  Mayor_sekou Member Username: Mayor_sekou Post Number: 681 Registered: 09-2006 |
....for making GM put a hold on this awesome would be V-12 Cadillac!!* http://www.caranddriver.com/da ilyautoinsider/12797/cadillac- sixteen-inspired-top-of-the-li ne-model-on-hold.html Cadillac Sixteen-Inspired Top-of-the-Line Model on Hold - Daily Auto Insider 1 | 2 V-12 remains an experimental engine for now. BY ALISA PRIDDLE, April 2007 Work on an ultra Cadillac is on hold until General Motors has a better idea of where the Bush Administration is going on fuel economy legislation, vice chairman Bob Lutz told CARandDRIVER.com in an exclusive interview at the New York auto show. Essentially all work on big cars and big engines has been halted, the head of product development said. One high-profile victim is a lovely creature based on the Cadillac Sixteen concept that stole the 2003 North American International Auto Show in Detroit. There has been much chatter recently that the long-awaited supersedan—so far going by such names as Cadillac Twelve and the trademarked XLS—is close to reality and powered by a 7.2-liter V-12 comprised of two 60-degree 3.6-liter V-6 engines bolted together. The engine will have the prerequisite bells and whistles meaning direct injection, variable valve timing, and cylinder deactivation technology. Holden subsidiary engineers in Australia have done work on a car that was expected to ride on a stretched version of the GM’s Global RWD Architecture (Zeta). Holden has the engineering lead for the Zeta large-car family that will include the Pontiac G8 and Chevrolet Camaro. But GM has hit the pause button, Lutz said, as it awaits details of President Bush’s push to reduce dependency on foreign oil. The government is proposing raising the corporate average fuel economy (CAFÉ) standards for passenger cars and light trucks to levels Lutz says will take many of GM’s future product plans off the table because they cannot meet those stricter regulations. Lutz said he hopes to know where the government is going by the end of the year so product decisions can be made. The super Cadillac “is still a program we love very much and we know exactly how we’d do it if we were going to do it,” Lutz said. “We have plenty of sketches and small clay models of what the car would look like. Tom Stephens over at powertrain is just itching to find a home for that V-12 because right now it’s just two engines with no plans to use them. We would just all dearly love to do the vehicle, but right now it would just be imprudent to plan on.” (rest at site) From the concepts I have seen it would appear that the Zeta platform has a lot of promise, here's to hoping these things especially that V-16 Caddy gets produced. (*title is a joke I am not actually mad at the president.) | ||
Fury13 Member Username: Fury13 Post Number: 1524 Registered: 10-2003 |
Seriously, there is no reason to produce such a car. The thinking that leads to producing V-12s, Vipers, Navigators and others of the gas-guzzler ilk is what will result in the extinction of our domestic auto industry. GM and Ford need to look to the future... to efficiency, to economy. Or they'll keep losing market share and revenue. | ||
Lilpup Member Username: Lilpup Post Number: 2028 Registered: 06-2004 |
This kind of car is to take money from those guys who have more than they know what to do with and yet still don't feel adequate | ||
Burnsie Member Username: Burnsie Post Number: 939 Registered: 11-2003 |
I suspect that this would be a "boutique" car, not made in nearly the numbers as other Cadillacs. I wouldn't have a problem with it, if it was a very small-volume production-- attractive enough to sell out but not in amounts that would have a big effect on the environment. | ||
Superduperman Member Username: Superduperman Post Number: 260 Registered: 01-2005 |
Sweet!!! I would have glady gave up my firstborn for that car if I kids. | ||
Patrick Member Username: Patrick Post Number: 4223 Registered: 10-2003 |
Hell yea there is a reason for this car to be built!!It is for all the dudes under 5'5" and the ones that lack in the groin region. Penis car-atcha | ||
Mayor_sekou Member Username: Mayor_sekou Post Number: 685 Registered: 09-2006 |
lol. Im 5'10 and I have gotten plenty of complements but I would still gladly if I had the money buy this car. If GM makes this I would have no reason to covet a Mercedes S65 AMG anymore, and it would legitimize Cadillac as a serious player in the luxury game to the rest of the world. | ||
Ccbatson Member Username: Ccbatson Post Number: 298 Registered: 11-2006 |
A low volume Halo car is not going to be affected by the direction of the administration. The timing might be however. It would not be good PR to market a gas guzzling monster while everyone is getting the warm and fuzzies over fuel efficiency (even though there is no real urgency..only the fake urgency started by Al Gore). Fortunately, the passion will peak and pass, and then the time will be ripe for a halo performance car (again, fuel efficiency for this kind of vehicle in the low volume produced is completely irrelevant). | ||
Gmich99 Member Username: Gmich99 Post Number: 181 Registered: 11-2005 |
George W. Bush did not know how to make grade in undergrad.; George W. Bush didn't know how to run a business when he ran the Astros into the ground (shortest field in the Major League Base Ball); George W. Bush didn't know how to run a state when he racked up the lowest literacy rate in the Union, the highest air pollution rate (above L.A.), and the highest death penalty rate in the Union; and George W. Bush didn't know how to run the federal government when he ran the government into the highest spending in the history of the US with more people on staff in the history of the US; George W. Bush could not run an alternative fuel auto when it was put in his fingers. Should we be surprised? Hardly. Of course this is biased. I watched him do it. I didn't feel it. That is biased. | ||
Eastsidedame Member Username: Eastsidedame Post Number: 98 Registered: 12-2006 |
A V-12?? A possible V-16?? It's all about HP, not anatomy! Detroiters know that, right? I'm sick of 2.3L scooters with fenders...aren't you? Screw the politics! Damn the granola chompers! I WANT IT!~ | ||
Thejesus Member Username: Thejesus Post Number: 909 Registered: 06-2006 |
cars like this are built to help a company's image, like the Viper did for Dodge in the early 90s...not built to mass produce or make money | ||
Danny Member Username: Danny Post Number: 5792 Registered: 02-2004 |
Yes Mayor_sekou, Blame that Neo-Con King! He's more into the post war Iraq the than other concerns. He did mention to the GM and all the other car companies to make alternation fuel vehicles for gas prices are going to UP UP UP!! | ||
Fury13 Member Username: Fury13 Post Number: 1525 Registered: 10-2003 |
"...It would not be good PR to market a gas guzzling monster while everyone is getting the warm and fuzzies over fuel efficiency (even though there is no real urgency..only the fake urgency started by Al Gore)." No urgency? How about $4 per gallon gasoline (coming soon... bet on it!)? | ||
Danny Member Username: Danny Post Number: 5793 Registered: 02-2004 |
Gmich99, I like your recent quote above. How could this Christian Ideological America pick a most retarded man in U.S. history with the Harvard education? My answer is it all comes to the folks in Florida with their 1920s voting system that made president. | ||
Genesyxx Member Username: Genesyxx Post Number: 709 Registered: 02-2004 |
I wasn't even expecting them to TRY to build this concept machine, for the simple fact that it will cost an ass-load of money to produce and an even bigger ass-load on the sticker. I actually agree with GW/Arnold on this issue. GM is losing this battle, and in order to actively compete with Toyota, Nissan and Honda, we're going to have to get more competitive with it's small/medium car market and improve greatly with it's image and fuel milage/emissions. | ||
Johnnny5 Member Username: Johnnny5 Post Number: 489 Registered: 06-2005 |
Most people buying high end Cadillacs could care less if they get 22 MPG or 12. And I doubt GM was planning on marketing this thing to the guy who price shops for gas. On the other hand GM blaming possible changes in fuel economy standards is hogwash. They should just admit that the project was looking like a failure or that they need to put their limited resources into more worthwhile ventures. | ||
El_jimbo Member Username: El_jimbo Post Number: 82 Registered: 12-2006 |
The point of building a car like that isn't to sell large numbers of them. It is more of a status symbol and image thing for the company. Right now Cadillac isn't really considered to be on par with Mercedes, BMW, or Lexus. Many people who can afford luxury cars won't give Cadillac a second thought before they drive to a dealership of one of these other companies. However, if Cadillac can prove that they can design and build a well styled, high performing, reliable supercar, it might get some of these people into a Cadillac dealership and then into an actual purchase from Cadillac of another one of the vehicles it produces. It would be the flagship of the brand. Similar in respects to how the Ford GT40 was. It proved to the world that Ford could still build amazing cars and not just a lineup of Fix Or Repair Dailies. | ||
Detroitsuperfly Member Username: Detroitsuperfly Post Number: 17 Registered: 07-2005 |
That is the problem with American car companies, they think in terms of flagships, not serious innovations. Japan (especially Toyota) are kicking American asses, becuase they are leading with inovation while American car companies are still stuck in a 1960s mentality where lure suckers in with cars they could never afford, trying to get them to look at the cars they can afford. The problem is that flagship cars rarely make a profit and the sales effect on other models are negligible. In the meantime, Toyota comes out with a 400 hp hibrid and the slack jawed yokels who listen to AM radio and watch FOX news whine about Al Gore and granolas, while living with their head up their asses and ignoring reality. They just want what they want, despite the consequences. The US dept of defense says global warming is real, Exxon says its real, 71% of Americans say its real, ice core samples at the poles say it man made. Toyota is taking this info and running with it commercially and kicking American ass as a result. Killing this model would be the best decision GM could make. Its time for both American car companies and Americans to get theri heads out of the 1950s and adapt to new realities. Otherwise, you'll be left behind, as you have been. | ||
Detroitsuperfly Member Username: Detroitsuperfly Post Number: 18 Registered: 07-2005 |
*It would be the flagship of the brand. Similar in respects to how the Ford GT40 was. It proved to the world that Ford could still build amazing cars and not just a lineup of Fix Or Repair Dailies. Yeah, how'd that turn out for Ford? Didn't help Ford's image or sales much, did it? | ||
Gannon Member Username: Gannon Post Number: 8921 Registered: 12-2003 |
There is a lot to be said about flagships, but some companies seem to be going crazy with them at every size range, like Audi in the past few years. They've got some inadequacy issues against their Teutonic competitors...obviously, they've got the engineering chops, but DAMN...how many 4-500 HP things do they need to make?! One of my clients just got rid of the previous ass-kicker Mercedes S-class...his reason? Gas mileage first and foremost. Perception secondary, since he lives and owns businesses in the Flint area. El Jimbo, I beg to differ with you...the foreign car buyers I know ARE certainly considering domestics, and of the high-end companies Caddy is the ONLY game in town for performance...since Lincoln/Mercury has chosen to not play the game. My Flint guy ended up with a reasonable Cadillac sedan and seems happy enough with it. We'll see what he does when THIS lease is up in a few years. One of my Rochester Hills guys swears AT Mercedes because of the horrible troubles he had with his high-end two-door (don't remember which one it was)...but he will NEVER buy Foreign now because of how much trouble he had with that vehicle. Cheers! | ||
Club_boss Member Username: Club_boss Post Number: 40 Registered: 12-2006 |
These limited edition vehicles are for a niche market for sure… Gasoline @ $2.80 a gallon or not, actually it’s $2.89 across the street from me. In the spring of 2008 Ford is bring out… Ford Shelby GT500KR, this vehicle is equipped with an incredible 5.4-liter supercharged V8 engine. Not fast enough…an optional Ford Racing Power Upgrade Pack is available to boost the engine's output up to 540 horsepower (estimated output only.) Only 1,000 units of this vehicle will be produced. The F-150 Foose Edition truck, designed by Chip Foose himself. At the heart of the Ford F-150 Foose Edition is a supercharged Triton V8 engine pumping out 450 hp and pulls out 500 lb.-ft. amount of peak torque rotating at 4,000 rpm These are very fuel efficient vehicles… | ||
Mayor_sekou Member Username: Mayor_sekou Post Number: 686 Registered: 09-2006 |
I still think this is good, Cadillac has nothing currently to compete with V8 BMW 7 Series, Mercedes S class, or Audi A8's. The V8 model would likely produce a majority of the sales and V8's are becoming ever so fuel efficient so these cars wouldn't be a complete drain on the environment. And if GM is going to produce cars on the zeta platform anyway, I don’t see why it would be terribly inefficient for them to produce this. They would already have a buyer in me. | ||
Yaktown Member Username: Yaktown Post Number: 152 Registered: 02-2006 |
Gmich, GW Bush had nothing to do with the Houston Astros. At one time he was part-owner of the Texas Rangers, please get your facts straight. | ||
Fury13 Member Username: Fury13 Post Number: 1526 Registered: 10-2003 |
"...V8's are becoming ever so fuel efficient..." I don't see any 35-mpg V-8 cars out there. | ||
Supersport Member Username: Supersport Post Number: 11490 Registered: 10-2003 |
quote: Dude, hop in your cute little Yaris and putter on outta here. lol You will soon see 35 mpg V8 cars out there, they've been knocking on the 30 mpg door for many years now, the new Camaro is projected to get 30+, while maintaining around 400 hp. | ||
Mayor_sekou Member Username: Mayor_sekou Post Number: 696 Registered: 09-2006 |
Aww, I liked the other title better. | ||
Ccbatson Member Username: Ccbatson Post Number: 304 Registered: 11-2006 |
Gmich; I actually agree with you regarding Bush, spending, and government running business. These are things government should not be involved in (private enterprise). Fury: Gas prices are rising, you are correct, so to is the price of many commodities (milk, steel, etc), also increasing are wages (on average) as a function of inflation. Gas prices have to be considered in context of inflation. Artificial influences come in the form of taxation and penalties (consumer at the pump taxes are at 50 cents a gallon and likely to rise sharply). When the market (meaning supply and demand) bring the price up to par with alternates, WITHOUT EXTERNAL GOVERNMENTAL INFLUENCE, then development of alternatives becomes a viable option, NOT BEFORE. Regarding the very low volume halo cars. 200-300 cars at a price of 500,000 dollars or more...or even the near 100,000 dollar Viper at 1800 units per year, means nothing to the economy, or the environment. For the owners, if they have that kind of money to spare on a luxury/performance/exotic car, do you think that the price of gasoline means anything to them? It could be 100 dollars a gallon for all they care, or more. How many miles do you think these cars are driven? Maybe 5000 miles a year (at the most), and, as it is likely that the owner have many other vehicles and one can only drive a single vehicle at a time, how significant are these vehicles in the big picture? Not very. | ||
River_rat Member Username: River_rat Post Number: 263 Registered: 02-2006 |
Some of us will always appreciate and drive 12 cylinder cars. They are nice and well, if you can afford them, why not? | ||
Ccbatson Member Username: Ccbatson Post Number: 309 Registered: 11-2006 |
Amen River rat, this is America, and we are free to choose how we spend our hard earned money. That is why this is an assault on our freedoms. Pressures from the government (championed by AL Gore) based on nonsense global warming hysteria to tax, regulate, and punish citizens for exercising their individual rights is an attack on capitalism and, therefore, our way of life. |
