Discuss Detroit Archives - Beginning January 2007 Vinton Building Previous Next
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Detroitbill
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Username: Detroitbill

Post Number: 178
Registered: 09-2006
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 9:34 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Does anyone know if the Vinton Building is progressing on target ? The last couple of times I have walked by it seems awfully quiet during a mid week work day,,,Hope this project hasnt stalled.
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Gannon
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Username: Gannon

Post Number: 8526
Registered: 12-2003
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 10:21 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Standard construction delays, from what I've heard...their initial cleanup contract is running a wee bit behind, far as I know there is nothing greatly amiss.

They got hit with an inventive and industrious scrapper team that caused much of the dismay...didn't get much, but what they landed kept some upper-floor work to stop.

Amazing shame the city couldn't help secure a building site a block from the CAY building...these scrappers need to be stopped.
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Jt1
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Username: Jt1

Post Number: 8521
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 10:25 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Scrappers need to be stopped but is it the city's responsibility to secure a building that is being developed by private developers?
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Tiorted
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Username: Tiorted

Post Number: 70
Registered: 02-2006
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 10:36 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

quote:

Amazing shame the city couldn't help secure a building site a block from the CAY building



why is it the cities responsibility to secure private property?
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Gannon
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Username: Gannon

Post Number: 8527
Registered: 12-2003
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 10:39 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I said HELP.

Please read.
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Tiorted
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Username: Tiorted

Post Number: 71
Registered: 02-2006
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 10:50 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

why is it the cities responsibility to help secure private property?
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Jt1
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Username: Jt1

Post Number: 8522
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 10:51 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Why should the city help. The city should get the scrapping to stop but securing a private development has no responsibility on the city.
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Dabirch
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Username: Dabirch

Post Number: 2131
Registered: 06-2004
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 11:01 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Why the should the city help?

Because these people are criminals and a normal city stops criminals.

People, where is your perspective?

A city's job IS to stop crime.

In a normal place, cops would actually be, you know, patrolling.
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Gannon
Member
Username: Gannon

Post Number: 8528
Registered: 12-2003
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 11:02 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Patrolling the streets and noticing some truck overloaded with crap is certainly their responsibility.

Seeing suspicious activity in an alley in the Central Business District is certainly their responsibility.

Legislating the scrap dealers into better behavior...treat them like the pawn shops...is certainly their responsibility.



Providing an environment where developers are NOT saddled with buying their own private police force or army is certainly their responsibility.



Those are ways that they can HELP secure private property.


HELP. It is the least we should expect.
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Dabirch
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Username: Dabirch

Post Number: 2132
Registered: 06-2004
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 11:06 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

What he said. ^^^
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Goat
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Username: Goat

Post Number: 9283
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 11:14 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Dabirch be quiet! You are only making sense.
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Jt1
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Username: Jt1

Post Number: 8523
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 11:19 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Dabirch, I agree with you POV. My issue isn't with preventing crime. We all agree that is the city's issue.

My issue was that I infered that Gannon was saying it is the city's responsibility to seal the construction site. That is not the responsibility of the city. Gannon's most recent post made his point much more clear. I agree with that post 100%.

Goat - Nice contribution as usual. Why engage in conversation when you can be an asshole.
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Susanarosa
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Username: Susanarosa

Post Number: 1407
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 11:20 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

But there is no reason the city should be buying locks and plywood needed to "secure" the building, right?

I think there are two competing definitions of "secure" happening here.
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Jt1
Member
Username: Jt1

Post Number: 8524
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 11:21 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I agree. The developers need to secure the building. The city needs to secure the streets.
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Gravitymachine
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Username: Gravitymachine

Post Number: 1538
Registered: 05-2005
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 11:30 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

^^ quit being so pedantic about it

its completely absurd that the city can't do anything about such brazzen crimes a block from the seat of the government

(Message edited by gravitymachine on March 14, 2007)
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Dabirch
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Username: Dabirch

Post Number: 2134
Registered: 06-2004
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 11:33 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Good, we all agree.
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Jt1
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Username: Jt1

Post Number: 8528
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 11:45 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Gravity - What was stolen? How brazen was the crime?

I think that police should respond to buildings being broken into but I think that developers have responsibility to secure their sites. It is a difficult scenario because it may not always be obvious that a place is bing scrapped. Development is a difficult thing to protect everywhere. You would be amazed at how much is stolen from developers in even the nicest parts of the region.

The point I was making is that if the site is not secured the city should not have to secure it. If there is criminal activity there then yes it is the city's responsibility.

If your home had no alarm and you left the doors wide open would it be the city's fault if someone walked in and took something? You would hope that a neighbor would call the cops but how else would they know if you left your place opened?

I don't know the specifics of the situation so I am not saying the Vinton people were neglecting their responsibilities but people are fast to put every responsibility on the city when that can't always be the case.
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Supersport
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Username: Supersport

Post Number: 11415
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 11:52 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Careful Dabirch, don't want you slipping into that Citylover mentality. Only rant about crime in small doses and you should be ok.
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Gravitymachine
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Username: Gravitymachine

Post Number: 1539
Registered: 05-2005
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 12:04 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

i have no idea what was taken, this is the first i've heard about it, i'm just saying that your getting into all these technicalities about who is responsible for what, when the person you were arguing with (gannon) was making a far more generalized statement, as did i.

I think its fair to assume that there was some level of security to the building site, obviously it wasn't enough, but its also fair to assume that what ever was taken, as offen with scrappers, was either large or of a large quantity, which in either case probably would've taken some time to remove and would have been fairly visible, which makes its occurence within a block of our city government's offices, someplace that most of us would assume is a rather secure environment, all the more absurd.
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Gannon
Member
Username: Gannon

Post Number: 8529
Registered: 12-2003
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 12:06 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

(sorry for the unclear language, I didn't think I'd have to go into what the developers did to secure the building, since a few of us know who some of the investment team are...and not a ONE of 'em lacks wisdom and knowledge about how the city life chews up and spits out unsuspecting folk)





Again, we are up against a seeming dilemma...we hear over and again how Americans are NOT willing to do the work that illegal immigrants do...but somehow some are willing to risk their lives scrapping live electrical wires, running up and down eighty-year-old fire escapes with heavy copper, and even again street-level drug dealing with the attendant risks.

Nah, we've got a good collection of people willing to do whatever it takes to survive...we just need to devise a scheme to get them turned into productive citizens outside their respective gray and black markets.

That scheme does NOT entail locking everyone up at society's expense, either...we need to find a way to undo a few generations of bad or missing parenting and all of the ways society has allowed these folks to fall through the cracks.

I am NOT excusing crime, I am talking of bringing those who in desperation and circumstance chose and choose poorly (some continually) BACK into an illumination of how their behavior mistracks our entire civilization...and hopefully help them learn how to be part of the solution.
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Crew
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Username: Crew

Post Number: 1135
Registered: 02-2004
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 12:34 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Why should the city help? It's the State's responsibility to regulate the srapping industry. Since scrappers are in the service industry, the State should be taxing them 2 cents.
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Rhymeswithrawk
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Username: Rhymeswithrawk

Post Number: 400
Registered: 11-2005
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 3:24 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I could be mistaken, but wasn't ItsJeff one of the lucky ones saving this building?
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Gistok
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Username: Gistok

Post Number: 3799
Registered: 08-2004
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 3:58 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Nope, that was Ndavies...
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Gannon
Member
Username: Gannon

Post Number: 8539
Registered: 12-2003
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 3:59 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

You are mistaken, but he knew everyone involved outside the Porche group.
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Bob
Member
Username: Bob

Post Number: 1409
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 8:30 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Theft from construction sites is happening all over MI. Out in Clinton Township they have had a couple major thefts from the new Partidge Creek mall being built, and with was with the rent-a-cop on site. Although according to the paper he was on the other side of the site.
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Irish_mafia
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Username: Irish_mafia

Post Number: 788
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 - 9:50 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Perhaps capital punishment for scrappers?

Just a thought.

Given what we've seen happen over the last two years...probably a thought too late
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Crew
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Username: Crew

Post Number: 1136
Registered: 02-2004
Posted on Thursday, March 15, 2007 - 8:44 am: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I would guess the thefts in Clinton Twp are more "family" related than scrappers.
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Urbanize
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Username: Urbanize

Post Number: 468
Registered: 02-2007
Posted on Friday, March 30, 2007 - 7:04 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

bump
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Downtown_remix
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Username: Downtown_remix

Post Number: 107
Registered: 03-2007
Posted on Friday, March 30, 2007 - 7:20 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

cant wait to have a glass of merlot on opening day at the 1st floor wine bar
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Innercitydoc
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Username: Innercitydoc

Post Number: 29
Registered: 09-2006
Posted on Friday, March 30, 2007 - 9:01 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Is that what Robert Porcher has planned? Or is that another entity? He was supposed to have several floors in the building correct?
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Detroitstar
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Username: Detroitstar

Post Number: 563
Registered: 01-2006
Posted on Friday, March 30, 2007 - 9:02 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

By opening day, are you saying that the place will be open by this coming monday??
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Thejesus
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Username: Thejesus

Post Number: 914
Registered: 06-2006
Posted on Friday, April 13, 2007 - 12:00 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

so what's the status w/ this project...drove by a few times over the past week...looks pretty good, but haven't seen much happening lately...is interior work being done perhaps?
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Yooper
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Username: Yooper

Post Number: 24
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Friday, April 13, 2007 - 12:05 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Does anyone have any pictures of the Vintage Building?
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Patrick
Member
Username: Patrick

Post Number: 4224
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Friday, April 13, 2007 - 12:16 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I wonder if they found any cool stuff inside the building when they were cleaning it out...maybe old blueprints and coins etc.
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E_hemingway
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Username: E_hemingway

Post Number: 1146
Registered: 11-2004
Posted on Friday, April 13, 2007 - 1:40 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Lots of progress made at Vinton Building; move-in expected early 2007

http://modeldmedia.com/develop mentnews/vinton75.aspx
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Buddyinrichmond
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Username: Buddyinrichmond

Post Number: 148
Registered: 02-2004
Posted on Friday, April 13, 2007 - 1:47 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I wonder if they found anything old in the Vintage Building.
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Susanarosa
Member
Username: Susanarosa

Post Number: 1432
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Friday, April 13, 2007 - 1:49 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

You mean like an article from December?
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E_hemingway
Member
Username: E_hemingway

Post Number: 1147
Registered: 11-2004
Posted on Friday, April 13, 2007 - 2:08 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Oh, we can go earlier.

Construction begins on Vinton Building rehab Downtown

http://modeldmedia.com/develop mentnews/vinton38.aspx

And earlier.

Vinton Building development reflects diversity, cooperation

http://modeldmedia.com/develop mentnews/vinton.aspx
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Lowell
Board Administrator
Username: Lowell

Post Number: 3788
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Friday, April 13, 2007 - 2:18 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Way to go Ndavies, and the other partners, for saving a great piece of Detroit's legacy.

[Applause!]
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Thejesus
Member
Username: Thejesus

Post Number: 917
Registered: 06-2006
Posted on Friday, April 13, 2007 - 2:24 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Does anyone know if they are going to fix up some more of the exterior? Parts of it still look pretty rough
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Dabirch
Member
Username: Dabirch

Post Number: 2237
Registered: 06-2004
Posted on Friday, April 13, 2007 - 2:26 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Cross streets would be nice.
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Gannon
Member
Username: Gannon

Post Number: 8928
Registered: 12-2003
Posted on Friday, April 13, 2007 - 2:42 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I don't think they have any responsiblity for fixing up, let alone cleaning the cross streets.


That would be back in the city's domain.
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Buddyinrichmond
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Username: Buddyinrichmond

Post Number: 149
Registered: 02-2004
Posted on Friday, April 13, 2007 - 2:59 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I heard Clean Detroit and Penske are going to be on it.
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Dabirch
Member
Username: Dabirch

Post Number: 2238
Registered: 06-2004
Posted on Friday, April 13, 2007 - 4:16 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

It's a shame the city doesn't better secure the property.
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Susanarosa
Member
Username: Susanarosa

Post Number: 1433
Registered: 11-2003
Posted on Friday, April 13, 2007 - 4:29 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Maybe we can turn it into a homeless shelter?
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Sharmaal
Member
Username: Sharmaal

Post Number: 1077
Registered: 09-2004
Posted on Friday, April 13, 2007 - 5:10 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

That would be excellent. There are many homeless people in that area. A homeless shelter in that location would place them very close to their customers.
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Jelk
Member
Username: Jelk

Post Number: 4324
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Friday, April 13, 2007 - 5:18 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL! SKI HILL!
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Gannon
Member
Username: Gannon

Post Number: 8933
Registered: 12-2003
Posted on Friday, April 13, 2007 - 5:26 pm: Edit PostDelete PostMove Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

They ARE looking for unique uses for the first floor.

Talk about making the streets cross.

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