Post Number: 40
|Posted on Friday, April 13, 2007 - 9:25 pm: || |
What do you think?
Bill would let bars serve drinks later.
LANSING -- One way to help prop up the cash-lean state budget: Let bars serve drinks two hours later, permit retailers to sell liquor on Sunday mornings and charge them a steep state fee for the privilege.
Legislation moving through the state House would do just that.
A bill approved by a 6-0 bipartisan vote of the House Regulatory Reform Committee earlier this week would allow bars with special permits to serve alcohol until 4 a.m. Current law cuts off liquor sales at 2 a.m.
The measure also would let stores and bars that purchase permits to sell alcoholic beverages beginning at 7 a.m. on Sundays, five hours earlier than they can do it now.
The price for the extended-hours permits: $5,000 for the late-night sales and $2,500 for the Sunday morning sales, although these fees may be lowered as the bill goes through the Legislature.
"This could be a shot in the arm to the entertainment industry and to the state budget," said Rep. Steve Tobocman, D-Detroit, who sponsored the bill.
It's uncertain how many of the state's bars, restaurants and retailers would buy the special permits. Estimates of revenue to the state range from $6 million to $20 million for the permits, in addition to untold millions in tax receipts from increased sales.
Sean Harrington, who runs the Town Pump Tavern near Detroit's Fox Theater, is among small business owners who support the legislation. He'd like to be able to sell liquor to tailgaters at Detroit Lions football games who start partying in his parking lot in the early morning on game days.
"They use our bathrooms, but we can't sell them a drink until noon," Harrington said. "The revenue we're missing is gigantic."
The bill also is backed by the Michigan Municipal League, Michigan Beer & Wine Wholesalers Association, the Michigan Retailers Association the Michigan Restaurant Association and the Michigan Licensed Beverage Association.
But it's opposed by MADD Michigan.
"MADD supports uniform bar hours and closing, because differing hours could promote bar-hopping," said Homer Smith, executive director of MADD Michigan. "If you have customers drinking at one place and then when it closes, they go to another place, that can cause drinking-and-driving problems."
There are at least 19 states that allow bar closing after 2 a.m., according to a National Restaurant Association survey. Bars are open until 4 a.m. in some big cities, such as Chicago and New York. In seven of those states, the late serving hour is a local government option.
Under the Michigan bill, current liquor licensees could apply for the extended-hours permits from their cities, townships or counties. Local units of government also could decide to opt out of the plan.
http://www.detnews.com/apps/pb cs.dll/article?AID=20077041303 27
(Message edited by cgunn on April 13, 2007)
Post Number: 1332
|Posted on Friday, April 13, 2007 - 10:19 pm: || |
Hell, let 'em open 24/7 like they do here in Nevada. No problem.
Post Number: 1438
|Posted on Friday, April 13, 2007 - 10:21 pm: || |
This is a no-brainer. A community can decide if they want to do this or not, so any complaints of extra policing would be addressed directly by the community. I bet the casinos would love this.
Post Number: 919
|Posted on Friday, April 13, 2007 - 10:27 pm: || |
I always thought it was a bit ridiculous that I can walk into Ford Field at 11:00am on a Sunday, that they have beer behind the counter at that time, but that they can't legally sell it to me until noon...
HELLO...do you really think there's even the slightest chance that I'm going to show up to church drunk when I'm at Ford Field at 11:00am on Sunday????
Post Number: 1439
|Posted on Friday, April 13, 2007 - 10:42 pm: || |
I think the clause that lets the community decide will make the people in the MI Bible Belt in western MI happy because can decide if they want to do it in their community.
(Message edited by bob on April 13, 2007)
Post Number: 40
|Posted on Saturday, April 14, 2007 - 1:44 am: || |
Sweet!!! I can get hammered at all hours of the day.
Post Number: 258
|Posted on Saturday, April 14, 2007 - 3:59 am: || |
Yeah, is there a reason that the serving laws aren't on a community-by-community basis here in Michigan?
Southeast Michigan alone has some cities/areas that could benefit from later hours - Detroit, Ann Arbor, Royal Oak - but a lot of the rest of the state is, as Bob put it, the Michigan Bible Belt. If they want to restrict sales in Holland or Traverse City, so be it, but those places aren't Detroit demographically and the same serving laws should not apply if the area deems it so, IMO.
I guess the problem becomes, who is in charge of creating the serving laws. If it's the city council, we might as well forget about it. I haven't seen one around here that actually gets shit done.
Or we can just say "Fuck it!" and let 'em serve 24/7, just as Libertarians would have it.
(Message edited by Sticks on April 14, 2007)
Post Number: 270
|Posted on Saturday, April 14, 2007 - 8:40 am: || |
Bad idea. Bad, bad, idea. While I have no problem with the consumption of alcohol by responsible people, I can see big trouble for us here in Funky Ferndale. First of all there are nearly 30 establishments that serve alcohol within a quarter mile of my back door in downtown Ferndale. Right now those places have no problem packing the house with boozers. Many of these bars have outdoor or sidewalk cafes for the patrons. Even on a slow weekday night there are throngs of people who frequent these establishments to take in the night air, cheer on the local sports teams, or listen to live music that pours into the night. All of this produces tons of noise from the drunks, live bands, automobile boom boxes and alarms, as well as the endless car and motorcycle traffic, not to mention pedestrians screaming, fighting, and pissing. Plus, the city maintains a P.A. system that plays music over the top of all this, seemingly with a mind of its own. We don’t need to add more on top of all this insanity. Maybe in Detroit, with its wide open ranges, it might work. But Ferndale has no buffer between downtown bars, and the sanctity of our nearby homes. I (along with many other tax payers) have complained at council about all of this, and they have only made it worse in response: More bars are opening downtown soon. There is little or no thought for those of us who live in the downtown area when decisions are made. But bad ideas are what they like, and I bet bad ideas are what we will get. All I want is to give peace and quite a chance.
Post Number: 111
|Posted on Saturday, April 14, 2007 - 10:41 am: || |
Bullet...Why did you choose to live near commercial development? Stop complaining...The reason your home has any value is because of everything you complained of.
I would love to see the bars stay open until 4am...While we are at it lets band tobacco in all public places.
Post Number: 41
|Posted on Saturday, April 14, 2007 - 10:47 am: || |
I hope your comment on banning tobacco is a joke right?
Post Number: 783
|Posted on Saturday, April 14, 2007 - 10:54 am: || |
It is quite possible the Mr. Magnet lived there prior to Ferndale becoming what it is today, after all that has only happened in the last fiver years.
Post Number: 274
|Posted on Saturday, April 14, 2007 - 11:41 am: || |
Well Charlottepaul! I am surprised you and I are in league on this. Yes, all of the fun things I complained about have happened over the last five years or so. When we moved here from big bad Detroit, the place was very nice, with an acceptable amount of noise. But as stated above, every one and their brother opened up a night club here. You can now get around the license restrictions just by having 20% of your revenue from food. Defendbrooklyn, all I want to ban is stupidly, so that means just Charlottepaul and I will be left to populate the city.
Post Number: 109
|Posted on Saturday, April 14, 2007 - 11:38 pm: || |
I think it's a good idea-it could add appeal to certain areas for nightlife and increase revenues. Best thing it would be optional for bars so they could decide if it would be in their best interest to stay open later.CHEERS!
Post Number: 923
|Posted on Sunday, April 15, 2007 - 1:36 am: || |
Bulletmagnet, at least here in Chicago, bars are required to close their outside areas at 10pm or 11pm (I can't remember, summer seems so far away!). I'm not sure if this is law or if everyone just does it out of courtesy, or fear of their alderman, or what. This way, bars stay open, but noise is kept to the minimum.
I used to live in Ferndale btw (only 8 months ago) and I don't remember having any particular problem with the noise. And I lived downtown, ON 9 Mile.
Post Number: 4
|Posted on Sunday, April 15, 2007 - 3:04 am: || |
This is a great thing. Hope it passes quickly.
Detroit can turn itself into "Vegas North" if it really wants to. We already have the casinos. Once the bar time gets extended to 4 am, we will have late night entertainment.
Who doesn't want downtown to become like "The Strip" in Vegas. That would be awesome. An entertainment district like that, marketed properly, will bring in many tourists from around the midwest.
We need new money to come into this community in order to grow. The existing money is dwindling by the day.
Pass the law.
Post Number: 1301
|Posted on Sunday, April 15, 2007 - 3:16 am: || |
that would suck
Post Number: 849
|Posted on Sunday, April 15, 2007 - 5:43 am: || |
2:AM bar culture, or 4:AM bar culture?
I think the pros of 4:AM far outweigh the cons.
I've lived in both "cultures". I only call it "culture" because people tend to act very differently when they know that they're going to be "cut-off" at 2:AM.
I spent 8 years working in bars all over the Detroit area (everywhere from Downtown to Royal Joke), then another 2 years working in bars in New York (before I finally got my career rolling here). I noticed a distinct difference between 2:AM bar culture & 4:AM bar culture.
The common thread between the bars I worked in in both cities is that the weekend crowds surge in around 11:PM. In Detroit, this means "power-drinking" for many, because you know that you only have 3 hours until zero-hour.
Some of the Downtown bars I used to work hired extra bouncers to show up at 1:30AM and prepare for "LAST CALL!!!", as that was the moment of the night that their bars were the most packed.
They'd have to shove people out the door like cattle, many of them pounding-down double-fisted drinks (that they'd doubled-up on at the bar just before "last call") right next to the exit out to the street -- where they'd get into their cars and swerve home, at the very height of their intoxication.
My experiences in New York include both New York CIty (where people can take a cab or subway home), and Long Island (where, like Detroit, everyone drives). The 4:AM bar culture in both places proved to be very different from Detroit. In general, people aren't pounding-down drinks like there's no tomorrow. It's a much more relaxed drinking schedule. They have a much longer time to ramp-up their buzz, then - most importantly - to ramp it down, space the drinks out with a few waters, and the crowd exiting the bars is more of a slow trickle than a race to the finish line.
Sure, there are extreme partiers & alcoholics everywhere who will push it to the limit given the opportunity, but the big difference I've seen between Detroit and New York in that respect is in the prevalence of "after-hours" joints. The after-hours joints in Detroit are just as populated by people who simply want to keep drinking past 2:AM, as those who are looking for drugs -- while the after-hours clientele in NYC is primarily drug-focused.
Out of all of the messed-up things that I saw in Detroit after-hours joints over the years (aside from the 'standard fare'...), the worst was seeing alcoholics becoming cokeheads.
[Typical scenario: Person goes Downtown for a bar adventure, gets wasted, wants to keep their buzz going after 2:AM, hears about an after-hours joint from a "friend of a friend" at the bar, follows a stranger there, then perhaps for the first time in their lives, is offered a 20-bag of coke, and they were so wasted that they bought it........]
In short, a 4:AM option would hopefully cut down on the number of drunk-driving accidents due to binge-drinking as the bars close, and would most certainly cut-down on the number of shady after-hours joints around the D (an unfortunate nightlife necessity for many after 2:AM).
Post Number: 850
|Posted on Sunday, April 15, 2007 - 5:54 am: || |
Here's the angle from London, England:
It seems that their bars' early-closing laws were originally brought-about by the same motivations as Henry Ford in Detroit: to keep their factory workers sober.
If you think 2:AM is early, try 11:PM!
They've been doing it since 1915. Less than 2 years ago, they changed their laws to allow 24-hour licenses.
Ya know what? The Apocalypse did not occur.
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/Arti cleNews/story/CTVNews/20051123 /pub_closingtimes_051123/20051 123/
http://www.findarticles.com/p/ articles/mi_qn4158/is_20060720 /ai_n16542602
Post Number: 281
|Posted on Sunday, April 15, 2007 - 6:53 am: || |
I think Crash_nyc's argument strongly supports the London England template. But I say lets get rid of the evil Alcohol!
Post Number: 223
|Posted on Sunday, April 15, 2007 - 8:23 am: || |
We've got enough drunk and drugged-up people causing problems.We don't need more of it with extended hours. Let them all go home and go to bed, and keep the city safe for maybe 1/2 an hour.
(Message edited by ladyinabag on April 15, 2007)
Post Number: 44
|Posted on Sunday, April 15, 2007 - 8:59 am: || |
I agree w/ “Crash_nyc” post and would like to add that from a business standpoint, generally speaking, many patrons arrive around midnight; it’s very difficult to run a successful nightclub with a 2:00 AM curfew looming over your head.
It’s not easy doing business (liquor) in Michigan, which is one of 18 states referred to as the “control states.”
Couple that w/ what I will refer to as an early last call and you have a recipe that “Crash_nyc” mentions, blind pigs, and or, legal bars serving past the witching hour.
Having last call @ 2:00 AM does not stop people from drinking, they simply go to a place that continues to serve, and usually they serve more than just drinks, they do not "go home."