lizaanne

Post Number: 8
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 - 3:47 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Wow! Those are gorgeous!

Slow but sure - this city will come back. Painfully slow I'm afraid, but I just have to believe it will come back. Way too much character and possibility to see it waste away.

~Liza
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Exmotowner
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Username: Exmotowner

Post Number: 294
Registered: 06-2005
Posted on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 - 3:52 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

1001 Covington were the nicest ones in the park. No wonder they are being taken!!!
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Hpgrmln
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Username: Hpgrmln

Post Number: 13
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 - 4:14 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Lizaanne- what exactly do you do at Rencen?
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Gistok
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Username: Gistok

Post Number: 4484
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 - 4:28 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

If ever an area warranted to be a "gated" community, these Palmer Park appartments are one such area. Since crime is what drove the gay community from the area, perhaps a gated fenced in community would keep the area safe from the riff-raff, and spark a renaissance there.
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Exmotowner
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Username: Exmotowner

Post Number: 295
Registered: 06-2005
Posted on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 - 4:41 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The city (Mayor and city council) would have to be more receptive to lure back many gays. But look what happend to the price of homes in Ferndale!! My old boss still manages apartments there and on my visit we had a very long conversation about it. It really is a shame.
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6nois
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Username: 6nois

Post Number: 329
Registered: 11-2006
Posted on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 - 4:54 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I really want to live in that neighborhood, but I am nervous about it. I would really like to find a building with quite a few empty units, and get a group of people together to move in. I would like to work a deal out with the owner for renovations and maintenance, and bringing the building back. At some point possibly doing a condo conversion as well.
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Royce
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Username: Royce

Post Number: 2241
Registered: 07-2004
Posted on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 - 5:16 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Was the crime directed towards gays or was it just crime in general that ran them out?
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Gistok
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Username: Gistok

Post Number: 4486
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 - 5:34 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Royce, I don't believe it was hate crimes, just crime in general.

That's why I think a gated & fenced in community would bring back many of those who left.
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Parkguy
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Username: Parkguy

Post Number: 39
Registered: 04-2007
Posted on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 - 5:47 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I have always thought those deco-vintage buildings were some of the best-designed in the city. The scale of the buildings in relation to the streets and to each other is amazing. It is one of those neighborhoods that makes you realize that all of the unique corners of town could still make a city vibrant.
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Lizaanne
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Username: Lizaanne

Post Number: 9
Registered: 06-2007
Posted on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 - 7:12 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I absolutely agree, Parkguy. It's why I nearly break my neck to look at them every time I drive down WW - they are just so beautiful to see, even in the state they are currently in.

~Liza
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Pffft
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Username: Pffft

Post Number: 1282
Registered: 12-2003
Posted on Wednesday, June 06, 2007 - 8:53 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The only time I've ever had any trouble in Detroit, I was robbed at gunpoint, going in to one of those gorgeous Palmer Park apartments to a party way back in 1980. The robbers were hiding in the foyer; the outside door had been propped open so the party-giver didn't have to buzz everyone in. Bad move. I'm sorry that things haven't gotten better.
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Focusonthed
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Username: Focusonthed

Post Number: 1027
Registered: 02-2006
Posted on Thursday, June 07, 2007 - 1:36 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Starting at $170k to live in a place with absolutely ZERO nearby amenities (well, besides the park I guess...and the McDonalds at Seven Mile)? Nah, I'll pass.
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Exmotowner
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Username: Exmotowner

Post Number: 296
Registered: 06-2005
Posted on Thursday, June 07, 2007 - 6:59 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The crimes were general but the criminals knew that they were in a gay area and did target us. I was mugged getting in my car after leaving the bar. And Focusonthed is absolutely correct. There are no amenities to living there besides the park. Theres not even a grocery nearby. I think the owners of those buildings should have gotten together to protect their investments. My old boss said that some did try but never followed through on anything and she quit going to the meetings. Most of the big owners (owners of multiple buildings in the park) have sold off their buildings to individuals.
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Pam
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Username: Pam

Post Number: 1754
Registered: 11-2005
Posted on Thursday, June 07, 2007 - 7:41 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

quote:

Starting at $170k to live in a place with absolutely ZERO nearby amenities (well, besides the park I guess



Some people might consider living in a Kahn designed building in a historic district to be an amenity.
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Gotdetroit
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Username: Gotdetroit

Post Number: 69
Registered: 12-2005
Posted on Thursday, June 07, 2007 - 7:52 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I don't know. 4 bedrooms, dining room, living room, and sun parlor in 2,600 square feet - that's an amenity. Throw on the historic aspect and the design, plus the park. I dunno, that sounds like a pretty decent deal.

Granted, the area is shady, but clean that up, and that $170 would be cheap compared to the turn around value.
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Jfried
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Username: Jfried

Post Number: 991
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Thursday, June 07, 2007 - 9:08 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Well, I guess that you're right about there not being many ammenities in the immediate neighborhood, but that doesn't seem to be a huge problem for the thousands of people who live right around the corner in Palmer Woods, University District, & the Golf Course Community. It's all relative, but most people who would purchase in this neighborhood would have a car, and with that in mind you live in an amazing building, within 10 minutes of mid/downtown, very close to the shopping in ferndale/royal oak, and pretty decent ascess to all expressways. It's definitely not walkable, but very few neighborhoods in the city are. The ammenities will follow the new residents who are working to improve the area.

As for creating a "gated community" I don't know what that really means. I don't think making that entire neighborhood private is the answer, but just like most other buildings, or single family homes for that matter, of course you would fence/sercure the perimiter of your property. I think securing the individual buildings and hiring a large private security force would greatly improve the neighborhood and it's chances of attracting more investment. I know many of the owners in the area are working together to create a neighborhood association that would work together on these issues.
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Charlottepaul
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Username: Charlottepaul

Post Number: 1095
Registered: 10-2006
Posted on Thursday, June 07, 2007 - 9:21 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

How about just put a gate around Highland Park. That would keep people in instead of trying to keep people out.
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Jfried
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Username: Jfried

Post Number: 994
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Thursday, June 07, 2007 - 10:16 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I've seen you post some stupid shit, but I seriously hope that is your attempt at a joke. Regardless, it's not very funny.
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Exmotowner
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Username: Exmotowner

Post Number: 297
Registered: 06-2005
Posted on Thursday, June 07, 2007 - 3:35 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"Some people might consider living in a Kahn designed building in a historic district to be an amenity."

Is Palmer Park designated as a "Historic district" otherwise its just old buildings.

Just being the devils advocate here. I did love living in the park.
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Exmotowner
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Username: Exmotowner

Post Number: 298
Registered: 06-2005
Posted on Thursday, June 07, 2007 - 3:44 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I actually have thought about putting a wall around HP and just turn it into a huge prison. Just think how many it would employe. Of course Im being facecious but seriously HP is a big huge ulcer right in the middle of the D. Look at the perimeter of HP and you can see it infecting the rest of the city.
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Charlottepaul
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Username: Charlottepaul

Post Number: 1096
Registered: 10-2006
Posted on Thursday, June 07, 2007 - 3:50 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

'Twas Jfried. I am actually really against fencing in places. I realize that more often than not it is for security and not appearance, but it also gives the impression on whatever property it is on that the site is for exclusive people and/or that the property doesn't really want to integrate itself into the community. Therefore, ironically, it is important in urban conditions not to have a fence. For example at Detroit Mercy the fence is/was important for the university's security, but it actually hurts its image as a neighborhood institution.
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Gistok
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Username: Gistok

Post Number: 4492
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Thursday, June 07, 2007 - 4:04 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Gated communities already exist in Detroit. Victoria Park and Grayhaven on the far east riverfront area are 2 such communities.

With police response so pathetic in Detroit, a fenced in gated community for the Palmer Park area doesn't sound like such a bad idea. It is after all a high density compact area. Having a manned entrance gate is one way to keep the riff-raff out.

That area was a gay community before... if you want them (or others) to come back (from the relative safety of Ferndale or Royal Oak), then I think it's gonna take more than a neighborhood patrol to do it. Hence the idea of a fenced in gated community.

Who wants to live in an area where you always have to watch your back when you leave your car to go to your apartment building? Not to mention worry about your car.

You want to start charging some of those high rates for a residence in a nice building, then safety issues will have to be addressed. If not, the area will just keep going downhill.

Crooks know that gays in general are a "monied" crowd, and often easy pickin's.

Of course crooks would probably get their asses kicked by the lesbians....

(Just kiddin') :-)
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Citylover
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Username: Citylover

Post Number: 2395
Registered: 07-2004
Posted on Thursday, June 07, 2007 - 4:19 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

About the only other thing I personally can think of that frustrates me as much as what happened to the people that revived the Palmer park apts is Archers destruction of the warehouse district. I am sure thousands of people could say the same thing about their neighborhoods.

I don't care if I am being politically correct or not.But ya gotta wonder how for so long now people are content to destroy their own city.The Palmer park apts are a prime example.It should never ever have come to this.The gay community turned that area around.It was attractive.Those bldgs were splendid_ now just another interesting area of architecture teetering along_ where the fuck were the cops and the city council and whoever else to protect things?

Sometimes I think the attitude is: .." It may be a shitpile but it is our shitpile"..
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Exmotowner
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Username: Exmotowner

Post Number: 299
Registered: 06-2005
Posted on Thursday, June 07, 2007 - 7:00 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Citylover, I used to manage a building in the park back in 85 for a couple of years. There was a private security that patroled the park then (I would guess that there still is? Im sure someone can fill us in better on that) and that was not enough. Im not gonna paste all of gistok's post again, but she really says it all.

"Who wants to live in an area where you always have to watch your back when you leave your car to go to your apartment building? Not to mention worry about your car.

Then END ALL is the same old song and dance CRIME! The owners could get together but I think their all also sick of fighting it. I just don't get why they dont ADVERTISE and beg the folks to come back but first they have to prove it safe.

Can you image if it were safe to put nice coffee shops and nice stores in the lower floors without getting robbed stabbed, etc. There are some beautiful buildings in there. I always liked the big white art deco building with the pool on the roof! as far as I know its the only one with a pool. I do know one thing if that area was like it should be, you wouldnt buy a condo in 1001 Covington for less than a million!

What a shame I would give anything to see it thrive. (except to live there again in its current state)
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Pam
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Username: Pam

Post Number: 1769
Registered: 11-2005
Posted on Thursday, June 07, 2007 - 9:11 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

quote:

Is Palmer Park designated as a "Historic district"



Yes it is. Scroll back up and click the link posted by Gotdetroit.
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Exmotowner
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Username: Exmotowner

Post Number: 300
Registered: 06-2005
Posted on Friday, June 08, 2007 - 6:03 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Thanks Pam. I had not looked at the link. Sorry bout that.

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