  Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 1009 Registered: 04-2006 |
I tried to post this earlier but it appears not to have worked... George W. Bush is searching for a legacy, and I know where he can find it. Head to Detroit right now, Mr. President, and assert real leadership. Bring to bear every resource of this nation to urgently restore our nation's public schools to excellence and success. You could not achieve a greater legacy. http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/06/ 19/Dobbs.June20/index.html | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 3026 Registered: 02-2005 |
An interesting commentary, and some advocacy for Detroit from an unlikely source. I have slim hopes for anyone in DC, Republican or Democrat, going out of their way to help any inner-city. We have become such a suburban nation that the majority of representatives probably represent a majority suburban/rural constituency, which could not care less about inner cities or their schools. I definitely agree that all public schools are getting worse together. | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 3027 Registered: 02-2005 |
Watching Lou Dobbs right now (don't usually do that)...he's talking all about the education crisis, and Kwame Kilpatrick will be on the show live in a few moments. | ||
Jerome81 Member Username: Jerome81 Post Number: 1498 Registered: 11-2003 |
I always think about all that money we're spending in Iraq and what we could do with it right here at home instead. With that kind of dollars, we could make a real dent in poverty and crime. Odd that really, since LBJ, there hasn't been a big advocate of the poor that actually did anything about it. LBJ didn't necessarily fix the "problem" but he sure put a lot of things in place so that the poor weren't so much left to fend for themselves. I just think of the police we could have, the community centers, the pools, the parks, the schools, the public health care for the poor we could have with all those billions lost in Iraq. How many lives are we costing at home by spending it over there? How many inner city young men will die because the police didn't have the resources to get the killer off the streets the first time, or because the killer didn't have a safe place to hang out and find a hobby or sport to keep them out of trouble? All those things that money could be used towards. We lose soldiers in Iraq every day. How many young people will be killed or severely wounded on the streets of the United States tonight? Why aren't we up in outrage over that? I'm not one of those war bashers, hippie, blah blah blah kinda people. It tend to take an is-what-it-is approach. But it does make me angry to look at all that money we're spending "over there" when there are so many people in need in our own country. Not saying we don't need a defense department, or we don't need all the advanced military machinery we have. But I am saying that I think spending all that money specifically in Iraq was and is a total waste. Not justified. I think somebody running for president that would focus on Iraq, finding a solution there, but also made a real promise and a real EFFORT to protect people here would find many sympathetic voters, even those of us who live in "safe" areas. I am fortunate not to have a life in the ghetto, but I still find it disgusting that the government takes my money and doesn't help American's who need it more than I do, and instead people in Iraq get it while telling us to get the F out of their country. How messed up is that? | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 3030 Registered: 02-2005 |
Kilpatrick basically said that in brief form in a CNN interview just now. If there wasn't an Iraq war, I'm sure the money would be spent between arms buildup, other arenas of the war on terror, entitlement programs, road building, etc. Plus we would probably see more cuts anyway, as per the conservatives request. The point being: DC wouldn't channel any more money to American cities. | ||
Jrvass Member Username: Jrvass Post Number: 118 Registered: 01-2007 |
OMG! I have just read some of the most clueless posts I have ever seen here. A few examples: 1. Hamas takes over the Gaza Strip from Israel, and the price of gas goes up 35 cents overnight. (Over 10%) 2. Hamas is funded and supplied by Iran and Syria, who are friends of the Russians and Chinese on the UN Security Council. Don't expect any action out of the UN. 3. LBJ did more with his "Great Society" to destroy poor families than help them. That is why Clinton reformed welfare. 4. Cutting exorbitant taxes works. That is why JFK did it, Reagan did it, and GWB did it. Not another penny, Jenny! 5. The Middle-East is the greatest threat to our lifestyle we have faced since the early 1940's. If Iran goes nuclear, it will affect a major US city eventually. 6. IT IS NOT WASHINGTON'S BUSINESS, how the Michigan/Detroit administered, public school system works! They may provide federal funding (and shouldn't be involved in that either). This is Jenny's/Kwame's/and the school board's problem! How the hell is Washington going to solve national problems, if they are concerned with "wiping the noses of every little town's" problems? Why even have local politicians? Send their ass to Washington so they can network and have cocktails! James | ||
Bte_in_va Member Username: Bte_in_va Post Number: 19 Registered: 12-2006 |
"I always think about all that money we're spending in Iraq and what we could do with it right here at home instead. " Yeah, like returning it to the original taxpayors?????? | ||
Detroitrunaway Member Username: Detroitrunaway Post Number: 33 Registered: 06-2007 |
James...what the hell is your problem. First of all, insulting posts is an idiotic way of getting your point across (notice how you just felt by reading my last couple of statements) and it is not a good example of having an open mind. Second, why isn't it Washington's Business? I mean isn't it our nation's capital? They're suppose to set an example for the rest of the country. The responsibility starts from the top and trickles down to the final city officials. You do work, don't you? Have you heard anything called the chain of command? If the 'man' at the top is unhappy with how his staff (senior management, lower management and 1st/2nd level employees) is handling things, normally, and correct me if I'm wrong, 'take over the situation? Yes, it is the responsibility of local politicians, but it does not omit the responsibility of Washington. I mean, just look at the percentages. 25%? This causes a threat to the future. Our children are failing...25-50% of our future dreams are failing with them; before it can even begin to cultivate. It is also the responsibilities of parents, students and school falcuty. It takes a village... I'm not and would never place this problem on one particular group's shoulder, but I damn sure won't excuse Washington. Hell, I work 5 blocks from the White House, work for an association who has major connections and advocacy on Capital Hill. Believe me, when you're that close to the 'lions den' it send a chill down spine. | ||
Mcp001 Member Username: Mcp001 Post Number: 2774 Registered: 11-2003 |
Where does the federal government have any authority to be doing anything about education? | ||
Detroitrunaway Member Username: Detroitrunaway Post Number: 34 Registered: 06-2007 |
mcp001....was that a serious question? | ||
Lilpup Member Username: Lilpup Post Number: 2341 Registered: 06-2004 |
The federal Department of Education was created by Congress in 1867 - it's been bopping around in one form or another ever since. | ||
Blksoul_x Member Username: Blksoul_x Post Number: 4 Registered: 06-2007 |
Why not Detroit!__ The land of the so-called 'free' must delve ino the depths where neither 'lie-berals' nor 'kkkonservatives' dare to tread, and that is, the murky waters of despair and dread that flood the streets of many Black villages__what better place than Black Detroit to revisit the mess 'they' created in the first place! Better yet, give 'us' the money(dare I say reparations)and we will fix it ourselves! blksoul_x-atcha! | ||
Lilpup Member Username: Lilpup Post Number: 2342 Registered: 06-2004 |
^^you really don't want to go there | ||
Jrvass Member Username: Jrvass Post Number: 119 Registered: 01-2007 |
I never commented specifically on any post. And I don't see yours above. But if "It takes a village..." "...it must take a village idiot to see what is wrong with our city schools!" (Don't miss the point here, pay attention.) There is no reason why the government needs to run schools except perhaps in rural areas. Public schools were begun during the agrarian period of our country in the mid-late 1800's. One room schoolhouses & such. Now the unions & politicians are so beholden to each other, it will be damn near impossible to stop their incestual relationship. And Washington DC's schools are ranked at the top, aren't they? In funding... not in achievement. That is one hell of an example. Yes. I do "work". I have never seen the man at the "top". I did sit next to a person at a luncheon who was sitting at the only spot at the table with both chairs empty next to her, because I got there late. We were chatting and she asked what I did, I told her. I asked her what she did and she said "VP of Sales and Marketing". I said "I thought your name sounded familiar, but I couldn't place your face with your name." The company I work for has over a billion dollars in revenue a year and provides health services for the poor, on taxpayer's money. What is your point? Why do you think it is, that so many children fail in school? Funding? Ha! What happened with "No Child Left Behind"? Child's Behinds ought to be the focus! Get their asses in school and ride them like mules! Why is there a 3 month break in the summer? It is not like they are planting/harvesting crops like a 150 years ago. They need "Vacations"? Fine & Dandy! Make them learning ones with Mom & Dad. I did once when I was 12 for a month. Had to do assigned schoolwork (bookwork) to keep up with the class. Plus reading, essays, and reports of the places I had been and the things I had seen. Discipline... If the child is uncontrollable, it is time to go after the parents. They are ultimately responsible. These are a few of my thoughts. I think I will invite a DPS teacher I know to comment here. James | ||
Dexterpointing Member Username: Dexterpointing Post Number: 230 Registered: 05-2007 |
Even if Bush rolled into town and saved the day and every damn thing turned out just ducky for everyone there financially and otherwise you guys would still hate him and act like 2 year olds when putting him down. We all know he aint the brightest crayon in the box but damn, you people are rtidiculous just like your hero Fatboy Moore | ||
Mayor_sekou Member Username: Mayor_sekou Post Number: 1045 Registered: 09-2006 |
"blksoul_x-atcha!" Who was the poster who used to say "blackatcha" after each post? Rasputin? I think he is back. | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 3031 Registered: 02-2005 |
Mcp, that used to be my opinion, and it was reinforced by no child left behind, which was mostly unneccesarily complex regulations which could screw perfectly good districts but let bad districts remain bad. Adding standardized tests which teachers have to teach for normally doesn't help. That doesn't mean there are not other ways the Federal government can get involved, especially to ensure accountability, provide extra funding where it is neccesary, etc. This is especially true in light of the mismanagment of schools at the state level here in Michigan. Somehow we passed proposal A to redistribute funds from GP and Bloomfield to poor country areas and Detroit, yet what improvement are we seeing in Detroit? So clearly it is more than just funding (the bulk of which is just payments to teachers anyway)...we need ideas that fundamentally change education and that force parents to somehow demand more of their children and their schools. | ||
Mcp001 Member Username: Mcp001 Post Number: 2779 Registered: 11-2003 |
Yes it was a serious question. It may have been a full-blown "department back in 1867, but it was downgraded very shortly thereafter, and remained so until Carter had some campaign debts to pay off. As for what Congress did, all you'll need to do is look at the powers that Congress has. Nowhere in that area is there anything specifically tied to education. | ||
Lilpup Member Username: Lilpup Post Number: 2343 Registered: 06-2004 |
The best educations are experiential, not just reading books and being lectured to. | ||
Mcp001 Member Username: Mcp001 Post Number: 2781 Registered: 11-2003 |
No debate there. | ||
Scs100 Member Username: Scs100 Post Number: 1145 Registered: 12-2006 |
quote: I can think of quite a few teachers who have done the lecture way. One of them (English, for anyone who went to GP South, this should tip you off) caused my friends to have rubber band fights to stay awake. My history teacher this year was the same way. I never listened, I actually taught myself. Thank god for the two I have next year who are fun. (Message edited by SCS100 on June 20, 2007) | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 3033 Registered: 02-2005 |
I actually don't know which English teacher you're referring too. Mrs. Ptasznik retired...good teacher but really boring, structured lectures. History w/...Cooper? | ||
Mauser765 Member Username: Mauser765 Post Number: 1577 Registered: 01-2004 |
"How the hell is Washington going to solve national problems, if they are concerned with "wiping the noses of every little town's" problems?" Mmmm...How about the US government stops running around the world wiping the noses of every little country's problems ? Not a penny more for THAT. (Reagan helped build the nuke program in Iran btw, its for power not weapons) | ||
Scs100 Member Username: Scs100 Post Number: 1146 Registered: 12-2006 |
English with Ajavon. Someone I know had Ptasznik for all 3 years of middle school and then one year for AP Lit. Loved her. The history teacher was Kaiafas, if you went to Brownell. EDIT: I have Cooper next year. That can't end well. (Message edited by SCS100 on June 20, 2007) | ||
Mauser765 Member Username: Mauser765 Post Number: 1578 Registered: 01-2004 |
" it was reinforced by no child left behind, which was mostly unneccesarily complex regulations " Dont forget that most of the promised funding has yet to show up, but the mandates are still in place. | ||
Jrvass Member Username: Jrvass Post Number: 120 Registered: 01-2007 |
"(Reagan helped build the nuke program in Iran btw, its for power not weapons)" Mauser765, please explain the facts behind this statement. I would appreciate being enlightened by your brilliance. James (Now this thread concentrates on my education! Amusing!) | ||
Blksoul_x Member Username: Blksoul_x Post Number: 5 Registered: 06-2007 |
I have only posted a few times and my character has been mentioned with 'ras' and even 'super_d'__ as a long time reader of 'DY', I take that has a compliment...those brothas' where brilliant in the way they reproduce 'the' jargon. ...perhaps the academic systems of rewards and status, prestige and influence, should avocate similar styles of scholar like 'Ras' and 'super_d' often presented__Then too, perhaps, academia in our inner city schools are failing due to the educational paradigm insinuated by the larger society. The profoundness of intellectual creativity offered by young black men have historically been demoralized and stifled because the 'academy' is the caretaker of intellectual legitimacy in ' white amerikkka'. We need to propose a unique system of education designed specifically with the reproduction of the jargon of power at the center, in relation to Black subject matter....perhaps one that includes the conversation amongst the prominent and prestigious that is offered by traditional white institutions(only because we reside in amerikkka)then perhaps our Black youth...eeer 'inner city youth' academic career will become more secure. blksoul_x-atcha! | ||
Spiritofdetroit Member Username: Spiritofdetroit Post Number: 516 Registered: 11-2006 |
livedog_2? | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 3034 Registered: 02-2005 |
//continuing an aside with Scs: ah, how did I forget Ajavon, I had her? Yes I know what you mean now. Roarty was my favorite English teacher. I'm starting to date myself with this fact, but I also had a class with Charles (Old Man) Stephens...speaking of boring lectures. Good man, though. I had Cooper the first year he taught my advanced US History and he prepared me well enough. end aside\ No Child Left Behind was an example of the sort of federal involvment we don't need. It piles unneccesary responsibility on teachers to teach for tests that don't help kids learn, it threatens to take away funding from perfectly good schools (it called Grosse Pointe South a failing school one year!!!), and doesn't do anything ingenious to reform the attitudes in inner city schools. In the short run, creating more public schools of choice to let the go-getters advance in a good setting (like Cass Tech, etc), creating more vocational and arts/sciences schools, and allowing more charter competition is our best medicine for the inner city. Federal legislation which creates incentives for better learning environments is the best thing for that level of government to do in the long run. For instance, grant money for schools that achieve a certain target in terms of GPA, graduation, % going to college, and perhaps a program that rewards at-risk children who come through and do graduate with grant money for college. You will always have negligent parents and a drop-out culture, the key is to deal one-on-one with students, giving them incentives that they can earn just for achieving. Sure, it doesn't benefit all of us responsible folk who grew up in a culture that expected success, but in order to overcome the drop-out culture and all the social odds placed against inner city students, a tangible system of incentives, that encourages them to take control of their own destiny, is the best thing. It doesn't matter if you are going to the best or the worst school in the district, if you achieve and set yourself up for success, you should get some benefits so that it is not in vain (i.e. so you can go to the college that you worked so hard to get in to). | ||
Scs100 Member Username: Scs100 Post Number: 1155 Registered: 12-2006 |
//continuing aside with Mackinaw: I have Roarty next year. Hope she is as good as you say. end aside\ Time will tell in this case, if all else fails. | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 3036 Registered: 02-2005 |
^^Well you just might be in my sister's class. I think you'll enjoy Roarty.> | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 3037 Registered: 02-2005 |
more on my earlier post: I think the way to determine who is eligible for grants/scholarships would be based on economics alone. Clearly race cannot be used for such things in this state anymore, and race alone does not correspond with socioeconomic barriers. While this will disproportionately help black youth if we make it an inner-city program, as long as the legislation does not limit it to just them, it will be fine. (Message edited by mackinaw on June 21, 2007) | ||
Scs100 Member Username: Scs100 Post Number: 1158 Registered: 12-2006 |
That idea for scholarships isn't that bad. I would just factor in grades as well, so people who do well, but don't have the money, could go to college. (Message edited by SCS100 on June 21, 2007) | ||
Detroitrunaway Member Username: Detroitrunaway Post Number: 35 Registered: 06-2007 |
You know what! Now I see why some children don't succeed, they're too busy noticing how we screw up things, pass the buck, ignore...shall I go on. The bottom line is. THE CHILDREN ARE FAILING. 75% of them. What are we going to do about it? I don't give two $hits on who should take the blame...or who has this power and that power. We all have some sort of power to make some difference. (repeating myself) The parents, the students, the neighbors, the teachers, local politicians, AND WASHINGTON. I will never justify the kids summer vacation...hell, I used to be a kid myself. | ||
Lowell Board Administrator Username: Lowell Post Number: 3908 Registered: 10-2003 |
George Bush in Detroit? LOL. He would be better off taking his long awaited triumphant ride through the streets of Baghdad. The only thing that would bring him here is siphon off money for a political fund-raiser. The Michigan budget deficit? Four days in Iraq would cover it. Detroit's? 12 hours. We build fire stations and schools in Iraq while we close them here and struggle to staff those that remain. Go figure. | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 3049 Registered: 02-2005 |
"We?" While I did support the idea of new legislation and perhaps even new funding sources from the federal government, everybody knows that the federal government DOES NOT build schools and fire departments in American cities. I know you know that Lowell, but you are just being crafy with your rhetoric. And what the hell is wrong with building stuff in Iraq after we messed it up so bad? They have basic human needs, too. To pretend that we are worse off than them is asinine. It's just like all the self-righteous anti-globalization people who want that third world to stay undeveloped and poor, so that we don't lose one job here in America. "We" shouldn't consider ourselves to be better than anyone else. Now maybe you Canadians are... It's also shameful rhetoric to suggest that defense spending should instead be used to cover a city's debts, because we are not the only city. Sure, a day of war expenses could balance our budget (where'd you get your numbers, btw?), but then the government would be expected to cover every city's ass. That would be a costly, bad precedent. | ||
Romanized Member Username: Romanized Post Number: 232 Registered: 02-2005 |
The Dept. of Education hasn't been necessary or effective. But Bush is still an ass, and his war is murderously stupid. Period. End of Story | ||
Hardliner Member Username: Hardliner Post Number: 54 Registered: 02-2007 |
I saw that interview with Mayor of Detroit on Dobbs show, what does he do, Blame the damn unions. screw that fat assed pig, let him sell that damned house he lives in and buy a normal sized house and maybe JUST F'IN MAYBE the Detroit Schools can be saved! mo fo jack assed monkey butt gonna try blame the unions on his inability to run the damn city, screw him! | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 3059 Registered: 02-2005 |
He was telling the truth. Someone with a name like hardliner will have trouble dealing with that. He was pretty gentle with them too, just asking for more cooperation. Did you say monkey? Shame on you. | ||
Detroitrunaway Member Username: Detroitrunaway Post Number: 37 Registered: 06-2007 |
I'm with you Mackinaw....shame on you hardliner. | ||
Kslice Member Username: Kslice Post Number: 71 Registered: 04-2007 |
Why would GWB want to make a legacy in a city where 95% of the urban dwellers voted against him. He would be much more at home in Livonia or Grosse Point. | ||
Iheartthed Member Username: Iheartthed Post Number: 1018 Registered: 04-2006 |
"Why would GWB want to make a legacy in a city where 95% of the urban dwellers voted against him." Because he is still the president of the country in which they reside? Because it may help ease some of the friction between his political party and urban dwellers across the country? Because it's the right thing to do? | ||
Scs100 Member Username: Scs100 Post Number: 1172 Registered: 12-2006 |
And the Grosse Pointe schools don't need help yet. | ||
Danny Member Username: Danny Post Number: 6091 Registered: 02-2004 |
We Don't need that FLIP FLOPPER. Detroit is no place for George Bush! (Message edited by danny on June 22, 2007) | ||
Hardliner Member Username: Hardliner Post Number: 57 Registered: 02-2007 |
I apologize for the Monkey reference, that was beyond what is allowed here. But he's got some nerve to try and put it on the teacher unions. let him sell that house he lives in. and get a real house, and not that oversized thing he lives in now. Hardliner - Union Supporter till I die. | ||
Patrick Member Username: Patrick Post Number: 4585 Registered: 10-2003 |
Hardliner, did you work 11 years and get healthcare for life too or are you pissed that they might axe that? | ||
Mackinaw Member Username: Mackinaw Post Number: 3070 Registered: 02-2005 |
Class warfare at it's best...what the hell does a house that could be sold for 1-2 million dollars (a drop in the bucket for our city budget and really not doing anything for our schools) have to do with this debate? Teachers deserve great compensation, but the union has been wrong in its approach. They went on strike for a week, and they are already among the highest paid in the state and among urban teachers elsewhere. But I guess we need to have a self-righteous union supporter or two on the forum... | ||
Detroitrunaway Member Username: Detroitrunaway Post Number: 39 Registered: 06-2007 |
Hey...has anyone read this article in the MetroTimes? http://www.metrotimes.com/edit orial/story.asp?id=7130 | ||
Blksoul_x Member Username: Blksoul_x Post Number: 9 Registered: 06-2007 |
Hey 'Detroitcastaway', perhaps the Metro Times article has located a warehouse supply of Black inner-city school learning material, ready to be ship out to Black school districts.... ...You and I are quite familiar with the resources available for Black 'inner-city' schools. Our village school supplies and equipment have always been in wretched and bareboned condition, whilst many white 'sub-urban school districts equipment are typically nothing less than cutting edge__if you are poor and Black, the disparity in educational expenditures are often huge compared to our white counterpart. 'Detroitcastaway' err 'runnaway', perhaps you may understand that, being that you were raised off gratiot on the east-side in the 'LLPG 444's Hood'!(YOU DONE FORGOT!)...or have you moved on up to the 5th floor, where ain't no fish burn'n on the grill__go figure! blksoul_x-atcha! | ||
Detroitrunaway Member Username: Detroitrunaway Post Number: 40 Registered: 06-2007 |
Blksoul_x...you got one more time to call me castaway...remeber...I know where you live...'D-Mack' | ||
Blksoul_x Member Username: Blksoul_x Post Number: 10 Registered: 06-2007 |
'Detroitrunaway', do I look like I'm shake'n?__methinks 'Balti-poor' is about 10hrs away??? And be careful, your 'east-side' is showing!!! The forum 'sub-urbanites' will become afraid of you!...'They' will think you have that 'mad-black-sista' disease!__go figure! blksoul_x-atcha! | ||
Detroitrunaway Member Username: Detroitrunaway Post Number: 42 Registered: 06-2007 |
LOL...you are crazy. Should we let everyone in on our joking? I'll leave that up to u. okay...i know its a saturday night...but i'm actually tired. BBQ today...i'm stuffed and now have the 'idis'. we'll pick up more school discussion tomorrow. Everyone...have a good night. |
