Discuss Detroit Archives - Beginning January 2007 New construction on single family homes Previous Next
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Bw7085
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Username: Bw7085

Post Number: 1
Registered: 02-2007
Posted on Monday, February 26, 2007 - 6:30 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I know that there are a lot of new condo's going up and being converted into lofts. Does anyone have any info on new construction single family homes or sub divisions east or west side?
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Tetsua
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Username: Tetsua

Post Number: 1122
Registered: 01-2004
Posted on Monday, February 26, 2007 - 6:34 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I saw some earlier this year in the bombed out neighborhood by the State fair grounds.
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Yelloweyes
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Username: Yelloweyes

Post Number: 94
Registered: 02-2007
Posted on Monday, February 26, 2007 - 7:22 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Yes, there are a lot of new single family homes on the east side. Most have been built sporadically in ghettohoods. I don't really understand who is purchasing these homes because I think they go for around $150,000. I believe there is some type of financing/land scam going on. They are wood frame houses that look like they might blow down on a windy day.
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Hybridy
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Username: Hybridy

Post Number: 74
Registered: 08-2006
Posted on Monday, February 26, 2007 - 7:25 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

there is a lot of vacant infill housing between 75 and hamilton off of mcnichols
there is also some more infill between puritan and the lodge by u of d
john r between 8 mile and mcnichols on the east side has some more
thats just what i know of in this part of the city
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Mackinaw
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Username: Mackinaw

Post Number: 2469
Registered: 02-2005
Posted on Monday, February 26, 2007 - 7:32 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Plenty of bland-looking single family homes south of Jefferson and east of Marquette, behind where you see the new gas stations/shopping center. This area was previously a prairie, so I guess it's not a bad thing, even if it followed zero conventions for what an urban home should look like.
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Charlottepaul
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Username: Charlottepaul

Post Number: 567
Registered: 10-2006
Posted on Monday, February 26, 2007 - 8:10 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Definitely the east side has the majority of new single family homes. Likely because they could develop more of the entire block as opposed to infill housing.

Yelloweyes, I second that! I am not really sure that there is a market for some of the locations of these new homes. Generally they do seem to be in more 'ghetto' areas. The best areas for new homes are in areas adjoining well established nicely kept neighborhoods, such as around Indian Village just for an example.
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Jt1
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Username: Jt1

Post Number: 8402
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Monday, February 26, 2007 - 8:12 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

quote:

even if it followed zero conventions for what an urban home should look like.



Define urban. Detroit is not urban as some people like to equate Detroit (or any heavily black area) to urban. Most of Detroit was developed in a very suburban manner.
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Mackinaw
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Username: Mackinaw

Post Number: 2471
Registered: 02-2005
Posted on Monday, February 26, 2007 - 8:21 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

In terms of spacing, lot sizes, and the pre-eminence of single family, detached homes, yes.

By not urban, I mean the following: a gaping garage door facing the street, composing about half of the home's facade. That is the problem, and you know exactly what I mean.

We can afford to let a lot of things slide if it means redeveloping empty areas and creating tax revenue, but we need to have some respect for the context that we are building these new things in.

I agree with your last statement, but mainly in terms of areas outside of the Grand Boulevard. Most of NE and NW Detroit were even developed in a post-war suburban manner. I do not know why 'heavily black area' comes into a discussion about planning and architecture, though.
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Bw7085
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Username: Bw7085

Post Number: 2
Registered: 02-2007
Posted on Monday, February 26, 2007 - 10:51 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Me and the wife are looking at two areas Jefferson
village and woodbridge estates. Both lot sizes are small for that amount of money.
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Jt1
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Username: Jt1

Post Number: 8405
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Monday, February 26, 2007 - 10:55 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mack - Not oriented towards you but there is a common misconception that urban implies black.

I have heard Southfield referred to as urban a few times recently. It wasn't urban before but now it is.


(Message edited by jt1 on February 26, 2007)
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B24liberator
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Username: B24liberator

Post Number: 33
Registered: 01-2007
Posted on Monday, February 26, 2007 - 11:16 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mackinaw, I'm with you on that whole garage door look-- Ugliest trend in modern home building. I've been in the building trades most of my adult life-- I first saw these California styled garage-fronted homes in the 70's- Sad to say I helped build a few, hated them then... Fast forward through the 80's and 90's, and my experience was this trend subsided for a bit, except for some condo developments-- But now it seems to be making a comeback insofar as single family homes... They're generally efficient, I'll give them that-- But they also reflect that troubling 'disconnect' that infects our modern insular lifestyles. You zip home, hit the garage door button, pull straight into your garage, get out enter the tiny mud/laundryroom, and boom! Soon your safe and sound with your TV-- Never having to see, let alone wave to any of your neighbors in their similar-styled homes.... Soul suckers, is what they are!
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Wilus1mj
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Username: Wilus1mj

Post Number: 172
Registered: 05-2005
Posted on Monday, February 26, 2007 - 11:47 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

sounds good...I hate neighbors!!

Leave me alone....
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Professorscott
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Username: Professorscott

Post Number: 218
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Monday, February 26, 2007 - 11:48 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mackinaw,

Shoot, out in Lenox Township or New Haven in the far northeast exurbs Anthony Lombardo is building what you would consider urban-style homes: small lots, garages facing a rear alley. He's selling 'em too, at least he was before the latest pileup of disastrous economic news.

The two subs are called Amherst and Decora Park. They are very moderate-priced by northeast exurb standards. I went and looked at them, not as a buyer but just to see what he's doing because there isn't much of that going on around here.

Detroit, which as Jt1 pointed out was built in an unusually (for a big city) suburban manner, could use such types of neighborhoods IMNSHO.
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Mackinaw
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Username: Mackinaw

Post Number: 2476
Registered: 02-2005
Posted on Tuesday, February 27, 2007 - 12:04 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I agree, let's swap whatever they have there for the south of Jefferson infill.

To be clear, most of the infill around Detroit has been sufficiently urban, in my view. Brush Park, Art Center (east of Woodward, north of Warren), etc. There are row houses going in in the NW part of West Village near St. Charles Church. These are all good signs. The newest developments are all of fairly good density. Unless I'm getting things mixed up, the development I was complaining about was from about 2001-2004.

B24, I couldn't agree more.

Jt1, I definitely get your drift on what shapes some people's definition of urban.
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Professorscott
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Username: Professorscott

Post Number: 220
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Tuesday, February 27, 2007 - 12:47 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The nice thing about the recent developments is that we are, for the first time, starting to create interesting options for people. From the 1910s to the 1990s, the suburban development model was about all Detroit (City and 'burbs) had to offer.

If you didn't want a single-family house with a lawn and a garage facing the front (usually becoming an obnoxiously overwhelming streetscape feature), and if you didn't want to drive absolutely everywhere, you pretty much had to live in another part of the world.

Now, granted, there are still a lot of people who like the suburban model, and I'm not saying they're wrong. But if you don't like that model, we are finally getting around to creating neighborhoods you might enjoy.

And, of course, this new urban-density housing model makes public transportation a reasonably efficient service (another lifestyle-choice amenity).
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Royce
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Username: Royce

Post Number: 2088
Registered: 07-2004
Posted on Tuesday, February 27, 2007 - 2:24 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Most of the infill housing with the vinyl siding and colorful shutters are subsidized homes. A lot of them are going up all over Detroit. Not what most of us on the forum want because they are not in the most desirable neighborhoods.

Don't know if the materials are cheap, but they do give the homeowner a nice wide fenced in backyard. The one car attached garage is not too bad. At least it's not two or three car bays taken up most of the width of the front of the house.
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56packman
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Username: 56packman

Post Number: 1036
Registered: 12-2005
Posted on Tuesday, February 27, 2007 - 7:33 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mack-the term for those houses is "snout house"--where the garage extends toward the street and its door is the most prominent feature of the house. Texans have had big issues with snout houses because of hurricanes and tornados--the high winds buckle the doors, the wind gets under the roof (in unfinished garages) and lifts the whole roof off of the house (single floor designs)
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Corktownmark
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Username: Corktownmark

Post Number: 269
Registered: 12-2004
Posted on Tuesday, February 27, 2007 - 11:31 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The north corktown new single family development really fit well with the existing houses. I hear phase 2 is starting real soon. The houses are for low income so may not be of interest to every one.
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Eastsidedog
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Username: Eastsidedog

Post Number: 917
Registered: 03-2006
Posted on Tuesday, February 27, 2007 - 11:33 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

New single family homes are being built at Helen & Agnes (just west of E. Grand Blvd. and a few blocks North of Lafayette). These are similar to the North Corktown houses. There are plans to build more on Baldwin as well (one block west of West Village). They look pretty decent and have garages facing the alleys.

From the English Village Web site:

Responding to the need for affordable for sale housing, Messiah Housing Corporation has started construction on the first phase of Bellevue Village. Bellevue Village, located on Helen Street between St. Paul and Agnes, consists of ten single family for sale homes priced at $145,000 with up to $55,000 in subsidy available per house. In addition Messiah has partnered with Islandview Village Development Corporation to construct 20 additional homes for sale in the Islandview Village Project, located on Baldwin and Field Streets. These homes are also affordably priced starting at $165,000. Other projects include Bellevue Village Phase B, located on Helen, Canton and Concord Streets; which consists of 40 afffordable homes comfortably priced starting at $165,000; and the Champlain Village Project, located on Field, Helen and Canton Streets; which is comprised of 40 units of affordable rental housing with 20 designed to address the needs of grandparents raising grandchildren with special needs.

http://www.englishvillagedetro it.com/index.php?id=1
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Mackinaw
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Username: Mackinaw

Post Number: 2478
Registered: 02-2005
Posted on Tuesday, February 27, 2007 - 11:40 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

ESD provided the link for what I was referencing in one of my posts. These buildings are definitly 'sufficiently urban'...indeed very nice. These are single family, but not detached.
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Eastsidedog
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Username: Eastsidedog

Post Number: 918
Registered: 03-2006
Posted on Tuesday, February 27, 2007 - 1:08 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mackinaw, the really hard part about building single family attached and detached homes in an "urban style" (i.e. close together with parking in rear) is the city has vacated the alleys (many of which are overgrown and rundown) PLUS there are zoning codes about set backs from property lines (I think a Zoning Appeal ala North Corktown overcomes this hurdle).

The alleys behind the English Village row houses were completely repaved as part of the developers deal with the city. Generally though the city is very reluctant to to anything with alleys except let them rot. This is why parking for infill ends up in front. I'm still waiting to see if the city will repaved the alleys behind the houses on Helen -- since the garages face the alley. If the city repaves them then hopefully they will repave the alleys between Seyburn and Baldwin, and between Townsend and Field.
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Eastsidedog
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Username: Eastsidedog

Post Number: 919
Registered: 03-2006
Posted on Tuesday, February 27, 2007 - 1:13 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mackinaw, BTW, the English Village row houses are in fact condos, not single family. The old turn-of-the-century row houses in West Village are single family with no association dues AND the homeowners own the small slice of land each row house sits on.

(Message edited by eastsidedog on February 27, 2007)
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Upinottawa
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Username: Upinottawa

Post Number: 760
Registered: 09-2005
Posted on Tuesday, February 27, 2007 - 1:27 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

With respect to urban meaning "black", that truly is an American phenomenon. In the rest of the world, urban studies is not a euphemism for the study of black people.
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Mackinaw
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Username: Mackinaw

Post Number: 2480
Registered: 02-2005
Posted on Tuesday, February 27, 2007 - 1:33 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Good info, ESD. Alley access is absolutely critical to being able to make high-density housing, and it seems like developers interesting in doing so will have to undertake it themselves.
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Professorscott
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Username: Professorscott

Post Number: 226
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Tuesday, February 27, 2007 - 1:45 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Are alleys 100% necessary? When I live in the City I park in the street. In a lot of big cities indoor parking is a very high-end luxury that not many people have access to. My grandfather owned a grocerette in New York, and he also owned a divided three-car garage on another street a few blocks away. ("Divided" meaning it was three separate garage stalls in the building, separated by concrete-block walls, and each with a separately locked entrance.)

It was that he owned three indoor parking spaces that impressed his neighbors, much more so than that he owned a grocerette. He parked his 1965 Dodge sedan in one and rented out the other two. He was one of very few people in his neighborhood who parked a car under a roof.

Incidentally, the grocerette (and the pharmacy, and the church) were in the middle of the neighborhood. The people who shopped there walked to the store, or bicycled; 100% of his customers did so. You didn't have to drive to get groceries. People shopped every few days, and he would deliver to anyone infirm (well not him, we would; that's what grandkids are for).
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Royce
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Username: Royce

Post Number: 2099
Registered: 07-2004
Posted on Sunday, March 04, 2007 - 6:38 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Take a look at the Georgia Street thread for some pictures of new homes being built in the city.
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Fnemecek
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Username: Fnemecek

Post Number: 2390
Registered: 12-2004
Posted on Sunday, March 04, 2007 - 8:41 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

quote:

I know that there are a lot of new condo's going up and being converted into lofts. Does anyone have any info on new construction single family homes or sub divisions east or west side?


There's a bunch of new single family homes being built in the Warrendale neighborhood. Most of them appear to be sold and occupied.

Details & photos (from a few months ago during construction) at http://warrendale.blogspot.com /2006/12/new-housing-in-warren dale.html
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Fareastsider
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Username: Fareastsider

Post Number: 194
Registered: 08-2006
Posted on Sunday, March 04, 2007 - 10:43 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Alleys were more relevant before the auto era. Part of the clean in front and dirty in the back idea. I think alleys are useful to keep a clean front end of the street. No open garage doors all along the road on the weekends.
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Focusonthed
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Username: Focusonthed

Post Number: 859
Registered: 02-2006
Posted on Sunday, March 04, 2007 - 11:11 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

New York is so nasty on garbage day too. That's another benefit of alleys. No such mess in Chicago.
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Viziondetroit
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Username: Viziondetroit

Post Number: 1029
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Monday, March 05, 2007 - 8:33 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

"The best areas for new homes are in areas adjoining well established nicely kept neighborhoods, such as around Indian Village just for an example."

So low density neighborhoods should not be an option?
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1953
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Username: 1953

Post Number: 1319
Registered: 12-2004
Posted on Monday, March 05, 2007 - 9:24 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

There are 130 new single family homes going up in Hamtramck. Half are infill near the city center, with a similar look and feel to the rest of town. The others are on the west side of 75, with a suburban look and feel.
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Mackinaw
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Username: Mackinaw

Post Number: 2521
Registered: 02-2005
Posted on Monday, March 05, 2007 - 10:40 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Vizion, I don't get it.

Indian Village certainly isn't high density even by Detroit standards.

To the extent possible, through zoning, i.e., low density neighborhoods should NOT be an option in the inner city. If we are talking NE or NW Detroit where the existing neighborhoods are already low-density, then it doesn't really matter, but if you are doing infill on the lower east side, there should be some reasonable density standards, if for no other reason than harmony of design. On the far east riverfront where you have new subdivisions cut off from the rest of the traditional neighborhood, the feeling there is anything but harmonious.
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Eastsidedog
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Username: Eastsidedog

Post Number: 933
Registered: 03-2006
Posted on Monday, March 05, 2007 - 10:59 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Mackinaw, the city repaved the alleys for English Village as part of an agreement with the developers. I am hopeful that the city will repave other alleys in the area for more of the affordable housing that is being built. Right now the city installing all new sewers in the area. There's a big construction sign with Kilpatrick's name on it and everything.

Professorscott, of course alleys aren't 100% necessary -- but off-street parking sure does help sell a place in Detroit (and off-street parking is much more aesthetically pleasing when it's off an alley). Car theft is a huge problem in Detroit. Off-street parking is a HUGE selling point. Most cars are stolen off the street. Parking for two cars off-street is pretty much essential nowadays. Few Detroit buyers are willing to drop $280,000 for a new rowhouse and park on the street.

I think most Detroiters would balk at the idea of walking a couple blocks to their garage. You could never sell such a place in Detroit, ever. If we had more mass transit in Detroit, of course parking would be much less of an issue.
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Mackinaw
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Username: Mackinaw

Post Number: 2522
Registered: 02-2005
Posted on Monday, March 05, 2007 - 11:12 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Good to hear that, Eastside. That sort of infrastructure upgrade is really needed.

I agree with your additional point about alleys. The most beautiful streetscapes are those with cars and garbage and utilities out of sight. They don't have alleys in Ann Arbor (just narrow driveways leading to small rear lots), but you see a huge difference here in my neighborhood east and west of State Street. East of State along Ann, Catherine, and Lawrence streets, you have on-street parking, and the power lines are out in the open. West of state there is no on-street parking and the utilities go behind the houses. While the entire neighborhood is nice, the neighborhoods west of State look like something out of a storybook, and with no cars or powerlines, the streetscape is essentially the same as it was in 1890 (except for it being paved).

You can't be that idealistic with all of Detroit, and I'm really not that averse to cars being parked on a street...I just wanted to show how much nicer a neighborhood can look if you take things off the street (and for most of Detroit, this is easily done because the alleys are in place--just not in good condition).
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Eastsidedog
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Username: Eastsidedog

Post Number: 934
Registered: 03-2006
Posted on Monday, March 05, 2007 - 11:23 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I know what you're saying Mackinaw. The power lines run down all the alleys on the lower east side (making it difficult for the city to totally vacate the alleys). Because of this there are some incredible streetscapes on Parker, Seyburn, Van Dyke and throughout Indian Village of course. Parker between Lafayette and Agnes is my favorite street in Detroit. Absolutely a gem of a street. The honey locust trees, gas lamps (many still running on gas!) and the old turn-of-the-century homes make strolls down that street truly magical.
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Mackinaw
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Username: Mackinaw

Post Number: 2523
Registered: 02-2005
Posted on Monday, March 05, 2007 - 11:55 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I think that block is one of Detroit's best exhibits of mixed-density housing. There are large single-family homes, townhouses, and apartment buildings. It is really nice.

Saint Paul St. has a beautiful run through West Village, too...the townhouses along it are really great.

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